losing money on vendor fees

[Raptor85]

I've always played a Forager/Crafter type. The reason I can make money doing it is because many Players don't want to spend thier available playtime gathering materials and making things they need themselves. They'd rather pay someone else to do it. PvPers want to PvP, PvM hunters want to hunt big bad monsters. I like to make things

This only works on shards/with items where you can price at a considerable profit over cost and still be within the range people are willing to pay, and yes, very true, I WANT to buy armor, I WANT to buy weapons...but I have to ask around in general chat for people to make me one as nobody stocks or wait for a guildmate with a crafter currently active to log in.

Theres a vendor in luna atlantic that sells abyssal cloth
It also has single clean bandages (must be a rare?) at 100 mil each
I think theres over 20 of em
My questions are
1 how much to keep that vendor up?
2 why they cost so much
3 who in their right mind will buy them????
4 and last im curious how much the most expensive vendors charge per day?
I have about 50 vendors and i stocked them pretty well and im paying 136k a day
Never been higher than 200k a day in total

They're transferring gold between accounts, it's the easiest way to do it for large amounts. That said though some items the vendor fees don't really matter, for artifacts, rares, vet rewards, and such the pricing is generally far above the investment that even losing 30% on vendor fees you're still well ahead . Also if you sell in high volume the vendor fees become less of an issue as what you lose on some items is generally made up by others, farming all resources yourself also you'll make a good profit if you're willing to put that kind of time into it. The problem is mostly in the low through mid-high range of items where the vendor fees actually can keep you from stocking your vendors, for instance nobody stocks decent dexxer suits as they'd cost a good 500-600k minimum and the selling rate is pretty low, you'd make a log more gold selling the mats to make it than the suit and it would take you far less time...or use the mats you would have used to make that suit to make 5 lesser ones that sell faster.

 

[Tanivar]

Tanivar said: ↑

I've always played a Forager/Crafter type. The reason I can make money doing it is because many Players don't want to spend thier available playtime gathering materials and making things they need themselves. They'd rather pay someone else to do it. PvPers want to PvP, PvM hunters want to hunt big bad monsters. I like to make things​

This only works on shards/with items where you can price at a considerable profit over cost and still be within the range people are willing to pay, and yes, very true, I WANT to buy armor, I WANT to buy weapons...but I have to ask around in general chat for people to make me one as nobody stocks or wait for a guildmate with a crafter currently active to log in.

I don't normally price at much over materials cost unless there is a lot of time involved or the vendor is in Luna and I want to avoid being a supplier for another higher priced vendor. I do orders at around 20% over my cost in materials I provide, the exotic stuff from ML & SA dungeons has to be provided by the customer. I don't fare well where Bad Things play. <g>

I've still got over a hundred 1 million gold checks and thats more than enough. I took a break last December and chucked about 50 odd checks out in Luna when I was packing stuff away. Unless UO provides a way to store larger amounts convienently, why clutter up your UO storage with hundreds of useless checks?

 

[Raptor85]

the exotic stuff from ML & SA dungeons has to be provided by the customer.

How do you load them on your vendors if they have to be provided by the customer so you can make the stuff at time of purchase? That's kinda my point, you need that stuff to make armor that's worth wearing, so if that's not the stuff on the vendors where do i find vendors where I can reliably go and buy a suit like that? I can't, that's the issue, nor could I afford to keep such suits in stock when my crafter was active as It was driving me bankrupt.

 

[Sevin0oo0]

Nabin mentioned the "fun" of searching for vendors providing certain services. While yes, with time to kill, just running around the country side, looking and shopping is fun, and some good deals can be found. If it's something I really need, spending hours of "fun" scouring the countryside isn't really an option, and becomes a grind. Just shopping in Luna where they're easier to find is a grind, hence the popularity of search sites.

 

[Tanivar]

How do you load them on your vendors if they have to be provided by the customer so you can make the stuff at time of purchase? That's kinda my point, you need that stuff to make armor that's worth wearing, so if that's not the stuff on the vendors where do i find vendors where I can reliably go and buy a suit like that? I can't, that's the issue, nor could I afford to keep such suits in stock when my crafter was active as It was driving me bankrupt.

