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Gold, Gold & more Gold

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Merus

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Personally I think UO needs more optional gold sinks. UO's economy is too much of a closed system... across all servers there are million (if not hundreds of millions) coming in each day with only a very very small fraction of that gold leaving the system. You could use any number of ideas to accomplish this... one that comes to mind would be to drop a few more castles down in malas in the closed housing zones and sell raffle tickets for them. Give them grandfather status and scale the price of the ticket to the population on the shard. Rent out secure storage in town inn's...100k per week per additional secure container. the list goes on.
 

Smoot

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It's not

like it belongs to you, didn't you read the small print in the UO TOS, EA owns the gold, they just let you hold it for a little while. :p
which is actually a very interesting argument when it comes to real life money exchanges. your not technically selling anything, because EA still owns it. Ive thought about this for some time, but thought id mention it because you did bring it up ;) No gold is ever actually "sold" in UO because the fact that EA still owns it makes actual selling impossible. its simply exchanged and any real life currency can legally only be seen as a "gift" for one player helping another in a video game.

Its also an interesting topic when it comes to real life law regarding virtual items. People are scammed / robbed etc of virtual items and currency all the time of levels that would be classified as felony theft if they actually owned it. but according to EAs TOS they dont. Just saying, it will be very interesting to see what precendents and legislation come out in the next 20 years when the practice of buying / selling virtual items & currency moves forward from its infancy of the last 15 years or so. I would have to research it more, but i wonder if there are any games TOS that do actually provide a statement that virtual property can actually be owned by the player (or at least legally owned throughout the life of the games existence) Does anyone know the legal standing of items / property in the game "Entropy" where rmt transactions are a standard, encouraged part of the game, and where the largest virtual sale to date was made at around $600,000 for the space station? With those high numbers involved, if something was hacked / "stolen" i would think buyers might expect some type of legal action for their loss.
 
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jrede23

Certifiable
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Stratics Legend
You lay a hand on my BILLIONS! you gon lose your HAND!! :). Hello to all my old peeps, havent been around in awhile. DOWN TO THIS THREAD THOUGH! :p
 

virtualhabitat

Lore Keeper
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Stratics Legend
Instead of advisors I think we should have fairness police. they would go around in blue robes lowering prices of items I think are too expensive -because it's not fair that I can't afford them.
 

James Moriarty

Journeyman
Stratics Veteran
Youre not the brightest obviously so Ill explain it. The gold you had left would be worth exactly the same as the gold you had. Something that cost a hundred million would now cost 10 million. Your 10 million would be able to buy something that cost 100 million. Get it? No? Thought not.
I dont care how bright you think i am, take any of my gold and im gone. Its not a hard consept to understand is it. I dont care how you try to justify it
 

Tina Small

Stratics Legend
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
which is actually a very interesting argument when it comes to real life money exchanges. your not technically selling anything, because EA still owns it. Ive thought about this for some time, but thought id mention it because you did bring it up ;) No gold is ever actually "sold" in UO because the fact that EA still owns it makes actual selling impossible. its simply exchanged and any real life currency can legally only be seen as a "gift" for one player helping another in a video game.

Its also an interesting topic when it comes to real life law regarding virtual items. People are scammed / robbed etc of virtual items and currency all the time of levels that would be classified as felony theft if they actually owned it. but according to EAs TOS they dont. Just saying, it will be very interesting to see what precendents and legislation come out in the next 20 years when the practice of buying / selling virtual items & currency moves forward from its infancy of the last 15 years or so. I would have to research it more, but i wonder if there are any games TOS that do actually provide a statement that virtual property can actually be owned by the player (or at least legally owned throughout the life of the games existence) Does anyone know the legal standing of items / property in the game "Entropy" where rmt transactions are a standard, encouraged part of the game, and where the largest virtual sale to date was made at around $600,000 for the space station? With those high numbers involved, if something was hacked / "stolen" i would think buyers might expect some type of legal action for their loss.
Some guidance from the United States Internal Revenue Service regarding tax consequences of virtual world transactions: http://www.irs.gov/Businesses/Small...ax-Consequences-of-Virtual-World-Transactions .

