Exactly.
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This is moronic, mage armor takes up a property slot, yet all it does is TAKE AWAY all the bonusses. It needs to GIVE bonusses (in this case, the ability to meditate), not destroy any existing ones.
Well I can see why they would be hesistant to allow it to have the inherant lmc..but it should keep the stamina protection imo. I just think that having mages run around in metal armor/studded or boned with both the stamina protection and the extra lmc would be potentially overpowering. So I can understand not being able to keep both bonuses I think. But getting rid of both the inherant lmc AND stamina loss is just too much. This turns mage armor into a rather crappy property :/
Well, my warrior still wears a violet courage and that should count as full plate. Just as many of the other artifacts should count as metal or studded armor. In particular expensive items such as gladiators collars. It's not an option to have them as only medable armor, as the mace and shield is also a compulsory item for many warriors which is medable.
It's called a Tank Mage and we had 'em since the early days of UO. They sacrifice their mana regen for extra defense, nothing wrong with it, IMO.
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Chuckles, did you read the first line of the patch notes? The one that says weapon damage has been normalized according to speed and handedness? The little weapon pictures are decoration. I could have put a kama and a bloodblade up there, or an assassin spike and a sai, or a dagger and a tekagi, or a bokuto and a tessen, or no pictures at all, and none of the stats would change whatsoever. I could change the speed at which base damage is compared to 3 or even 4 seconds and the average would never vary by more than 1.5 points. Your post is a waste of electrons.
SSI has to be imbued into those slots and points I was counting, genius, and specials aren't taken into account because we're not comparing specific weapons, we're comparing ANY two weapons at the same base speed. Congratulations on being the only guy who managed not to understand a simple chart.
Wrong. Even if we ignore parrying and bushido completely, the balance-imbued two-hander is STILL giving up an imbuing slot just to gain a whopping half-point of average base damage. It's laughable.
OH I agree it should still give the stamina protection bonus. I think they were maybe worried about mage armor being too good *which it could be* if they allowed both the lmc bonus and stamina protection. But removing both bonuses is way overkill and does turn mage armor into a rather undesirable property.
Agreed, mage armor has been made to be more of a penalty then anything atm...
I don't think that the LMC bonus should be applied at all to any form of med-able armor, because meditation wouldn't have a use.
but the stamina protection would (IMO) provide a good enough bonus to make mage-armor viable At least with metal armor types, where the stamina protection is very high, I'm Not so sure about studded level stamina protection. I haven't tested the stamina protection changes since the updated publish has made it to TC1.
Yeah I do think there is some twohanded weapons like the ones you listed that will become much more popular. I know I plan on probably making myself a nice executioners axe and hatchet!
Ok im having an issue with the stackable npc refinement resources given from the barrels. It seems every time I put mats form the stack into my pack the weight doubles and wont go away when items are removed. I'm now at 0/125 items in my pack which wieghs 548 stones. This is kind of like the cannonball bug. Except I cant reset my wieght. Closing and restarting the client doesnt help. Any ideas?
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You are talking like a fool bud. If you put balanced on just the 2 handed weapons I mentioned they will become quite popular and deadly in pvp.
Which quite clearly means that the proposed changes to 2 handed weapons will be substantial and viable.
Which quite clearly also means that your chart was complete nonsense no matter what cute little pics you thought to use
- You've got to be ****ing kidding me.
Sooooooo tired of new things being introduced into the game that do not stack when they're quite obviously going to be gathered in quantity.
Sure they will, sport. Now go sit down and let the big kids talk. Maybe try reading and understanding what's in front of you next time, before you spend six paragraphs muttering pointlessly about how nobody uses short spears.You are talking like a fool bud. If you put balanced on just the 2 handed weapons I mentioned they will become quite popular and deadly in pvp.
Which quite clearly means that the proposed changes to 2 handed weapons will be substantial and viable.
Which quite clearly also means that your chart was complete nonsense no matter what cute little pics you thought to use
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So its not possible to just raise or lower a certain resist 5 points without raising/lowering any other?
No kidding I have no idea why they wouldn;t be made stackable from the start! I mean we are going to have to collect a ton of this crap it sounds like if we want to to this refinement thing. As it is right now if they donlt let it stack I wonlt bother with it. I was kinda excited about the resist thing. But heck that doesn;t even seem towork like I hoped it would. I want to be able to add points to specific resists not go up and down the resist list adding a point to each. Though I guess the order does depend on the type of armor? Wonder why they can;t just tell us how that works? Like ok with this armor you start here and this armor starts here. Eh guess it gives me a lot of stuff to test.
