Respecting EM's, RPC's and the global story arc.

[Calyndrell]

Ok i have been quiet (at least mostly quiet) long enough

Now I won't mention the name(s) of whom I am talking about here but I am getting fed up of a certain character(s) trying to lord it over Queen Dawn. Firstly standing infront of Queen Dawn on the steps as Queen Zhah approached smacks of trying to steal dawns thunder. Reality of the situation, and common sense also, is that unless the Queen asked you to, you just would not do this. Secondly, I don't care how these character(s) address everyone else, you would never, ever, ever refer to a queen as anything less than 'Your Highness' and preferably 'Your Majesty' in public. There can be no respect for a queen by the people if she lets herself be demeaned in public. Thirdly, If a Royal Escort tells you to get out of the way you would move, or they will move you, violently if necessary. Trust me on this I know by personal experience in my real life profession.

Now if I see a proclaimation from Queen Dawn acknowledging certain matters then my attitudes will change because then it is official. However I will be dismayed at having to allow this manner of situation to continue.

Would I expect someone to accept certain boasts and feats of my character if my character could not back up those boasts up with solid proof in game, in character? No, because then they are an unproven matter which is no matter at all.

It is true, that everyone is entitled to their view, but this whole situation becomes a problem when I hear players of baja saying that this is not right, repeatedly, but say they are forced and have to accept it otherwise they and their characters will be excluded from the RP community and the RP community will be lost to them. This type of strong arming on another player for the views of their RPC (or the player also where applies) is unacceptable in that it does not allow the player to let their character have different and varying belief or take upon a matter. It stunts their RP, ruins their game, and hurts the community as a whole.

I apologize if I offend.

 

[BajaElladan]

Let me add some comments. I love role-play. I think it greatly adds to the experience of UO to create characters with personalities, codes of ethics and conduct, etc. and to speak in character and in "period" whenever possible.

The character I believe you speak of, has created a character that many on Baja found interesting and intriguing. The character, over time took a twist, and claimed to have a connection to Lord British. This path was taken with great risk. Some would almost certainly oppose and deny the claim. Some might embrace the claim.

To my knowledge the EM's have yet to react or acknowledge this Players character and her claims. Moreover, the Player, thru the character has made it clear they make no claim against the Crown and Throne of Britannia.

Many players, through their characters, appeared, spoke, and behaved in ways some may have objected to, during last nites Event of the visit of Queen Zhah. You clearly objected to this characters actions. I objected to others.

I have no idea whether or not the EM's will address any of this. However, we all know that outside of Felucca, there is almost nothing other players may do to affect how other players behave.

Lastly, you speak of respecting EM's. While in general I am greatly supportive and appreciative of our EM's, like all others they must earn respect. It cannot be demanded nor coerced.

Like you, I do NOT mean nor intend to offend anyone by my comments.

Let us hope the dialogue will be a positive, open, and helpful one.

Elladan

Ok i have been quiet (at least mostly quiet) long enough

Now I won't mention the name(s) of whom I am talking about here but I am getting fed up of a certain character(s) trying to lord it over Queen Dawn. Firstly standing infront of Queen Dawn on the steps as Queen Zhah approached smacks of trying to steal dawns thunder. Reality of the situation, and common sense also, is that unless the Queen asked you to, you just would not do this. Secondly, I don't care how these character(s) address everyone else, you would never, ever, ever refer to a queen as anything less than 'Your Highness' and preferably 'Your Majesty' in public. There can be no respect for a queen by the people if she lets herself be demeaned in public. Thirdly, If a Royal Escort tells you to get out of the way you would move, or they will move you, violently if necessary. Trust me on this I know by personal experience in my real life profession.

Now if I see a proclaimation from Queen Dawn acknowledging certain matters then my attitudes will change because then it is official. However I will be dismayed at having to allow this manner of situation to continue.

Would I expect someone to accept certain boasts and feats of my character if my character could not back up those boasts up with solid proof in game, in character? No, because then they are an unproven matter which is no matter at all.

It is true, that everyone is entitled to their view, but this whole situation becomes a problem when I hear players of baja saying that this is not right, repeatedly, but say they are forced and have to accept it otherwise they and their characters will be excluded from the RP community and the RP community will be lost to them. This type of strong arming on another player for the views of their RPC (or the player also where applies) is unacceptable in that it does not allow the player to let their character have different and varying belief or take upon a matter. It stunts their RP, ruins their game, and hurts the community as a whole.

