Last night in gen chat

[Dot_Warner]

So, just playing devils advocate, wouldnt it be better for EA legally if there are not gms or supervision of chat, because if there were broadsword could be liable under that law. if they do not have it supervised tho, and know nothing of it, you yourself said they cant be held liable.

Its not that back and white, sadly. They're somewhat screwed due to the RoC items against harassment (bullying):
From the RoC:

1. You may not victimize, harass, threaten, or cause another player unwanted distress or discomfort, as determined by Support Staff.
2. You may not use any offensive or sexually explicit language, graphic descriptions, or accounts of sexual acts (including but not limited to sexual language of a violent or threatening nature directed at another individual or group of individuals).
   
3. You may not use any unlawful, harmful, threatening, abusive, harassing, defamatory, vulgar, obscene, hateful, racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable language toward any other player.

They can blather about the harassment policy, the ignore and "leave the area" one, but it wouldn't hold much water as it clearly places all the power in the hands of the harasser.

Now, the ToS muddies things further with the limitation of liability and indemnification clauses...however...they couldn't use it to escape criminal prosecution (should there be a DA willing to charge) and courts have laughed out online game ToSes before as being too lopsided.

In the end, simply enforcing their RoC, which all UO account holders have to agree to, would be the best option. If other studios can do it, so can Broadsword. If they're worried about losing too much revenue due to axing scumbags, then they should just shut the servers down and be done with it.

Ignoring it just makes EA/Broadsword look weak and callous. Not a reputation they should want to foster while trying to bring in new customers. Not everyone is a masochist.

 

[cazador]

I don't think there's enough players to fill up ignore..are you guys that anti-social? Just ignore it and act like the freaking adults you claim to be..if the suicidal boy can't freaking ignore someone..then there's deeper issues his psychiatrist needs to handle..not the GM's of a damn game! Seriously people! Holy christ! I can't believe this is even a topic for discussion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Capt. Lucky]

I don't think there's enough players to fill up ignore..are you guys that anti-social? Just ignore it and act like the freaking adults you claim to be..if the suicidal boy can't freaking ignore someone..then there's deeper issues his psychiatrist needs to handle..not the GM's of a damn game! Seriously people! Holy christ! I can't believe this is even a topic for discussion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So you don't really have an opinion on this?

 

[Smoot]

if it comes down to UO being shutdown because there is not enough resources to police chat / cheating / bullying or it staying online, i hope it just stays online. id hate to see UO shut down because people complained and it just wasnt possibly meet expectations.

 

[Capt. Lucky]

if it comes down to UO being shutdown because there is not enough resources to police chat / cheating / bullying or it staying online, i hope it just stays online. id hate to see UO shut down because people complained and it just wasnt possibly meet expectations.

I think a lot of us miss the days when UO was all over this kinda stuff.

 

[The Craftsman]

So far you have posted comments that define bullying from a dictionary. That was a good definition and I agreed with it. It just doesnt apply to the topic of the thread. Now I dont know what dept of education you got this from but it makes no sense and isnt fairly applied. Let me explain:
So who determines who is less powerful? I am a little guy and can verbally insult a larger person and under your definition it is not bullying. The bigger guy finally has enough and returns the favor with his own words. Since I am smaller he is bullying me. Do you not see how your definition is messed up? And we wonder what is wrong with the kids these days.

Now not once have I insulted you, Maybe you should practice what you are trying to shove down others throats.

You dont understand the word 'dismissed' either? Incredible.

 

[The Craftsman]

I know exactly what she means. Disagreeing with a game design is one thing. Calling the developers stupid and incompetent is entirely another thing. If you want them to read this forum for feedback on game mechanics, keep the comments on game mechanics.

I understand that, and agree. My point was she should have been moderating in an evenhanded manner and calling ANYONE stupid or incompetent should have been treated in exactly the same way. She made it clear that was not the case and the devs got preferrential treatment which bears out my earlier comments in this thread about the old mods bias and lack of fairness and evenhandedness. It was rife

 

[Modoc]

Use the ban feature if it offends you. According to the TOS you must try to remove yourself from the situation. To the OP, this is a game in a virtual world if a conversation is too much for you to handle even when it does not include you, I would say leave chat, close the game and see what the real world is like. Now this is just my opinion people need to grow up the world is full of bullies and the internet just makes it easier for them to insult people. But hey guess what, that is all they can do on the computer is call you names. IGNORE them, I have several people in UO on ignore and I may be on ignore from them.