What I make as stock for vendors, and what I craft for customers who place orders for things to be crafted for them are two different things.

The items for vendors are basic things that many might be interested in buying, say a basic suit of All 70's Resists armor, nothing else added.

An order placed by a customer would be something like 5/6 of a suit of All 70's Resists armor with extra high numbers for certain Resists to go along with a favorite helm. Make it with Mana Regeneration 2 on all 5 pieces and Nightsight included. Or it might be a Crossbow with certain bonus's.


"That's kinda my point, you need that stuff to make armor that's worth wearing"

The idea of what is worth wearing varies from person to person. Depends on what the character needs per his skills and purpose. I could make uber armor, with very nice bonus's imbued in, that a couple of people might be interested in, but putting high value items few would want on a vendor is a bad idea, it sits to long. That couple of Players could both have similar gear already with 200 Durability left. I'd be checking to see if the item sold each day for years and paying the vendor fee each of those days. If your after specific exotic gear, then your going to have to place an order with a Crafter for it. Crafters are not inclined to put a fortune in gold into making something exotic thats going to sit on a vendor for ages because there is little, if any, demand for it.

Even with vendor fees removed, you still are going to have all the gold involved in crafting the exotic gear tied up , effectively useless, for however many months it takes for someone to become interested in buying such gear, and finding it. Vendor fees don't influnce that one bit. <shrug>

 

[Raptor85]

I'd be checking to see if the item sold each day for years and paying the vendor fee each of those days. If your after specific exotic gear, then your going to have to place an order with a Crafter for it. Crafters are not inclined to put a fortune in gold into making something exotic thats going to sit on a vendor for ages because there is little, if any, demand for it. <shrug>

So, let me get this straight, the kind of armor I'm looking to buy (standard 70's suit with max stats/MR/LMC, basicly the exact same thing most warriors buy, nothing exotic) you can't put on your armor vendor with your other suits to keep avaialable when people are looking to buy it because they sell slowly so the vendor fees are too expensive....which is exactly the problem, you're picking and choosing a few specific items to sell that sell quickly, meanwhile a lot of crafted things many of us need are simply not available. I only play a hour or two a day tops, when I log in, If i lose my armor I want to be able to replace it quickly, but as is now I get to sit around for a few days asking if anyone wants to take on an imbue job in general chat, losing my gear generally puts me at a disadvantage where I don't have a full suit of armor to wear for a good week or two, as I end up having to wear bits and pieces looted from others. I'm not a pvmer, and I'm not a crafter if I can so help it, and I don't have hours to wait around doing nothing while waiting for a crafter with mats to say "yeah, I can make that". I'd rather see vendors loaded up with gear so I can pick and choose what I need instead of peple being afraid to stock something since it might not instantly sell due to vendor fees.

 

[Tanivar]

So, let me get this straight, the kind of armor I'm looking to buy (standard 70's suit with max stats/MR/LMC, basicly the exact same thing most warriors buy, nothing exotic) you can't put on your armor vendor with your other suits to keep avaialable when people are looking to buy it because they sell slowly so the vendor fees are too expensive....which is exactly the problem, you're picking and choosing a few specific items to sell that sell quickly, meanwhile a lot of crafted things many of us need are simply not available. I only play a hour or two a day tops, when I log in, If i lose my armor I want to be able to replace it quickly, but as is now I get to sit around for a few days asking if anyone wants to take on an imbue job in general chat, losing my gear generally puts me at a disadvantage where I don't have a full suit of armor to wear for a good week or two, as I end up having to wear bits and pieces looted from others. I'm not a pvmer, and I'm not a crafter if I can so help it, and I don't have hours to wait around doing nothing while waiting for a crafter with mats to say "yeah, I can make that". I'd rather see vendors loaded up with gear so I can pick and choose what I need instead of peple being afraid to stock something since it might not instantly sell due to vendor fees.

A 70s suit with max stats, I'm guessing MR2 on each piece, and the max LMC possible of 40% is one very exspenive outfit to make. The LMC would take *at least* 25 relic fragments at around 40,000 each, a good one million right there. 50 Essence of Order at 30,ooo each for another 1 1/2 million. The MR2 on six pieces of armor will take 60 Seeds of Renewal which are around 75,000 each for another 4 1/2 million. Thats 7 million in materials right there. *Seven Million*.

