• Hail Guest!
    We're looking for Community Content Contribuitors to Stratics. If you would like to write articles, fan fiction, do guild or shard event recaps, it's simple. Find out how in this thread: Community Contributions
  • Greetings Guest, Having Login Issues? Check this thread!
  • Hail Guest!,
    Please take a moment to read this post reminding you all of the importance of Account Security.
  • Hail Guest!
    Please read the new announcement concerning the upcoming addition to Stratics. You can find the announcement Here!

Cal_Mythic and the Excel file...

Status
Not open for further replies.

Viper09

Grand Poobah
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Ok, that for the theory.......

What about then the reality check ?

What about the argument I often hear that if too many accounts were found using cheats it would be a hard decision to use the ban hammer on all of them ?

Betweem what should be done and what can reasonably be done sometimes there can be a big difference.

In those cases where the action cannot follow the theory what would be the best way to proceed, if I may ask for ideas ?
Reality check? lol! Where can I go to get rewarded for playing by the rules? Tell me, lol. The idea alone to reward someone for following the rules is just ridiculous. The only reward we should, and do, get is to not get penalized when we follow the rules.

As for ideas, leave that for the devs to figure out. Something tells me the devs already have something in mind otherwise they wouldn't be working on the this detection program. Some will be banned I'm sure, but not all in the first round.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Amazing how removing the greatest fault this game has will destroy it.
Losing a significant amount of players will. And judging from other games that have gone the same route, it slowly destroyed them, it will likely slowly destroy UO.

Quit making UO into WoW, WoW can afford grand boldness with millions of accounts to play around with, it has the manpower, it has the advertisement, it has the marketing. UO has nothing of this.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I had a GM arrive to check on me one time and with all the container windows I had open I didn't see him and didn't react until the computer screen suddenly changed to a jail area. That got my attention.
Had the same thing happen to me...probably the only mark I've ever had on any account. Unattended banksorting, LOL.

Yeah, I didn't see the GM, nor the GM message with all the containers open.
 
K

Kratos Aurion

Guest
LOL, as shown here many times, lots of people cheat in the ways that they cannot detect. Like using illegal search sites to gain advantages and ruin the economy for lesser vendors.
Lessor vendors? Those websites only promote Luna for the most part, probably where 90% of the games vendor base has been located for the past 5 years. It's not hurting anyone, it's just a source of free advertisement. Nothing's stopping you from opening a vendor shop at Brit moongate or elsewhere and throwing down runes. The only advantage you gain is uhh.. price competition (drives prices down) and saved time. Normal capitalism, nothing to see here.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Lessor vendors? Those websites only promote Luna for the most part, probably where 90% of the games vendor base has been located for the past 5 years. It's not hurting anyone, it's just a source of free advertisement. Nothing's stopping you from opening a vendor shop at Brit moongate or elsewhere and throwing down runes. The only advantage you gain is uhh.. price competition (drives prices down) and saved time. Normal capitalism, nothing to see here.
They promote Luna only, which means that there's a lot of revenue lost for many vendors that are not well known or pre-search site. I know many who have tried to run vendors, dropping runes, etc. But that business has been dropping more and more for anything worthwhile, as Luna is so easy to search, it even shows you on a map where the item is located.

Its increased the dominance of Luna by a large margin. The only two people I know that has vendors in Luna have said its increased their profits quite a bit ever since the search sites came up.

But yeah, keep justifying the cheating. It doesn't matter if its harmful or not, its cheating nonetheless, thats what you guys keep arguing. Funny how it becomes OK when *you* do it.
 
B

Beer_Cayse

Guest
Ohhh!:gee: Damn ... dint see that one coming! Well done, Sirrah! :bowdown:
 
K

Kratos Aurion

Guest
But yeah, keep justifying the cheating. It doesn't matter if its harmful or not, its cheating nonetheless, thats what you guys keep arguing. Funny how it becomes OK when *you* do it.
You really need to stop putting words in peoples' mouthes. I never said I supported cheating, and I don't support the use of such websites. I literally haven't had to purchase gear (or much of anything) in over two years because I made all (well most) of the stuff I needed years ago, not to mention imbuing now.

I believe Ultima should follow suit with the practice of implementing an auction house, but I find it funny though how people whine over a free-advertised section of the map due to an unethical program providing a service to the customers that EA should have provided long ago. That service while supported by an unethical practice is highly desirable in game.