It just seems they cant introduce any mechanic without a load of hidden underwater rules that aren't displayed anywhere in game. Users will have to experiment endlessly, read through a decade of patchnotes, beg the devs to clarify in an ask&answer, or read many pages on third party sites to get an understanding what they have to do.
Example of popular online game with bad graphics and simple rules: http://www.realmofthemadgod.com/
Why can't UO just ditch the AOS garbage and get back to the basics?
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My thoughts xactly.
Please, people. Think about these suits/armors. They can only be created by a craftsman who is intimate with the ins and outs of both pvm and pvp. Granted that the existing pvp or pvm person with a lot of experience and daily testing can make suits and armor to sell based on his particular play style, how in the heck can a new player choose to become a craftsman? He is forced to play pvm or pvp intensely in order to understand what is needed. How in the heck can he foresee what others may need so that he can stock a vendor? This is just crazy. Devs......You are creating a monster here. New players will not have a chance and even old players who have not gotten into top of the line pvp or pvm will not be able to participate in even the crafting portion of the game successfully. My gosh, even now, almost every post is by a pvp'r trying his best to maximize his gear to his advantage. Where is is playing time going? Even now, everyone is planning suits and strategies (if he is also expert in crafting) and not out playing the pvp he signed up for. On the other hand crafters are sitting around wondering what to do. In the near future, the crafter style player will be resigned to filling special orders, hoping the person who orders can supply all the needed materials for the crafting and hoping that the resulting "deal" will be a beneficial economic transaction for both.
Indeed, this. Simplify, simplify, simplify. (And stackable, stackable, stackable!)
I made a suit today on TC for my elf: 69/69/69/69/80 and only sacrificing 2% MAX DCI penalty. It wasnt made as well as I would on production shards but still managed 150 str, 205 stam 97 mana, 55% LMC, 55% SSI (icluding 30% on weapon) and 1150 luck (all with with an invigorate bard in tow adding +14 to all stats).. Fought a few unbound ev's. Wow I really like these changes. Almost "too good to be true" really.
Video? Pictures? Please!
I'm wondering how much time will need to be spent finding armor refinement materials, if people choose to use them. I really wasn't seeing a lot of the components as stealables. Have not read yet any feedback from anyone regarding how often they show up in treasure chests, on ships, or as champ spawn boss loot. And with 336 different armor refinement items that come as loot or as stealables, how long is it going to take to get the ones you really want? And will the devs adjust the drop rate so that the most desirable ones have the lowest drop/spawn rate? Only time is going to tell.
Also, if you go to Test Center 1 now, something odd is happening with the barrels of refinement components. Most of them (or in some cases, all of them) are not giving materials to brand new characters that have never used the barrels before. You get the message, "That is locked."
I guess on the bright side of things, the devs DID add barrels at each of the 3 shops giving out commodity deeds for 5,000 each of the solvent, alloy, and braid you need to buy from NPCs. (The commodity deeds don't say what they include though, so you'll want to keep track of what you have until you redeem the deeds.) That was a good move, so you don't have to spend most of your time on Test trying to find a shop that still has some in stock. However, I don't understand what's going on with the barrels of refinement components. I was able to get just now multiple bags of the woodland and gargish stone armor refinement components and none of those 28 unique items will stack identical components in other bags.
I highly recommend that if you want to test any of this stuff, you plan to put up a house on TC and copy over a character or two loaded with a commodity deed box and maybe crystal and corrupted crystal portals and perhaps a stash of armor you've already got made to which you want to apply armor refinements. There's no way to work on this stuff out of the bank, there's just too many materials.
This. Has it been fixed yet, that you can tell?
No fix for it. I had to abandon my crafter and make a new one. I did find out a few things on the new crafter though. I was using the leather braid thingers. Remove the braids from the stack and place them on the ground. then pick them up and put them in your pack. If you get wieght bugged go through one of the moongates to the refinement areas. It should reset your wieght. Unfortunatly I fiddled with it so much on my orginal crafter, he is now too encumbered to move or use a gate
Damn, giving myself a headache trying to figure out a plan for testing in which order resists are added to or taken away from an item if you do the armor refinement. If it varies by type, you'll need samples of every type. Should you use non-exceptional/purchased items only for the testing to make it easier to see what's going on? (Would have to be able to make nonexceptional for the armor types you can't buy from NPCs, I guess.) If you use nonexceptional only, how do you know that the rules don't change for exceptionally crafted pieces? And how do you get enough of the darn refinement materials to confirm your testing if the barrels are locked? Grrr. I guess this would be the starting point for the testing: http://uo.stratics.com/content/arms-armor/armor.php. It's missing the gargoyle armor, though. I tried to check UOGuide, but can't get the site to open.
