Poormans Sampire Weaponskill?

[ViscidSix]

Hi all

I just restarted playing Ultima on Atlantic and have a huge desire to make a sampire (rhyme? i think so ).

I have literally nothing for this character or money to buy things with.

With this in regard which weapon skill should i pick?

THANKS!

Viscidsix

 

[Zalan]

Poor man weapon skill Mace. I see 120 powerscrolls selling for 800k to 1 mil.

 

[Smoot]

Sampire is a great class if your looking for the most for your money. Macing would be great, id probably use a gnarled staff, but anything not too fast would work. Your suit would be pretty cheap too. I got away with 115 bushido, 120 weapon skill, 110 parry, 110 tact, 100 necro, 100 anat, rest chiv, for a while. You dont need mana regen or lower mana cost on your armor (the expensive ones), so itll be relatively cheap to have imbued.

 

[Farsight]

I bought my last 120 mace scroll for a whopping 250k gold. That wasn't a vendor typo either, they're actually CHEAPER than that on a couple of shards.

The weapons, if you can find them, are also dirt cheap.

Not only that, but if you can have a good Black Staff imbued, it's one of the best (arguably the best) whirlwind weapon out there, and the diamond mace hits like a truck.

So if you can't afford all the gear you need as an armsman by the time you finish training, you definitely did something wrong.

 

[[JD]]

go with faster weaps so you dont need insane amounts of crazy sta and imbued armor. black staff is about as good as it gets for your whirlwind money in that dept.

if you dont need as many imbued pieces for sta you can use artifacts for cheap dci (fey legs) or lmc (rune beetle carapace)

 

[Old Man of UO]

Definitely, maces is the cheapest melee skill by far and underrated compared to swords.

My favorite mace weapons are the diamond mace with 30SSI and blackstaff with 20+ SSI. The gnarled staff with 150 stamina and 35+ SSI is as good as the diamond mace, keeping in mind that you can enhance with ash to get +10 SSI after imbuing (but mine keep breaking).

And mace weapons are usually cheaper than a comparable sword weapon!

 

[Garm The Green]

Sampire is a great class if your looking for the most for your money. Macing would be great, id probably use a gnarled staff, but anything not too fast would work. Your suit would be pretty cheap too. I got away with 115 bushido, 120 weapon skill, 110 parry, 110 tact, 100 necro, 100 anat, rest chiv, for a while. You dont need mana regen or lower mana cost on your armor (the expensive ones), so itll be relatively cheap to have imbued.

No it's not. Mage/Bard Tamer, pure bard are far more cost effective.

Sammies need high (esp fire) resists dci hci DI stam LMC. You also need bush/weapon/parry scrolls 115-120, awesome weapons on top of an awesome suit. mace and shield, crimson, totems/trinkets/primers don't come cheap.

Tamer mages need LRC and maybe some fc/fcr and that's it. need 110/110 tame/lore for GD, everything else is easy. for years i rocked a tamer with resists in like the 30s and i could trounce the dungeons of britania with a WW and nightmare, tank ancient wyrms rock the gauntlet in doom etc etc...all it cost was bandages...

Pure bards need 120 scrolls and an LRC suit and that's it. So, when i get poor i shift focus from back to my tamer bard and mage and they help to bankroll my warriors back to a sate where the self-support...

To make an ok chiv warrior or chiv sammy with healing is easy and cheap. to make an effective vamp samurai is not so...as you need to hit fast and hard enough to keep you alive...

Sorry to be a PITA! I just couldn't let it lie!

To be ok is easy, but to tackle the same stuff as tamers and bards takes a great deal of dosh!

 

[Smoot]

No it's not. Mage or Bard Tamer, pure bard are.

Sammies need high (esp fire) resists dci hci DI stam LMC. You also need bush/weapon/parry scrolls 115-120, awesome weapons on top of an awesome suit. mace and shield, crimson, totems/trinkets/primers don't come cheap.

Tamer mages need LRC and maybe some fc/fcr and that's it. need 110/110 tame/lore for GD, everything else is easy. for years i rocked a tamr with resists in like the 30s and i could trounce the dungeons of britania, tank ancient wyrms etc etc...all it cost was bandages...