But at the same time, if you don't feel compelled to advertise your vendors outside of the scope of that programs reach, then you're just being lazy. I know people (one a great guy from Legends, Woody) who have owned shops for 12 years with absolutely no need to advertise their shops because those were the places that provided the best items at a reasonable price; word of mouth. At the same time, I know people who drop over 100 runes a day throughout their schedule. If you're going to promote your shop and want people to keep visiting it routinely, don't half-ass your merchandise and stay dedicated too it.

p.s. 90% of the best deals I find are from vendors outside of the so called programs "luna promotion" range. And I get those deals from runes I find on the ground.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
You really need to stop putting words in peoples' mouthes. I never said I supported cheating, and I don't support the use of such websites. I literally haven't had to purchase gear (or much of anything) in over two years because I made all (well most) of the stuff I needed years ago, not to mention imbuing now.
Yet, you keep writing like you support it.

I believe Ultima should follow suit with the practice of implementing an auction house, but I find it funny though how people whine over a free-advertised section of the map due to an unethical program providing a service to the customers that EA should have provided long ago. That service while supported by an unethical practice is highly desirable in game.
And I think that Ultima should implement autolooters and better scripting tools, like WoW and other games. Yet you don't seem ok with people using the unethical versions of these programs because EA hasn't provided it.

But at the same time, if you don't feel compelled to advertise your vendors outside of the scope of that programs reach, then you're just being lazy. I know people (one a great guy from Legends, Woody) who have owned shops for 12 years with absolutely no need to advertise their shops because those were the places that provided the best items at a reasonable price; word of mouth. At the same time, I know people who drop over 100 runes a day throughout their schedule. If you're going to promote your shop and want people to keep visiting it routinely, don't half-ass your merchandise and stay dedicated too it.

p.s. 90% of the best deals I find are from vendors outside of the so called programs "luna promotion" range. And I get those deals from runes I find on the ground.
And so what? Sure there are better deals *sometimes*, but most people don't use that. Like I CLEARLY said earlier, some vendors will do well, especially old well established ones, but as a whole, vendoring is clearly hurting over this.

I don't know many who don't use the search program and because of that they using Luna...before then, they weren't using Luna at all. Business is booming in Luna because of this.

But in the end, it doesn't matter. ITS A CHEAT EITHER WAY. I am fine with it, but people shouldn't play hypocrites by cheating themselves and then saying all cheats are bad.
 

Balinor of Pk?

Sage
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Exactly ... it's a fine between justice and fairness and ... perception of both.

We discuss methods of action from zany to subtle and invisible to the general population. It's the difference between putting someone on a rack in front of the town a la Puritan New England ... v. something clandestine where players the next day will just notice someone gone ...

You get the point. It's important to know, though, that we are still actively on this item.

in addition to publishes, backend hardware updates and golf lessons in Tahiti ...

Okay they are Wii golf lessons ... :)
It's great to see some people on the dev team have their heads on straight. This makes me have a little faith in what's going on behind the scenes. For my own piece of mind tho, I'd love to know what the dev team considers actionable scripting and non actionable... is this going to be defined? Or are we just leaving it alone and trying to weed out the stuff that's harming the game, ala: Horrible speed hacking. I'd LOVE to see a rack, where you bend a character over in it, lock them up for 24 hours for unattended macroing. I'd mark a rune there daily to get a good laugh. haha And honestly, I'd rather have that happen to them, and interfere with their gameplay, than see them banned. Banning should be a very last resort, our game is dying slowly as it is, lets plug the leaks and work together for a better GAME. Not a less populated one...
 

Madrid

Slightly Crazed
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I'm not sure if many of you stratics members here truly understand the magnitude or ramifications in regards to this topic. If any of the posts above are indicators then clearly most players don't have a clear understanding of the bigger picture.

A website (You know the one) which I'm not allowed to mention has over 30,000 Registered Users and this is just one of a handful of sites.

UO is a business first and foremost and the world economy isn't exactly booming. People's livelihoods depend on the business being viable. Given that UO is not attracting new players at the rate of other MMORPG's it would be wise not to alienate the current customer base you do have.

I know many stratics members posting above think you speak for the majority on the topic but the reality is stratics members are just the vocal minority and players that keep silent on this issue make up the silent majority.

The Japanese are renown for scripting/cheating and I don't even think the Japanese look at scripting as cheating rather than a tool to be used within the game.

The same can be said of most scripters, they simply do not look at it as cheating rather than a tool to accomplish certain task within the world of UO.

There was a time when UOA by Tugsoft was labeled as cheating and bannable. This is not any different.

Speedhacks, dupes, exploitable bugs need to be dealt but this topic much like the war on drugs is a war on players and it's not one that can ever be won.

Stratics members need to lighten' up on this subject.
 

Taylor

Former Stratics CEO (2011-2014)
VIP
Alumni
Supporter
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
UNLEASHED
Campaign Benefactor
Registered members doesn't mean UO subscribers. First, many folks have left UO over the past several years. These people would not have deleted their accounts on said website. Second, I'd venture to guess that most of the registered users are playing on illegal free shards, which either allow or fail to police the use of scripts/cheats.