"Online games create computer-generated settings for multiple users to interact as characters called avatars. These avatars frequently exchange goods and services in both the real and virtual worlds. Cyber-economic activities in the online world may have tax consequences that real world avatar counterparts need to consider.

"The IRS has provided guidance on the tax treatment of bartering, gambling, business and hobby income - issues that are similar to activities in online gaming worlds.

"In general, you can receive income in the form of money, property, or services. If you receive more income from the virtual world than you spend, you may be required to report the gain as taxable income. IRS guidance also applies when you spend more in a virtual world than you receive, you generally cannot claim a loss on an income tax return.

"In addition, the IRS issued guidance on the tax consequences of various activities that apply to Internet-based activities and online businesses. This guidance can help answer questions about the tax consequences of your online virtual world activities."
 

Tanivar

Crazed Zealot
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
My 150-200 million drops to zero I'll just colorfully comment on the current Devs heritage all the way back to the Big Bang and keep on playing UO. It's not like you need a megaton of gold to play the game.

It's all gone when EA decides to pull the plug on UO anyway. Just play the game.
 

old gypsy

Grand Poobah
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Dang... this entire thread is starting to sound almost... political... :tinhat:
 

The Craftsman

Certifiable
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Dang... this entire thread is starting to sound almost... political... :tinhat:
I dont know if its political but some people offering uninformed opinions on concepts that they quite obviously dont understand and a me, me, me mentality about something that they dont actually own (but again they seem unaware of this) and threatening to quit like spoilt children.
 

Thrakkar

Certifiable
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Stratics Legend
I think it is time to get an Gold Limit per Account in Ultima Online.
...
You can have in real so much Cash you want but in a Game there should be some balance. There should be since years a Gold limit but none cared. Perhaps now it is time to care about a big problem in UO ... unlimited UO Gold.
That's an extremely naive suggestion. Obviously you don't have any idea, why it works in real life, but not in UO. Ever heard of economy? And judging by your post, you haven't heard anything of inflation as well.
As long as you don't fix duping & scripting and don't give player an incentive to spend their gold, so it can be removed from the system (aka gold sink), cap won't solve solve anything.
UOs economy is borked beyond repair. That boat has sailed long ago...
 

Tanivar

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Stratics Legend
I dont know if its political but some people offering uninformed opinions on concepts that they quite obviously dont understand and a me, me, me mentality about something that they dont actually own (but again they seem unaware of this) and threatening to quit like spoilt children.
Does leave you wondering how many will try and sue EA for the loss of their game golds RL value when EA eventually shuts down UO, in spite of what the ToS says.

Probably be riots in the streets outside the offices of EA and Broadsword. The whole nine yards, pitchforks, torches, and Devs burned in effigy.
 

DJAd

Stratics Legend
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Cap on the amount of gold you can have??!! Are you serious?!

I want a cap on the amount of deco you can have in a house. How about that? The lag as I run past homes with all this stuff locked down gets annoying.
 

Lady Michelle

Sprite Full SP
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Stratics Legend
UNLEASHED
And what do you propose be done with all the extra gold that can't be contained to each account?
Hide the extra gold on boats in fel near arctic island on great lakes. No one will find it no one goes to fel.
 

Tanivar

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Stratics Legend
Hide the extra gold on boats in fel near arctic island on great lakes. No one will find it no one goes to fel.
You know, that could be an excellent way to get more people to go to Fel. Most of the Dev's past efforts to get people to go to Fel to entertain the PKers and Thieves have failed miserably, ships with 125 million gold checks in them that can be scuttled and cleaned out would likely do the trick.
 

Tanivar

Crazed Zealot
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Cap on the amount of gold you can have??!! Are you serious?!

I want a cap on the amount of deco you can have in a house. How about that? The lag as I run past homes with all this stuff locked down gets annoying.
Just be glad 90+% of it doesn't load unless your crossing each houses steps as you go by. :)
 

Ender

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Yeah since they announced the planned currency changes I've thought it's a bad move making it easier to stockpile obscene amounts of gold, and a global reduction of a couple zeroes would be better or should at least accompany it.
 