Pure bards need 120 scrolls and an LRC suit and that's it. So, when i get poor i shift focus from back to my tamer bard and mage...

To make an ok chiv warrior or chiv sammy with healing is easy and cheap. to make an effective vamp samurai is not so...as you need to hit fast and hard enough to keep you alive...

Sorry to be a PITA! I just couldn't let it lie!

Stick with the sampire. You can use healing if you want i guess, but then you just have a dexter. Why i said a sampire is the cheapest class to make:

The powerscrolls: not gonna find a 120, not even a 115 mage for 250k, and in eval and your close to 20 mil for 2 needed skills.

Its faster to train; you can get to 99 necro using just forms. You can use med for mana regen with a trainer lrc suit, which some would probably give you for free. Then can replace the skill with anat when you go out fighting.

The suit is Much cheaper than a mage suit. Yes you need at least 105 fire resist, but this isnt hard to get with imbuing. The hit and defence chance increase is also very easy to get imbued. Fey leggings, and quiver of infinity give you 25 dci right there. And with high parry and lightning strike, you dont need max unless your soloing the hardest fights.

Imbuing wise, the suit is the cheapest in the game. You dont need mana regen or lower mana cost At all. This would run you a decent amount of gold on a mage suit. Stam, mana, and hit point increase are all very cheap to imbue.

You can spend hundreds of millions putting together the "perfect" sampire suite, but like i said before its the cheapest and easiest / quickest thing to train. Only sort of tedious part is getting the 99 necro for needed vamp form. But you can train this up first, and it is relatively painless.

 

[Garm The Green]

Stick with the sampire. You can use healing if you want i guess, but then you just have a dexter. Why i said a sampire is the cheapest class to make:

The powerscrolls: not gonna find a 120, not even a 115 mage for 250k, and in eval and your close to 20 mil for 2 needed skills.

No, you don't need these as a tamer 100 in everything except taming lore which only have to be 110 - these shouldnt be more than 5k-10k if not free.

Its faster to train; you can get to 99 necro using just forms. You can use med for mana regen with a trainer lrc suit, which some would probably give you for free. Then can replace the skill with anat when you go out fighting.

Well if necro is cheap and easy to train so is mage and eval (to 100) which increase at the same time.
Music and peace can be done in a day easily for free without any mana/cost.
Training weapons/anat/tactics takes a lot more time, even using a golem. You have to fight the right things at the right skill levels etc etc, you can just macro through mage training.
Taming can be slow but you only need to train (starting skill of) 50-74-84 taming and use 2x+13 jewels (min cost) these can have mage/tame/lore/vet +13 each making 52 on each ring, 104 points overall and +26 each skill. This makes high level tames very very easy to obtain... magery/vet/lore a singe to level to GM.
Bushido is easy to train.

The suit is Much cheaper than a mage suit. Yes you need at least 105 fire resist, but this isnt hard to get with imbuing. The hit and defence chance increase is also very easy to get imbued. Fey leggings, and quiver of infinity give you 25 dci right there. And with high parry and lightning strike, you dont need max unless your soloing the hardest fights.

I said tamer. A tamer only needs LRC. A bard doesn't need a "mage suit" either, just the basic LRC. we're not talking about a pvp mage. Resists, regen, lmc etc etc dont really matter on a tamer.
A warrior will always need to balence stats (str/dex/int) have high resists, stam increase and prefereably LMC. Quiver of infinity etc cost money. you can buy an lrc suit which will be more than adequate for >30k.

Imbuing wise, the suit is the cheapest in the game. You dont need mana regen or lower mana cost At all. This would run you a decent amount of gold on a mage suit. Stam, mana, and hit point increase are all very cheap to imbue.

You need to fully pof the suit (and weapon) too which is darn pricey - as being melee the suit will loose durability very quickly. This is not the case for a tamer or bardmage. You'll also need stam increase, LMC, high resists, mana increase. you also need weaps imbued with SSI and leeches. A tamer or bard needs none of these, only LRC.

You can spend hundreds of millions putting together the "perfect" sampire suite, but like i said before its the cheapest and easiest / quickest thing to train. Only sort of tedious part is getting the 99 necro for needed vamp form. But you can train this up first, and it is relatively painless.

For this you need an lrc suit, which is all you'd need for a tamer.

