Petition to save UO!

[Conleth]

OK that title is a little inflammatory, flames expected.

I've been thinking about Ultima; new players, old players, what kind of trouble folks might be having, or would have if new or returning (I am a return vet). So, here are some ideas to toss around. Give new or returning players:

-Runebooks (as in TC). The lands have gotten so big that just getting from A to B is an undertaking. (Before you say yay or nay, consider that when UO came out it was 1 facet, with limited cities. We all hung at WBB. Newbies, or returning vets literally could not get lost in the game, nor would they ever feel they were alone on their shard.) There are a huge number of choices for us all to make; for new players, it could be boring/overwhelming to try to find folks to assist them, or to learn all the new lands whilst running around on their own.

-More gold. For insurance, for buying powders, for the myriad of things that you absolutely NEED in the game these days. The starting gold should be reflective of the current economy and it's not. This game is very wealthy; 1K is not helpful.

-Horse. If I understand the anniversary gift horse? You double click it and a real, bonded horse becomes yours? (Not an ethy.) If it doesn't work this way, it could and maybe should. Make it easier to run around. A new or returning vet will have to spend most of their gold on a mount just to get around, even IF they have runebooks.

I'm going to think more on this, and annoy you all by posting again methinks.

And before you tell me that there ARE no new players, well, that's what steam will remedy. Or could do. We need new blood, we aren't getting any younger.

Cheers

 

[Conleth]

I expect some of you will think 'yeah but until and unless they upgrade the graphics significantly, nobody new is going to play'. Maybe. Or not. Because SOTA. (Looks like Might and Magic but it's getting backing geez.)
Also, imagine the people who have come to know and love UO, a sudden shock of changing the graphics abruptly might cause player loss. They've done an outstanding job, I think, of introducing new graphics - this game does *not look as it did back in the day. (I don't necessarily agree with all of it, but on the whole I do.) I remember wishing for new items ingame, and we were told then that that would never happen. Robed clothing, rare item graphics, etc... 'not gonna happen'. Well we've come pretty darned far.

Edited for typo.

 

[Kirthag]

I believe the devs are working on a "new player experience" where players are introduced to things via game play. This would be great to adapt to returning vets as well. Help introduce them via solo play to the new stuff.

However, as has always been the way with UO, it is the community that players should turn to. Is why Stratics, UOforums and other communities are still around. Instead of solo-ing.... tell us, oh returning veteran, what shard you play. Perhaps others will come help you.




What made UO so successful in the past was it was the first, the only, the best. Now, 18 years later, other games have come out that blow UO out of the water.

When I started playing WoW, I used to say, "Merge WoW & UO & you got the perfect game!!"
I don't think so anymore.

Merge Diablo3 (it has that same oblique perspective as UO - but is really 3D!) with UO and yes, we will have a seriously "modern" UO. What needs to happen is Broadsword gets into a new gaming engine - seriously - and that will lure in the younger crowds and give us old-timers the viewpoint we love so much.

Even the earlier Diablos had better graphics - if you want to argue graphics.

What made UO so successful was the sandbox approach. You'll be hard pressed to find that today (even SotA is not a full sandbox game). Keep the sandbox features, but upgrade the game engine.

 

[Smoot]

agreed.

and better yet, maybe a small quest chain that pops up for new characters. quest rewards would be:

a bonded horse
a runebook and some scrolls, and a few runes to locations
1 mil gold

 

[Gamer_Goblin]

I'd agree with the bonded horse... but, the runebook... not so much. Players already want to leave New Haven too soon. You're meant to stay there for a good while. I do think there should be a "Walkthrough" written up on the new wiki on Suggested starting goals. For example... starting with a Melee Fighter or Mage is a lot easier to learn than a Tamer/Treasure Hunter.

One thing I will note is that I've been pointing new players to New Haven Mine for Earth Eles and I wish I had been telling them about the spot in Blackthorns so they could get Minax minors.

 

[Conleth]

.. it is the community that players should turn to. Is why Stratics, UOforums and other communities are still around. Instead of solo-ing.... tell us, oh returning veteran, what shard you play.

Yes and no. Many people ingame are now self sustaining. Most. There is no 'we are all learning as we go' feeling ingame anymore. I'm honestly thinking of new players, and not only for the new players sakes, but for ours as well. Because without new blood, this game dies. Simple.

As I understand it from another post, appx 1 percent of UO players reads stratics. It could be that a new player wouldn't know to come here. (Can be googled however I am sure.) Could be that new players may not want to come here. Seems only 1 percent of not new players want to come here, with all due respect (love ya Stratics). I know when I started, on Europa (it was a pretty kick butt shard at the time), I started on my own. You could do that then. And I met folks. You could do that then too. Having the choice was awesome. I keep coming back to that.

Now, it seems, a new player might just sink before learning how to swim. I hope not.

I am currently rather forced to play multiple shards. Oceania is one of my first choices, but; it is very, very very quiet. I can run for hours and see no one. I could probably run for days, for weeks, and see no one, including no vendors. Not that a vendor would do particularly well, as it's such a low prodo shard.

Did I sound like I myself needed help? Not at the moment, fortunately, but thank you for offering. New folks just might. And I *was feeling frustrated earlier, as costs have increased (insurance, which is needed in Tram now, regs, powder of fort, etc etc et al). I was losing a couple/few thousand easy every time I died, for example. (My gear is old but still expensive to insure; boomstick is 350, etc.) How could I have known that liches were so overpowered now? Had to relearn. (And if it matters, I myself don't need any of the items I mentioned. I would outright refuse them. Indeed, I was given two one million gold checks, and a nicely powered LRC suit by that I promptly put away where they would be safe and not eaten up by insurance costs... gifted by really awesome shardmates whom I never actually see whilst wandering around ingame because it's so empty. I'm running around in my old armour, relearning what's what. I have an edge that new players certainly would not have. I know the lands, for example. Hence the runebook ala TC idea. I personally have my old runebooks.