MalagAste

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You know I've said for years that just because you see something for sale at a ridiculous price does NOT mean that's what it's actually selling for...

Most idiots who price things ridiculously pay more in vendor fees for the thing to sit there on the vendor for ages than they actually could make if they sold it for a normal price people could afford and are willing to pay.

Kinda like the guy who spends all day spamming about selling something but is so concerned about spamming he neglects to see responses of people offering to buy said item. Or the guy that you see spamming the item for sale day in day out at an outlandish price who fails to realize if he just stuck it on a vendor he could have spent the week actually doing something fun rather than standing about Luna bank spamming all day and might have gotten 2 or 3 similar items in that time to put on a vendor and actually sell.

As for gold capping it is a silly idea and would do nothing... now if I were a DEV and looking to change gold from check and coin to just a number one of the things I would do is add into the code something that watches for large deposits and withdraws of gold to see who's moving large amounts of gold and then watch what it is these folk are doing... see if it's a legit vendor or if its some sort of illicit activity. But that's just me.
 

HoneythornGump

Lore Keeper
Stratics Veteran
Communism in UO?

This has to rank as one of the worst ideas ever posted on stratics, and that's saying alot!

Why should someone who plays 1 hour a week be on the same footing as someone who plays 10-12 hours or more a week.

I've invested serious amounts of time in game, at crazy hours in the night, in order to farm and sell items for gold. Farming monsters, over and over, where the drop rate is like 50 to 1, and after having my "eureka" moment I should now have my work "wiped" away. Are you (expletive) serious?

Secondly, If you want an item you don't have to pay for it. You can go craft it or go get it yourself (with the exception of veteran rewards) by farming the monster that drops it...no one is forcing anyone to "buy" items in UO.

Lastly, there aren't any new players joining UO.

The only players left in UO these days are the jurassics who cling to a 20 year client.
 

Merlin

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Does leave you wondering how many will try and sue EA for the loss of their game golds RL value when EA eventually shuts down UO, in spite of what the ToS says.

Probably be riots in the streets outside the offices of EA and Broadsword. The whole nine yards, pitchforks, torches, and Devs burned in effigy.
Sue EA? That won't happen. For one, EA is sufficiently covered by the language in it's ToS and is the owner of all the gold in the game, which is already noted in this thread. Second, unless someone has truly big money worth in UO gold (i.e., $25,000+ USD worth of gold) that is lost and is willing to retain a lawyer for additional thousands of dollars, we likely wouldn't see many lawsuits (if any at all). Most lawyers would take your money and then tell you there is nothing that could be done. I would also think that EA could afford much more sizable legal team to squash any legal complaints filed related to this. The victims would have to show a substantial burden of proof to show wrong-doing on the part of EA/Broadsword. And even IF there was a case whereby EA lost, would anyone truly expect to get anything more than pennies on the dollar for what they believed the fair market value of UO Gold truly is? Highly doubtful.

The comment about devs burned in effigy was worthy of a laugh though ;)
 

old gypsy

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Regarding the suggestion that players might sue EA, I think it's highly unlikely. It's even less likely that an ethical attorney would consider spending time on this. Although I'm not an attorney, my almost 40-year-old son (with extensive experience in commercial litigation) is... and there is no doubt in my mind that if he was approached, he would politely inform the player (or players) that it would not be worth either his time or theirs.
 

Spock's Beard

Sage
Stratics Veteran
I'll just post it again because I like posting it.

STEP ONE: Convert gold to a non-physical value, just like they're planning on doing.

STEP TWO: Add an optional button that will display your currency as "platinum" at a 1000:1 conversion ratio. This doesn't actually change anything, it just moves the decimal point basically. You can sit there checking and unchecking the box and watch the display change from "1,000,000 gold" back and forth to "1,000 platinum" over and over if you want.

STEP THREE: All monsters begin dropping platinum instead of gold at a 1:1 ratio. Instead of dropping 150 gold, for example, an ettin drops 150 platinum. That's right, we just increased monster drops by a factor of 1000 basically.