It's just not the most cost effective.

So "sampire" needs:

Suit - Fully POF with HPI, MI, HCI, DCI, DI.
Jewels - with remaining DI/HCI/DCI/STR/DEX/INT etc etc
Weapon - Fully POF with HML, HSL, HLD, SSI
LRC suit - to train to 99 necro
Golem/Poison weap - to help weapon training
3x 120 or 115 power scrolls
Stat scroll (at least 115 @ £millions)
POTS/Bandies/Regular Repairs

A tamer needs:
LRC suit - imbued or GM made, not POFd
2x110 power scrolls (cheaper than chips)
Maybe + skill jewels (can be imbued near max intesnity for minimal cost)
Bandies

A bard needs
2-4x120 power scrolls (bard ones other than music are cheaper than warrior)
LRC suit - imbued or GM made, not POFd



I'm not saying you can't start with a warrior; i did! There are just easier and cheaper ways, but if like me you enjoy being a warrior the do that. It's down to personal playstyle but i think a certain amount of objectivity (which is perhaps lacking here?) is required to deem what's cost effective. With an LRC suit and some Jewels a newly jeweled-to-GM tamer can obtain a hiryu and take on an ancient wyrm or a balron.
A sampire will require a lot more investment to accomplish this as well as being useful and flexible in group situations to res/cure/heal/gate/mark etc etc.

 

[Old Man of UO]

No it's not. Mage/Bard Tamer, pure bard are far more cost effective.
...
To be ok is easy, but to tackle the same stuff as tamers and bards takes a great deal of dosh!

I pretty much agree with Smoot on this. Garm's advice really isn't very sound in my experience.

I just wanted to add that if you play a mage/bard/tamer the way Garm outlined, you aren't going to be nearly as effective as a moderately equipped sampire. You can make an awesome sampire suit with imbuing and not require all those expensive artifacts... AND do twice the damage of a greater dragon that you won't have good control of with just 110/110 lore/taming skill. In fact, I detest tamers who have to spam "ALL FOLLOW ME! / ALL KILL!" just to get their dragon to behave because they don't have high enough skill. And that is all you would be with the skill levels that Garm says you need - a pathetic bard, weak mage and a spamming tamer.

I have both a mage/bard/tamer and a sampire. Without the 120 bard scrolls you won't be effective against high end mobs - you just can't discord them no how, no way. A good sampire starts with 115 parry, bushido and weapons scrolls (although as someone else pointed out there are 120 mace scrolls available for 250-300K on several shards).

My advice - make a bard/mage/tamer AND a sampire. There are very few places and very few mobs my sampire can't deal with, but I can't say the same about my bard/mage/tamer - and a greater dragon just isn't the best pet for all mobs.

 

[Garm The Green]

Oh and in response to the OP I'd suggest just go to 110 or 115 for now when you scroll skills.

110 bush/weaps/parry will do you fine to begin with, everything else except chiv to GM.

Try to get a decent SSI/Leech weapon as i find this massivly more important than any other single part of your armour.

Concentrate on phys resist when making a nooby suit as most your early foes won't cast, you can always (and most likely will) upgrade. Fit in fire resists if you can to make it a bit more flexible.

Choose whatever weapon skill you like, you wont need to be 120 straight away. 110 and 115 will do you fine, though macing is nice for reducing a foes stamina!

By the time you're trained up you will be able to afford what you need.

try stealing/borrowing some virtue armour peices as these are blessed and wont leech insurance from you and have decent resists - though nothing else unfortunately!

just a thought....

 

[Garm The Green]

twice the damage of a greater dragon that you won't have good control of with just 110/110 lore/taming skill. In fact, I detest tamers who have to spam "ALL FOLLOW ME! / ALL KILL!"

Well whether you detest them or not is quite irrelevant old man! This isn't about personal dislikes and objections! With 110/110 the stratics animal calc gives 99% controle chance for a GD. Bakes and Hiryu is a piece of cake at even lower values and can demolish most things.

Check it out: http://uo.stratics.com/content/skills/anim.php

Without the 120 bard scrolls you won't be effective against high end mobs - you just can't discord them no how, no way. A good sampire starts with 115 parry, bushido and weapons scrolls (although as someone else pointed out there are 120 mace scrolls available for 250-300K on several shards).

