Despise fix to stop (slow) griefers

[weins201]

Despise has become a favorite place for grievers to play nowadays. They conscript critters then use the critters to harass Opposite karma players. They do this buy camping the alter and even chase players thru the dungeons and kill off their conscripts while training preventing them from ever being able to answer the call to war. Also they agro other conscripts and lure them into areas that are overwhelming with opposite karma monsters.

Fixes;
1 - once conscripted and turned color or not and in the opposite karma dungeon for gains the Conscript CANNOT go back thru the gate back to their original color side again! Of course grievers would still be able to sit at alter and res kill and blokc players from getting orbs, but one can sneak around that.
2 - a conscript in defensive mode and on a short lease will NOT walk more than 5 steps away from its anchor! this will prevent them from dragging conscripts to their deaths.

Buy keeping the reds out of the blue side they would not be able to kill off good karma conscripts and actually allow players to complete the quests (and visa versa), and the short leash will prevent the luring.

 

[Gospel]

It's supposed to work this way. I would think it obvious considering the theme of the dungeon is a conflict between two opposing forces. Just because you don't like the way it works doesn't mean people are griefing you. Hell, a few of the "issues" you mentioned can be solved simply by controlling your creature better.

 

[Picus of Napa]

Everyone just wants a big red easy button.

 

[cdavbar]

All of what you just said has been pointed out by the devs as being designed that way. I don't really see your issue with people using a dungeon the way it was designed to be used.

 

[Viper09]

Oy, "buy" means to purchase...
But yes, this is how it was suppose to be. Otherwise it would have been changed a long while back. Just find a way to get the upper-hand against the griefers.

 

[SlobberKnocker]

it is pvp in tram. call it for what it is. im not complaining about this, just that if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck it must be a duck.

 

[Winker]

there is no option to vote, "Keep it as is", cause thats how its meant to be...

 

[whiterabbit]

yerg is the way it was meant to be. lebe it alone

 

[weins201]

I was gonna make a more poiniont reply but to many idots in here - please lock this, and those above dont bother replying you are all muted.

 

[Viper09]

Bit of a rash response to people disagreeing with you...

 

[Picus at the office]

That's not very nice.

 

[Winker]

lol

 

[weins201]

well Viper and Picus Rash rash not nice doesn't really matter since the people I were referring to really had no clue, as it has already been stated that that "play style" is grieving and not intended or allowed and the votes seem to be in my favor soo .. instead of catering to them and adding fuel to a fire that really isn't there its easier to just remove them from the thought process all together.

They can still get their conscript and harass whoever they want in the training dungeon.

 

[Mitzlplik_LS]

Ridiculous.

Much ado about nothing. Every dungeon addition shouldn`t hafta be perfectly safe. You already have insurance and a way to lose absolutely nothing but somehow a dungeon that plays on ones karma is a bad thing. Its meant to be challenging ina tram based world. Its the way that dungeon was designed so you should just learn to live with it,otherwise there is already shame and covetous or different times of day when said griefers aren`t griefing,lol.

When I played LS we kept gettin harrassed by some guy that didn`t like our archer method,so he did everything he could do to get it messed up and we all die out. Until! We discorded his pet and invised ours..... next thing ya know,his pet dies and he is ported out. Once you are inside witht he boss you can also kill anothers pet,you take damage but you can kill it...which also ports them out. Alot easier with a discorder.There is ways of dealing with anybody,you don`t always have to run to Stratics and cry foul for an easier resolution. Maybe try changing the time you go there,maybe during less peak times. Earlier in the morning maybe.

I didn`t vote because there is no:

Leave as is choice.

 

[Lord Lew]

Ridiculous.

Much ado about nothing. Every dungeon addition shouldn`t hafta be perfectly safe. You already have insurance and a way to lose absolutely nothing but somehow a dungeon that plays on ones karma is a bad thing. Its meant to be challenging ina tram based world. Its the way that dungeon was designed so you should just learn to live with it,otherwise there is already shame and covetous or different times of day when said griefers aren`t griefing,lol.