I apologize if I offend.

 

[Oriana]

I have held off long enough on this matter. I was hoping those that I know agree with Cal's response would come forward. Well, I do agree with Cal! It's high time people started respecting the EM's and the program. They are here to entertain us and guide us through GLOBAL events. That mean they are pretty much set in stone what they have to accomplish. I am sick to death of certain players thinking they are higher or mightier enough to be able to attempt to overshadow the EM's and the plots THEY are trying to establish.

I will say it for the record... Heaven's Forge does NOT endorse the Widows claim and DOES in fact back the dear friend of Lady Aino who had become a dear friend to Oriana. Queen Dawn deserves respect not encroachment and out right rudeness.

 

[Cadsuane Sedai]

I have held off long enough on this matter. I was hoping those that I know agree with Cal's response would come forward. Well, I do agree with Cal! It's high time people started respecting the EM's and the program. They are here to entertain us and guide us through GLOBAL events. That mean they are pretty much set in stone what they have to accomplish. I am sick to death of certain players thinking they are higher or mightier enough to be able to attempt to overshadow the EM's and the plots THEY are trying to establish.

I will say it for the record... Heaven's Forge does NOT endorse the Widows claim and DOES in fact back the dear friend of Lady Aino who had become a dear friend to Oriana. Queen Dawn deserves respect not encroachment and out right rudeness.

Thats it!

I held my tounge to long....

Get off yer high horse and quit putting other people down.

I won't say much here cause i don't know how civil I can be for the cowards that want to talk behind ppls backs and such.

I personaly wanted to see these ppl come forward as well so we would know Who is was talking all the trash and makeing mountains out of mole hills. I never thought i'd see crap like this on BAJA I really didn't.

If anyone would like to discuss this civilly or otherwise, PM me or my icq is 241282194.

That goes for the EM's as well.

 

[Oriana]

Anya I have never ever with held my position or trash talked anyone. It is a fact that certain people are causing issues with the EM events. I have nothing against the RP community. I indulge quite often. But stepping on the EM's events is in my opinion rude. Yes The EM's should look at what the rper's are up to BUT they have to accomplish certain things as well. I feel these people need to step back and look at their actions and the confusion they cause for other players as well.

 

[SuperKen]

Hmm, I suppose I'm not part of this debate but I'm drunk so what the heck...

Isn't the beauty of UO the randomness of it all?

Isn't this a chance for Baja to do our own thing?

I think we all appreciate the work that the EMs have done, and I'm sure most of us aren't intentionally trying to make their jobs harder. But we've already set ourselves apart from the other shards with our uniqueness, why stop now?

I, for one, am proud of what we've acheived as a shard, and I am amongst many who are impressed by our shard's EMs' ability to not only keep up with us, but throw us for a few curveballs too. It's unfortunate that we aren't able to directly communicate with the EMs to ask them if they appreciate all the extra work we give them.

But at the end of the day, I suspect that they might be proud of their work too.

So yea, we've got a few prominent roleplayers on this shard that are trying to do their own thing. I probably don't even know the ones y'all are referring to. But I think those roleplayers are only trying to get into the game their own way; not ruin it for the EM's and us. Their intentions are good.

And the EMs have shown us time and time again that they can take whatever we dish out for them, and I believe they also have the judgment to just ignore certain issues if they aren't going to work out. I trust the EMs will be able to handle this.

Forgive me if I've talked out of turn; admittedly, I'm new at this (and I know I don't have all the facts about this). But what keeps me on UO is the sheer chaos and randomness of it all, and I can't honestly see people trying to horn in on public events as being a bad thing. They can be ignored, or they can be included; I think our EMs will know what to do.

...Isn't that the highest respect we can give our EMs? The trust that they will make the judgments that are best for the shard?

EDIT: I can write all this while drunk. Hah! Let's see what you folks can do even while sober!

 

[Matraes]

Thats it!

I held my tounge to long....

Get off yer high horse and quit putting other people down.

I won't say much here cause i don't know how civil I can be for the cowards that want to talk behind ppls backs and such.

