Fighting with a paladin samurai

[Tsadkiel]

I'm always learning how to use my paladin samurai. I have the template given by Corwin as "defensive example" with 90 healing and the armor model given by duncan. So I don't have resist and I use protection.
When fighting a balron paragon 100HLL is not sufficient, I am often frozen so I have to run as soon as my health is under 80 to heal otherwise I know that if frozen I will die.
I see a video on youtube with someone tanking a balron paragon without moving. Seems to be a sampire. I thought that a paladin samurai was as powerful as a sampire. What did I missed ?
Another one here :

 

[CorwinXX]

When paralyzed use a trapped box.

How much stamina and SSI do you have when cursed?

 

[Tsadkiel]

With DF I have 153 stamina and 40SSI without potions. Cursed don't know will have to ckeck that.

 

[CorwinXX]

looks low...
write a video and/or look how often you swing speed is not 1.25s

 

[Tsadkiel]

Well I died a little to see what happen.
1) My base stats are 120/105/35 and with my armor I have 130 strenght 135 hit points, 120 dex 153 stamina, 43 int 75 mana. I reach 1.25 on my double axe with DF. But when I'm cursed I loose 14% stamina and the speed fall to 1.5. If I'm right, I would need 175 stamina to resist to clumsy. I don't see where I can find that on my armor. I have already 15 dex increase from arties and 33 SI imbued.
2) The second pb I have is when my mana fall down at the moment where I need to cast again DF

 

[Tuan]

Don't you have HML on your axe? You should be mostly at full mana.

Actually, more importantly, how much damage are you doing per hit on average?

 

[Smoot]

sampires tend to do better than bushido healers when there is a slayer and no need to run away. heals every 1.25 seconds rather than every 3 or 4

150 stam is a bit low in my opinion. remember when you take damage you lose stam, and all those chiv spells takes up mana. as healing samurai, your swing doesnt matter quite as much becuase your just using it for mana, stam, and damage, rather than also healing yourself such as a sampire.

I like to have around 180 stam so i can use a bladed staff with no ssi on it, get hit a few times and still swing at max speed.
Or use double axe at 55 ssi for when taking massive damage, and stamina loss at very hard spawns. (can swing at max down to 120 stam)
this is with 20 ssi not on weapons (from suit, divine fury if you use it, or town bonus)

On my bushido samurai (no vamp form) i also use 75 hit life leech on my bladed staffs.
staff looks like
100mana leech
75life leech
50stamina leech
slayer or hitspell
50 hit lower attack.

no damage increase as i have 100 percent on suit.

i use pots sometimes on this character against very hard stuff, but dont rely on them.

Another thing to consider is having a little mana regen, so you can cast your spells even when theres nothing to leech. I have about 5 mana regen for those circumstances.

 

[Tsadkiel]

Tuan, the idea of the template I have was given by Duncan here :
http://stratics.com/community/threads/paladin-template-and-gear.300779/
I use double axes 100HLL 81HML 50HSL slayer with 50 DI
Using honor, DF and slayer with 100DI, I think I am at the higher damage possible. With balrons, I can add EOO for fun.
I kill trasher without healing, same for miasma. My problem is clearly with spellcasters.
Smoot, I understand your 180 stam, I can have them but with potions (183 with potions). To have them without potions, I would have to loose others mods, and I need them all for this template. Well I have only 2 mana regen.
But my question come from the fact I'm not easy with warriors. For me, balron paragons were not so dangerous to need potions and perhaps this template can't tank them. I thought it was only because I don't master the template but I can be wrong. Well, I kill them, but running away for healing

 

[CorwinXX]

Well I died a little to see what happen.
1) My base stats are 120/105/35 and with my armor I have 130 strenght 135 hit points, 120 dex 153 stamina, 43 int 75 mana. I reach 1.25 on my double axe with DF. But when I'm cursed I loose 14% stamina and the speed fall to 1.5. If I'm right, I would need 175 stamina to resist to clumsy. I don't see where I can find that on my armor. I have already 15 dex increase from arties and 33 SI imbued.
2) The second pb I have is when my mana fall down at the moment where I need to cast again DF

Get a 50 EP ring (or 25 ring and brac) and an 1h weapon. Write a macro to equip the ring and the weapon, drink str and dex potions. This gives you 150 STR 150 DEX (150 HP 183 stamina) before curse. If you see that you still haven't enough stamina you can move 5 points from int to dex. Swing speed is VERY important stat. You should have 1.25 most of the time even when cursed.