I don't think you have the insight that you believe you do. Ending cheating does not mean ending UO, as your post seems to imply.
 

Balinor of Pk?

Sage
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
So Syrus? How many accounts do you have? I'd venture to guess, that if every scripter was banned tomorrow, over half of UO's accounts would be gone. Most scripters that I know have multiple accounts. On average 2 - 10. Most people who don't script I would venture account for only one account, maybe 2. I'd venture to guess that if by that number alone even 20 percent of the population was banned for scripting, it would end up being 50 percent of the paid accounts that are in the game. That's wild speculation, but even so, makes you think a bit harder about YOUR assumptions. Besides, you really want to consider shopping on vendors without those nifty search sites? Cause that's what you're talkin about here. I'm tired of complete noobs deciding how the game I enjoy playing is run. Maybe I'll start a grass roots effort and all the people that dont cry and complain 24/7 will start to really say what they think. And start getting some of the things THEY want. I dont EVER come here crying about the things I want in game, because honestly I just have fun playing it. Most of the changes that get implemented are horribly ill conceived because the people whining to get them just want what they want, with no thought as to how it will actually affect things. This is just my opinion, but if the developers wanted to REALLY change the game for the better, they'd stop using stratics as a measure of what to change in the first place. Start polling the ENTIRE population again like it was done years ago. Get pvp sites involved in PVP DECISIONS. Get the planters involved in planting decisions. Most of the people who actually ENJOY playing, don't come here and cry about changes. I'm not trying to be rude, just hoping someone in a position to make decisions has the common sense and wisdom to see beyond the surface of things and make changes that actually matter. I've been impressed with some of the talk, and a few of the changes have been great, but honestly, this whole issue is going to be the deciding factor for my accounts. Cause I wont pay to play a game I can't play in an enjoyable manner. I speak with my dollars in everything I do to put it plainly.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Registered members doesn't mean UO subscribers. First, many folks have left UO over the past several years. These people would not have deleted their accounts on said website. Second, I'd venture to guess that most of the registered users are playing on illegal free shards, which either allow or fail to police the use of scripts/cheats.

I don't think you have the insight that you believe you do. Ending cheating does not mean ending UO, as your post seems to imply.
The program only works on a few free shards, but either way, it is just one of many programs and cheat sites out there.
 

Taylor

Former Stratics CEO (2011-2014)
VIP
Alumni
Supporter
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
UNLEASHED
Campaign Benefactor
. . . if every scripter was banned tomorrow, over half of UO's accounts would be gone.
Besides, you really want to consider shopping on vendors without those nifty search sites? Cause that's what you're talkin about here.
Cause I wont pay to play a game I can't play in an enjoyable manner. I speak with my dollars in everything I do to put it plainly.
If cheating makes your gaming experience more enjoyable, maybe you should find a game that doesn't prohibit cheating in its TOS. You agreed to the rules when you signed up. Don't act surprised that you're being held to your agreement.

Also, I have four accounts.
 

G.v.P

Stratics Legend
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
What about the hacks ? The speed hacks, and those which allow to pass through static objects which, In Felucca, might be quite an advantage ?
I would think the tree stump crack would be visible by checking the integrity of certain files ... however, speeders, well, I'm not sure how they would be checked. The thing about speeders though is they make casting, and actions, very hard to do without scripts, so I think if you knock out illegal third party script programs then speeders are going to be a little less effective ... except for tamer hybrids, they'll still be annoying.

Anyway, I'd follow the illegal third party thing I posted for both the crack and the speeder progs, but I'm not sure if EA can really trace speeders.
 

Cetric

Grand Poobah
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
UNLEASHED
i'd say 1st offense - warning that you have been caught, and anythign further will result in punishment

2nd offense - 1 week ban... sit back and think about what you are doing dude!

3rd offense - you obviously can't learn can you?
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I find it endlessly amusing that the so called anti-cheaters don't want a new place without tons of scripted gold, scripted characters, resources, and scripters.

Guess they want to hold on to their own ill-gotten gains that they got before this anti-cheating started, lol.

Two whom my guild knows are doing just that, they've hoarded huge amount of resources, hundreds of millions of gold, arties of every kind and maxed out chars. They don't need to cheat any more and they don't. They're actually very much in favor of this change.

Funny enough so many anti-cheaters are anti-clean slate and anti being actual cheat free, LOL.
 

popps

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I'm not sure if many of you stratics members here truly understand the magnitude or ramifications in regards to this topic. If any of the posts above are indicators then clearly most players don't have a clear understanding of the bigger picture.

A website (You know the one) which I'm not allowed to mention has over 30,000 Registered Users and this is just one of a handful of sites.

UO is a business first and foremost and the world economy isn't exactly booming. People's livelihoods depend on the business being viable. Given that UO is not attracting new players at the rate of other MMORPG's it would be wise not to alienate the current customer base you do have.