I'd already said a bard needs 120 scrolls.
A mage tamer doesn't. He can "all kill" and spam bandy/G-heals as well as curse/flamestrike/mindblast etc etc without scrolling above 110. he is in no way a weak character and requires far less setup. hell you don't even *need* lrc/fc/fcr when fighting, they're just nice to haves while new!
However while you're raising the issue, 100/100 music/peace is all that is required for area crowd control if you're going that route...

My advice - make a bard/mage/tamer AND a sampire. There are very few places and very few mobs my sampire can't deal with, but I can't say the same about my bard/mage/tamer - and a greater dragon just isn't the best pet for all mobs.

Again, i didn't mention a GD as the *only* option, rather providing this creature as a meter stick as harder-to-control tame. If you can controle a GD with 110/110, you can pretty much controle anything. I'd rather recomend 2x Bake or a hiryu for those early days. There is more to taming than trotting about with a GD!

Really, I'm not telling him or suggesting what to do, but i am saying you can be an effective tamer with a basic, basic LRC suit and maybe some jewels, but that a "sampire" requires far more flash kit.

Whether you "detest" or think a charecter is "weak" is another matter as the basic sampire you suggest would be "weak".
If you disagree with using jewels and disdain nooby low skill jewel-tamers, that's your playstyle, but everyone starts somewhere right?

Fact is that you don't need good kit, when you have a pet or songs to hide behind.

When starting on new shards, my tamers always bankroll my other chars for this reason...

"a pathetic bard, weak mage and a spamming tamer"

*lol*

 

[Smoot]

Viscidsix , im on atlantic so if you want ill make you a decent sampire suit. It wont have anything to expensive, but good to start with / add to. and im sure i could put together an lrc training suit for you too.

 

[Smoot]

Are you elf or human? Elf (tho i dont really like elves haha) are best for a sampire, but if youve started on a human thats fine.

 

[Aibal]

I too disagree with Garm. Yes, you're mage/tamer or mage/bard can get by with just an lrc suit, but lets be realistic..there is NO way in hell you are going to raise your magery/eval fast with that suit...no lmc/mr means a long time to work your skill up. Certainly not a day or two as you suggest.

Secondly, I've done three legendary bards...I can assure you that working disco to the point of being useful on higher end mobs is going to take a llllloooonnnnggg time....using Poo's guide, and a LOT of hours every day, you can do it in a couple weeks...if you're a power gamer. By the time Garm has his disco at legendary, I will have millions in the bank from pwning Dread/Navery etc on my sampire.

Finally, I put together a cheap sampire outfit for a new sampy I started on a different shard. I was totally effective with less than a million into the suit, utilizing things like Heart of the Lion and imbued pieces I found on vendors. Not at all difficult. I went with macing and had 115 scrolls for right around 400k for everything I needed. Weapons I purchased as I could afford them, but I did that by killing stuff.

Bottom line, you'll be in the gold far faster with a vampire warrior than you will with any mage, tamer, or bard template. And you'll be taking on high end content well before you can with either of those others as well. You have to remember, the tamer needs to find good pets and get them bonded (time), the bard needs to work their skills up (disco=MAJOR time), and the mage needs at least a couple million in scrolls (115 mage/eval) if not more depending on shard. The bard/mage/tamer is neither cheaper nor faster to make and takes more time to become effective. When I set up on a new shard, the first character I always make now is a sampire because they will get me on my feet the fastest.

 

[Stupid Miner]

Sammies need high (esp fire) resists dci hci DI stam LMC. You also need bush/weapon/parry scrolls 115-120, awesome weapons on top of an awesome suit. mace and shield, crimson, totems/trinkets/primers don't come cheap.

Just need Resists, DCI, 110 of each skill and a WW weapon.
The Weapon needs Mana Leech, Stamina leech, and needs to not be slow.

You're confusing high-end supplements with necessities.

Most of this is covered by Fey Leggings/Heart of the Lion/Aegis of Grace. Only need 2 out of the 3.

 

[Garm The Green]

I too disagree with Garm. Yes, you're mage/tamer or mage/bard can get by with just an lrc suit, but lets be realistic...no lmc/mr means a long time to work your skill up.