For that matter take me out of the picture entirely. I'm frankly thinking on new players, or *other return players. Beyond myself.

I think we can at least all agree that for this game to continue forward, to survive, we need new blood. Will tossing it on Steam, with all the f2p games out there, be enough? I think we can encourage new players, surely. Make it a bit more user friendly. I hope they do introduce a new player experience as you mentioned - I'd like to believe it will bring folks rolling in.
Cheers

 

[Smoot]

I agree with what you say Kirthag, UO is at its roots a sandbox game, but at the same time its a different world than even 10 years ago. Not even for new players, but players just starting a new character, you want to get into the game quickly. a week to bond a horse is just too long. 1mil is enough where a quick vendor search can yield some decent gear, even 1 good thing, and a little insurance gold to make life a little easier.

I will always have nostalgia to bumbling around figuring out the game, taking weeks to even know what i was doing, but in reality, i think that same experience should take maybe 1day now. 1day to know what your doing, have relative ease of mobility and direction.

Plus, corspe decay time has been greatly reduced. i would have quit the game now if the decay time was what it is now when i first started. theres just not enough time to get back to ones corspe reliably. Even now sometimes when i rez i cant get back to it quickly enough to get my potions and consumables, let alone if i was dying over and over on a low-skill character.

 

[Kirthag]

There is one thing I can't understand : ppl keep complaining about UO graphics (CC) yet we have a whole lot of players who love decorating and items in UO, who are "in love" with their home etc ; there must be something special about the charm of graphics in UO after all!!....

Oh, I'm not arguing the graphics. I luv my nostalgia. I still play Populous! Is just usually threads like this get around to the graphics so I wanted to get my dos centavos in before the herd. Its been mushed, mulled, dredged, beaten, cursed and blessed many times over. Statistically speaking however, the graphics do turn a lot of people away. I'll note the "cartooney splash screen" we now have.... made my sister (who originally got me addicted to this game way-back-when) balk in the worst way. She wouldn't even log in. Her hubby (who did beta) just laughed hysterically in the background.

My son asked if we get to kill Barney.



Personally, I think the antiquated graphics, if done right, could be sustainable. What I'd really like to see is a D3 look... omg, I'd never stop decoing my castles!

 

[Conleth]

IMO what makes UO not attractive to "new players" is the extreme difficulty and variety of this game : you really can get lost and frustrated and, if you don't get hooked for some reason, you'll do something else

Said it better than I did or could. Agreed. We could make it a bit easier for folks that don't know what they don't know to navigate. Is it just me or are alot of folks kind of short on attention span nowadays? Part of it has to be on demand entertainment, maybe fast changing tech... Gotta grab 'em and hook 'em quick, I think!

 

[old gypsy]

There is one thing I can't understand : ppl keep complaining about UO graphics (CC) yet we have a whole lot of players who love decorating and items in UO, who are "in love" with their home etc ; there must be something special about the charm of graphics in UO after all!!....

IMO what makes UO not attractive to "new players" is the extreme difficulty and variety of this game : you really can get lost and frustrated and, if you don't get hooked for some reason, you'll do something else

What is extraordinary and unique in this game is that you are never bored ; you can be worried, frustrated, even angry or anything but never bored in any way, even if you play solo
You always have projects in mind, so many things to do that you'll never have done it all!!!

Ah, yes, I still love the graphics (and I use the CC). As for bored... that has never been my problem, although frustration has run high for me in recent years simply because of the type of player I am, and the fact that my favorite characters are truly not needed in today's game. Due to that frustration, I almost closed my account recently. Fortunately, the attachment I have to in-game friends changed my mind. As for quitting a world I fell in love with in 1998, it looks like I'm not ready to do that after all.

UO may be past its prime, but if so many of us are still here that must mean it still has something special that nothing else can quite match. I do hope the Devs can find a way to make it easier for new players, though. Some of the suggestions in this thread sound pretty good to me.

 

[virtualhabitat]

A few marked runes, but no runebook. They can make a scribe and craft one themselves.

Gold is hideously easy to make in this game. No need to start with 1 million.

No bonded horse for newbies. What do gargoyles get? A magic carpet? I assure you they will want something...


Bring back despise dungeon. I remember getting lost in despise when I was new. I broke into a sweat it was so exciting! This, by far, was one of the best newbie dungeons ever -maybe covetous too.

That hole they dug out in the corner of haven is not a dungeon.

 

[old gypsy]

Oh, I'm not arguing the graphics. I luv my nostalgia.

My son asked if we get to kill Barney.

No... don't kill Barney!

 

[Conleth]

agreed.

and better yet, maybe a small quest chain that pops up for new characters. quest rewards would be:

a bonded horse
a runebook and some scrolls, and a few runes to locations
1 mil gold

I really think you're onto something there. Runebooks to help them get around without having to ask for help (what if no one is on?); to the cities, or a few of them, moongate or two, enough to allow them freedom of movement. I love that there were expansions and new landmasses, but it's gotten so bloody big that newbies/returners are bound to have a spot of trouble.

Back in the day, we'd run from Brit to Minoc and back again...and we'd see tons of people, couldn't get away from them, even! Not the same, today.

 

[Conleth]

A few marked runes, but no runebook. They can make a scribe and craft one themselves.

A runebook that decays, then? Some kind of expiring runebook visitors visa...to go along with trial account. Something temporary.

Gold is hideously easy to make in this game. No need to start with 1 million.