I know many stratics members posting above think you speak for the majority on the topic but the reality is stratics members are just the vocal minority and players that keep silent on this issue make up the silent majority.

The Japanese are renown for scripting/cheating and I don't even think the Japanese look at scripting as cheating rather than a tool to be used within the game.

The same can be said of most scripters, they simply do not look at it as cheating rather than a tool to accomplish certain task within the world of UO.

There was a time when UOA by Tugsoft was labeled as cheating and bannable. This is not any different.

Speedhacks, dupes, exploitable bugs need to be dealt but this topic much like the war on drugs is a war on players and it's not one that can ever be won.

Stratics members need to lighten' up on this subject.


The game HAS TO BE playable on an equal footing by any and all players.

It is as simple as that.

Either noone has to cheat, if it is wanted to be illegal, OR, EVERYONE needs to be told that they are free to cheat.

There is no middle ground here. Either noone, or everyone.

This said, it is up to those who own and run the game which way they decide to go, whether get rid Ultima Online of any and all cheating (as I hope), or give up the fight and let UO be cheat ridden but then, it must be clear that ALL players will be allowed to script, hack just alike.

Either all, or noone.......

As in regards to players wanting an "easier" more, I thought the Enhanced Client was there for that.

Ban the third party programs and boost the macroing system with what is allowed for the Enhanced Client so that those players who want a level of macroing will be able to have it with the EC client.

Definately, though, the current situation with some players haveing a blast with cheating and other players just paying the consequences of playing at a handicap is no longer sustainable.

Things really must change, one way or the other.

Either noone will any longer be able to cheat in UO or everyone will be allowed to.

Choose which way UO should go (I hope the no cheating way).
 
G

Green Mouser

Guest
LOL, as shown here many times, lots of people cheat in the ways that they cannot detect. Like using illegal search sites to gain advantages and ruin the economy for lesser vendors.
If you consider that a cheat....then reading any information on this site to prepare yourself for an expansion or publish is a cheat also.
 

Pinco

UOEC Modder
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
another way to solve the problem is open a new shard "Cheater Paradise" where everything is much harder and you can survive only by cheating, speedhacking and duping. This shard should use the same fix anti-cheater of the other shards and the events are to find a way to cheat again.

In this manner the cheater will also help the devs to discover bug without problem... obviously there should be fast fixes for avoid the use of the bugs in the non-cheating shards :p
 

LordDrago

Certifiable
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I find it endlessly amusing that the so called anti-cheaters don't want a new place without tons of scripted gold, scripted characters, resources, and scripters.

Guess they want to hold on to their own ill-gotten gains that they got before this anti-cheating started, lol.

Two whom my guild knows are doing just that, they've hoarded huge amount of resources, hundreds of millions of gold, arties of every kind and maxed out chars. They don't need to cheat any more and they don't. They're actually very much in favor of this change.

Funny enough so many anti-cheaters are anti-clean slate and anti being actual cheat free, LOL.
I find it endlessly amusing that you can never see anyones elses choices or viewpoints outside of your own context.

Speaking as someone who has not, and will not cheat in uo, I do not feel the need to move to a new shard. I continue to survive OK on my current shard. If there is an item I want, I set myself a goal to get it (without cheating), and I get it. Sometimes it takes me a bit to get it (still looking to get myself a crimson cinture - seems everyone and their brother has one except for me) and sometimes luck shines down on me (I received three tangles, kept one for me to share among my chars, and gave two to friends).

Now, if they created a new shard, and my friends decided to all move there, then I would go along as well.
 

G.v.P

Stratics Legend
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
If you consider that a cheat....then reading any information on this site to prepare yourself for an expansion or publish is a cheat also.
Well, his point is those sites use illegal third party scripts to collect the vendor information. If you support those sites, you support scripters. Not exactly the same thing as reading spoilers over on Stratics, hehe.
 

Picus at the office

Certifiable
Supporter
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I'm waiting to pass my judgement but I will be rather pissed if they go around with the ban stick after all this time has passed. There should be some middle ground at the end of it. I think everyone will agree that the never ending grind of filling a bod is absured as is making a new smith but sitting on a boat casting a predetermined set of spells is silly also. There needs to be a better option for the lack of UOA type of interfaces for people whom do not wish to pay for a UOP program(which the scripting one covers nicely). I'd love to see just a plain option to auto-open a corpse as I am sure a heck of alot of tram based players use something just like this.

Speeding needs to be delt with as I see it daily, or so I believe I do. The healers and stuff matter little to me as do the miners, cats out of the bag I say and no ones buying those ingots anymore save for the bod fillers.

There are lots of good ideas in this thread and a equal number of useless ones.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
If you consider that a cheat....then reading any information on this site to prepare yourself for an expansion or publish is a cheat also.
No it isn't, because that information isn't gained through cheating.