I can assure you that working disco to the point of being useful on higher end mobs is going to take a llllloooonnnnggg time....

Finally, I put together a cheap sampire outfit for a new sampy I started on a different shard. I was totally effective with less than a million into the suit, utilizing things like Heart of the Lion and imbued pieces I found on vendors. Not at all difficult. I went with macing and had 115 scrolls for right around 400k for everything I needed. Weapons I purchased as I could afford them, but I did that by killing stuff.

The bard/mage/tamer is neither cheaper nor faster to make and takes more time to become effective. When I set up on a new shard, the first character I always make now is a sampire because they will get me on my feet the fastest.

Touche!

You're quite right - disco and provo take ages to train!
Taming without jewels takes ages, as does pet bonding.

If your on a tight timer, perhaps you'd just have an edge.

My initial argument was value for money though where somebody said "Sampire is a great class if your looking for the most for your money."
Looking at Lord GODs, Lynks, Conners, Thuderz suits - well they're just out of my budget. I'll always be able to afford an LRC suit though!

If you've got somebody willing to make you a suit (POF and Imbue) then you're onto a winner!
People want to argue that warriors are quicker, and they may well be, but I'm just talking about budget toon-creation.

I started on a shard, picked up LRC bits from discarded swoop corpses (before swoop was buffed, when swoop was perma-camped) and used this LRC kit to GM Mage/eval/focus/med as well as raise int to GM within a few days through attended macros. I scavanged 110 scrolls from fell spawns so no cost there. Now, raising to gm/elder tame is a doddle with imbued jewels, so i don't see the tough bit and vet/lore just flies too.
Nill total cost, for an effective farmer. Nice for the solo, unaided player.

I'm in no shock that the warrior forum may be a little biased.
Still, i seem to be completely alone in presenting an alternative. So, I concede; Making a "sampire" is the best and therefore only viable option available in the whole of the game.


Miner - I agree with you, but you're going to need a nicely modded weap, or a soulseeker and DCI somehow which either costs relics, or comes on arties... even HOL/SS/fey leggins etc cost dosh! You need none of these things on tamer.

Sorry to be argumentative, but my connection has gone funny so i can't play this week, and i have a project to be doing, so i'm happy to distract myself with pointless banter

Plus i can't believe you think it's cheaper to make a Samurai than a Tamer!

 

[Garm The Green]

Hi all

I just restarted playing Ultima on Atlantic and have a huge desire to make a sampire (rhyme? i think so ).

I have literally nothing for this character or money to buy things with.

With this in regard which weapon skill should i pick?

THANKS!

Viscidsix

PS Viscidsix, sorry for hijacking your thread

I'd bite smoots arm off for the suit! its a kind offer...

 

[Stupid Miner]

Miner - I agree with you, but you're going to need a nicely modded weap, or a soulseeker and DCI somehow which either costs relics, or comes on arties... even HOL/SS/fey leggins etc cost dosh! You need none of these things on tamer.

Check Humility and Valor Ilsh spawns every once in a while, over 100k drops once the champ dies.

OR

Kill the weak critters in the SA mini-spawns. Sell the ingredients at half their normal price. Spam General Chat/Luna Bank if necessary.

Essence of Order sells best, but Fire Ants can be tricky.
Essence of Control sells well and Goblins are easy.
Same with Singularity and Slimes.

Also, you can scavenge corpses to look for blackrock in the Bane/Ophidian conflict

 

[Smoot]

Viscidsix - made your suit today, weapon, and lrc training suit. hope you have fun with it.

 

[Zalan]

Sampire require a lot less time & effort than a tamer. Starting sampire can get away with using a Virtue Armor suit. Get some DCI Jewelry with some fire resist on it. Mana Leech, & Stamina Leech on a weapon. Then just upgrade from there as you can afford to.

 

[Garm The Green]

GAH!

for the gazzilionth time, it wasn't a discussion about effort, but about being cost effective!

*head spins*

 

[Garm The Green]

Touche!

You're quite right - disco and provo take ages to train!
Taming (without jewels) takes ages, as does pet bonding.

If your on a tight timer, perhaps you'd just have an edge.

My initial argument was value for money though where somebody said "Sampire is a great class if your looking for the most for your money."...People want to argue that warriors are quicker, and they may well be, but I'm just talking about budget toon-creation.