Easy if you know how. We used to get newbified items. Now we don't, and that's fine, because we can afford to pay for insurance (but will newbie/returners be able?)

No bonded horse for newbies. What do gargoyles get? A magic carpet? I assure you they will want something....

Well, gargoyles get to fly. They move with the speed of a horse already. They'd cope I'm sure.

Bring back despise dungeon. I remember getting lost in despise when I was new. I broke into a sweat it was so exciting! This, by far, was one of the best newbie dungeons ever -maybe covetous too.

Despise rocked!

 

[Acid Rain]

I'll note the "cartooney splash screen" we now have.... made my sister (who originally got me addicted to this game way-back-when) balk in the worst way. She wouldn't even log in. Her hubby just laughed hysterically in the background.

My son asked if we get to kill Barney.

Killing The New Boss On Test Center

That log in page is horribad

 

[virtualhabitat]

A runebook that decays, then? Some kind of expiring runebook visitors visa...to go along with trial account. Something temporary.

Runes without a runebook decay just fine by themselves and they only cost 10 gold to insure. One mongbat loot will cover a few deaths.

We used to get newbified items. Now we don't, and that's fine, because we can afford to pay for insurance (but will newbie/returners be able?)

Current starting equipment (plain dagger and scissors) cost 10 gold to insure. See mongbat loot.

Gold is hideously easy to make in this game. No need to start with 1 million.

Easy if you know how.

This is a matter of opinion, but I believe a large part of the magic that is UO is the discovery. Sure someone may have done it or thought of it before you, but when you discover it -you own it. Giving the discovery away with no investment renders it valueless.

 

[Conleth]

Killing The New Boss On Test Center View attachment 37428 View attachment 37427

That log in page is horribad

Dang that was funny!

 

[Smoot]

The point is, if your actually a new player

1. you dont even know a horse can bond. you dont know you should be bonding your horse right away. a quest that provided a "quick bond" would get players going, while also Explaining the bonding process (which is the main point, the information)

2. rune-book same thing. it would give players an idea that theres actually other ways around than running. how exactly would a new player even know that a "runebook" exists, and what its for unless they have one?
being provided with one would let them know they exist and be able to learn how to use it.

3. the gold. realistically, if you dont want to lose your stuff now you have to insure it. insurance costs are high, even throwaway armor that you find at the bank isnt 30 or so gold to insure, it can be 700 to 3k to insure.... that adds up fast. there has to be some way that gets a player a decent start up gold WITHOUT LOOTING MONSTERS.

Reason: because if players get in the habit of looting gold from monsters, they think thats how their supposed to make gold, which just is NOT the case in modern UO.
If they were given a 1mil check they might second guess looting 30 gp off mongbats and realize thats not what they should be doing (for gold anyway)

And finally, Yes i agree in an ideal world, and at UOs peak these questions could all be answered by players you come across in game, but realistically that just isnt the case now.

 

[old gypsy]

The point is, if your actually a new player

1. you dont even know a horse can bond. you dont know you should be bonding your horse right away. a quest that provided a "quick bond" would get players going, while also Explaining the bonding process (which is the main point, the information)

2. rune-book same thing. it would give players an idea that theres actually other ways around than running. how exactly would a new player even know that a "runebook" exists, and what its for unless they have one?
being provided with one would let them know they exist and be able to learn how to use it.

3. the gold. realistically, if you dont want to lose your stuff now you have to insure it. insurance costs are high, even throwaway armor that you find at the bank isnt 30 or so gold to insure, it can be 700 to 3k to insure.... that adds up fast. there has to be some way that gets a player a decent start up gold WITHOUT LOOTING MONSTERS.

Reason: because if players get in the habit of looting gold from monsters, they think thats how their supposed to make gold, which just is NOT the case in modern UO.
If they were given a 1mil check they might second guess looting 30 gp off mongbats and realize thats not what they should be doing (for gold anyway)

And finally, Yes i agree in an ideal world, and at UOs peak these questions could all be answered by players you come across in game, but realistically that just isnt the case now.

These are really good points, and support the idea that the best way to keep any new players is to make the initial entrance into the game as comfortable as possible. They'll adapt to the harder things soon enough if they don't become discouraged in the very beginning.

 

[The Craftsman]

And before you tell me that there ARE no new players, well, that's what steam will remedy. Or could do.

Wishful thinking. When it got greeen lighted the game got absolutely destroyed on the steam forums. When (if) it gets released on steam I dont expect a good reception. Sure we might get a few but not in any numbers to make a difference. The new players just arent there.

 

[Lord Arm]

the game is very complicated now. there is so much to know. noticed the new players give up, some shards don't have much new items for sale. when they ask me questions about their char, they tend to have a mix of skills that probably shouldn't be together. a good introduction manual would be great/updated. is their a list of guilds/shard that takes/wants new players and where can we find this. just a thought. later, some aren't happy when they find out they cant do a lot of the stuff without paying a lot for up grades. I could go on, like setting up mythic account/paying, other needed add ons like uo assist, maps, ect... would be nice if they came with the game. starting out with 1k gold?. good luck getting arrows $.

 

[Kirthag]

I'm working on something on Pacific just for that cause.. to assist new and returning players to get used to the confuzzleness of UO. My sister was gonna be my guinea pig to make sure everything is suitable. Its been so long that I've been a "newb" that I really would like some returning player's opinion - but, well, her laughter at the "oh so cute" release splash screen still rings in my ears.

 

[Jack Daniels]

First off, get rid of the new log in page, it looks like it was made by a special ed kid with crayons, first impressions are going to make or break a new player. Secondly, make a new player start with the basic armour and make it blessed for them and only them, this lets them enjoy the game without having to worry about insurance for the first bit. Secondly, let them start with better spell books to start either a full one or say half full, starting with like 12 spells is pointless.

