Gargoyles + Throwing = Huh?

[UOPlayer4LYFE]

I don't know who is in charge of PvP balance for UO, but they consistently do a terrible job at it.

Let's take a look at throwing:

Ranged weapon: check!
One-handed weapon: check!
Faster than archery: check!
Hardest hitting melee skill: check!
Highest range cap: check!
Amazing combination of specials: check!
Can chug potions without needing a balanced property: check!
Can running shot: check!
Can dismount: check!
No penalty to defense: check!

Now let's take a look at the only race that can use throwing (gargoyles).

Highest hit chance cap: check!
Can dismount without needing a mount: check!
Can have a greater dragon while at mount speed: check!

It seems to me as though something is missing here...ah yes, a downside. When archers got the ability to use potions, they instantly became the most overpowered/overused template in the game. Throwing is just simply archery, but faster, harder hitting, and more accurate. Someone please explain to me how this makes sense (in terms of PvP balance).

~This is not a rant, just an honest attempt to have a severely imbalanced template fixed. Oh ya, and make poisoning like it used to be so that I can hit my cure pot macro once instead of 15 times.

 

[Eddie123]

suits are harder to build.. and there ugly..

and u must have got killed by a garg lol

 

[UOPlayer4LYFE]

Don't know why people who obviously don't PvP post in a PvP thread.

 

[yars]

they drop like rocks if you stealth at yew gate with your archer/mystic/dread/nox/stealth/alchemist

 

[icm420]

all you can is disarm spam them

 

[red sky]

You forgot to add in the berserker suit and another gargoyle with mysticism and a greater dragon spamming cleansing winds on the thrower.

 

[anna anomalous]

it costs 29.99 to own one. (plus taxes)

 

[Flutter]

Move at running speed with 5 follower slots: check.

 

[CovenantX]

First thread I agree on 100%

I don't think you missed Anything, Gargoyles are Overpowered as hell
Bring back the mages plz,
Or are you guys actually TRYING to kill UO OFF?

I've been tryin to figure out why archery weapons are harder hitters than 2handed Melee weapons.

Now throwing (ranged 1 handed weapon) hits Slightly weaker than a hvy Xbow without the need to disarm to chug
OR have balanced, who's idea was it to come up with the base damage for these Weapons?

and for the record its Cheaper/easier to make a gargoyle siut because it takes 1 less armor piece and the resists are more than enough compensation for the lack of the missing piece.

 

[Xalan Dementia]

and for the record its Cheaper/easier to make a gargoyle siut because it takes 1 less armor piece and the resists are more than enough compensation for the lack of the missing piece.

they take 6 armor slots just like everyone else

 

[Raptor85]

they take 6 armor slots just like everyone else

this is true, but what he's talking about is the fact that even just exceptionally crafted barbed garg suits end up as 70's suits needing little imbueing, you essentially get all 70's to all resists with 5 pieces and the 6th piece you can easily max imbue 5 things onto, on top of the normal imbues on other pieces like you would a human/elf suit. Garg armor has MASSIVE base resists. you can fit a few things more into garg suits than you can human/elf ones.

 

[retrorider]

I thought they took away the dismount?

 

[Mr. Smither1]

If you want to talk overpowered go fight a 70dci focused wrestle parry mage with inscription and wearing a casting focus suit.

 

[Lynk]

The only thing that Throwing lacks is being able to have double hit spells on your weps and a wep that does double shot.

 

[Ender76]

Isn't new content always supposed to be "overpowered"? Would be a pretty dumb thing to introduce new races/items/content that no one wanted to use, no?

 

[Wojoe]

They (EA) make the newest stuff overpowered on purpose, So that people are Forced to buy it or not able to compete. Did it with necro, spellweaving, mystic and now throwing. They wont change it untill they sell "X" amount of upgrades.



kinda makes me understand why people are protesting on wall street.

 

[UOPlayer4LYFE]

Isn't new content always supposed to be "overpowered"? Would be a pretty dumb thing to introduce new races/items/content that no one wanted to use, no?