Wow. Were you using braid purchased from weaver NPCs or from a redeemed commodity deed from one of the barrels?No fix for it. I had to abandon my crafter and make a new one. I did find out a few things on the new crafter though. I was using the leather braid thingers. Remove the braids from the stack and place them on the ground. then pick them up and put them in your pack. If you get wieght bugged go through one of the moongates to the refinement areas. It should reset your wieght. Unfortunatly I fiddled with it so much on my orginal crafter, he is now too encumbered to move or use a gate
And have you figured out what's going on with the message about having better success if you go to xyz shop? I haven't tried again since the other night.
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The message you are receiving is meant to direct you to the correct location to be able to apply the refinements should you be in the incorrect location when you try. The messages depend on whether you are in Fel or Tram, and direct you to the appropriate shop (The shops where the moongates lead on Test Center).
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They were braids from the deed barrels.
Concerning the Mage Armor property, how about when imbued to a non-medable piece of armor, it drops the stamina reduction penalty to 1 class below the item's armor class. If we imbue Plate armor with Mage Armor property, that piece of platemail will have reduced Stamina Reduction similar to a piece of Wood/Stone armor.
I'll simplify armor into classes in order of most to least Stamina Reduction:
Dragon Scale
Metal (Plate, Chain, Ring)
Wood/Stone
Studded/Bone
Leather/Cloth
Mage Armor will still be beneficial but will not be completely useless in terms of this new Stamina Reduction stuff. That being said, Studded/Bone will be useless with Mage Armor but then lets give Studded/Bone armor added inherent properties that might make it more useful, say enhancing with special leathers on only Studded and Bone armor pieces give additional properties not found on regular leather, like inherent 3% HCI.
I'll simplify armor into classes in order of most to least Stamina Reduction:
Dragon Scale
Metal (Plate, Chain, Ring)
Wood/Stone
Studded/Bone
Leather/Cloth
Mage Armor will still be beneficial but will not be completely useless in terms of this new Stamina Reduction stuff. That being said, Studded/Bone will be useless with Mage Armor but then lets give Studded/Bone armor added inherent properties that might make it more useful, say enhancing with special leathers on only Studded and Bone armor pieces give additional properties not found on regular leather, like inherent 3% HCI.
Are you saying that the application of refinements is ONLY supposed to work at NPC shops? I was able to apply them in my house on Test Center and got the message along the lines that I had skillfully and expertly applied the refinement. So what's the point of the message being the same in both locations? It doesn't make sense that you get the same message in both places and then in other places you MIGHT get another message but it doesn't seem to affect anything, i.e., you still end up making the plating, etc. Can you please explain further what the intent is so we know if things are properly or we need to report something as a bug? And why did I get a message to go to Fel Bucs Den? The barrel for smithing refinements that you get to from the Haven gate is at the Brit smith shop on Test Center.
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You can take the components (Wash, Scour, Polish etc) and combine them with the raw materials (Alloy, Braid, Solvent) anywhere. Doing so will yield you plating, resin, or threads. These refinement tools need to be used at one of the locations mentioned in the message.
Also: Where's your house at?
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Actually I thought this over I think only 55 is possible not 58 because only 5 pieces of nonmed armor count towards the inherant lmc. So 55% is the max possible.
Yep its frustrating really. Ahh well guess I do really need to get on test center and test this stuff. I am happy right now for the most part about the armor and weapon changes. Minus something things like them not balancing resists, no parry/evade on twohanded weapons with balanced and of course this refinement mess. Oh and of course the incredibly bad HLD/DCI changes. I have no idea why they think those are a good idea! I wish they would just make it so that you can;t over cap DCI!It just seems they cant introduce any mechanic without a load of hidden underwater rules that aren't displayed anywhere in game. Users will have to experiment endlessly, read through a decade of patchnotes, beg the devs to clarify in an ask&answer, or read many pages on third party sites to get an understanding what they have to do.
Example of popular online game with bad graphics and simple rules: http://www.realmofthemadgod.com/
Why can't UO just ditch the AOS garbage and get back to the basics?