If having this "standard 70's suit with max stats/MR/LMC, basicly the exact same thing most warriors buy, nothing exotic" is really important, I'd say bribe some Crafter to make you a half dozen such suits to stash in the bank, then reorder a replacement as you lose each one.

Better yet, with this being a standard suit, why don't all of you who use them get together, pool the gold, one of you spend a couple play sessions crafting the suits, and just keep a vendor or group chest stocked, rotating the job of making the suits around the group.

The vendor fee for a 7 million gold single item is 42, 060 a day. A mere 6/10 of one percent of the price. With a group all getting thier replacement armor suits from one group vendor, the vendor fee would be meaningless as the stock would sell and not sit long term. Someone loses each fight. <shrug>

 

[Raptor85]

while a few dozen suits would last me until doomsday (I mean....I only need like 1 a month, I rarely lose mine it's more of the pieces just wear out, you don't buy one "each fight" just as you need new armor) I neither have the storage nor the reserve funds to buy a dozen suits at once just to keep as spares, neither do I have the time to waste playing crafter/gatherer. (also, I buy suits like that for about 700k here)

I don't get the argument though, you seem to agree that slow sellers eat too much gold to keep on vendor, but then you argue that it's fine that it's like that I can just make it myself or wait for someone in chat? Why are you so against the fees being fixed so, say, you could leave 1-2 such suits on your vendor so that in time people will buy them and you can just refill them next restock? Would it be so horrible if instead of hundreds of empty vendors with their last restock dates dotting the countryside that, you know, those of us who only play a few times per week/month can afford to keep things worth more than 499 gold in stock?

You being a crafter may be able to make your own stuff, so maybe you simply have no idea how hard it is to get things you need right now with such a low population and so few shops stocked....If something happens in battle and you lose your last helmet/hat what do you do? Right now, spam general chat for 3-4 hours or log off and play a different game. Same with weapons, nobody keeps them stocked, not even "simple" ones anymore because they don't sell fast enough to outpace the vendor fees.

 

[Tanivar]

while a few dozen suits would last me until doomsday (I mean....I only need like 1 a month, I rarely lose mine it's more of the pieces just wear out, you don't buy one "each fight" just as you need new armor)

Just individual pieces? <g> Clearly your not a Crafter or you would realize that means custom adjusting the new piece's resists to go along with the old five pieces.

I neither have the storage nor the reserve funds to buy a dozen suits at once just to keep as spares, neither do I have the time to waste playing crafter/gatherer. (also, I buy suits like that for about 700k here)

Your getting a seriously good deal then. Browse Luna on your Shard and see what the materials I listed in my last post sell for. I'd lose over 6,000,000 gold a suit selling for that price on Chessie with what I'd have to pay out for the materials to make it with.

Why are you so against the fees being fixed so, say, you could leave 1-2 such suits on your vendor so that in time people will buy them and you can just refill them next restock?

6/10 of one percent is a cheap fee. I don't consider it broken.

Would it be so horrible if instead of hundreds of empty vendors with their last restock dates dotting the countryside that, you know, those of us who only play a few times per week/month can afford to keep things worth more than 499 gold in stock?

I suspect most of those perpetually empty vendors are just holding the gold of our Mega-rich Players. A vendor can hold something like 2 billion gold I've read, thats 2000 one million gold checks. About 16 regular bankboxes full.

Stick your 100 billion gold on 50 empty vendors or pay for around thirty extra accounts with 18x18 houses with 3000 storage and 5 bank boxes & characters backpacks stuffed with one million gold checks each month.

I can see why there are empty vendors all over. Far cheaper.

You being a crafter may be able to make your own stuff, so maybe you simply have no idea how hard it is to get things you need right now with such a low population and so few shops stocked....If something happens in battle and you lose your last helmet/hat what do you do?

It is hard to find certain materials at times, no doubt.

Finding just what you want can be hard sometimes, I'm looking for an Orc Ship to replace the one that sank from lack of logging in often enough last December before I just hauled off and took a long break. Haven't found one yet. Just one part of the plans for one.