Cost?

Pets are free, and lrc can be scavanged/obtianed for negligable amounts of money!

 

[Old Man of UO]

Cost?

Pets are free, and lrc can be scavanged/obtianed for negligable amounts of money!

Good Point!

But then, sampire weapons and armor are free too... just scavenge better than average armor and weapons from miasma or swoops corpse.

While you can make great money with a bard/mage/tamer, you can have a fully trained and outfitted sampire in half the time and making money off high end mobs and loot long before you get your "free" pet (if you plan to tame it yourself).

 

[Zalan]

GAH!

for the gazzilionth time, it wasn't a discussion about effort, but about being cost effective!

*head spins*

Aw but Time is Money... It all factors in.

*waits for Garm The Green`s head to explode*

 

[Stupid Miner]

Aw but Time is Money... It all factors in.

*waits for Garm The Green`s head to explode*

Not to mention training taming to 120 makes you hate UO with a passion.

 

[Garm The Green]

Not to mention training taming to 120 makes you hate UO with a passion.

lol @ all replies!

I like this forum

 

[Smoot]

I made Viscidsix a suit and weapon that would be able to solo many abyss renowneds, and probably dread horn and the like. Its materials would have cost about 3 million gold total. If thats not the most bang for your buck, i dunno what is. True, you can go around and loot things, but honestly to make an equally powerful tamer / caster suit would have cost at least 15. Thats not counting scrolls. only 120 you need for a sampire is a 300k macing scroll. you can get away with 110s for the rest.

 

[Garm The Green]

....but honestly to make an equally powerful tamer suit would have cost at least 15. Thats not counting scrolls. only 120 you need for a sampire is a 300k macing scroll. you can get away with 110s for the rest.

no.

 

[Zalan]

Tamer suit is cheap. Less than GM Imbuer can make an all 70`s 100 lrc suit with mr 6 for probable less than 100k. Most expensive thing would be the Gems for imbueing.

 

[Old Man of UO]

Tamer suit is cheap. Less than GM Imbuer can make an all 70`s 100 lrc suit with mr 6 for probable less than 100k. Most expensive thing would be the Gems for imbueing.

It's really all relative.

I made a cheap sampire suit from minor arties and found loot, Heart of Lion and BrightSight lenses, for all 70s resist even with VE cast. You can even buy both minor arties for just over 100K, and get the DCI/HCI from jewelry and Quiver if you have them. Or you can even put in Fey leggins for more DCI, and use the Royal Leggins of Ember for more fire resist if needed.

Now, neither the tamer suit nor the sampire suit will be top end that way. But I used that suit for two years before imbuing came out and it worked just fine for most mobs.

 

[Smoot]

a tamer suit comparable to a sampire suit needs 40 lmc 12 mana regen, just the 12 mana regen is very expensive. add in spell damage and your running Alot more (tamer is basically a mage with a pet imo so spell damage you kinda need) I guess if you just hit "all kill" and heal your pet you can use non-max suit, but your losing alot of damage from mage spells. you can get max stats on a non regen non lmc non spell damage suit for much less.

 

[Zalan]

This is my opion Tamer only needs magery for 6 reasons:

- Greater Heal for pet or self
- Inviso so they loose agro
- Cure to cure poison pet or self
- Res in case a friend dies
- Recall
- Mark

All that other stuff on a suit is nice, but not needed for a tamer to function. A tamers needs are way different than a sampire.

 

[Old Man of UO]

This is my opion Tamer only needs magery for 6 reasons:

- Greater Heal for pet or self
- Inviso so they loose agro
- Cure to cure poison pet or self
- Res in case a friend dies
- Recall
- Mark

All that other stuff on a suit is nice, but not needed for a tamer to function. A tamers needs are way different than a sampire.

That would pretty much describe a "beginner" tamer. I also use Gate and Teleport (to get close to my pet fighting a target switching demon-type), EV and Earth Elemental, Gift of Renewal, Fireball, Mind Blast, Flamestrike, and Earthquake. But by far, the Greater Heals combined in a macro with the bandage/vet skill takes the most mana when fighting high end mobs.