Okay, Kyronix came and fixed my bugged crafter on Test Center (she became overweighted after picking up some braid from a redeemed commodity deed). We also figured out that the message I saw Friday night was indeed from trying to apply plating to something while at the wrong location.
Before I talked to Kyronix, I had done some looking around in Felucca to find out if there were barrels in that facet on TC. I found them. If you go to the Fel Bucs Den bank, there are 3 orange gates that take you to three different NPC crafter shops in Fel where you can find barrels of the refinement components and can make the plating, resin or threads.
The components for wood and stone armor are at the "Tree to Yew" shop in Fel Jhelom near the 3 teleporters in the middle of town. The components for leather and bone armor are at the "Better Leather Tannery" in Occlo. The components for metal armor are at the "Cutlass Smithing" in Bucs Den. (In Trammel, you go to the "Bloody Thumb Woodworks" in Yew, "Aventurer's Clothing" in Trinsic, or "The Hammer and Anvil" in Britain, depending on what you need or want to make.)
I asked Kyronix to reconsider the smithing location for Fel before the final publish, because of the lack of guards in Bucs Den, so he may switch the Fel blacksmithing location for applying armor refinements to another non-faction town in Fel, maybe Cove. He also said that the components / refinement items may eventually be insurable or Siege blessable.
Screen shots of the orange gates and refinement shop in Fel on Test Center are below. I don't know what the two black gates are for. There is a similar pair of silver ones in New Haven that don't seem to do anything yet except sparkle when you walk through them.
Patch Notes
2013 Feb 22 23:22 GMT
Changes to Publish 81 have been patched to TC1. Click on more for the updated publish notes.
Components can be combined with 20 raw materials available from NPC Merchants:
Blacksmiths
(Malleable Alloy)
Weavers
(Leather Braid)
Carpenters
(Solvent Flask)
These should be available elsewhere too such as the way Saltpeter is. The prices need to be roughly 250-300gp each on NPC vendors (to match the 280 price and 500 qty of Saltpeter on NPC vendor) and then need to be available in other ways. I would prefer that it NEVER be available on NPC vendors, but you will never get others to not whine and complain since it would actually take work to get items.
For instance:
- Malleable ally could come as an ore that needs to be mined and smelted.
- Leather Braid could come from tailoring skill. To craft one would need to use scissors on leather to create Leather Scraps. The tailor could then run the scraps through a spinning wheel to create the Leather Braids.
- Solvent Flasks could be made by Alchemists by mixing a Greater Strength Potion with a Scouring Toxin.
These are the changes I would personally like to see implemented to these items.
Because there would be nothing to do. UO is an mmo not a flash game. I'm all for simplification and clarification of current stuff, but going back to pre aos... they might as well just shut the game down.
I'm not saying they need to go back to exactly the same ruleset as we had before AOS, I'm saying that the AOS stuff should be scrapped and the game reworked into a smooth and clear ruleset. Not necessarily a very simple one, but an easy to understand one with quite a bit of depth to it. The easy to learn, hard to master saying comes to mind.
But allright, if you want another example of an MMO with an awesome simple ruleset: Guild Wars 1. Three types of armor, and a two slots for armor properties in which you can choose out of a few dozen properties. Each being equally powerful. Same with weapons, roughly 10 types of weapons, all weapons of the same type dealing exactly the same amount of damage, player can put three properties of choice on the weapon, all properties being equally powerful. Weapons and armor come in dozens of appearance skins, but even the most good-looking sword will have the same damage and capacity for properties as an NPC bought item. Now skills, you can bring 8 skills of which 1 elite skill. There are a few hundred skills to learn. As you can expect, all skills are roughly equally powerful, so as soon as you have 7 and an elite and your NPC-bought weapon, you're good to go.
Easy to learn, you can't really go terribly wrong no matter what you pick. Now unlocking all items and skills to make awesome combos, THAT is hard and cost me over 8000 hours.