The devs already ruled this illegal back when there were campspawn sites, as per the rules, its cheating.
 

popps

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
If you consider that a cheat....then reading any information on this site to prepare yourself for an expansion or publish is a cheat also.
Well, his point is those sites use illegal third party scripts to collect the vendor information. If you support those sites, you support scripters. Not exactly the same thing as reading spoilers over on Stratics, hehe.

Unless my memory fails me and I recall wrong, I seem to remember that years back someone found a way to read the data stream and get at server up from maintainance the info about all houses ready to fall, with their locations.

A real time saver, no more time spent to walk around looking for IDOCs....
Just read the log and go straight to the place where the House was about to fall.
 

BlissMarie

Lore Keeper
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Hurry up, Cal & crew! It's been a long wait. I want to know how you are going to deal with these people.

Can you give us any kind of a time frame for when you will finally act on these things? A month? Two? Before Christmas?

Please?

BlissMarie
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I find it endlessly amusing that you can never see anyones elses choices or viewpoints outside of your own context.

Speaking as someone who has not, and will not cheat in uo, I do not feel the need to move to a new shard.
So you find it fine to benefit indirectly from cheating, playing in a ruined economy, cheated resources, etc.?

You don't want a blank slate to just build everything without the cheaters around and things have value again?

I continue to survive OK on my current shard. If there is an item I want, I set myself a goal to get it (without cheating), and I get it. Sometimes it takes me a bit to get it (still looking to get myself a crimson cinture - seems everyone and their brother has one except for me) and sometimes luck shines down on me (I received three tangles, kept one for me to share among my chars, and gave two to friends).
Then stay, there would be nothing requiring you to move to this new cheat free shard, nothing would change for you.

Now, if they created a new shard, and my friends decided to all move there, then I would go along as well.
Then see, you'd have the choice. And we can see if it brings in new players playing the right way.

Though gotta wonder why the anti-cheat crowd are so afraid of that...I wonder.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Unless my memory fails me and I recall wrong, I seem to remember that years back someone found a way to read the data stream and get at server up from maintainance the info about all houses ready to fall, with their locations.

A real time saver, no more time spent to walk around looking for IDOCs....
Just read the log and go straight to the place where the House was about to fall.
But still a cheat...so are you admitting to being a cheater too?
 

LordDrago

Certifiable
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
So you find it fine to benefit indirectly from cheating, playing in a ruined economy, cheated resources, etc.?

You don't want a blank slate to just build everything without the cheaters around and things have value again?
Exactly how am I benefiting from a ruined economy? If anything, I would say that the results of people scripting has hurt me. Have you ever tried to fill a valorite BOD? Used to be, I would find a valorite vein and be able to mine the hell out of it. Now, I find a vein, mine it for a bit, and it goes goes poof faster than an Army lead over Navy at halftime. Randomizing ore veins or whatever they call it.

I do not buy resources or items, but go out and play the game for them. I find that fun. My blacksmith is not yet 120....Neither is my tailor....nor my embuer (although all three are scrolled to 120). Some day I will get a 120 animal taming scroll (I am currently scroll binding for it, but you never know, I may get lucky some day at a spawn). My Sampire is scrolled to 110 or 115 in swords, and is almost there, and just this month has been able to go "vamp").

Would it be "easier" to go out and buy scrolls, items, etc. and then go out whacking things and people? Maybe. But I am playing the game the way I like to play it, and within the ToS.
 

LordDrago

Certifiable
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I continue to survive OK on my current shard. If there is an item I want, I set myself a goal to get it (without cheating), and I get it. Sometimes it takes me a bit to get it (still looking to get myself a crimson cinture - seems everyone and their brother has one except for me) and sometimes luck shines down on me (I received three tangles, kept one for me to share among my chars, and gave two to friends).
Then stay, there would be nothing requiring you to move to this new cheat free shard, nothing would change for you.
Exactly my point. Nothing would change for me, so why do you wonder why I would not want to move. Do you often move for no reason?
 

rareitem

Journeyman
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Im my opinion developers should try to consider what thye did wrong , tbh some times I think that this game was developed for scripters fun, quests that need millions of clicks, endles hours of training, not fun at all, and so on, I think its more easy to find what is wrong in the game mechanics than punish people just because they dont want to get insane having to doubleclik items for weeks to get a collection item for example.

To be honest this game is getting so complicated to play , its not hard to figure out why new players leave the game after 2 weeks or less.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Exactly how am I benefiting from a ruined economy? If anything, I would say that the results of people scripting has hurt me. Have you ever tried to fill a valorite BOD? Used to be, I would find a valorite vein and be able to mine the hell out of it. Now, I find a vein, mine it for a bit, and it goes goes poof faster than an Army lead over Navy at halftime. Randomizing ore veins or whatever they call it.
And that was caused by Llewyns ilk, not the cheaters themselves. It was the whiners that kept going at it and the devs made a knee jerk reaction and viola, randomized resources.