To me a bully is someone that physically pics on someone.

 

[whiterabbit]

The irony here is I got pms like that all the time on here, and the reason I got them was because I wouldn't allow such attacks against the posters - especially those aimed at the Devs.

ARRP PETRA NICE TO SEED YOOS

 

[NuSair]

1. Anyone who thinks the first amendment gives them the right to say anything in really needs to educate themselves on what the first amendment really does. To paraphrase one of my favorite movies 'I don't think that means what you think it means'.
2. Stop victim blaming.
3. Saying that ignore works, leaving the situation, ect is not the answer. You are creating an environment that encourages, fosters, and supports this kind of behavior.

Honestly, after all the things that have gone on the past couple of years regarding online bullying you would think that someone in charge would have done something about it by now.

ESPECIALLY considering that given how they handle things (or don't) would make them libel if something would ever happen because of it.

 

[Mervyn]

There is an option to leave the general chat in both clients.

I tell you the truth.

In classic client, under 'interface' you must have 'disable the menu bar' unchecked, click on chat. there you'll find an option to leave.

I hope this helps:

 

[Mervyn]

The irony here is I got pms like that all the time on here, and the reason I got them was because I wouldn't allow such attacks against the posters - especially those aimed at the Devs.

yeah sorry about all those death threats, i get a little carried away.

 

[MalagAste]

A prime example of a lot that is not only wrong with UO, but the world in general.

Exactly... my only thought of posts like that are that Karma will come around. Hopefully soon.

 

[Merlin]

A prime example of a lot that is not only wrong with UO, but the world in general.

What's wrong with the world in general are entire threads like this. Further proof of the pussification of America since the people who can't take care of themselves want authority figures to regulate every aspect of their lives. THAT'S what's wrong with the world in general.

 

[old gypsy]

This actually made me laugh. Go back to the real "wild west" and talk to people like some like some of these cyber bullies do and see how long you last. If you read history, and not just watch cowboy movies, you will realize in the old west people tended to treat each other with respect and honesty, as there were real consequences to their actions and words

That's what's been lost. There is no need to take responsibility for what is said now

Sadly, it's a world where freedom has been turned into license... and all too many no longer realize there is a difference.

 

[The Slug]

Sadly, it's a world where freedom has been turned into license... and all too many no longer realize there is a difference.

*nods* but let's not use logic as it only enrages those who can't comprehend it. Besides this has no bearing on me as I no longer play, I just had to comment on that as it made me laugh.

Now Merlin's comment? I'm not commenting on that as it scares me lol

Altho it is ironic that Merlin was Arthur's tutor, (in mythology of course) and Arthur believed in justice and protecting the weak *shrug*

 

[Silentfury]

I'd be willing to see a Dollar a Month hike in my Subscription Rate if it meant 24/7 GM Coverage. Back in the day, these people who have ended up in jail with at the very least a Flagged Account. This type of Conduct is absolutely Intolerable !

 

[Merlin]

Altho it is ironic that Merlin was Arthur's tutor, (in mythology of course) and Arthur believed in justice and protecting the weak *shrug*

Not really too ironic as there is significant difference between protecting the weak (which Arthur and his noble knights did) and enabling the weak (such as what we see throughout modern Western society today).

 

[Shady Ghost]

is one less mouth to feed coming out of my pay check.

That's not how liberals roll.. while it may be one less mouth to feed the same amount of $$ will be taken out and you'll soon start paying into a UO suicide prevention fund, which would be an extra 30 bucks a month out of your paycheck before you get to cash it/auto-deposit it, that maybe 5% of that accumulated money will be spent on institutions throughout your community where freshmen straight out of a liberal arts college who didn't even study psychology or anything pertaining to medicine will become accredited counselors to talk people off the ledge or put the keyboard down.. etc.

And for goodness sakes, don't get me started on 'so-called- conservatives. Ick.

I suppose what I mean is there is a lot of things to get worked up over instead of thinking about committing suicide because XRASTA GAnGStA RaGeX
made one too many yo momma jokes. Honestly, the chat is annoying, sucks, and is nothing but a nuisance, it is unhealthy, disturbing, rude, unpleasant, psychotic, disgusting, and definitely shouldn't be part of a game rated T for Teen even with a little disclaimer that says ratings may change from time to time.. but separating facet chat could help.. and being stern when saying that pvp chatter needs to stay in the intended channel or you may face consequences.. may not be the most effective solution, but it beats out having to pay people more money to monitor chat channels, and does limit the opportunities that present themselves to those who can't control their fingers/mouths.