 

[HoneythornGump]

Th graphics/low resolution is absolutely atrocious, and the primary reason why UO will never attract new players.

No new player is ever going to look at this game and give it a try in it's current state.They'll likely look at it then laugh.

It doesn't matter how many events you run, how much content you ad, or how much you advertise the game until the game actually looks good from a high resolution art perspective UO will never be able to attract a new playerbase.

 

[The Craftsman]

Th graphics/low resolution is absolutely atrocious, and the primary reason why UO will never attract new players.

No new player is ever going to look at this game and give it a try in it's current state.They'll likely look at it then laugh.

It doesn't matter how many events you run, how much content you ad, or how much you advertise the game until the game actually looks good from a high resolution art perspective UO will never be able to attract a new playerbase.

Sad but true.

 

[Smoot]

Th graphics/low resolution is absolutely atrocious, and the primary reason why UO will never attract new players.

No new player is ever going to look at this game and give it a try in it's current state.They'll likely look at it then laugh.

It doesn't matter how many events you run, how much content you ad, or how much you advertise the game until the game actually looks good from a high resolution art perspective UO will never be able to attract a new playerbase.

No game is successful if its trying to be something its not, and UO is NOT a modern game. Its almost 20 years old, even older than many of the games / consoles that are now considered "retro gaming" and become collectors items and very expensive. Who would want to play an atari game with modern 3d graphics? No one. that defeats the whole purpose of playing a retro game. I think youd be surprised how popular old games are, especially in Asian markets and Gen-Xers who want a taste of their youth. Even young gamers who see the old style as a novelty, something different than the 1000s of new games out there. They dont want a new look, something that can be gotten anywhere. They want the original.

 

[Uvtha]

No game is successful if its trying to be something its not, and UO is NOT a modern game. Its almost 20 years old, even older than many of the games / consoles that are now considered "retro gaming" and become collectors items and very expensive. Who would want to play an atari game with modern 3d graphics? No one. that defeats the whole purpose of playing a retro game. I think youd be surprised how popular old games are, especially in Asian markets and Gen-Xers who want a taste of their youth. Even young gamers who see the old style as a novelty, something different than the 1000s of new games out there. They dont want a new look, something that can be gotten anywhere. They want the original.

Yeah, but with a monthly fee... probably not so attractive.

Also, resolution is a real problem, but one that can be solved by changing your monitor settings happily. Too bad the game can't do that for itself.

 

[MalagAste]

I was under the impression that they decided to forego working on a New Player Experience and gave us Advisers instead... Which IMO is a lazy copout.... but whatever.... it is what it is.

But the prospect of having new players is pretty low.

Whatever is done it should be done before UO goes on Steam... Otherwise I'll not be happy spending most my time trying to help people learn the game watching them quit in frustration and then I'll get more frustrated.

Most of us don't want to spend hours trying to help new folk play because we know it's such a daunting task at this point that most will quit and it'll be a wasted effort. Having helped numerous people over the years I can say it's just so draining. Without a new player experience to help them at least get the basics down I just can't see them sticking around.

 

[MalagAste]

So very true!!! Also not to forget that new players don't like this much asking for help all the time!! Eventually at one point they'll decide to experiment by themselves and see what they can get out of this game and -at that moment- they'll make their final decision

No they don't like to. Lets not forget that most games now consist of a series of quests to "lead" you along the way while you learn... While UO has never really had that it is the "norm" of gameplay now. Even Landmark has a series of quest that offer small "rewards" as incentive to learn along the way. Sure we have newbie quests in New Haven but even those are largely incomplete. There is not anything for Taming, nothing for Spellweaving (While I know it's in Heartwood no one "new" is even going to know there is a Heartwood let alone how to get there or anything about Spellweaving since it isn't even something on the starting list...) Likely if they would want Spellweaving in the future they will have to buy and learn to use a Soulstone... which is another can of worms... Crafting quests are right there but again not all finished... And the worst part about starting "new" in UO is that there isn't even any "prior" information in regards to building a character and such.... most folk won't know jack about what skills to chose or anything like that and the offered "templates" at the start are so grossly out of date that they will be at a HUGE disadvantage.

And honestly new characters ought to start with armor that will bring them at least into the 40's for resist... and should have at least 1 piece with MR on it...

Also we need a slot for pants like we have a slot for a shirt. Silly that there are pants in game that NO ONE wears because they have no resist.

Hats ought to be more like armor... you should be able to enhance them with leathers... and the runic sewing kit ought to give them bonuses just like any other piece of armor. It's completely insane that they aren't included in that. This includes masks like the deer mask, Bear Mask etc that can be crafted.....

 

[Zuckuss]

OK that title is a little inflammatory, flames expected.

I've been thinking about Ultima; new players, old players, what kind of trouble folks might be having, or would have if new or returning (I am a return vet). So, here are some ideas to toss around. Give new or returning players:

-Runebooks (as in TC). The lands have gotten so big that just getting from A to B is an undertaking. (Before you say yay or nay, consider that when UO came out it was 1 facet, with limited cities. We all hung at WBB. Newbies, or returning vets literally could not get lost in the game, nor would they ever feel they were alone on their shard.) There are a huge number of choices for us all to make; for new players, it could be boring/overwhelming to try to find folks to assist them, or to learn all the new lands whilst running around on their own.

-More gold. For insurance, for buying powders, for the myriad of things that you absolutely NEED in the game these days. The starting gold should be reflective of the current economy and it's not. This game is very wealthy; 1K is not helpful.