Have you tried taming a bane dragon yet? How are you planning to beat it down into submission? Same for the blue beetles.

Unless you are just an "All Kill" tamer, you will eventually need more than the beginners suit and that short list of spells.

 

[Zalan]

A mare plus a Leaf Blade take care of any Bane or Beetles. If a tamer is using a summons along side with its there pets. Then a Tamer is not using the right pet combo. Gift of Renewal is not a mage spell. There is nothing in that list that requires more than all 70`s 100% LRC suit either.

 

[Garm The Green]

A mare plus a Leaf Blade take care of any Bane or Beetles. If a tamer is using a summons along side with its there pets. Then a Tamer is not using the right pet combo. Gift of Renewal is not a mage spell. There is nothing in that list that requires more than all 70`s 100% LRC suit either.

+1

You can have uber mods on a tamer suit, but, you don't need them. You don't even need resists or LMC, just a pet.

a naked tamer with bandies & regs, played well could slay para balrons, esp with disco.
I'm not saying you'd want to, but you could.

HOL, brightsight, etc etc all cost a fair wedge for a new starter.

 

[Smoot]

My point was that a tamer who only uses a pet for dps wont be able to kill things nearly as fast as a sampire.

ps lol @ how long this simple post has become, its keeps popping up haha

 

[Old Man of UO]

... HOL, brightsight, etc etc all cost a fair wedge for a new starter.

Really? I can find the lenses are 25K on my shard, and HOL 75K.

A low end tamer and sampire suit are about the same cost. You don't need high-end mods for either one... but eventually you will want better. A high end tamer suite definitely costs more to make than a high end sampire suit... unless you want arties to finish either suit, then the cost can be sky high for either.

And smoot is right, most tamers use spells to speed up the kill and to be sure to get looting rights at popular spots.

Zalan is just being dense by saying, "Gift of Renewal is not a mage spell" since the discussion was about LMC and LRC on the suit. And I DO use summons as a tamer... that's how I beat down critters that need to submit to taming. I'm not sure, but Zalan, you sound like an "All Kill" tamer who doesn't tame his own pets if you've never run into a situation that you needed summons.

 

[Garm The Green]

My point was that a tamer who only uses a pet for dps wont be able to kill things nearly as fast as a sampire.

ps lol @ how long this simple post has become, its keeps popping up haha

i know >

mwahahaha!

Amd, i agree with you on the above

 

[Garm The Green]

Really? I can find the lenses are 25K on my shard, and HOL 75K.

100k is a lot of money for a new player.

 

[Garm The Green]

Zalan is just being dense by saying, "Gift of Renewal is not a mage spell" since the discussion was about LMC and LRC on the suit. And I DO use summons as a tamer... that's how I beat down critters that need to submit to taming. I'm not sure, but Zalan, you sound like an "All Kill" tamer who doesn't tame his own pets if you've never run into a situation that you needed summons.

Some might claim that Zalan isn't dull, rather that you seem puffed up and pompous; but perhaps it wasn't seen as conducive to a good debate to highlight one anothers personal flaws?

This whole argument/disccussion was sparked by me being petty when smoot (allow me to paraphrase) said "sampires are cheap" and i said "no they're not".

We shouldn't start laying into each other lol!

How about we agree to differ on this subject of what i quickest/cheapest/required etc etc as we all have very different perspectives on how charecters might be played, or what constitutes "value for money"?

Peace to all who post on this thread!

 

[Old Man of UO]

100k is a lot of money for a new player.

It's a lot less than the 100% LRC suit that you said a bard/mage/tamer needs. A low end sampire is faster to build, cheaper to equip, and will begin making large amounts of gold before the tamer even makes it to GM taming skill.

But me being puffed up an pompous, and you saying we shouldn't start laying into each other? LOL... you need to turn that mirror around! Anyway, we all play these things differently. I actively play both a sampire and bard/mage/tamer.... and have for years. I know you took 3 years off and just recently came back... so naturally we will disagree on the details.

 

[Smoot]

I don't really see gold being a huge issue. Yes if you just kill lizardmen by yourself it would take forever to be able to buy anything, but with just a little polite asking, not begging, just asking, players can usually be given a couple million gold. I know i give out stuff pretty regulary if i think its justified. Of course i never make it too easy for someone, anyone has to build their character up to really appreciate it, but a suit, or a million gold here and there gives people at least something to start with, and be more likely to stay with the game. If you join a guild, your even more likely to be helped out (or scammed or stolen from lol) When it comes down to it, its a mmorpg, so a little interaction with other players can go a long way.