STEP FOUR: But wait! The entire NPC economy, the housing system, everything, begins taking platinum instead of gold, also at a 1:1 ratio. Yep, we've just increased the price of everything by a factor of 1000.

"BUT SPOCK'S BEARD I AM SUPER RICH, ISN'T THIS A BIG NERF TO ME?!"

Not really. If you have a million platinum you're still ten times richer than the guy who only has 100k platinum. Hell, keep displaying it as gold forever if you really want. The money hasn't gone anywhere and the NPC economy means nothing to you at your level anyway. The only thing that's changed is that it's now possible for a normal person to eventually catch up somewhat by killing monsters and playing the game. But you're clever and make most of your money trading rares and such anyway, right? You'll always be ahead of a pure monster basher that way.

"BUT WAIT I'M SUPER POOR, WHAT ABOUT ME?!"

On day one everything is going to look super expensive to you, but if you go kill a few monsters everything will quickly prove to be just fine. Better than fine. If you really get hustling and hunting, you could actually catch up to the rich guy above if he spends too much time banksitting and slacking off.

Bam, the economy goes from being a fossilized hyperinflated pile of crap to having some vibrancy and mobility again. After a while everyone stops talking about "gold" entirely, the same way nobody tells you how many millions of cents they make per year.
 

Nexus

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Regarding the suggestion that players might sue EA, I think it's highly unlikely. It's even less likely that an ethical attorney would consider spending time on this. Although I'm not an attorney, my almost 40-year-old son (with extensive experience in commercial litigation) is... and there is no doubt in my mind that if he was approached, he would politely inform the player (or players) that it would not be worth either his time or theirs.
Ask him about Bragg v. Linden Lab I'd be interested to see how the direction that case took would be able to impact people who went up in arms over the game closure due to virtual items sold from the Origin Store.
 

azmodanb

Grand Poobah
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I'll just post it again because I like posting it.

STEP ONE: Convert gold to a non-physical value, just like they're planning on doing.

STEP TWO: Add an optional button that will display your currency as "platinum" at a 1000:1 conversion ratio. This doesn't actually change anything, it just moves the decimal point basically. You can sit there checking and unchecking the box and watch the display change from "1,000,000 gold" back and forth to "1,000 platinum" over and over if you want.

STEP THREE: All monsters begin dropping platinum instead of gold at a 1:1 ratio. Instead of dropping 150 gold, for example, an ettin drops 150 platinum. That's right, we just increased monster drops by a factor of 1000 basically.

STEP FOUR: But wait! The entire NPC economy, the housing system, everything, begins taking platinum instead of gold, also at a 1:1 ratio. Yep, we've just increased the price of everything by a factor of 1000.

"BUT SPOCK'S BEARD I AM SUPER RICH, ISN'T THIS A BIG NERF TO ME?!"

Not really. If you have a million platinum you're still ten times richer than the guy who only has 100k platinum. Hell, keep displaying it as gold forever if you really want. The money hasn't gone anywhere and the NPC economy means nothing to you at your level anyway. The only thing that's changed is that it's now possible for a normal person to eventually catch up somewhat by killing monsters and playing the game. But you're clever and make most of your money trading rares and such anyway, right? You'll always be ahead of a pure monster basher that way.

"BUT WAIT I'M SUPER POOR, WHAT ABOUT ME?!"

On day one everything is going to look super expensive to you, but if you go kill a few monsters everything will quickly prove to be just fine. Better than fine. If you really get hustling and hunting, you could actually catch up to the rich guy above if he spends too much time banksitting and slacking off.

Bam, the economy goes from being a fossilized hyperinflated pile of crap to having some vibrancy and mobility again. After a while everyone stops talking about "gold" entirely, the same way nobody tells you how many millions of cents they make per year.
STEP FIVE: Forget above steps.
 

Tanivar

Crazed Zealot
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Stratics Legend
And what do you propose be done with all the extra gold that can't be contained to each account?
When I decided to leave UO for a couple of years I just trashed checks until I had enough free bank/backpack/beetle space to store what I wanted to keep. At some point you've just got a completely useless amount of gold and may as well trash it since all it is is useless clutter.