I think that is exactly the type of gameplay we need in UO:
* Easy to understand
* Easy to acquire a set of good gear - no large power gap between the most common and the most rare item (in case of Guildwars, common weapon upgrades did 12% situational damage increase and the best ones in the game had 15% situational damage increase)
* Easy to understand the properties of the gear
* Broad selection of properties to choose from, but each being a valid choice and more or less equally powerful
* Freedom to choose the cosmetic appearance of items, artifacts have shiny appearances instead of crazy imba stats
* Crafting should be easy to get in to (and easy to produce something worthwhile to the economy) but have a lot of depth to it and an end result where you can craft something that almost no-one else can (ultimately leading to ability to craft unique combinations of stats or unique appearances of items)
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Kyronix, you might want to also consider moving the Fel location for applying wood and stone armor refinements to a different nonfaction town. Occlo (and Nujelm) on Siege can be a terribly difficult location for some people to get to and from with nonmage characters or if they lose their LRC armor or reagents because there is no moongate that you can use to reach it or return from it. Other nonfaction towns that are within a guard zone and might be good alternatives for the Fel NPC shops on Siege would be Cove, Jhelom, Magincia, or perhaps Serpent's Hold, as long as there are no plans to remove the gate from the EM hall in Britain to the counselor's hall in Serpent's Hold. Mugen has a Trammel facet that is accessible to red characters, so they would have the Trammel locations to use if the Fel locations are too onerous, but Siege has no Trammel facet.
I guess you probably also need a Fel town and a Trammel for applying armor refinements to tinkered earrings and necklaces for gargoyles. I'm assuming that you're going to be putting that out there too at some point for people who buy the next booster.
Edited to add: Maybe not on the tinkering. Seems like the armor refinements are only for nonmeddable armor. Which also makes me wonder if you don't also have more stuff to spring on us with regard to the "armor revamp."
I guess you probably also need a Fel town and a Trammel for applying armor refinements to tinkered earrings and necklaces for gargoyles. I'm assuming that you're going to be putting that out there too at some point for people who buy the next booster.
Edited to add: Maybe not on the tinkering. Seems like the armor refinements are only for nonmeddable armor. Which also makes me wonder if you don't also have more stuff to spring on us with regard to the "armor revamp."
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Ha ha - surely you jest. Lets enjoy the www.uo.com coverage of 'crafting' here http://uo.com/Crafting
Lets see..no mention of reforging, imbuing etc. Lets remember that this is the MAIN PAGE for UO that any new character will start with in terms of understanding the game. Now lets consider why they don't stick around long. Its like giving someone a car and expecting them to maintain it with a user guide that says 'insert key, start car'.
Yeah there really needs to be an "advanced" crafting guide in there as well. Something that explains how things like imbuing and reforging and of course this new refinement system works.
I looked this stuff over a lot & i doesn't understand it at all.
OK, I went and tried this armor stamina stuff again, My results are as follows
Character started at 141 stamina. I went and fought the swoop. Below is the drop in stamina with woodland armor, (5 pieces)
141
136
133
128
121
119
115
106
97
92
84
At this point my health was low to mid 60, up to this point I was losing 2-9 stamina per hit and the swoop was hitting for 9-15 damage(i believe, I will check this again) Upon the next hit I dropped to 47 health and went to 62 stamina. That is a big jump, 22 as opposed to the 2-9. So my question would be why such a big jump with the lower life.
This was done with an elf(should have been a given), and not holding a weapon. Also all 70's resist except energy which was 75. I tried this multiple times with roughly the same results. I then noticed that If you start fighting with not all of your stamina that you will not lose any until several hits later.
Example was:
I have a stamina pool of 141 but after my death was only up to 64, I attacked the swoop and took damage but did not loose any stamina until my health was roughly mid to lower 60's. I then took the big stamina loss of about 20. I did not track how many hits I took from the swoop but this seemed weird to me. I tried this again and had the same results(still did not count the hits taken, I suck as a tester)
I then tried to attack the swoop with a weapon on the same character above, I was not able to keep my stamina up(stamina leach of 50 on weapon) while fighting and had to retreat several times to replenish my health and stamina. (the nerf on stamina leach is the issue with this setup)
I then logged in with my human that is wearing all plate armor. Fought the swoop with no weapon and I did not lose any stamina until I got low on health and then started losing roughly 20 stamina per hit. I tried this multiple times both riding a swampy and standing on the ground. I did not try to fight with a weapon. So I can do some more testing if anyone has any suggestions on how better to test this.
From what I tested: (woodland armor) the initial stamina loss has been reduced from current production shards to the test shard while the stamina loss taken at the bottom end(while health is low) is roughly as it is now on production. The same character setup on Production can kill the swoop standing toe to toe due to stamina leach on the weapon, on Test center I was unable to maintain the swing speed to damage/leach what I need back in time and had to run away to heal/ regain stamina. I tried casting divine fury which was a disaster as I would get hit and as soon as I did would lose the stamina that was just added by the spell. I did not try total refresh potions.