-Horse. If I understand the anniversary gift horse? You double click it and a real, bonded horse becomes yours? (Not an ethy.) If it doesn't work this way, it could and maybe should. Make it easier to run around. A new or returning vet will have to spend most of their gold on a mount just to get around, even IF they have runebooks.

I'm going to think more on this, and annoy you all by posting again methinks.

And before you tell me that there ARE no new players, well, that's what steam will remedy. Or could do. We need new blood, we aren't getting any younger.

Cheers

The new players could definitely use a bone thrown their way. The new players are there by the way. It just takes a little pro-activity on our part in order to hunt them down before they become frustrated and quit. The "veteran" players themselves have been the single most important resources in keeping new players.

I do agree that the starting gold should be upped. They way it is currently, they won't be able to buy very much. The idea is for them to find other players, not to play solo. If I was new and trying to make my way solo, the first thing I would do is probably buy is a horse. The second, a weapon for my skill set. The ability to move across the lands quickly holds high value in the ability to make some starting cash. @Kyronix @Bleak The increased decay rate has hurt the new player's ability to pick up junk off of the ground to resell it. Given this I would pick up reagents and kill low level creatures for starting cash and skill.

Runebooks from the start? I don't know if it is necessary but it certainly might help. It would severely water down the exploration factor though. As newbies back in the day, we had to run out into the woods in a general direction like everyone else. If you remember, recalling was only reserved for mid-high level mages. I think the exploration aspect is extremely important for the new player, more so than their need to immediately have access to every city and dungeon. It's a small scale sense of achievement to have found a new area which is important in the long chain of UO achievements to be had at all levels of the UO player's experience.

Your intentions are good. The new player experiences does indeed need some work. I think that updated tutorials and easy access to information will provide the best resources towards making the new player experience much better.

 

[Conleth]

The new players could definitely use a bone thrown their way. The new players are there by the way. It just takes a little pro-activity on our part in order to hunt them down before they become frustrated and quit. The "veteran" players themselves have been the single most important resources in keeping new players.

I do agree that the starting gold should be upped. They way it is currently, they won't be able to buy very much. The idea is for them to find other players, not to play solo. If I was new and trying to make my way solo, the first thing I would do is probably buy is a horse. The second, a weapon for my skill set. The ability to move across the lands quickly holds high value in the ability to make some starting cash. @Kyronix @Bleak The increased decay rate has hurt the new player's ability to pick up junk off of the ground to resell it. Given this I would pick up reagents and kill low level creatures for starting cash and skill.

Runebooks from the start? I don't know if it is necessary but it certainly might help. It would severely water down the exploration factor though. As newbies back in the day, we had to run out into the woods in a general direction like everyone else. If you remember, recalling was only reserved for mid-high level mages. I think the exploration aspect is extremely important for the new player, more so than their need to immediately have access to every city and dungeon. It's a small scale sense of achievement to have found a new area which is important in the long chain of UO achievements to be had at all levels of the UO player's experience.

Your intentions are good. The new player experiences does indeed need some work. I think that updated tutorials and easy access to information will provide the best resources towards making the new player experience much better.

 

[Conleth]

Good discussion, cheers. Also sounds like we're on the same page at least.

Mobility is a concern not only for new players but possibly returning vets, depending on how long they were absent. (Did they miss ML? T2A? SA?, etc., you get the drift.) Perhaps a starting rune, or runebook (either temp or limited permanent) to a number of key locations. Spot on, we had to either run to other cities or rely on a more learned mage to cast a gate (folks now are, rightly, spread out over vast areas, and can be hard to find). These days, trying to run (and perhaps even gallop) anywhere outside of the original facet (or add on) can be daunting. Akin to trying to motorcyle around the planet (kudos to those that do) in an airplane age. Particularly as we've had so many expansions. Let's not forget water add ons we have (may not be new water tiles to explore, or are there?? but it seems many folks are spending a lot of time in the water now, on those fancy pirate ships). In general there is much, much more to see, and it's vast.

Starting gold, and shortened decay are issues, for newbies and returners such as myself (depending on how chars were left). I think tens of thousands of gold, or perhaps a million gold. Somewhere in that range. I don't think folks would begrudge a new player, or returner that. Most folk I run into ingame nowadays try to give me that amount, and these are folks that don't know me. Either I ask for some help and they offer, and then try to give me gold as well, or maybe they just see my ancient armour that was once pretty decent, and feel sorry for me! Perhaps a raised starting gold 'gift' could be tied to an account (such as the idea of blessed starting armour, which I personally like the idea of). This would discourage folks starting up tons of trials for, say, gold farming. Just a thought.

Nice to see there's still healthy discussion about UO! What a great game, what a fab experience. You guys rock!

Cheers
Edited to add: I'm going to use 'returner' to simplify/clarify. As opposed to returning vet or just vet.

 

[Kirthag]

About Steam...

UO will not ever get onto Steam until they take control of the Player Account system (which, by the by, is still reading EAMythic and is still a nightmare to take care of for people wanting to reclaim old accounts). Yes, UO has received the Greenlight, but the account system needs to get revamped. One of the things about Steam is that people can pay for things with their Steam Wallet.... that is no where near possible with the current account system for UO.

When Broadsword revamps the Player Account system and gets it all under control, I expect the Steam integration to be next, then we will see what happens.

 

[azmodanb]

You should not be able to pick other towns with new chars .. You should start in haven.

How many times have i ran into a new player lost by themselves in some random town. Spawning new players in haven square .. At least they would see another player and not simply log out.

 

[Conleth]

Runebooks from the start? I don't know if it is necessary but it certainly might help. It would severely water down the exploration factor though. As newbies back in the day, we had to run out into the woods in a general direction like everyone else. If you remember, recalling was only reserved for mid-high level mages. I think the exploration aspect is extremely important for the new player, more so than their need to immediately have access to every city and dungeon. It's a small scale sense of achievement to have found a new area which is important in the long chain of UO achievements to be had at all levels of the UO player's experience.

