Cheer up - it could be a lot worse!.

[Bobar]

Seeing all the recent posts relating to scripters and their annoyance factor got me to thinking. Like everyone else they annoy, well more than annoy me, in fact I detest them. But then I thought of how much more satisfying it is to do things by the rules and succeed. Compare that to achieving things through cheating, where is the satisfaction in that?.

How small must your life be to need to do that, how pathetic. To win by cheating is no win at all. It must make them happy and they must have a compulsive need to win at all costs, to have more than anyone else, how sad, when you think about it. So in reality those who dont feel that need should be happy too, after all if things were worse you could be one of them. One should, in fact, feel sorry for them. It is not even a case of holier than thou, most of us like to win but we will achieve no satisfaction from cheating to do so and we know how it feels to play and win in competition by our own endeavours.

So I think we should pity them, the richness of success through your own efforts will forever be beyond them.

Think on this, they KNOW they cheat so how little self-esteem they must have.

 

[GalenKnighthawke]

Seeing all the recent posts relating to scripters and their annoyance factor got me to thinking. Like everyone else they annoy, well more than annoy me, in fact I detest them. But then I thought of how much more satisfying it is to do things by the rules and succeed. Compare that to achieving things through cheating, where is the satisfaction in that?.

How small must your life be to need to do that, how pathetic. To win by cheating is no win at all. It must make them happy and they must have a compulsive need to win at all costs, to have more than anyone else, how sad, when you think about it. So in reality those who dont feel that need should be happy too, after all if things were worse you could be one of them. One should, in fact, feel sorry for them. It is not even a case of holier than thou, most of us like to win but we will achieve no satisfaction from cheating to do so and we know how it feels to play and win in competition by our own endeavours.

So I think we should pity them, the richness of success through your own efforts will forever be beyond them.

Think on this, they KNOW they cheat so how little self-esteem they must have.

In all honesty I think the problem is too much self-esteem; some people are above actually playing.

The constant problems of skill gaining and resource-gathering is, I admit freely, also clearly a factor -- but at the end of the day based on what they say in public some folks cheat just because they see themselves as above playing, to the point where stuff they don't like to do but perceive the need to does not count as "playing." "I just want to play the game," by which they mean do stuff they want to do, and yet reap the benefits and rewards from stuff they do not want to do.

Hmm.

-Galen's player

 

[Eärendil]

One point is true: Nothing beats the satisfaction that comes from investing effort and being successful. I HATED killing all these Devourer of Souls [Renowned]... But I will never forget the day I opened the corpse and found these Animated Leggins. I was happy for 3 days. Think of someone duping an item like this... No satisfaction at all... And I never bought a Tangle. Needed about 250 Navs for my first one - and then it rained Tangles... But I never forget the first one. Some day I will get a Slither... It will be a glorious day...

Also, I will never forget my first EM-event-item. Lucky me, it happened BEFORE they changed it towards the top-damager (which was a very wrong thing to do). I was there with a weak template, gave my very best, opened the corpse and there it was: A gorget with Blackthorns family emblem... Fantastic.

But at least, it isn´t items, that gives best satisfaction: Seeing people attending your guildies auctions and having fun, helping a friend to get a Castle... Making a nice suit for a newbie (as a present, of course), laughing your a**se off when you and your guildies fail a 100 times while trying to get those damn keys for the Shimmering...

I will never forget when I got my first Legendary Artificer. It was such a long way and so much hard work...

This game has so much to offer...

 

[Bobar]

I would imagine that a fair amount of the scripting and other types of cheating, of whatever type, is done in order to derive a real life income from UO or to be able to purchase desirable game items or codes (e.g., game-time codes or soulstone codes) with in-game gold. I would imagine that someone involved in either situation has probably defined their own unique set of goals and "rules" for how they play UO and doesn't much care any more about the simple satisfaction of acquiring something in UO by playing within the ToS/RoC.

You are almost certainly right about some gaining income from the game. But doesnt that just make it just another form of..... ugh WORK?

As for the game time codes etc that seems to be a catch 22 situation, script to get more game time so they can script and get more game time so they can, and so on ad infinitum.