I believe this is the longest post I have ever typed
Character started at 141 stamina. I went and fought the swoop. Below is the drop in stamina with woodland armor, (5 pieces)
141
136
133
128
121
119
115
106
97
92
84
At this point my health was low to mid 60, up to this point I was losing 2-9 stamina per hit and the swoop was hitting for 9-15 damage(i believe, I will check this again) Upon the next hit I dropped to 47 health and went to 62 stamina. That is a big jump, 22 as opposed to the 2-9. So my question would be why such a big jump with the lower life.
This was done with an elf(should have been a given), and not holding a weapon. Also all 70's resist except energy which was 75. I tried this multiple times with roughly the same results. I then noticed that If you start fighting with not all of your stamina that you will not lose any until several hits later.
Example was:
I have a stamina pool of 141 but after my death was only up to 64, I attacked the swoop and took damage but did not loose any stamina until my health was roughly mid to lower 60's. I then took the big stamina loss of about 20. I did not track how many hits I took from the swoop but this seemed weird to me. I tried this again and had the same results(still did not count the hits taken, I suck as a tester)
I then tried to attack the swoop with a weapon on the same character above, I was not able to keep my stamina up(stamina leach of 50 on weapon) while fighting and had to retreat several times to replenish my health and stamina. (the nerf on stamina leach is the issue with this setup)
I then logged in with my human that is wearing all plate armor. Fought the swoop with no weapon and I did not lose any stamina until I got low on health and then started losing roughly 20 stamina per hit. I tried this multiple times both riding a swampy and standing on the ground. I did not try to fight with a weapon. So I can do some more testing if anyone has any suggestions on how better to test this.
From what I tested: (woodland armor) the initial stamina loss has been reduced from current production shards to the test shard while the stamina loss taken at the bottom end(while health is low) is roughly as it is now on production. The same character setup on Production can kill the swoop standing toe to toe due to stamina leach on the weapon, on Test center I was unable to maintain the swing speed to damage/leach what I need back in time and had to run away to heal/ regain stamina. I tried casting divine fury which was a disaster as I would get hit and as soon as I did would lose the stamina that was just added by the spell. I did not try total refresh potions.
I believe this is the longest post I have ever typed
Based on the Dev posts....it's full steam ahead with these horrible additions.
That's the end for me if this garnage goes through.
That's the end for me if this garnage goes through.
ksara........its getting stupid.....
I donlt know we will see they have listened to some of our feedback. Not sure why they seem to be refusing to listen to certain things though. I mean I understand sometimes the feedback players give is not really good because they are just trying to help themselves or its just ranting lol. But things like the HLD/DCI changes being bad have been well explained same with why it is important to balance resists and why making mage armor lose all the stamina bonuses and inherant lmc is a bad idea. However despite these issues I do feel the publish is starting to go in the right direction. I am actually quite happy about somethings, like having more viable options for armor and weapons. I certainly donlt want the publish to go live as it is though. The above issues need to be addressed at the very least and I personally think they should ditch the refinement system. But to be honest if they put the refinement system as it is now I will probably just ignore it.
I can't shake the feeling there is more to the refinement system than what we've seen so far. There has to be a good reason why all those new items were added but identical ones can't be stacked with each other. And it seems very incomplete to me to go to all that work to create a system that only lets you raise or sacrifice resists for some other property just with respect to nonmeddable armor. I'm wondering if something similar will be rolled out that lets you do the same for meddable armor if you sacrifice or add some property that would be useful to spellcasters.
They seem to have laid the train tracks for this pub, and changes and tweaks will be just that, no deviation from the destination of the tracks. The problem is that no one wants to get to the destination at the end of this rail, no matter how many amenities the rail car has. It's sad really, I have ignored content added from so many pubs (town loyalty, Halloween content, invasions, hell, even all of SA including Gargs and imbuing for like a whole year) in the past, and my game play was not really effected at all. To me, the changes being implemented here even with tweaks will not allow me to keep playing and ignore whatever crap was just thrown into the game. In this case, the crap CHANGES core systems of the game that force a casual player to do a whole bunch of research to re-tool their dexxers and crafters in order to continue playing at the same level that they are used to. As a side note, I know a bunch of people who do not read Stratics, and play. I cannot imagine the amount of GM pages that will occur if something similar to this change goes through and these players are given no more notice than a patch notification when they log in...