Your intentions are good. The new player experiences does indeed need some work. I think that updated tutorials and easy access to information will provide the best resources towards making the new player experience much better.

Newbies need the experience of learning to move around UO, that is true. Can't they receive the best of both worlds? How about a runebook (either permanent or temporary, or possibly temp papers issued by a foreign leader) to...the most populated areas of the lands? Busiest cities? Most popular dungeons? Pity the new player or returner that literally has trouble even locating other folks ingame.

That, and increased starting gold, possibly 'blessed', might be very helpful indeed.
Cheers

 

[WootSauce]

About Steam...

UO will not ever get onto Steam until they take control of the Player Account system (which, by the by, is still reading EAMythic and is still a nightmare to take care of for people wanting to reclaim old accounts). Yes, UO has received the Greenlight, but the account system needs to get revamped. One of the things about Steam is that people can pay for things with their Steam Wallet.... that is no where near possible with the current account system for UO.

When Broadsword revamps the Player Account system and gets it all under control, I expect the Steam integration to be next, then we will see what happens.

I'd be willing to bet 1/3 of my left pinky finger that we will see flying pandas as a playable character race along with an expansion that allows us all to build 3 extra houses in the clouds before we ever see a release on Steam.

 

[Kirthag]

I'd be willing to bet 1/3 of my left pinky finger that we will see flying pandas as a playable character race along with an expansion that allows us all to build 3 extra houses in the clouds before we ever see a release on Steam.

sadly.. you're probably right

 

[Elenni]

Returning player here...and have to agree, it's been a little overwhelming. I may as well have been a "never played," I'd forgotten EVERYTHING...I was gone 10 years. The good news is that players are returning all the time, and it amazes me -- just as the game still amazes me. But it is definitely overwhelming trying to get back in the swing, even with old accounts with GM skills and a few mil I was lucky enough to have put in the bank instead of my houses.

Here are the things that have been my biggest challenges:
-- Getting around? How do you even know what city you're IN, much less which city you want to be in or how to get there? Can we please put some darn street signs up, and the name of the city on the ruddy buildings??? How about a clickable city directory in strategic parts of town (the "you are here" dot would be a bonus.)
-- Speaking of getting around....the moongate for Britain (which used to be our "main" city, I remembered that at least) is waaaaaaayyyyyTF south of town -- to a newbie anyway. (We won't even talk about other city moongates.) Put the moongates IN the cities and make them easy to find!
-- Except...no one goes to Brit anymore anyway. Everyone hangs in in Luna. Oh yeah...I forgot there was a place called Luna. I guess that's why I played for 3 days without seeing anyone.
-- 80% of the player vendors are empty. (And actually I think that may be a generous number.) So by the time I find Luna to shop for some basic supplies, I get so sick of clicking empty vendors it makes me want to log out and go watch re-runs.
-- I could go gather resources and craft my own stuff, but nothing my old GM characters can make is worth anything to anyone anymore...except maybe a new player who doesn't know any better.

On the bright side: I was able to find spots to place 4 houses within a couple days -- including 2 in my old house spots. I think that's a bright side, anyway

I love, love, LOVE this game; it's incredible how much there is to do. But the "overwhelming" part is what's going to prevent new players from sticking around. I ran across a true newbie the other day, and he was really sounding dubious because the shard was so empty and he had no idea what he should be doing. I raved about all the cool stuff you can do in UO and offered to help, but I think he'd already made up his mind...and that made me really sad.

 

[MalagAste]

Returning player here...and have to agree, it's been a little overwhelming. I may as well have been a "never played," I'd forgotten EVERYTHING...I was gone 10 years. The good news is that players are returning all the time, and it amazes me -- just as the game still amazes me. But it is definitely overwhelming trying to get back in the swing, even with old accounts with GM skills and a few mil I was lucky enough to have put in the bank instead of my houses.

Here are the things that have been my biggest challenges:
-- Getting around? How do you even know what city you're IN, much less which city you want to be in or how to get there? Can we please put some darn street signs up, and the name of the city on the ruddy buildings??? How about a clickable city directory in strategic parts of town (the "you are here" dot would be a bonus.)
-- Speaking of getting around....the moongate for Britain (which used to be our "main" city, I remembered that at least) is waaaaaaayyyyyTF south of town -- to a newbie anyway. (We won't even talk about other city moongates.) Put the moongates IN the cities and make them easy to find!
-- Except...no one goes to Brit anymore anyway. Everyone hangs in in Luna. Oh yeah...I forgot there was a place called Luna. I guess that's why I played for 3 days without seeing anyone.
-- 80% of the player vendors are empty. (And actually I think that may be a generous number.) So by the time I find Luna to shop for some basic supplies, I get so sick of clicking empty vendors it makes me want to log out and go watch re-runs.
-- I could go gather resources and craft my own stuff, but nothing my old GM characters can make is worth anything to anyone anymore...except maybe a new player who doesn't know any better.

On the bright side: I was able to find spots to place 4 houses within a couple days -- including 2 in my old house spots. I think that's a bright side, anyway

I love, love, LOVE this game; it's incredible how much there is to do. But the "overwhelming" part is what's going to prevent new players from sticking around. I ran across a true newbie the other day, and he was really sounding dubious because the shard was so empty and he had no idea what he should be doing. I raved about all the cool stuff you can do in UO and offered to help, but I think he'd already made up his mind...and that made me really sad.

About the empty Vendors... I wish there was some way to tell that they were empty before clicking on them... Like if they have nothing for sale instead of being Yellow they highlight blue or black to indicate that they have nothing for sale when you mouse over them.

