[Bushido] Question about damage increase

[Duncan Drake]

OK I´ve checked out the FAQ´s but I am still not sure about that. To be true I´m not the best with maths so here comes the question.

Is the di cap 300% of the basic weapon damage or is it + 300 %?

What kind and how much additional DI do I exactly need as a sammy when I´ve already honored the enemy (100%) and cast enemy of one. (50%)

Am I right that this is already the max?

Lets say Weapon damage is 50:

+ 100% Honor = 100
+ 50% EEO = 150

so 300% of the basic weapon damage?

 

[Stupid Miner]

Lets say Weapon damage is 50:

+ 100% Honor = 100
+ 50% EEO = 150

so 300% of the basic weapon damage?

That will get you to the 300% damage cap.
You also need to get 100% DI from items, because that functions differently.
(item property works the same way as Tactics, and Anatomy do)

 

[Macrophage]

EOO + honor won't cap you.

if your base dmg is 10 then your cap of "Damage Increase" is 30 base damage.

"Damage Increase" takes into account the following :
_ Item properties (Damage Increase on the item) : 100% total cap
_ Slayer Properties : Supposedly 100% for super slayer and 200% for super slayer (Unclear bonuses)
_ Abilities : EOO, Honor...
_ Items (Grapes of Wrath ...)

All these add up. This total is capped by 300.

You also get another bonus, not subject to that cap from skills and str. Only subject to hard caps. (I think it s around 288%)

They supposedly all add up to determine your total damage, then you withdraw your opponent resist and add up the "Damage Modifier" bonus.

From my experience I am not sure it works that way. Using Ignore Armor on certain critters I have an accurate figure on my final damage. For example I cap on miasma at around 170 damage with a bladed staff. that s base damage * ~12. If I first consider my stat/skill bonuses, I get around 50. if I then add in my "Damage Increase", I arrive to 200. If was just adding up I d arrive to around 100. Another possibility is your skill/stat % is not a bonus, but rather actually behaves like a %. that way my damage after stat/skill would be around 40, and after rolling in the 300% 160, which is very accurate.

 

[Duncan Drake]

ok now i did some testing. true, dmg bonus from anatomy tactics ... is not subject to the damage cap.

I fought medusa with the follwing mods:

1st: 100% di from items, 100% from repond slayer, 100% honor and 50% eeo
2nd: 100% di from items, 100% honor and 50% eeo
3rd: 100% di from items, 50% eeo

Configuration 1 and 2 ended in the same dmg, so 1st has 1 property that exceeds the cap, 3rd does less dmg

so this leads me to the conclusion that the math works this way:

damage cap = 100%(di) + 100% (honor) = 200% + 100% (eeo, 50% from 200% = 100%) = 300%

Further conclusion is if i use a superslayer weapon and i honor the enemy + eeo any di on items exceeds the cap.

the same is with a lesser slayer and honoring the enemy. then eeo and di from items exceeds the cap.

 

[Lynk]

I usually use a super slayer wep in addition to Honor/EoO whenever I can to account for a missed swing here and there and DI lost from going down a step in perfection. Keeps the damage at cap.

 

[Duncan Drake]

mhh makes sense. But I think about adding a nice amount of HLD to the weapon instead of a super slayer. Including the 30 % Mace and Shield Glasses I think it is possible to keep the mob at -25% Dci for all the time thus rarely missing.

 

[Stupid Miner]

Further conclusion is if i use a superslayer weapon and i honor the enemy + eeo any di on items exceeds the cap.

Again, the Item Property "Damage Increase" is completely separate from the 300% damage cap. "Damage Increase" works exactly like Tactics or Anatomy.

Normal damage = 100% damage
Super slayers double the damage, so 200%
Enemy of One increases damage by 50%. 50% of 200% is 100% so 300% damage is the result.

... I don't even know why i bother with this anymore, no one understands the formula even when it's explained.