And for those who are suicidal, nothing worth killing yourself over. Especially not a nearly 20 year old video game. Peace and love.

 

[Candy Cane]

I too hate to see people belittling each other in gen chat but lets get real. All they have to do is turn off their computer or turn off gen chat and the problem goes away. Most everyone playing this game today are adults, I just can't feel sorry for someone who allows themselves to be bullied on a video game. Whats the old saying "Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me".

 

[The Slug]

Not really too ironic as there is significant difference between protecting the weak (which Arthur and his noble knights did) and enabling the weak (such as what we see throughout modern Western society today).

I understand your argument, but again your logic is flawed. Providing a consequence free environment in which to promote bullying is only enabling weakness to the nth degree

 

[Merlin]

That's not how liberals roll.. while it may be one less mouth to feed the same amount of $$ will be taken out and you'll soon start paying into a UO suicide prevention fund, which would be an extra 30 bucks a month out of your paycheck before you get to cash it/auto-deposit it, that maybe 5% of that accumulated money will be spent on institutions throughout your community where freshmen straight out of a liberal arts college who didn't even study psychology or anything pertaining to medicine will become accredited counselors to talk people off the ledge or put the keyboard down.. etc.

And for goodness sakes, don't get me started on 'so-called- conservatives. Ick.

I suppose what I mean is there is a lot of things to get worked up over instead of thinking about committing suicide because XRASTA GAnGStA RaGeX
made one too many yo momma jokes. Honestly, the chat is annoying, sucks, and is nothing but a nuisance, it is unhealthy, disturbing, rude, unpleasant, psychotic, disgusting, and definitely shouldn't be part of a game rated T for Teen even with a little disclaimer that says ratings may change from time to time.. but separating facet chat could help.. and being stern when saying that pvp chatter needs to stay in the intended channel or you may face consequences.. may not be the most effective solution, but it beats out having to pay people more money to monitor chat channels, and does limit the opportunities that present themselves to those who can't control their fingers/mouths.

And for those who are suicidal, nothing worth killing yourself over. Especially not a nearly 20 year old video game. Peace and love.

I'm afraid that is how many liberals do roll (and are far more 'icky' than conservatives, IMHO), but that's an entirely opinionated debate that's probably not appropriate for this thread.

"UO Suicide Prevention Fund"? Not so much. How about maybe some good parenting and teaching for their children to be well-balanced enough that they know some pixels in a 20 year old 2D game isn't worth offing yourself over? As Candy Cane just noted, sticks and stones...

Your point about there needing to be some type of separate PVP channel where smack-talking or 'adults only' chatter should happen is far better idea than 1) paying someone to be chat room baby-sitter or 2) giving unemployed "moderators" ability to ban people / put them in chat time out which ultimately ends up being a game of favoritism. Maybe something along the lines of any one using certain dirty words is automatically moved to this 'X-rated' channel.

 

[Shady Ghost]

I'm afraid that is how many liberals do roll (and are far more 'icky' than conservatives, IMHO), but that's an entirely opinionated debate that's probably not appropriate for this thread.

"UO Suicide Prevention Fund"? Not so much. How about maybe some good parenting and teaching for their children to be well-balanced enough that they know some pixels in a 20 year old 2D game isn't worth offing yourself over? As Candy Cane just noted, sticks and stones...

At the risk of going political, will say, that no amount of people dying is going to reduce the amount of money a liberal will rob out ofyour paycheck to further propagate their vote securing mechanisms. And the UO suicide prevention fund would be another mechanism to help them secure votes, because the liberals behind the action will appear to the suicidal person as the white knights in valiant liberal plate armor that dashed into the offensive conversation and kept them from killing themselves. Which will need more $$ out of your paycheck. You'll never win when you go liberal. Not for voting for them, or playing along with their little schemes. And that is a big reason the conservatives never get anything done, because they are too afraid to confront a lib in their schemes because they'll be branded either a racist/hate mongerer/or uncaring callous person who wants to see the hungry die and the poor get more poor.. (regardless of any grain of truth or complete pathological lies associated with the brandings). I'd suggest watching or listening to anything people like John Kerry/Al Gore/ Nancy Pelosi/ Barack Obama/ Joe Biden/Dianne Feinstein/ Hillary Clinton/ Jonathan Gruber etc.. just anything they got to say. And maybe for the average lib IQ standard, check out Hank Johnson on guam capsizing.