If you can't store the checks and gold on your account using vendors and such, you've really got ****way**** more than anyone could ever need. :rolleyes2:
 

Lady CaT

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Since we get sooner or later the Gold changes my question is, do a Player really need Billions of Gold in UO? I Play on Atlantic, Houses costs there between 5 Million Gold up to 5 Billion Gold. Event Items are on Vendors for 50 - 135 Millions for only 1 Item, which is just an Random Ugly Colored Item.

I think it is time to get an Gold Limit per Account in Ultima Online. Cause new Players can't afford crazy priced Items and all those ultra rich Players with their Billions of Gold, are selling their Gold illegal for Real Cash. Right now this is an never ending thing. Would it be not enough if an Account can have max 1 Billion UO Gold which is by the Way ultra much Gold.

Yes i know soon this Thread gets smacked down by all Players who have over 1 Billion UO Gold and the haters gonna start to cry but hey UO is a Game. You can have in real so much Cash you want but in a Game there should be some balance. There should be since years a Gold limit but none cared. Perhaps now it is time to care about a big problem in UO ... unlimited UO Gold.
You are under the MISTAKEN belief that you need gold to play UO and get the best items.
 

Alexander of ATL.

Rares Fest Host | Atl June 2013
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Stratics Legend
UNLEASHED
To be honest....

this thread is idiotic.

All I'm going to add to this thread is some truth and comic relief. So here is the truth:

I've played this game for over 9 years. Started out with mediocre LRC suits and hunted in graveyards to earn a 'living'. I picked up trash on the ground and on corpses and then sold them to shoppes in town. Made a little gold off of that. I started hunting tougher things as my level progressed.

Then I went to IDOCs and looted items to sell or keep.

Later, I went to EM Events and became a collector, auctioneer, etc.

See a pattern?

This game isn't and shouldn't be like the US government. It's a 17 year old game that has levels and people must climb there way up the ladder. Yes, I help all new players when I see one. I go hunting with them, supply them with needed gear, and give them tips. Then I give them a rune to my house in case they need help.

NO.... giving something away will kill this game... instead of helping it. I work for my gold. I farm champ spawns, spend time and gold on characters for events, spend HOURS upon HOURS at houses when it's not even guaranteed that there is something in the house let alone I will get anything good if there is. So no... I do not agree with a gold cap. It's IDIOTIC.


TRUTH and COMPROMISE:

If you want there to be less gold, then offer up a solution instead of complaining. A solution would for the dev team to offer another lottery event like they did with the Magincia plots. This took out SO MUCH GOLD from the game.

1rst Priority: Gold conversion as they are doing now - (eliminates further duping of gold)
2nd Priority: Lottery Event to take out gold from the game (stabilizes the economy somewhat)


RANT OVER....

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Alexander of ATL.

Rares Fest Host | Atl June 2013
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
UNLEASHED
Instead of advisors I think we should have fairness police. they would go around in blue robes lowering prices of items I think are too expensive -because it's not fair that I can't afford them.
Just dumb... and I don't need to state why... it's so obvious...
 

Uvtha

Stratics Legend
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I'll just post it again because I like posting it.

STEP ONE: Convert gold to a non-physical value, just like they're planning on doing.

STEP TWO: Add an optional button that will display your currency as "platinum" at a 1000:1 conversion ratio. This doesn't actually change anything, it just moves the decimal point basically. You can sit there checking and unchecking the box and watch the display change from "1,000,000 gold" back and forth to "1,000 platinum" over and over if you want.

STEP THREE: All monsters begin dropping platinum instead of gold at a 1:1 ratio. Instead of dropping 150 gold, for example, an ettin drops 150 platinum. That's right, we just increased monster drops by a factor of 1000 basically.

STEP FOUR: But wait! The entire NPC economy, the housing system, everything, begins taking platinum instead of gold, also at a 1:1 ratio. Yep, we've just increased the price of everything by a factor of 1000.

"BUT SPOCK'S BEARD I AM SUPER RICH, ISN'T THIS A BIG NERF TO ME?!"