Why can't you introduce something new that is GOOD, but not way better than everything else? Or at the very least, make it take some skill rather than just toggling primary and secondary ability over and over. When mysticism came out, it was way overpowered for a very long time before the devs decided to do something about it. Even with the several nerfs to mysticism, it is still hands down the best casting skill available. I just don't understand the logic in making one skill the best at everything.

 

[5% Luck]

The 1st thing to note here is there is absolutely NO WAY to get a glaive to swing cap. NONE!

Using a faster wep will negate the swing rate but also lowers damage significantly AND takes away some of the best special moves.

As I gargoyle I know when I get dismounted most times I need to raise my health to FULL before I can re-engae in flight.

Suit options are near non existent Gargs get Glasses? Thats about it. Almost all the good artis are shields...SHIELDS! which means no chugging and another near usless skill!

Even at 50 HCI 120 skill vs 100 skill throwing still whiffs A LOT!

Yes a good player can make the most of a garg but over powered? No definitely not!

 

[Black Majick]

They are a pain. The only other guild that my guild can fight on Sonoma plays them almost exclusively....I rarely die to them 1v1 now. Just had to put parry on my focused mage with some scribe. About the only way to get them though is to hope they don't pay attention to there life bar or have a pair of focused mages sync dump them.

Now as far as overpowered...yes...they are a bit. They take the challenge out of the game. Litterally with the right weapon it is "click and follow" as I have seen people get dismounted and then hit for 20-25 damage every couple seconds by the thrower following them. One day the devs will tweak the weapon speed or scale down the damage.

 

[Yalp]

I feel it's necessary to post some of the facts in this debate between Throwing gargs v. human/elf archers so an honest discussion can be held instead of the hyperbole.

Throwing weapons
1) Mystic Arc/Concussion Blow - Boomerang 2 sec 1 handed Damage 12
2) Moving shot/dismount (while on foot)/para (while flying) - Cyclone 3 sec 1 handed Damage 17
3) AI/Mortal -- Soul Glaive 4 sec 1 handed Damage 22


Archery weapons
1) Paralyze Blow/Mortal - Bow 4.25 2 handed Damage 19
2) AI/Moving shot - Composite Bow 4.0 2 handed Damage 17
3) Concussion/Mortal - Crossbow 4.5 2 handed Damage 22
4) Force arrow/Serpent Arrow - Elven Composite 4.0 2 handed Damage 16
5) Moving Shot/Dismount - Heavy cross 5.0 2 handed Damage 24
6) Lightening Arrow/Psychic attack - Magical Short 3.0 2 handed Damage 13
7) Double Strike/Moving shot - Repeating Cross 2.75 2 handed Damage 12
8) Armor Pierce/Double Shot - Yumi 4.5 2 handed Damage 20


3 weapons for throwing v. 8 weapons for archery
7 unique special moves for throwing v. 13 unique special moves for archery
Gargoyles can not use beneficial mounts like swamp dragons with their +20% damage reduction armor
The Best pvp weapon for throwing is the 3 second cyclone v. 2.75 sec Repeating cross for archery
Gargoyle equivalent arties are non-existent for most pvp valued pieces
Using shield = DCI/HCI penalties countered by Parry skill points
Can not parry with throwing weapons
No need to carry arrows/no ammunition need
Can not poison throwing weapons
Can not hide/track/weave w/o investing points into skill
"Sweet spot" requirements for throwing weapons
1)Underthrown - HCI -12%
2) Perfect - No Hit Chance penalty, no damage reduction
3) Overthrown -47% damage reduction


Racial Benefits
Garg
Flying
Bezerk
+5 HCI
+5 HCI Cap

Human
+2 HPR
JOAT


ELF
+5 Energy Cap
Tracking +
Detect Hidden +
+20 Mana increase

 

[Mervyn]

is this supposed to be a newsflash that throwing gargoyles are overpowered?

 

[Ahuaeyjnkxs]

A refresh... why is the need to be that iritable ?

Usually when after 6 months you hear not even a hint of communication on a clearly important subject, you submit it again and maybe new ideas will come up which make the old idea more palatable or simpler to implement.

I prophetised many things about the gargoyles, and up till now, it's been eerie.