 

[Zalan]

Really? I can find the lenses are 25K on my shard, and HOL 75K.

A low end tamer and sampire suit are about the same cost. You don't need high-end mods for either one... but eventually you will want better. A high end tamer suite definitely costs more to make than a high end sampire suit... unless you want arties to finish either suit, then the cost can be sky high for either.

And smoot is right, most tamers use spells to speed up the kill and to be sure to get looting rights at popular spots.

Zalan is just being dense by saying, "Gift of Renewal is not a mage spell" since the discussion was about LMC and LRC on the suit. And I DO use summons as a tamer... that's how I beat down critters that need to submit to taming. I'm not sure, but Zalan, you sound like an "All Kill" tamer who doesn't tame his own pets if you've never run into a situation that you needed summons.

This discussion was not just about LMC & LRC. I`ve made quite a few mage suits, & warrior suits. So, I know my prices, & which ones are cheaper to make. If you would have read into my post you would realized my Tamer is a Warrior/Tamer. So, I don`t use summons. I use my blade to beat down my submission tames.

Everone should be able to have a discussion without insulting anyone on either end.

 

[Garm The Green]

ts a mmorpg, so a little interaction with other players can go a long way.

i cant disagree with u there brother wise words

 

[Garm The Green]

Everone should be able to have a discussion without insulting anyone on either end.

Again, power to you Zalan, i don#t always agree with your opinion, but i do agree with the manner in which you present it what a gentleman!

 

[Old Man of UO]

This discussion was not just about LMC & LRC. I`ve made quite a few mage suits, & warrior suits. So, I know my prices, & which ones are cheaper to make. If you would have read into my post you would realized my Tamer is a Warrior/Tamer. So, I don`t use summons. I use my blade to beat down my submission tames.

Everone should be able to have a discussion without insulting anyone on either end.

Sorry, I wasn't trying to insult you but you made tried making a point that was out of context in my opinion. You might want to re-read your own posts in this thread, nowhere does it say anything about a Warrior/Tamer nor do I see how it could be inferred. I wasn't disputing your posts about the suit prices, rather agree with that point. Your post was just less than clear to me, is all.

You also say that someone who uses summons isn't using the right pets... I'm just saying there are times when it's better to use summons then a pet. Some places a pet ball won't work and you can't instantly stable your pet. So if you need to beat a target into submission for taming, you could use a pet to do that... run or recall back to the stables... and then run or recall back to the target you want to tame. Which has probably healed itself. Or you could just use summons to beat it into submission, dispell the summoned creature, then try taming it. Sometimes I would use a Sword of Prosperity, but not for the new bane dragons. For me at least, summons in this case make more sense.

 

[Zalan]

This is my opion Tamer only needs magery for 6 reasons:

- Greater Heal for pet or self
- Inviso so they loose agro
- Cure to cure poison pet or self
- Res in case a friend dies
- Recall
- Mark

All that other stuff on a suit is nice, but not needed for a tamer to function. A tamers needs are way different than a sampire.

That would pretty much describe a "beginner" tamer. I also use Gate and Teleport (to get close to my pet fighting a target switching demon-type), EV and Earth Elemental, Gift of Renewal, Fireball, Mind Blast, Flamestrike, and Earthquake. But by far, the Greater Heals combined in a macro with the bandage/vet skill takes the most mana when fighting high end mobs.

Have you tried taming a bane dragon yet? How are you planning to beat it down into submission? Same for the blue beetles.

Unless you are just an "All Kill" tamer, you will eventually need more than the beginners suit and that short list of spells.

A mare plus a Leaf Blade take care of any Bane or Beetles. If a tamer is using a summons along side with its there pets. Then a Tamer is not using the right pet combo. Gift of Renewal is not a mage spell. There is nothing in that list that requires more than all 70`s 100% LRC suit either.

Thats were you would be able to see the warrior part. We`ll let the dust settle on the rest of this stuff.

 

[Garm The Green]

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