 

[Lynk]

Again, the Item Property "Damage Increase" is completely separate from the 300% damage cap. "Damage Increase" works exactly like Tactics or Anatomy.

Normal damage = 100% damage
Super slayers double the damage, so 200%
Enemy of One increases damage by 50%. 50% of 200% is 100% so 300% damage is the result.

... I don't even know why i bother with this anymore, no one understands the formula even when it's explained.

You've contradicted yourself with other posts, so I don't have much faith in your explanation of how this is calculated.

 

[dlwiii]

In the EC client, you can look at your character's Attack tab and get the current damage range. Put this onto a hot bar for easy viewing.

Your maximum damage, regardless of anything, is 3x that maximum damage. You can get there using slayers, EoO, Honor, or whatever, but you will never exceed 3x that maximum.

For example: damage = 1-6 means max is 18
damage = 54-72 means max is 216

If you Lightning strike, then every so often you will get a critical hit which should be at this maximum. If not, then you're missing something.

To me, this is the easiest rule to keep in mind.

 

[Stupid Miner]

You've contradicted yourself with other posts, so I don't have much faith in your explanation of how this is calculated.

Contradicting past posts isn't a contradiction, rather it's refining the formula.
*shrugs*
I'm not exactly trustworthy because in the end i'm just hypothesizing from tested data.
Only thing going for me is i've actually tested the data. (one variable at a time)

Anyone has the ability to calculate the formula too if they put the time and effort and test each variable by itself.

 

[Duncan Drake]

Again, the Item Property "Damage Increase" is completely separate from the 300% damage cap. "Damage Increase" works exactly like Tactics or Anatomy.

Ok now i got it.

testet it right away. that means for maximum damage you always need 100% di

 

[Stupid Miner]

Ok now i got it.

testet it right away. that means for maximum damage you always need 100% di

Yep!

 

[Delbrie]

Again, the Item Property "Damage Increase" is completely separate from the 300% damage cap. "Damage Increase" works exactly like Tactics or Anatomy.

Normal damage = 100% damage
Super slayers double the damage, so 200%
Enemy of One increases damage by 50%. 50% of 200% is 100% so 300% damage is the result.

... I don't even know why i bother with this anymore, no one understands the formula even when it's explained.

So according to this calc, honoring an opponent would not result in any damage increases resulting from perfection?

How does the damage for AI calculate into this? My understanding is was that it is not dependent on you %DI. Does honoring and perfection affect the damage AI does?

Just asking cause I am seeing higher damage outputs when honoring even though I am at your theoretical max damage cap. I have just been running alot of tests on this and the results so far are quite confusing.

Thanks

 

[Vortex]

In the EC client, you can look at your character's Attack tab and get the current damage range. Put this onto a hot bar for easy viewing.

Your maximum damage, regardless of anything, is 3x that maximum damage. You can get there using slayers, EoO, Honor, or whatever, but you will never exceed 3x that maximum.

For example: damage = 1-6 means max is 18
damage = 54-72 means max is 216

If you Lightning strike, then every so often you will get a critical hit which should be at this maximum. If not, then you're missing something.

To me, this is the easiest rule to keep in mind.

This seems to be most accurate by my testing, I hit the 3x max when I AI, which should in theory be the most damage possible (assuming a good RNG on the damage range). The neat thing about doing it this way is you can see the effects of potions and equipment directly in your status bar.

It also seems to support what Stupid Miner says about the 300% cap coming into play AFTER skills and items are figured in, leading me to believe that the 300% only applies to Arcane effects (EoO, Honor, slayer, etc.)

However, I disagree with Miners suggestion that EoO gives 50% damage increase which when figured with the 200% = an additional 100%. It seems to me that if you already have 200% then EoO is only going to add 50% to the total increase, ie 250%. That would explain why you are seeing more damage when you honor, Delbrie, you are actaully hitting the 300% at that point.

I could of course be wrong, but so far, every test I have done supports this. I too see more damage when I have EoO, slayer, and Honor active then when I just have EoO and slayer active as Miner suggested.