 

[Elenni]

About the empty Vendors... I wish there was some way to tell that they were empty before clicking on them... Like if they have nothing for sale instead of being Yellow they highlight blue or black to indicate that they have nothing for sale when you mouse over them.

Maybe if they're empty they should be grey and only say "Ooooooooo...." :-D

 

[Uvtha]

Yes! New players know NOTHING AT ALL trust me and eventually they can stay in this "new player" stage forever if they get no help now are you surprised you don't get any new players??? (staying I mean)

But I mean... isn't that the way with EVERY game? The basics of UO are painfully simple. Picks skills that sound good, grab a weapon, and go kill something. I highly doubt it's the learning curve that keeps new players from staying.

UO could use a better new player experience than Haven, and could use a lot more documentation in game as to what things do like item properties, but really it's not as abstruse as people make it out to be.

 

[Uvtha]

The point is, if your actually a new player

1. you dont even know a horse can bond. you dont know you should be bonding your horse right away. a quest that provided a "quick bond" would get players going, while also Explaining the bonding process (which is the main point, the information)

2. rune-book same thing. it would give players an idea that theres actually other ways around than running. how exactly would a new player even know that a "runebook" exists, and what its for unless they have one?
being provided with one would let them know they exist and be able to learn how to use it.

3. the gold. realistically, if you dont want to lose your stuff now you have to insure it. insurance costs are high, even throwaway armor that you find at the bank isnt 30 or so gold to insure, it can be 700 to 3k to insure.... that adds up fast. there has to be some way that gets a player a decent start up gold WITHOUT LOOTING MONSTERS.

Reason: because if players get in the habit of looting gold from monsters, they think thats how their supposed to make gold, which just is NOT the case in modern UO.
If they were given a 1mil check they might second guess looting 30 gp off mongbats and realize thats not what they should be doing (for gold anyway)

And finally, Yes i agree in an ideal world, and at UOs peak these questions could all be answered by players you come across in game, but realistically that just isnt the case now.

I mean I agree with all of these notions simply to ease learning, but really I think new people are given too little credit. I mean everyone here figured it out themselves at one point and clearly not all of us are geniuses.

 

[MalagAste]

But I mean... isn't that the way with EVERY game? The basics of UO are painfully simple. Picks skills that sound good, grab a weapon, and go kill something. I highly doubt it's the learning curve that keeps new players from staying.

UO could use a better new player experience than Haven, and could use a lot more documentation in game as to what things do like item properties, but really it's not as abstruse as people make it out to be.

Oh? Well I can say that I've actually met new players to the game who had played 3 months or more and didn't know they had a bank box. They were constantly throwing everything on the ground to keep under 125 items.

 

[Uvtha]

Oh? Well I can say that I've actually met new players to the game who had played 3 months or more and didn't know they had a bank box. They were constantly throwing everything on the ground to keep under 125 items.

lol, ok ok sure, SOME of them...

 

[Conleth]

Returning player here...

Welcome back!

How about a clickable city directory in strategic parts of town...

What a great idea, and should be a simple fix! Could be as simple as a plaque on buildings, even.

....the moongate for Britain...

Another good one! In some cities, on some shards, there are moongates in Britain. Clearly that can be done.

...I get so sick of clicking empty vendors it makes me want to log out and go watch re-runs..

I feel your pain! No stock vendors could, after a week or two, vanish again; gold goes into bank or onto bank balance.

...the "overwhelming" part is what's going to prevent new players from sticking around.

That's my concern as well. Harmless 'assists' would go far in keeping newbies ingame.

Cheers!

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

Completely disagree with this thread, it has never been easier to be new in UO, I recently began a new character on Origin and within 2-3 days I was taking part in new content with an 80% built character.

To address what I've read in here so far:
1. Runebooks like on TC/knowing where you are what city you're in. You know what city you're in because you select it when you make the character. Giving people runebooks means they won't learn where anything is in relation to anything else. There's also a few hundred web pages devoted to this game, plus mapper tools.
-My 3 days old Origin character still has no Runebook and can easily get around UO, buy a boat, look at a map, use the Moongates, use other people's Crystal Portal's it isn't hard.

2. More gold for the insurance you NEED.
You DON'T NEED IT. People successfully played this game for many years before insurance, when you're new throw on what you loot, it's more than adequate. IF the thing that kills you loots you (quite a lot still don't) then it's corpse will be instanced to you no matter who kills it. But as you're new and using looted gear it doesn't matter if you lose it, just loot some more. If you're getting killed that much that it's an issue then hopefully some common sense should kick in and tell you that you are not ready for this fight yet. Trying to fast track your way to end content is why you're not learning anything. New players SHOULD be looting 30 gp off mongbats. That's what you do when you're new. It is a gradual process, you start low to train, when you're more skilled you can hunt bigger, until then you don't need insurance or top of the range gear.

3. Free mounts for everybody.
No. Why? Because you're completely invalidating skills and racial abilities and making everything bland and equal. What is the point of having a racial ability for flight if everyone has a free mount. You don't need it. Take the time to explore and learn the game. Nothing in UO is that far away.

4. The starting weapons do actually allow you to start. Try it. They last a bloody long time. VvV free high end enhanced artifacts available to anyone, 'in my day we used to have to spend a month in Doom for an Orny or something to trade for one'. Alacrity Scrolls, SOT's, a dungeon IN Brit. Just about everything in UO at the moment is some sort of turn in or quest for some artifact or another. Then there's all the training grounds where monsters either don't move or are easily stuck.

5. New Haven. This alone is probably the number one reason why it's so easy to start now, considering you can start with two skills at 50, instantly buy another two to 40 and take accelerated skills gains to get those to 50 too it's not difficult to go and kill something. Stuff in Old Haven gives you gains, that's what it's there for, that's why it's the default option for where to start.