Not really. If you have a million platinum you're still ten times richer than the guy who only has 100k platinum. Hell, keep displaying it as gold forever if you really want. The money hasn't gone anywhere and the NPC economy means nothing to you at your level anyway. The only thing that's changed is that it's now possible for a normal person to eventually catch up somewhat by killing monsters and playing the game. But you're clever and make most of your money trading rares and such anyway, right? You'll always be ahead of a pure monster basher that way.

"BUT WAIT I'M SUPER POOR, WHAT ABOUT ME?!"

On day one everything is going to look super expensive to you, but if you go kill a few monsters everything will quickly prove to be just fine. Better than fine. If you really get hustling and hunting, you could actually catch up to the rich guy above if he spends too much time banksitting and slacking off.

Bam, the economy goes from being a fossilized hyperinflated pile of crap to having some vibrancy and mobility again. After a while everyone stops talking about "gold" entirely, the same way nobody tells you how many millions of cents they make per year.
This wouldn't work the way you are expecting it to.

First of all, by leaving gold in the game, but removing its functionality... it's essentially a gold wipe. Why would anyone ever take gold over platinum? You can't just say 1000 gold is worth 1 platinum, 1000 gold has to function as 1 platinum. You have to allow gold to still function, or to be converted.

Secondly, (and lets assume you allowed people to convert gold to plat, just so we can continue) when you deflate wealth, but don't deflate income it completely throws the economy out of whack.
An item selling now for 1 million gold wouldn't sell for 1k platinum... it would sell for 1m platinum. Well actually probably not exactly the same price, but it would be close to the same price as it was in gold in platinum. Why? Because platinum in this scenarios is just as easy to farm as gold is to farm today, and you would never trade something hard to get for something easy to get.

So everyone has less currency wealth, but currency is still easy to get, trade is going to stagnate (for all but the previously uber gold wealthy) until the new currency piles up, and things even out, but that would probably take a fairly long time.

I think there is a plutonic ideal of being able to buy anything they want with looted gold acquired within a reasonable time frame, as it was in the early days, but that really can't happen unless you greatly devalue all rare commodities by making them less rare, which of course won't happen, and with no item loss, really can't happen.
 

Spock's Beard

Sage
Stratics Veteran
This wouldn't work the way you are expecting it to.

First of all, by leaving gold in the game, but removing its functionality... it's essentially a gold wipe. Why would anyone ever take gold over platinum? You can't just say 1000 gold is worth 1 platinum, 1000 gold has to function as 1 platinum. You have to allow gold to still function, or to be converted.
You're making this sound more complicated than it is. Remember, currency is non-physical under this system and the only thing "platinum" changes is how the number is displayed. You can sit there checking and unchecking the box and watching the display go from "1,000,000 gold" to "1,000 platinum" over and over if you want, it's all the same number in the end. Both currencies are accepted everywhere because really they're the same thing.

Secondly, (and lets assume you allowed people to convert gold to plat, just so we can continue) when you deflate wealth, but don't deflate income it completely throws the economy out of whack.
An item selling now for 1 million gold wouldn't sell for 1k platinum... it would sell for 1m platinum. Well actually probably not exactly the same price, but it would be close to the same price as it was in gold in platinum. Why? Because platinum in this scenarios is just as easy to farm as gold is to farm today, and you would never trade something hard to get for something easy to get.
Okay slam on the brakes, full stop. Prices today are NOT based on how much work it takes to farm the gold. At all. Nobody would ever kill 17,000 dragons to save up for a barbed kit or whatever. Prices today are based on the total amount of gold circulating in the economy after nearly 20 years of farming and duping. That's why killing monsters for their gold is virtually worthless now, and that's sort of the entire point.

On the other hand, if a system like mine went into effect and prices BECAME at least somewhat based on the amount of work it took to farm the money, that would be a HUGE IMPROVEMENT. Nobody could go out there and ask 17,000 dragon kills worth of money for a barbed kit like they do now. Nobody would do it, nobody would pay it. You'd HAVE to lower your price, or else just stare at your pile of barbed kits for another 20 years.