Whatever the reason they obviously lack something the rest of us have. Morals? Ethics? Principles? Standards? something is missing or in very short supply. I am just grateful it is not me and that cheers me up no end

 

[SlobberKnocker]

tina is spot on. i would tell you some are making pretty good coin off this game, even given the current state of gold prices.

the cheating that goes on in regards to pvp is a horse of a different color.

the bottom line is this is on the games, heads. for whatever reason, i.e. legal, manpower or lack of interest, the cheating and scripting is largely un regulated by the game's management. sure they burn a house or two every so often but in the end of the day, scripter/cheaters pay subscriptions too. This is like having porn channels for sale at every major hotel chain. noone at marriot or hilton will ever talk about it on a business network tv show but there making a hell of a lot of coin off it.

 

[Zosimus]

If pixels didn't have any monetary value scripting would not be an issue. It wouldn't even exist in the most part.


Voyage Century Online has actually a "feature" where you can go afk and gain levels and loot. Since it's allowed there is no issue. You can die though and you will weigh down after a while to a crawl once you have to much weight. Maybe the UO devs should look into something like this as a "feature" since policing the issue is a total fail.

 

[Cyrah]

After today my only hope for this game is with Mesanna.

 

[Gospel]

You are almost certainly right about some gaining income from the game. But doesnt that just make it just another form of..... ugh WORK?

As for the game time codes etc that seems to be a catch 22 situation, script to get more game time so they can script and get more game time so they can, and so on ad infinitum.

Whatever the reason they obviously lack something the rest of us have. Morals? Ethics? Principles? Standards? something is missing or in very short supply. I am just grateful it is not me and that cheers me up no end

I'm sure it's enjoyable to think you're somehow superior to people that script. Isn't that why Jerry Springer and reality TV are so popular? But like most people who insist on discussing the scripting issue, you're so single-minded in your thinking it blinds you to any opinion other than your own.

Have you ever considered maybe people who script are doing it so they don't have to stare at their computer for hours on end repeating menial tasks to train a skill or acquire a resource? While they are no doubt cheating in the game, they're also getting a lot more actual enjoyment out of the time they do spend in game because they're not forced to "grind" the parts of the game that so many people do.

The vast majority of scripts are to train skills, not cheat you out of your IDOC loot or cheat you out of pvp victories. Many other scripts are simple repetitions of other boring tasks, such as filling BODs. Using a script for skill gain is hardly ruining or even affecting your gameplay.

Do I think it's ok to do this? No. It takes the value away from the time I spend actually doing things in the game. It makes earned rewards seem trivial when someone can do it while they sleep or watch TV. But saying people who script don't have morals or ethics or are somehow inferior to "normal" people is a really stupid thing to say. I don't know if you're ignorant or just trying to find a way to lash out and get your payback against the vile scripters, but saying it like that brings your own morals and ethics into question, does it not?

If you really want to make a difference in the cheating in UO, people who dupe do far more damage than people who script. Maybe you guys should be brainstorming that problem every other thread since none of you seem to have any idea what scripting actually does.

 

[Lord Lew]

Gospel, your like a skipping record, repeating your dogma on each thread. You seem to think you know everything about scripting, and if someone disagrees, they are ignorant. Please refer to the terms if service for uo and then re-justify your position.

As for duping, yes it's bad, and I'm sure some if us do our part to help rid the game if this as well. I myself have turned in and helped demonstrate the technique that I stumbled into by accident. And yes it was on accident, and no I did not duplicate anything for myself. I sent in the bug report, and sent an email message Mesanna about what I discovered. It was fixed and implemented quite fast. They took a proactive approach instantly, even providing me with things I lacked on test to check the fix and help tweak it if need be.

And I'll state what was sated above. Mesanna has made a believer out if me, I look forward to where she is leading the team. Sure there will always be griefers and such, but the future may just be a bright light with her at the helm. I await in anticipation for the rumors to become reality, for the real true dawn of a renewed UO, based on community and fun. I BELIEVE!!!!!

 

[Dan123The123Man]

One point is true: Nothing beats the satisfaction that comes from investing effort and being successful. I HATED killing all these Devourer of Souls [Renowned]... But I will never forget the day I opened the corpse and found these Animated Leggins. I was happy for 3 days. Think of someone duping an item like this... No satisfaction at all... And I never bought a Tangle. Needed about 250 Navs for my first one - and then it rained Tangles... But I never forget the first one. Some day I will get a Slither... It will be a glorious day...

Also, I will never forget my first EM-event-item. Lucky me, it happened BEFORE they changed it towards the top-damager (which was a very wrong thing to do). I was there with a weak template, gave my very best, opened the corpse and there it was: A gorget with Blackthorns family emblem... Fantastic.