6. If you're new to this game read the websites, read the user manual, it's not complicated. The game is 18? years old, hm, if only someone had documented something! Advanced skill gain tokens. You have no idea just how easy you have it now.

My Origin character, three days, on a laggy, empty vendored shard and I'm getting masterys from the new Champ, I don't have one skill at 100 yet and can still play perfectly well with no insurance and reap rewards.

If you want to play and go straight to easy mode with no effort then play Test Center, you get everything free there, Runebooks, Ethys, set your skills to whatever you want. Hell you could even use that to learn the game before starting on a production shard.

Personally I just think people are lazy and getting lazier.

 

[Alex"Drake Iron Heart"CS]

I'd agree with the bonded horse... but, the runebook... not so much. Players already want to leave New Haven too soon. You're meant to stay there for a good while. I do think there should be a "Walkthrough" written up on the new wiki on Suggested starting goals. For example... starting with a Melee Fighter or Mage is a lot easier to learn than a Tamer/Treasure Hunter.

One thing I will note is that I've been pointing new players to New Haven Mine for Earth Eles and I wish I had been telling them about the spot in Blackthorns so they could get Minax minors.

How long do you want them to be in New Haven? Remember that a young kids focus span wont go further than 20mins in a single place with no one around, One of two choices they take, They endure the game and play for some time or they give up after 20mins of playing solo and go play a game with more player base and better graphics.... Very few young players will like to play solo.... Not even I want to play solo, I got a saying, If you gonna play solo, might as well get on PS4 Or Xbox and play a single player game....

As I understand it from another post, appx 1 percent of UO players reads stratics. It could be that a new player wouldn't know to come here. (Can be googled however I am sure.) Could be that new players may not want to come here. Seems only 1 percent of not new players want to come here, with all due respect (love ya Stratics). I know when I started, on Europa (it was a pretty kick butt shard at the time), I started on my own. You could do that then. And I met folks. You could do that then too. Having the choice was awesome. I keep coming back to that.

I cant really see many young players wanting to check a Forum to play a game, more like scares them away to a simpler more lineal game.....

The point being miss I think is, new players (Children 12+) are not interested in reading, writing or commenting in forums, they want to play and kill, thats the basics...
Also this game cant be played anymore if you are new to the game, 1k Gold dont cover the insurance even for a basic LRC suit which will have to be given to them as they cannot craft and they cannot kill a strong enough mob to be able to get semi decent gear such a basic LRC and LMC suit...
I know many will disagree but look at you suits and think if u would be able to get that within a few days of playing and not saying for uber suits......
1-2 Mil gold to start, simple city runebook and maybe Trammel dungeon rune book to start would be good, as that can set a player to do stuff, sitting in New Haven with no one around, just sounds like disaster as they get bored and they leave...

Ah, yes, I still love the graphics (and I use the CC). As for bored... that has never been my problem, although frustration has run high for me in recent years simply because of the type of player I am, and the fact that my favorite characters are truly not needed in today's game. Due to that frustration, I almost closed my account recently. Fortunately, the attachment I have to in-game friends changed my mind. As for quitting a world I fell in love with in 1998, it looks like I'm not ready to do that after all.

UO may be past its prime, but if so many of us are still here that must mean it still has something special that nothing else can quite match. I do hope the Devs can find a way to make it easier for new players, though. Some of the suggestions in this thread sound pretty good to me.

People play this game by nostalgia , but really its just turned into a cliche game afterall

 

[Alex"Drake Iron Heart"CS]

My son asked if we get to kill Barney.

Probably the sanest thing he could say, I would also love to kill Barney!!

 

[Smoot]

Completely disagree with this thread, it has never been easier to be new in UO, I recently began a new character on Origin and within 2-3 days I was taking part in new content with an 80% built character.

To address what I've read in here so far:

2. More gold for the insurance you NEED.
You DON'T NEED IT. People successfully played this game for many years before insurance, when you're new throw on what you loot, it's more than adequate. IF the thing that kills you loots you (quite a lot still don't) then it's corpse will be instanced to you no matter who kills it. But as you're new and using looted gear it doesn't matter if you lose it, just loot some more. If you're getting killed that much that it's an issue then hopefully some common sense should kick in and tell you that you are not ready for this fight yet. Trying to fast track your way to end content is why you're not learning anything. New players SHOULD be looting 30 gp off mongbats. That's what you do when you're new. It is a gradual process, you start low to train, when you're more skilled you can hunt bigger, until then you don't need insurance or top of the range gear.

you didnt used to need it, but corpes decay now much much faster than they did when most of us started. try dieing in the bottom of a dungeon, then find a wandering healer, then die a few more times because you have no armor. your gonna lose your stuff. no chance in hell you could get back to corpse in time. and remember, you may not even have a runebook yet to make things quicker, or to go back to the bank for supplies because you dont know they exist yet.

the rest of your post i didnt quote, but you sound like a player whos played for 10 years plus. Yes, i can make a new character and have him on end game content and be making mils very quickly. hours. however we're not talking about someone who knows the game. we're talking about someone whos options are:
Try UO and have no clue what anything is for weeks, plus no help (because most shards are empty)
Play another game and be up and running, with known goals and direction in less than a day.

which would you chose?

 

[Elenni]

Completely disagree with this thread, it has never been easier to be new in UO, I recently began a new character on Origin and within 2-3 days I was taking part in new content with an 80% built character.

Personally I just think people are lazy and getting lazier.

"Starting a new character" and "being a new player" are two different things. Orientation is the primary issue -- "laziness" has nothing to do with it.