If you lose your good helmet/hat, you go buy any one you can find quickly to use temperarily, and find a better one later.

...or log off and play a different game.

This is what I do off & on. Though I tend to play a variety of UO playstyles depending on what mood I'm in and stay in game. Mime, log, stock vendors, craft & sell to NPCs, buy from one NPC & sell to another NPC in another town for a profit, hunt, etc.

Same with weapons, nobody keeps them stocked, not even "simple" ones anymore because they don't sell fast enough to outpace the vendor fees.

Your "simple" weapons are likely very expensive, like that suit you want. Crafters don't tend to be so rich that they can tie up 10's or 100's of millions in gold in stuff that will it on vendors for ages, even if there were no vendor fees anymore.

You have to use money to make money in UO. Leaving it sit as gear that sits unsold for months on a vendor isn't going to do that very well.

 

[Zyon Rockler]

Well, i'm not done building all of my suits yet but what I have to try to do is take each character class and build a suit that is very good but not maxed out in the way of resources but 500 weight.

So, rather than using high cost resources I use the lowest cost possible, so, mainly i'm using gems. This seems to make more sense if you imbue all of the pieces so it keeps the cost low. When you begin to mix artifacts in and in some cases, it seems necessary. For example: Lower mana cost. Then it would make sense to sell pieces rather than whole suits explaining to the customer what arties should be used.

I find in suit building, sometimes more than one arty can be used. For example: The Hat Of The Magi would be used in Wraith Form but The BrightSight Glasses would be used when you changed into a Leech.

Also, as a Weaver, you would change into a Tree or as a Vampire, your resistance is affected.

One of the suits that I have mastered first was The Vampire and that suit was made with Shadow Ingots which were earned killing Shadow Elementals, so there was no cost of ingots. Same with the weapons and shields, ring and bracelet, plus then no powder is used, so the cost comes down again. Then i'm not capping out any of the MODs, so i'm not using ingredients, another huge savings in time and cost. Then the suit is tested, if the Sampire can live then the suit is passed, if the Sampire dies then the suit is adjusted. The desktop also plays an important role as well as skills because the suits are designed for that character.

Another thing though, that can be done, is to add artifacts to the suit. So, by removing the neck piece, you can replace it with an artifact and not break the suits integrity. So, you basically end up with 2 versions of every suit and you can sell a complete suit for around 100,000 GP and still make a big profit as far as the GM made material.

The problem is, is that if you're going to stock the vendor, for example: Say I put 5 suits or I put 10 suits, who is going to buy them? Now, the ones that I put on there sold the next day and all of the prototypes and pieces sold. Without a buyer the sets are going to sit for years. So, I really don't produce them yet. Without a guaranteed buyer there's no point on just making suits and selling them. The vending system needs to purchase the items.

 

[Raptor85]

Just individual pieces? <g> Clearly your not a Crafter or you would realize that means custom adjusting the new piece's resists to go along with the old five pieces.

No, I buy full replacement suits as my old ones wear out, being a dexxer they generally wear pretty evenly anyways, generally toss once it gets to about 0/10 dura. If a vendor had max imbued pieces for sale as a grab bag I'd love that as well as then I could just replace pieces, maxed out with high resists and stats even if not matched to my other suit pieces they should be close enough to full 70's anyways, as long as it's 65+ and max stats it would be acceptable.

Your getting a seriously good deal then. Browse Luna on your Shard and see what the materials I listed in my last post sell for. I'd lose over 6,000,000 gold a suit selling for that price on Chessie with what I'd have to pay out for the materials to make it with.

our prices aren't hyperinflated like other shards, none of our vendors are in luna but the ones in new mag that do sell resources they're about 1/10 the prices you listed

I suspect most of those perpetually empty vendors are just holding the gold of our Mega-rich Players. A vendor can hold something like 2 billion gold I've read, thats 2000 one million gold checks. About 16 regular bankboxes full.

HIGHLY unlikely, they just get checked once in a blue moon and restocked now and then, it's players that only play on weekends or every once in a while so they can sit empty for a few weeks at a time. I doubt anyone on the entire shard even has close to that much anyways.