And you're benefiting from it due to it being so much easier to get and buy. I am not as such saying you personally as such, but in the end, this is what this economy offers...why not try a blank slate where everything means something again, where earning your first 100K actually is a worthy accomplishment, where mining actually matters and can be done as a trade.

I do not buy resources or items, but go out and play the game for them. I find that fun. My blacksmith is not yet 120....Neither is my tailor....nor my embuer (although all three are scrolled to 120). Some day I will get a 120 animal taming scroll (I am currently scroll binding for it, but you never know, I may get lucky some day at a spawn). My Sampire is scrolled to 110 or 115 in swords, and is almost there, and just this month has been able to go "vamp").
Well, that is good.

Would it be "easier" to go out and buy scrolls, items, etc. and then go out whacking things and people? Maybe. But I am playing the game the way I like to play it, and within the ToS.
You can buy the items within the TOS too. Heck, you can buy them for real dollars within the TOS too.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Exactly my point. Nothing would change for me, so why do you wonder why I would not want to move. Do you often move for no reason?
So if nothing changes for you, why exactly jump on the anti-cheating bandwagon when there's the danger lurking of too many accounts being shut down and UO being forced to downsize or even close down shards or the game itself.

Why take that risk if nothing changes for you? Why not just let the game pass on as it has for the last decade+.
 

LordDrago

Certifiable
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Now, if they created a new shard, and my friends decided to all move there, then I would go along as well.
Then see, you'd have the choice. And we can see if it brings in new players playing the right way.

Though gotta wonder why the anti-cheat crowd are so afraid of that...I wonder.
I can think of several reasons why people would not want more shards.

Limited EA/Mythic resources. Might get spread too thin and reduce in game events, support, expansions, etc. Reduced support, more people get mad and leave, and EA decides to cancel UO.

or

They already support one or more "classic" shards, and if these alternate "new shards" are created, this might push back, or negate, any possibilities of creating the shard they want.

or

They are like me, and the cheaters do not effect them so much that they feel the need to start over. For example, many PvPers are against cheating because the cheats that effect them are PvP cheats. Get rid of the PvP cheats, and they are happy. Why move to a new shard and start over if the cheats that effect them the most are removed?

These are three off the top of my head, but I am sure there are others.
 

Madrid

Slightly Crazed
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
The game HAS TO BE playable on an equal footing by any and all players.

It is as simple as that.

Either noone has to cheat, if it is wanted to be illegal, OR, EVERYONE needs to be told that they are free to cheat.

There is no middle ground here. Either noone, or everyone.

This said, it is up to those who own and run the game which way they decide to go, whether get rid Ultima Online of any and all cheating (as I hope), or give up the fight and let UO be cheat ridden but then, it must be clear that ALL players will be allowed to script, hack just alike.

Either all, or noone.......

As in regards to players wanting an "easier" more, I thought the Enhanced Client was there for that.

Ban the third party programs and boost the macroing system with what is allowed for the Enhanced Client so that those players who want a level of macroing will be able to have it with the EC client.

Definately, though, the current situation with some players haveing a blast with cheating and other players just paying the consequences of playing at a handicap is no longer sustainable.

Things really must change, one way or the other.

Either noone will any longer be able to cheat in UO or everyone will be allowed to.

Choose which way UO should go (I hope the no cheating way).
Popps let's get real for a minute....

I think your being a little melodromatic. Your the one that started this thread and one of the ones that keep bringing up the subject on "When are you doing to do something about Scripting!?" ,"What is the status of monitoring Cheating etc?". I mean we see a thread on the subject almost every other day started by the same few people.

To me it's a bad subject and one that should just be left alone. All this topic does is bring about discord because there is no good answer to it. Your the one clammoring and making noise about it whereby making it an issue.

I have absolutely no qualms about people scripting and when I do see it I don't page or feel slighted I just go about my merry way enjoying the things I like to do in UO.

The bottom line is this Popps? Are players happy playing UO? I think most peeople who play UO are happy and enjoy it...this includes the scripters...they like scripting.

Your the one by posting up threads such as this are trying to create discord were really there doesn't need to be any.

We're not gonna see eye to eye on this but players need to enjoy the game not worry about things that don't effect them.

I'm trying to think of a good analogy on this topic. It's like parents telling their teenagers not to have sex...some are gonna do it anyways. Yet you want the parents to come out and tell them yeah it's okay to have sex.

There is not going to be a "Your are allowed to cheat" announcement from EA. What we have had is probably the best response we can have. I personally don't want to see EA's time and resources spent in trying to track down who is doing what and possibly losing subscriptions.