But at least, it isn´t items, that gives best satisfaction: Seeing people attending your guildies auctions and having fun, helping a friend to get a Castle... Making a nice suit for a newbie (as a present, of course), laughing your a**se off when you and your guildies fail a 100 times while trying to get those damn keys for the Shimmering...

I will never forget when I got my first Legendary Artificer. It was such a long way and so much hard work...

This game has so much to offer...

.... And then there was a revert.... Due to unforseen things... Which are also due to unforseen circumstances... Which ultimately lead to unforseen this and unforseen that and.... Well it never ends.

(hears the sirens)

sorry, couldn't resist lol

 

[Doubleplay]

Actually, we have a whole generation who may never know the satisfaction of being self reliant and "moral". I see teens today getting someone to pay 60 bucks for a game, and the first thing they do is memorize the cheats found via a google search. By the time their game arrives it is a mad dash to the endgame. They say the world is changing, get with the program. That is just the point, these people are programmed. When they fail, they don't even know it.

 

[weins201]

I'm sure it's enjoyable to think you're somehow superior to people that script. Isn't that why Jerry Springer and reality TV are so popular? But like most people who insist on discussing the scripting issue, you're so single-minded in your thinking it blinds you to any opinion other than your own.

Have you ever considered maybe people who script are doing it so they don't have to stare at their computer for hours on end repeating menial tasks to train a skill or acquire a resource? While they are no doubt cheating in the game, they're also getting a lot more actual enjoyment out of the time they do spend in game because they're not forced to "grind" the parts of the game that so many people do.

The vast majority of scripts are to train skills, not cheat you out of your IDOC loot or cheat you out of pvp victories. Many other scripts are simple repetitions of other boring tasks, such as filling BODs. Using a script for skill gain is hardly ruining or even affecting your gameplay.

Do I think it's ok to do this? No. It takes the value away from the time I spend actually doing things in the game. It makes earned rewards seem trivial when someone can do it while they sleep or watch TV. But saying people who script don't have morals or ethics or are somehow inferior to "normal" people is a really stupid thing to say. I don't know if you're ignorant or just trying to find a way to lash out and get your payback against the vile scripters, but saying it like that brings your own morals and ethics into question, does it not?

If you really want to make a difference in the cheating in UO, people who dupe do far more damage than people who script. Maybe you guys should be brainstorming that problem every other thread since none of you seem to have any idea what scripting actually does.

Take your close mined opinion else where, you want everyone else to. The one who has NO clue what scripting is seems to be you. You have entered almost every thread on the subject bashing everyone else. Scripting is cheating as you say and understand.

Breaking the law is breaking the law and should be dealt with not allowed. That is the point of just about every stop scripting post i have seen. you seem to think its OK. All the repetitive tasks you think are scripted can be repeated in the EC client without any problem alleviating repetition and no need to script and use 3rd party programs to do it.

If you are not going to be constructive in your reply and just bash other peoples opinions, keep them to yourself.

 

[Dan123The123Man]

"Breaking the law is breaking the law "

Scripting or cheating in Ultima Online is NOT breaking the law by any means. Frowned upon and punishable by being banned sure. Breaking the terms of service sure. But literally breaking any law? Sorry, no. I know my post here probly won't be viewed as "constructive" but hopefully will educate some people that seem to think that you will break any real law. China maybe but not in the US for say "scripting" somehow in ultima online.


Unless ofcourse you meant to say:

"Breaking the RULES is breaking the RULES "

?

 

[Bobar]

I'm sure it's enjoyable to think you're somehow superior to people that script. Isn't that why Jerry Springer and reality TV are so popular? But like most people who insist on discussing the scripting issue, you're so single-minded in your thinking it blinds you to any opinion other than your own.

Have you ever considered maybe people who script are doing it so they don't have to stare at their computer for hours on end repeating menial tasks to train a skill or acquire a resource? While they are no doubt cheating in the game, they're also getting a lot more actual enjoyment out of the time they do spend in game because they're not forced to "grind" the parts of the game that so many people do.

The vast majority of scripts are to train skills, not cheat you out of your IDOC loot or cheat you out of pvp victories. Many other scripts are simple repetitions of other boring tasks, such as filling BODs. Using a script for skill gain is hardly ruining or even affecting your gameplay.

Do I think it's ok to do this? No. It takes the value away from the time I spend actually doing things in the game. It makes earned rewards seem trivial when someone can do it while they sleep or watch TV. But saying people who script don't have morals or ethics or are somehow inferior to "normal" people is a really stupid thing to say. I don't know if you're ignorant or just trying to find a way to lash out and get your payback against the vile scripters, but saying it like that brings your own morals and ethics into question, does it not?