Also peace and love.

 

[Amber Witch]

Unfortunately there are people who behave in ways that hurt others. There are those that think they can do what ever they want, when ever they want, without regard to others. When those that feel this way realize that the " WE" is more important than the "I" then there won't so much of a need for conversations such as this thread.

 

[The Slug]

Unfortunately there are people who behave in ways that hurt others. There are those that think they can do what ever they want, when ever they want, without regard to others. When those that feel this way realize that the " WE" is more important than the "I" then there won't so much of a need for conversations such as this thread.

Shush you! I'm enjoying this debate!

Like I said I no longer have a horse in this race so my opinion doesnt/shouldnt matter. But here's an idea .. enforce the TOS or scrap it altogether. Let people know what they are in for

 

[Merlin]

Iv'e just read all the crap you have posted in this thread..
lol man, are you for real ??
How about you uninstalled uo, got shaved, and got out of mommys basement alittle, you clearly have no idea what life is about.. (specially not the wild west)

DERP

 

[NuSair]

There is a difference between trash talk, cursing every other word because you can, and encouraging someone to kill themselves.

 

[Modoc]

yeah sorry about all those death threats, i get a little carried away.

Eat a Snickers, Your not yourself when your Hungry.

 

[Smoot]

agreed.

 

[Ender]

I can't believe some of the people in here. Then again I've probably seen a few of them spewing their bull in chat, so...

Merlin seems like the type that would blame **** victims for inviting it.

 

[Goldberg-Chessy]

I don't think there's enough players to fill up ignore..are you guys that anti-social? Just ignore it and act like the freaking adults you claim to be..if the suicidal boy can't freaking ignore someone..then there's deeper issues his psychiatrist needs to handle..not the GM's of a damn game! Seriously people! Holy christ! I can't believe this is even a topic for discussion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well said.
Drama queens perpetuating drama is pointless and boring

 

[Goldberg-Chessy]

Iv'e just read all the crap you have posted in this thread..
lol man, are you for real ??
How about you uninstalled uo, got shaved, and got out of mommys basement alittle, you clearly have no idea what life is about.. (specially not the wild west)

Any reason you felt the need to degenerate an MMORPG discussion into referencing someone's grooming habits and their mother?
No offense but you sound a bit like an immature bully when you say things like that bud.

 

[Ender]

Well. Let's hope the new admins here do their job.

 

[Oscar the Grouch]

Lets just tone it down a touch in here, there is a lot of passion in the opinions going around as it is a passionate topic but keep it closer related to the topic at hand please. I did a little thread cleanup if I screwed up any reply trains let me know and I'll try and fix it.

 

[kaio]

Well said.
Drama queens perpetuating drama is pointless and boring

Adapt or duel me !!!!

 

[kaio]

Any reason you felt the need to degenerate an MMORPG discussion into referencing someone's grooming habits and their mother?
No offense but you sound a bit like an immature bully when you say things like that bud.

What exacly do you mean ?
Your reply does sound a bit childish.

 

[Merlin]

What exacly do you mean ?
Your reply does sound a bit childish.

Because your reply to me was sooooo mature.

 

[MalagAste]

Lets just tone it down a touch in here, there is a lot of passion in the opinions going around as it is a passionate topic but keep it closer related to the topic at hand please. I did a little thread cleanup if I screwed up any reply trains let me know and I'll try and fix it.

Thinking you have more work to do here.. infact I'm starting to think that all useful discussion of this topic is finished.

 

[Tanivar]

Somebody will eventually take their life and a family will find out why and bring in the police, then the harassers will be tracked down . Then EA , Broadsword, and the harassers will find theirs names in the news and their asses in a sling.


Wonder if their jollies will seem worth it then.

 

[Ashlynn_L]

A lot of companies have long since woken up to the fact that toxic players like those described in the OP are very damaging to a game's community, reputation and (most importantly for them!) revenue stream. It's a popular subject at things like the GDC and it's interesting to see the analysis and some of the approaches taken to try and curb this sort of behavior in other games.