I'd rather have them working on a Pirate Expansion, UO high resolution, Classic Shard, or a total revamp of the PvP system.

I think your approach to this topic Popps is more of a moralistic one than one based on logic. I think your wrong on this one and that should let it lie and worry about things that can be changed and improved. History has more than proven for many years now scripting is and has been a huge part of UO.
 

LordDrago

Certifiable
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Exactly how am I benefiting from a ruined economy? If anything, I would say that the results of people scripting has hurt me. Have you ever tried to fill a valorite BOD? Used to be, I would find a valorite vein and be able to mine the hell out of it. Now, I find a vein, mine it for a bit, and it goes goes poof faster than an Army lead over Navy at halftime. Randomizing ore veins or whatever they call it.
And that was caused by Llewyns ilk, not the cheaters themselves. It was the whiners that kept going at it and the devs made a knee jerk reaction and viola, randomized resources.
Blaming the victim? I would agree that i do not like the solution to the problem with script miners (and lumberjacks), but blaming the people that saw the problem and asked for a solution. No.

The best solution would have been to find the scripters and ban them. Perhaps there were reasons at the time that made this an unfeasible solution. But blaming the people asking for a solution is not someplace I will look.

Look at it backwards as a causality string. Of course that would lead back to the devs who created a system that allowed the cheating to occur in the first place, however the 1st player action in the string falls on the cheaters.
 

lucitus

UOEC Modder
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
UO without scripters is that UO no!

We have lived with it over years now and now all cry the bad scripters ban them all?

No problem if you want to play alone, for me UO is over, again there are the credits on my screen, Thank you for playing Ultima Online, Game Over.

UO is booring, no players, no good PvP, no challange with mobs. Imba armors, items, artifacts and more more more.

I will test the new treasure maps, but it is clear that this only brings fun for 1 or 2 hours.

UO is old and the graphical update has failed, there no nice new effects or systems with it, so UO's really bright future is over, for me this are really the last breaths, until UO is cancelled or UO gets free to play.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I can think of several reasons why people would not want more shards.
Ok, lets go for that.

Limited EA/Mythic resources. Might get spread too thin and reduce in game events, support, expansions, etc. Reduced support, more people get mad and leave, and EA decides to cancel UO.
People keep saying that no cheating will bring back people = more money = more support and events.

Not to mention, if you ban thousands of players, what do you think will happen to game events, support and expansions down the line?

They already support one or more "classic" shards, and if these alternate "new shards" are created, this might push back, or negate, any possibilities of creating the shard they want.
Making a new shard is easy as hell for them, just duplicate one onto some old server hardware and host it the same place the rest are hosted...done deal.

If it gets enough players, get it an EM.

They are like me, and the cheaters do not effect them so much that they feel the need to start over. For example, many PvPers are against cheating because the cheats that effect them are PvP cheats. Get rid of the PvP cheats, and they are happy. Why move to a new shard and start over if the cheats that effect them the most are removed?
Because then the cheated characters will be gone too, their money will matter again, regular PvPers can compete without having 100 million gold suits, etc.

These are three off the top of my head, but I am sure there are others.
And I refuted all 3. There really aren't all that many good reasons at all.
 

Zalan

Crazed Zealot
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
**New item at UO Game Codes**

Soul Cleanser- For $49.99 we will unban & remove all marks from one account of your choice.

Soul Sprite- For $9.99 we will remove one mark from your account, or a 72 hr ban.

Soul Surge- For 5.99 we will remove any 24 hr ban or warning you recieve.


The above mentioned items are fictionall & meant to be a joke. Any future related items have nothing to do with this post. All items, & content are property of Frigamal Industries.
 

jack flash uk

Crazed Zealot
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
UNLEASHED
Popps

i read just a few lines of your latest world and peace nonsense and i nearly gave up all hope and stopped breathing................

here's an idea

how about you STOP, just please keep your opinions about EVERYTHING UO to yourself

play the game you pay for

and let the Dev team sort out the game they are paid to sort out

just this ONCE please, STOP

I made the mistake of removing you from my ignore list, then I remembered just how much crap you create, obviously you are being added again

I am of course ANTI SCRIPT, but i am also ANTI YOU!

QUOTE THAT!
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Blaming the victim? I would agree that i do not like the solution to the problem with script miners (and lumberjacks), but blaming the people that saw the problem and asked for a solution. No.
Without them, there wouldn't have been such a stupid solution. If they hadn't whined and whined, the devs might have found a sensible solution...but noooo, they were forced into making a knee jerk decision instead.

The best solution would have been to find the scripters and ban them. Perhaps there were reasons at the time that made this an unfeasible solution. But blaming the people asking for a solution is not someplace I will look.
Maybe, but then you're overlooking where 95% of the blame lies.
 