If you really want to make a difference in the cheating in UO, people who dupe do far more damage than people who script. Maybe you guys should be brainstorming that problem every other thread since none of you seem to have any idea what scripting actually does.

Well lets see......
Yes it is only my opinion and others can agree or disagree as they will, that is the point of forums and I will freely state that I do indeed think that all people who refrain from cheating are superior to those that dont. They are honest players which obviously leaves scripters and such as dishonest. Of these 2 attributes which is to be admired? which is SUPERIOR?. So yes , guilty as charged.

No I have not considered why people script, it is immateriel to me why they do, it is cheating pure and simple. So some aspects of the game are boring and they script, that is a reason not a justification, there is no justification.

I guess I must be really stupid because I do think they lack something, I proposed several alternatives for consideration, why do most players not script? because they have principles. what does that leave scripters to have? obviously much lower principles if indeed they have any.
So you dont think that those who script lack ethics? by that reasoning scripting is ethical is it not?. I think few would agree.

As for duping while people would agree it is a massive and enduring problem it is difficult to imagine an ingame sutuation where someone would say 'somebody was duping there that caused that and I saw it' There are times when scripting can be seen to have been done something. Duping does not fall in the same category and it would be difficult for players to brainstorm any solution as you suggested.

Finally you point out that none of us have any idea of what scripting actually does. Well perhaps that should not be any great surprise because most players dont script so why should they?. Even the average player however has some idea of game mechanics and when seeing the same thing, which falls outside them, several times begins to smell rodent.

Your statement implies however that you have an intimate knowledge of how to script so we should all perhaps bow to your superior knowledge.

 

[cdavbar]

The vast majority of scripts are to train skills, not cheat you out of your IDOC loot or cheat you out of pvp victories. Many other scripts are simple repetitions of other boring tasks, such as filling BODs. Using a script for skill gain is hardly ruining or even affecting your gameplay.

Boy, then you know nothing of scripting if you believe this. As for IDOC loot or cheats, until the advent of the house placement delay and tool timers scripting at IDOC's was rampant. Nowadays people want to scream scripter because they lost the spot or loot. However it is impossible to script loot/place IDOC's these days and have even the slightest edge over non-scripters.

As for the majority of scripts and what they do, they do dang near everything. You are also wrong on your little pvp victories line. While most pvpers are honest rule abiding murderers, there are also a vast array of scripts and hacks out there that can automate 97% of a pvp battle so all you have to do is run after your target, without having to worry about tombstones or twigs etc cuz you can run through them.

I'm not just trying to pick on you here either. I think too many people are naive in the possibilities and uses of scripting. I also think that after 15 years of inaction by the developers (yes they may have taken some action but really?) it is something that has become accepted on some level and really discussions should stop.

Alas, it is a never ending argument between everyone that will never be settled. Even after the days of UO are nothing but a memory, there will still be people complaining and blaming things on a scripter when there was more the devs could have done a decade ago to combat it.

Just my two cents.

 

[HonorableAdventurer]

Boy, then you know nothing of scripting if you believe this. As for IDOC loot or cheats, until the advent of the house placement delay and tool timers scripting at IDOC's was rampant. Nowadays people want to scream scripter because they lost the spot or loot. However it is impossible to script loot/place IDOC's these days and have even the slightest edge over non-scripters.

As for the majority of scripts and what they do, they do dang near everything. You are also wrong on your little pvp victories line. While most pvpers are honest rule abiding murderers, there are also a vast array of scripts and hacks out there that can automate 97% of a pvp battle so all you have to do is run after your target, without having to worry about tombstones or twigs etc cuz you can run through them.

I'm not just trying to pick on you here either. I think too many people are naive in the possibilities and uses of scripting. I also think that after 15 years of inaction by the developers (yes they may have taken some action but really?) it is something that has become accepted on some level and really discussions should stop.

Alas, it is a never ending argument between everyone that will never be settled. Even after the days of UO are nothing but a memory, there will still be people complaining and blaming things on a scripter when there was more the devs could have done a decade ago to combat it.

Just my two cents.

I assure you people who downplay and try to justify the use of scripts know very well all the "Benefits" of scripting ...just do a search of their posts you shall see

 

[SlobberKnocker]

Player 1: I'm shocked, shocked to find cheating going on in this game!!!"