So, my belief = I have a base weapon damage of 18-22 on my soul glaive.

Then I have 100% increase from my equipment, plus strength bonus, plus anatomy bonus, plus tactics bonus. My displayed damage is 66-81.

So, with EoO, honoring, and slayer, AND when using AI, I should hit for between 198 and 243. When testing, all of my hits were in this range.

When I had only EoO and slayer, AND when using AI, I should hit for between 165 and 203. This was also true in testing.

When I used slayer only and with AI, I should hit between 132 and 162. Again, this was true in my testing.

I'm probably wrong somewhere, but my tests seem to support my theory.

 

[Delbrie]

That is exactly what i have been seeing. And i agree that the eoo only adds 50% to give you the 250% with 100DI from equip and slayer.

 

[Quickblade]

Here's why so many poeple are confused with Damage Increase cap for melee archer and throwing, let's start with Stupid Miner's post which is half true I'll explain here :

Normal damage = 100% damage
Super slayers double the damage, so 200%
Enemy of One increases damage by 50%. 50% of 200% is 100% so 300% damage is the result...

Here's what he should have said :
Normal damage = 100% damage (that's true but don't think its 100% DI here)
Super Slayers double the damage, so 100% DI (yes it doubles yea but since when double the damage means 200% DI? Double the damage means +100% DI. For example I hit for 6 , double the damage means I'll hit for 12 which is +100% DI not 18 which is +200% DI. Only the lessers slayers means +200% DI wich is triple the damage ( I hit for 6 , triple damage I'll hit for 18 thats +200% DI and Stupid Miner was right but only for lessers slayers.

So conclusion
-Super Slayers doubles damage means +100% DI so you need to have honor(+100% DI) and EoO (+100% DI,) because EoO is 50% of the both previous added so 50 % of 200% =100% DI, to have your 300% cap (super slayer +honor+ EoO)

-Lesser Slayer triple damage means +200% DI so you only need EoO OR honor to have your 300% cap

Finally don't forget DI from items(100% cap) and all skills that add DI are not counting towards the 300% cap.

Excuse me for typing faults, I'm a french but I hope that clarify all poeple now.

 

[Klapauc]

So conclusion
-Super Slayers doubles damage means +100% DI so you need to have honor(+100% DI) and EoO (+100% DI,) because EoO is 50% of the both previous added so 50 % of 200% =100% DI, to have your 300% cap (super slayer +honor+ EoO)

-Lesser Slayer triple damage means +200% DI so you only need EoO OR honor to have your 300% cap

Finally don't forget DI from items(100% cap) and all skills that add DI are not counting towards the 300% cap.

Excuse me for typing faults, I'm a french but I hope that clarify all poeple now.

Nice thread necromancy here, and on top of that its a bit wrong.
If you test in practice, you will find:

Super slayer + 50% from eoo is sufficient for cap damage(3x of what is displayed in your stat window).
Single slayer is triple damage by default now and you dont need anything else here.

 

[Quickblade]

What about if I use a Super Slayer amd Honor the monster, do I get the 300 % damage cap just here ?

 

[Klapauc]

What about if I use a Super Slayer amd Honor the monster, do I get the 300 % damage cap just here ?

You reach cap, even without full perfection.

Btw dont worry, these calculations are not so easy to understand, its better to watch damage numbers ingame to understand what happens.

 

[Bort of Atlantic]

This may be helpful; it's a list of posts from Logrus how damage works in conjunction with chivalry, slayers, etc:

http://vboards.stratics.com/uo-developer-feed/245043-chivalry-changes.html

Short version: Damage increase property and damage increase from high-chiv divine fury impact the base damage you'll do (and see on your character stats). Everything else counts towards the 300% damage increase cap. It's late, so if I'm off, feel free to correct.

 

[CorwinXX]

What does "300% Damage Increase Cap" mean? Does it "300% increase" = 4x damage? Is it counted before resistances?