LordDrago

Certifiable
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Would it be "easier" to go out and buy scrolls, items, etc. and then go out whacking things and people? Maybe. But I am playing the game the way I like to play it, and within the ToS.
You can buy the items within the TOS too. Heck, you can buy them for real dollars within the TOS too.
If you new me in game, you would know how funny this is.

My "richest" character currently has about 2.7 million gold. Admittedly I could have a lot more (as I mentioned above, I have given away 2 tangle, as well as the one pair of those nightsight glasses i recieved, a ton of the imbuing essences [gave away the last, except for 2 of each as placeholders, the other day since i will likely not imbue anything for myself until i reach 120, and that will likely take me at least until the end of the year at this rate], every replica I have ever gotten (only about 5 or 6 i think), etc.).

These items go to my friends as they have either better uses for them than me, they like to run vendors (something I am not currently into - someday, maybe), they like them, or whatever.

As I said, i still have fun playing.
 

LordDrago

Certifiable
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Blaming the victim? I would agree that i do not like the solution to the problem with script miners (and lumberjacks), but blaming the people that saw the problem and asked for a solution. No.
Without them, there wouldn't have been such a stupid solution. If they hadn't whined and whined, the devs might have found a sensible solution...but noooo, they were forced into making a knee jerk decision instead.

The best solution would have been to find the scripters and ban them. Perhaps there were reasons at the time that made this an unfeasible solution. But blaming the people asking for a solution is not someplace I will look.
Maybe, but then you're overlooking where 95% of the blame lies.
No I am not, its with the cheaters. You just refuse to see that.

Some may wonder why that is....



Hey, the place are setting up DWI checkpoints at New Years. Blame all those people asking the police to do somethign about drunk drivers? No, you blame the drunk drivers for creating the situation in the 1st place.

Perhaps not the best analogy, but I have to go now and pick up my daughter.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I don't really have much gold either, heck I have only ever fought 2 peerlesses and 1 renowned twice. I have some extra amounts of gold and some extra nice gear because I bought it for RL cash. I would never have had even a fraction of what I have without it. I just play around and have fun, I don't powerfarm anything or power play. I don't even have a sampire and I can't even take credit or sole credit for most of my chars with 120 in skill. Most of those are to my wifes credit, as she can just zone out doing these things...heck, she even had multiple level 99 characters in Diablo 2, where my single highest character was level 92.

I am just chilling, playing with my gf and/or my wife, playing with my guild, going on some fun hunts, just hunting regular stuff and exploring the world and sometimes re-exploring.
 

Lord Chaos

Always Present
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
No I am not, its with the cheaters. You just refuse to see that.
Oh really...so lets follow that logic.

If you dropped a pieces of paper in a no-litter zone and I blew your brains out with a shotgun because I have to pick it up afterwards.

Who's to blame?

Me or you?

Hey, the place are setting up DWI checkpoints at New Years. Blame all those people asking the police to do somethign about drunk drivers? No, you blame the drunk drivers for creating the situation in the 1st place.

Perhaps not the best analogy, but I have to go now and pick up my daughter.
Yeah, thats like mine, not a good analogy. But anyway, that really wasn't a knee jerk reaction. And they don't ruin driving.

I haven't mined in years no, except for a short while here a couple of weeks ago. Why? Because of randomized resources, its absolutely ruined mining completely. Why was it? Because the devs didn't listen to what us the sensible people were saying and go for the long term solutions...no, they caved in to the whiners who demanded action RIGHT HERE AND RIGHT NOW!

And I am afraid this will just happen again, and yet again, the game will be permanently scarred because of it...but of course, the whiners will keep on whining.
 
S

Sergul'zan_SP

Guest
Now, I find a vein, mine it for a bit, and it goes goes poof faster than an Army lead over Navy at halftime. Randomizing ore veins or whatever they call it.
*Cackles*

That was both funny and true.

:pint:
 

Zalan

Crazed Zealot
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I am just chilling, playing with my gf and/or my wife, playing with my guild, going on some fun hunts, just hunting regular stuff and exploring the world and sometimes re-exploring.

If your GF finds out about the wife she wont be playing with you. & if the wife finds out about the GF you probable won`t have a computer or house to play in. Sorry, had to take a pot shot at that statement :D
 

Taylor

Former Stratics CEO (2011-2014)
VIP
Alumni
Supporter
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
UNLEASHED
Campaign Benefactor
. . . heck I have only ever fought 2 peerlesses and 1 renowned twice.
These achievements represent under an hour of playing for most folks. Yet, you claim to know about how many players cheat? You have as much experience as a week-old player in my guild. Yet, you claim to have deep insight into UO's economy?

You don't have the experience to speak on these issues. You should defer to players with actual experience.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top