 

[CorwinXX]

But my question come from the fact I'm not easy with warriors. For me, balron paragons were not so dangerous to need potions and perhaps this template can't tank them. I thought it was only because I don't master the template but I can be wrong. Well, I kill them, but running away for healing

Use Evasion smartly. It helps a lot. Is you feel you need it - use healing non stop (even if you get just few damage start applying bandage).

 

[CorwinXX]

You can also get some SI on jewels.

 

[Tsadkiel]

Thanks Corwin, I have already the EP ring with the macro. My mistake was the thought that it was not needed with this template for a balron paragon. Well I will have to learn healing non stop, it's just for now difficult for me to monitor both healing and DF casting/potions. Thanks also for the trapped box tip. I just had to make a macro to close it after use because I was unable to create one with magic unlock/lock, I only get "this seems to be locked". Going to learn right now.

 

[CorwinXX]

You needn't to close your trapped box. It works well when it is opened. You can move the box window in a corner so most of the window is out of sight (our the boundary of your screen).

 

[Tuan]

Well, I guess I am going to have to go kill some balrons in ishy. I can't say I remember playing with any paragons (seems like a low-upside play) so far. Maybe I will try tonight after work and see how it goes.

 

[CorwinXX]

Depending on template some monsters may be harder or easier. For example, for a classic paladin a paragon balron is easier.

I've just killed (solo) a paragon balron.

98 mac, 85 tactics, 113 parry

cheap 100 lrc suit that my mystic dexter used before he got his current suit

120 str 130 hp
120 dex 161 stam
66 mana
20 hci 50 dci


I used trapped crate, orange petals, NPC str/dex potions (+15 str/dex for 2 min).

This message was posted on Jan 6 2012.

 

[Tuan]

OK, so I just gave this a try. Did two of them. I am a vampire/paladin template: sw, anat, tact, chiv, parry, resist, necro.
All 70s armor, using DF, and probably somewhat importantly, an armored swamp dragon.

I had no trouble at all chaining AIs to kill them. Took 21 and 19 AIs to kill them. Never really even had to think about running off to heal.

Maybe you've just been a little bit unlucky in that when you've missed a swing or two, they're landed big combos, or you've been unlucky with 2 below average leeches in a row when you're low on health or something?

 

[Tsadkiel]

Tuan, as smoot said, they are easier with a sampire, I tried too. Nevertheless, you gave me another idea. I use a double axe. I will try a broadsword to have AI to see if it's better. Don't think it's a pb of luck as a killed dozen of them with the same result (I'm now able to run around the walls without looking at the screen ).

 

[Tuan]

I am not a sampire - I have 0.0 bushido.

Do you use a swamp dragon with dragon's barding? non exceptional dragon armor "saves" 10% of damage from hitting you, exceptional stuff saves 15%. For something that can hit for ~40+ damage past 70 resists saving 6-7 damage per hit, and 2-3 per spell can be a big help.

That is one of the things I was trying to do some testing with on the normal balrons. It looks like they're right on the cusp of where the border is between it being smarter to consecrate and double strike, vs AIs. I suspect that paragons are better to do AIs than double strikes. Since I only had two paragons, I didn't have much time to test my damage w/o AIs.

 

[Tsadkiel]

Tank done following all the advises, only with DF and honor, with a swampy shadow armored, and using greater potions.
As says Corwin, with this template, you MUST apply bandages every 5 sec, use close wounds between and confidence, cast immediatly DF when finished and drink immediatly potions when effect down, use immediatly the trapped box when paralysed and use evasion. If you miss one "immediatly", you are dead. This mean 7 keystokes only to stay alive .
It's now possible to better that with DS or AI, CW or LS (3 keys more). Well it works but I find this template a little difficult to use, compared to a sampire.
What is surprising for me is that it seems that those balrons hit me harder than the navrey.
Thanks to all of you for your help. I'm stubborn : I will continue to improve myself.....

 

[CorwinXX]

With a Bladed Staff (100 HLL, Deamon slayer) you may kill them without using healing skill. Just don't forget about Evasion.
And don't use Close Wounds - during the time you spend to heal you usually take another hit and need to heal again.

 

[Tsadkiel]

Right! I suppose that the double axe must be reserved to the mobs with WW . I will buid a set of bladed staff