I think in the case of UO it's a simple matter of resources.

 

[Uriah Heep]

I'd be willing to see a Dollar a Month hike in my Subscription Rate if it meant 24/7 GM Coverage. Back in the day, these people who have ended up in jail with at the very least a Flagged Account. This type of Conduct is absolutely Intolerable !

We already fell for that line of BS...and you see what that $1 a month improvement in CS got us. Don't drink koolaid out of the same glass you had before, people.

 

[TheScoundrelRico]

OMG. I really wish some folks would get a thicker skin. Its teh internets dammit. Not real life...la

 

[Dantes]

OMG. I really wish some folks would get a thicker skin. Its teh internets dammit. Not real life...la

I used to believe that as well. I was quite an ass online as well as in real life, and then I grew up. Just because it's 'teh Internets dammit' doesn't mean you aren't talking to actual people. If you wouldn't say it to their face, don't hide behind a screen & keyboard and say it.

Some people will always be toxic, but it's usually because of their glaring insecurities and lack of respect for themselves as well as fellow human beings.

 

[TheScoundrelRico]

If you wouldn't say it to their face, don't hide behind a screen & keyboard and say it.

I would have no issues saying anything I write to someone so I really wouldn't classify it as hiding...if any of those who have threatened my life via teh webs want, they are free to PM me for my address...la

 

[Deraj]

This thread offends me. Ban it. It offends my sensibilities, therefore I am a victim of it.

If you suggest that I avoid reading the thread, you are victim blaming.

If you suggest that I am overreacting or putting on a false pretense to illustrate a point, you are invalidating my feelings.

If you suggest that I adopt a personal philosophy that upholds mental fortitude and mastering my own feelings in order to deal with a reality I cannot control, you are fostering a harmful environment.

If you disagree with me in any way, you are antagonizing me and a bully.

Ban this thread.

 

[Dantes]

I would have no issues saying anything I write to someone so I really wouldn't classify it as hiding...

Neither would I, but I read a lot of things in general chat that I know for a fact people would not say to another persons' face. The anonymity of the Internet gives some the feeling of a super-human and the lack of actual repercussions only fuels that fire. The fact of the matter remains that some things are better left unsaid. The old saying, "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all", comes to mind.

 

[TheScoundrelRico]

The old saying, "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all", comes to mind.

And while I agree with that...there will be those who don't, and thus another saying that comes to mind. "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen"...la

 

[Aurelius]

All they have to do is turn off their computer or turn off gen chat and the problem goes away. .

No, the problem stays there - all you achieve by adding someone to ignore is to stick your head in the sand and pretend ignoring what is going on makes it go away. Also, suggesting people have the "option" of leaving general chat actually means they lose the ability to use a genuinely helpful and useful part of the game that they pay for, purely so they do not have to read the abuse and insults of antisocial morons who are breaking the rules Broadsword claim to enforce - not an option people should ever have to take, thanks , if Broadsword want people to be 'second class' customers who gets to use only part of the game because Broadsword can't be bothered to keep their word, they can expect to kiss yet more money goodbye.

This stuff is also putting off other people from playing or staying in the game, not many people like their computer screens to be filled with this sort of garbage. Broadsword have rules on their website, they claim they matter, yet manage to invent endless excuses why they 'can't' actually manage to enforce anything - and then add extra insult be claiming they 'care' about us, except people who 'care' sort out the problems, whilst people who want to look like they care just talk about how much they care. Pretty clear which category Broadsword fall in to.

 

[Dantes]

And while I agree with that...there will be those who don't, and thus another saying that comes to mind. "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen"...la

We could do this all day. You are correct with that saying - but it shouldn't apply towards people breaking rules that used to be enforced. I'm just saying that all these work around fixes that have been put into the game as of late, instead of fixing the actual issues outright, will be the downfall of this game.

But hey, at least we're not the League of Legends community. Those people are told to kill themselves thrice daily.

 

[TheScoundrelRico]

I guess the big thing is...are the rules vague in their writing and thus vague in their interpretation?

I've always hated the way the RoC at Stratics are written. One mod may think something written is against the rules where another mod may not and brush it off.

We don't know if there is any monitoring of the UO chat system (doubtful)...but couldn't they be watching, and not feel that certain things have crossed lines where the posters here who are offended do?...la