When I played LS we kept gettin harrassed by some guy that didn`t like our archer method,so he did everything he could do to get it messed up and we all die out. Until! We discorded his pet and invised ours..... next thing ya know,his pet dies and he is ported out. Once you are inside witht he boss you can also kill anothers pet,you take damage but you can kill it...which also ports them out. Alot easier with a discorder.There is ways of dealing with anybody,you don`t always have to run to Stratics and cry foul for an easier resolution. Maybe try changing the time you go there,maybe during less peak times. Earlier in the morning maybe.

I didn`t vote because there is no:

Leave as is choice.

OMG this is insane!! In one paragraph you're saying that griefing is perfectly ok in your book, and then in the next paragraph you we're being harassed (griefed) while exploiting the game mechanics. I don't even know how respond to this idiocy....

 

[Viper09]

OMG this is insane!! In one paragraph you're saying that griefing is perfectly ok in your book, and then in the next paragraph you we're being harassed (griefed) while exploiting the game mechanics. I don't even know how respond to this idiocy....

Really? Made perfect sense to me. His point summed up says that dungeons shouldn't always be safe, this new one is suppose to be a challenge. All this topped off with a story of how he was able to fight back against a griefer and advice for other players.

 

[Gospel]

OMG this is insane!! In one paragraph you're saying that griefing is perfectly ok in your book, and then in the next paragraph you we're being harassed (griefed) while exploiting the game mechanics. I don't even know how respond to this idiocy....

Your poor attempt at logic is flawed from the point you said using archers was an exploit when indeed it is not. If it were, people would be getting disciplined for doing it. They are not. You are wrong. Have a nice day.

 

[Lord Lew]

In trammel, a dungeon is supposed to be challenging due to its content, not from other players. If I wanted to deal with other payers personal issues, I can go to Fel and do that.

My issue with the reply was his statement that the player did not like his method, and thus began to harass him. The Archery method is an exploit of game mechanics, offers no challenge, and no risk.
And please don't try and argue this, we all know the method uses the ledge,with no way for the champ to reach your critter.

I just found it funny that he combined the two, as funny as I find the rationalization for griefing by saying dungeons were not mention to be safe.

Ahh and with that said, I too will not return to this thread.

 

[Petra Fyde]

Please leave the personal attacks out.
The idea of the dungeon is you kill opposite karma non-conscripted creatures to advance your pet
The idea is NOT that you deliberately ruin someone else's attempt to advance their pets.
Anyone claiming that harassing other people is the point of the dungeon is simply perverting the facts to excuse their grief play.

 

[Otis Leroy Funk]

Then they should change how the system works in that dungeon. I paged and the GMs told me it was a pvp zone
in tram. The goal is to do whatever or takes to get your army power higher than the other side and they give you the ability to basically sic your "pet" on an opposite karma player so guess what I gonna do.

 

[weins201]

Then they should change how the system works in that dungeon. I paged and the GMs told me it was a pvp zone
in tram. The goal is to do whatever or takes to get your army power higher than the other side and they give you the ability to basically sic your "pet" on an opposite karma player so guess what I gonna do.

What GM told you it was a PvP zpne in tram please remember and send his name in he is COMPLETELY wrong and needs to be corrected and dealt with. :gun: But I am sure you dont remember ah well. It is this kind of thinking that needs to be SQUASHED, there is NO such thing as a PvP zone in tram get it thru your heads, if you are being told so in game you need to report the idiot of a GM, he is WRONG!

Despise IS NOT and NEVER was designed to be a place for PvP !!!!!!

 

[Otis Leroy Funk]

Lol wow.... Well all I can tell you is what I was told by the GM and two of my guild mates received the same message. So guess what. We teamed up got organized and went in four straight times. It was fun once we knew the rules and what had to be done.

 

[Viper09]

Lol wow.... Well all I can tell you is what I was told by the GM and two of my guild mates received the same message. So guess what. We teamed up got organized and went in four straight times. It was fun once we knew the rules and what had to be done.

Very nice! I think that is indeed how the devs wanted us to approach the dungeon

 

[Gospel]

Please leave the personal attacks out.
The idea of the dungeon is you kill opposite karma non-conscripted creatures to advance your pet
The idea is NOT that you deliberately ruin someone else's attempt to advance their pets.
Anyone claiming that harassing other people is the point of the dungeon is simply perverting the facts to excuse their grief play.