So everyone has less currency wealth, but currency is still easy to get, trade is going to stagnate (for all but the previously uber gold wealthy) until the new currency piles up, and things even out, but that would probably take a fairly long time.
Trade flourishes because prices are pushed down to levels that are more attainable by farming. You can't charge 20,000 or 50,000 dragon kills worth of money for an item if people actually have to kill the dragons.
 

Uvtha

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You're making this sound more complicated than it is. Remember, currency is non-physical under this system and the only thing "platinum" changes is how the number is displayed. You can sit there checking and unchecking the box and watching the display go from "1,000,000 gold" to "1,000 platinum" over and over if you want, it's all the same number in the end. Both currencies are accepted everywhere because really they're the same thing.
I understand the idea, its part 4 of your plan I was referring to: "The entire NPC economy, the housing system, everything, begins taking platinum instead of gold". That makes gold valueless. The game can TELL you 1000 gold is worth 1 platinum, but if 1000 gold cant do what 1 platinum can do, then its not. If that is not what you intended, then ignore that point. :p

Okay slam on the brakes, full stop. Prices today are NOT based on how much work it takes to farm the gold. At all. Nobody would ever kill 17,000 dragons to save up for a barbed kit or whatever. Prices today are based on the total amount of gold circulating in the economy after nearly 20 years of farming and duping. That's why killing monsters for their gold is virtually worthless now, and that's sort of the entire point.
1) Barbed kits don't cost 17m. They cost like 2m-3m. In fact I can buy a Valorite hammer CHEAPER on Atlantic than I can on Siege (5.5m vs 7m) despite a vastly smaller currency pool, because in part currency is much harder to get on siege, and of course supply is lower. My point is that average wealth is only one factor, supply and demand I would say are larger factors, especially in a world without needs.
Honestly the only things that cost a stupid amount of money (100m+) are either elite pvp gear, or vanity items like cool housing spots and uber rares. No one needs these things, and its perfectly fine that they cost stupid amounts of money.

On the other hand, if a system like mine went into effect and prices BECAME at least somewhat based on the amount of work it took to farm the money, that would be a HUGE IMPROVEMENT. Nobody could go out there and ask 17,000 dragon kills worth of money for a barbed kit like they do now. Nobody would do it, nobody would pay it. You'd HAVE to lower your price, or else just stare at your pile of barbed kits for another 20 years.
No, you really wouldn't have to lower your prices indefinitely. No one NEEDS to sell anything, and if you don't make a profit for your time, you will like I have said take barter, or simply stop selling. Now I think prices WOULD be lower, just not a ton, and not for all that long, and certainly not by the correlating currency conversion rate, if you leave income rate the same.

Trade flourishes because prices are pushed down to levels that are more attainable by farming. You can't charge 20,000 or 50,000 dragon kills worth of money for an item if people actually have to kill the dragons.
Let me put it this way: If all you could get for a rare artifact was an amount of gold that someone could reasonably farm... would you personally still spend all of the time and effort going after that artifact? Or would you just farm the weak monsters?
People will always need to get that relative profit margin, or the economy will stop function for those hard to get items. Deflating wealth WOULD drop the numbers but the margins would stay the same. If something costs a lot now, it will still cost a lot after such a change.
Also I don't know why it would come down to just looted gold with this change. I don't see why things would be any different than they are now, where the most profitable thing to do at low levels is sell minor commodities, not loot gold off of monsters.

Also, of course, like a fair tax ,the lower your wealth, the more the negative impact, so I think your probably just going to be making it harder for people who are already having a hard time.
 

Uvtha

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lol, when i replied to this thread i had no clue it would conspire to be this...

I will summarize this thread with a simple quote.

"it was a fool who argued with a fool"
That's in your sig bro!!!
 

Riyana

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This thread was locked due to repeated rules violations. I gave a general warning earlier in the thread, and it went unheeded. With apologies and thanks to those who behaved, this thread has proven counterproductive and will remain locked. You are free to open threads on similar topics so long as they remain within the Rules of Conduct. Thank you.
 
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