Player 2: (to player 1) ''youre 29 valorite hammers are ready for pick up. please meet at my vendor''

Player 1: (to player 2) ''Thank you"

 

[Sauteed Onion]

Player 1: I'm shocked, shocked to find cheating going on in this game!!!"

Player 2: (to player 1) ''youre 29 valorite hammers are ready for pick up. please meet at my vendor''

Player 1: (to player 2) ''Thank you"

Allow me to make some adjustments prz.

Player 1: I'm shocked, SHOCKED to find cheating going on in this game!

Person on ICQ: Your 29 valorite hammers are ready for delivery, top of luna bank. Hey you sure we can't interest you in some Barbed Runic Sewing Kits?

Player 1 to person on ICQ: Thanks.

 

[SlobberKnocker]

i ripped off a classic scene from the movie Casablanca to make that post. figure i should explain it.

 

[Gospel]

Boy, then you know nothing of scripting if you believe this. As for IDOC loot or cheats, until the advent of the house placement delay and tool timers scripting at IDOC's was rampant. Nowadays people want to scream scripter because they lost the spot or loot. However it is impossible to script loot/place IDOC's these days and have even the slightest edge over non-scripters.

As for the majority of scripts and what they do, they do dang near everything. You are also wrong on your little pvp victories line. While most pvpers are honest rule abiding murderers, there are also a vast array of scripts and hacks out there that can automate 97% of a pvp battle so all you have to do is run after your target, without having to worry about tombstones or twigs etc cuz you can run through them.

I'm not just trying to pick on you here either. I think too many people are naive in the possibilities and uses of scripting. I also think that after 15 years of inaction by the developers (yes they may have taken some action but really?) it is something that has become accepted on some level and really discussions should stop.

Alas, it is a never ending argument between everyone that will never be settled. Even after the days of UO are nothing but a memory, there will still be people complaining and blaming things on a scripter when there was more the devs could have done a decade ago to combat it.

Just my two cents.

Everyone's an expert on scripting I guess. No, they can't make you run through impassable objects. That's just ridiculous and kind of takes the rest of your post into question. I do agree with your last statement though.

As for Bobar's moral debate, it really shows you regularly search for a reason to feel superior to others. If you've ever put a penny on the keyboard so you didn't log out, you're just as guilty, so stop pretending you're above everyone else. Ever gone a few MPH over the speed limit. Gasp! You're immoral!

And for the hallowed "new player" two things. One, it must be disheartening to come to the forums and see all the complaints of cheating. I wouldn't join a game like that. And two, there are several guilds that upon your joining will instruct you how to script and openly discuss it as a common practice.

Bottom line, regardless of my opinion or yours, is that cheating is happening on a massive scale and nobody is going to put a stop to it. If you continue to waste your time discussing it, that's your problem, but while you're typing away on stratics another scripter is filling his pack with runics. If that makes you feel superior, far be it from me to break the illusion you've worked so hard constructing for yourself.

 

[Sauteed Onion]

Everyone's an expert on scripting I guess. No, they can't make you run through impassable objects. That's just ridiculous and kind of takes the rest of your post into question. I do agree with your last statement though.

Not an expert on scripting or hacking, but I could point you in the direction of a youtube video some igmo made of themselves and shows "stump" hack in full swing. Anyone that wants the video just shoot me a pm.

Also just go google cheats for any mmo off the top of your head, you'll be surprised..

 

[Gospel]

Not an expert on scripting or hacking, but I could point you in the direction of a youtube video some igmo made of themselves and shows "stump" hack in full swing. Anyone that wants the video just shoot me a pm.

If you've never heard of player run servers, consider this your introduction.

 

[Sauteed Onion]

If you've never heard of player run servers, consider this your introduction.

This took place on test server on production.

 

[HonorableAdventurer]

Bottom line, regardless of my opinion or yours, is that cheating is happening on a massive scale and nobody is going to put a stop to it. If you continue to waste your time discussing it, that's your problem, but while you're typing away on stratics another scripter is filling his pack with runics. If that makes you feel superior, far be it from me to break the illusion you've worked so hard constructing for yourself.

And yet you are in every scripting discussion trying to justify scripting , trying to sway people from demanding something be done .... Why dont you stop wasting your time seeings how confident you are nothing will ever change and find something else to do while enjoying the "Benefits" of scripting

 

[Petra Fyde]

And this thread has turned into the usual trainwreck when this topic is brought up. Time to end it.