The pets AI is deliberately designed to attack creatures of the opposite side. I've had players go fumbling by and my pet kills theirs and they accuse me of griefing. The pets are made to attack each other, this is what is called a game mechanic and it is the theme of the dungeon.

Now, continually killing another sides pet may be an ******* move, but I don't think it can correctly be called griefing and it certainly is not an exploit. Not only that, but I've had people try this tactic on me before. It is easily avoided and as I stated in the 2nd post of this thread, most of the things the OP is complaining about can be avoided simply by playing better according to the mechanics of the dungeon.

As for Lord Lew's pathetic argument that using archers is an exploit, he was kind enough to PM me and try to insult me while still providing no evidence or even a solid argument that it is indeed an exploit. If one of our more educated members can show me where this was listed as an exploit I would appreciate it.

 

[Winker]

Lol wow.... Well all I can tell you is what I was told by the GM and two of my guild mates received the same message. So guess what. We teamed up got organized and went in four straight times. It was fun once we knew the rules and what had to be done.

We had a GM turn up and tell us to let the other players have a chance, we were kinda owning the dungeon at that point. We asked the GM if we were playing the dungeon wrong by killing the other players pets. The GM indeed agreed this was the idea of the new content, in his words it was a war of Good Vs Evil to see who could get through to the champ.

But he said we had very little interest in going to the champ and we were just hanging around to kill other players pets, so we were not playing the content as intended, which we had to agree with.

So the long and the short of it was, its ok to kill the other sided pets as long as you intended on going through to the boss. Its not ok to just hang out down there with lvl 15 pets killing everyone on sight, all day long without going down to the champ

 

[cazador]

Lol! All I can say! So funny reading these posts

 

[cdavbar]

The idea of the dungeon is you kill opposite karma non-conscripted creatures to advance your pet

Taken From UO.com:

We have made the following fixes and changes that will be seen after maintenance tomorrow.

• We have made the following changes to the game mechanics of Dungeon Despise (Trammel)
  1. When a player damages any orb-controlled creature, that player will receive retaliatory damage
  2. Players now do less damage to orb-controlled creatures
  3. Orb-controlled creatures now receive a damage bonus against players
• Fixed issue resulting in Despise artifact distribution not rewarding players involved in killing the Despise boss.
• Fixed issue resulting in looting rights not being given to players involved in killing the Despise boss.

Please tell me where this fix says that you are not supposed to kill conscripted creatures? This post makes pretty clear that it is intended that players be able to attack other peoples orb controlled creatures. The dungeon was designed like this, and at first it was too easy to kill other peoples creatures so they implemented a fix that made it more challenging, but not impossible.

As for people whining about it being pvp, it isn't pvp! You still CANNOT attack another player. These are not your "pets". PvP is still limited to Fel, Guild/Alliance Wars, Faction Wars, Arena's and A few little known techniques that can be used in tram rule-set area's *evil grin*.

Simply put if you do not like the way the dungeon works, go to another dungeon. Heck, Fel side still runs the old way, go there, I'm sure what you'll get the second you stroll in there is nothing compared to what is being handed to you in Tram.

And I swear, if the dev's even remotely bow down to this ridiculous request to have the dungeon babiefied like the OP suggests, I then have lost all faith in the development team for sure.

 

[Petra Fyde]

Despise has always been a playground for griefers. I think my first experience of grief play was in there as a newbie warrior at the hands of a bard who followed me around the dungeon provoking anything I was fighting onto something else until I gave up and left.

That at least hasn't changed.

I agree that what Weins201 is asking for is not practical, but there's a vast difference between someone who's conscript attacks another conscript which happens to pass too closely inbetween attacking the un-conscripted creatures and someone who deliberately seeks out other players rather than attack un-conscripted spawn.

I suspect this kind of interference in other's gameplay can not be prevented any more than it could in the past.

On the other hand, players also need to recognise the difference between accidental interference and deliberate interference. Much of the so - called griefing is due to inexpert controlling of the conscripts - on the part of both parties.