I personaly wanted to see these ppl come forward as well so we would know Who is was talking all the trash and makeing mountains out of mole hills. I never thought i'd see crap like this on BAJA I really didn't.

If anyone would like to discuss this civilly or otherwise, PM me or my icq is 241282194.

That goes for the EM's as well.

Anya, there is a world of difference between having an opinion and trash talking and putting people down. This is proving Cal's point that anyone who has an opinion other than acceptance of matters as they currently stand, is attacked and blacklisted by certain people in the community, the effect of which carries down through the community as a whole. This results in the person with the contrary opinion having their own rp, storyline, character(s), and game ruined because they don't hold with the views and opinions of a handful of individuals who would state otherwise and would enforce involvement in character storylines upon others.

These sorts of accusations to people having an opinion (or even their characters having an opinion IC) contrary to matters (or even not having one at all by choosing not to get involved in the storyline) and the subsequent exclusion or risk of exclusion by certain members in a community is why those who you would accuse of trash talking and putting people down have not stepped forward and spoken out about their upset over the hijacking at EM events.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but the issue becomes very wrong when matters are forced blantantly into the face of other players in a manner where the only choice that they have to make is to choose one way or another to partake of an enforced interaction/involvement where they may not wish to interact at all as is their right.

This choice of uninvolvement or unacceptance should not result in the entire community blacklisting another, but it seems to and it is rude to the other players around who want to enjoy their game, it is rude to the EMs, it is just rude to the general player-base.

 

[Bucko the Kid]

Greetings All,

I think there are valid issues on many fronts that have been raised here. I know I am the new kid on the block here but in my short time on this shard I have seen some of what has been mentioned in this thread. Some of these things you'll see in some measure where ever you are, whatever shard you're on. It also happens to be a real life issue.

I love this shard! I think this shard truly has some of the finest people on it and it would be great if we can all sit down together, as the Duchess WildStar has suggested, and talk openly and respectfully about these issues. I think this would be a good first step in a positive direction.

Here is a link to her thread: http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=158726


Respectfully,

Bucko the Kid

 

[Yalp]

Ok.. I am not in on the current dust up, and I guess this is a troll.. but it's entertaining... let's see it get worked out civilly, err.. civilicious, civilledly, err. politely!

 

[Sleath]

Wow, I was hoping that things would have changed while I was gone. Guess not.

I wonder if it will ever change?
OK Back to RL have a billion things going on.
Good Luck Real RP'ers!!! Hopefully someday!!!

 

[Sara Of Baja]

Links to EM Seppo's 'Notes on interacting with us:

goldenbrewtavern.com: http://goldenbrewtavern.com/?p=1314
Baja forum link: http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=159822

 

[Mama Faith]

Hmm, I suppose I'm not part of this debate but I'm drunk so what the heck...

Isn't the beauty of UO the randomness of it all?

Isn't this a chance for Baja to do our own thing?

I think we all appreciate the work that the EMs have done, and I'm sure most of us aren't intentionally trying to make their jobs harder. But we've already set ourselves apart from the other shards with our uniqueness, why stop now?

I, for one, am proud of what we've acheived as a shard, and I am amongst many who are impressed by our shard's EMs' ability to not only keep up with us, but throw us for a few curveballs too. It's unfortunate that we aren't able to directly communicate with the EMs to ask them if they appreciate all the extra work we give them.

But at the end of the day, I suspect that they might be proud of their work too.

So yea, we've got a few prominent roleplayers on this shard that are trying to do their own thing. I probably don't even know the ones y'all are referring to. But I think those roleplayers are only trying to get into the game their own way; not ruin it for the EM's and us. Their intentions are good.

And the EMs have shown us time and time again that they can take whatever we dish out for them, and I believe they also have the judgment to just ignore certain issues if they aren't going to work out. I trust the EMs will be able to handle this.

Forgive me if I've talked out of turn; admittedly, I'm new at this (and I know I don't have all the facts about this). But what keeps me on UO is the sheer chaos and randomness of it all, and I can't honestly see people trying to horn in on public events as being a bad thing. They can be ignored, or they can be included; I think our EMs will know what to do.

...Isn't that the highest respect we can give our EMs? The trust that they will make the judgments that are best for the shard?

EDIT: I can write all this while drunk. Hah! Let's see what you folks can do even while sober!

I laughed at your drunk vs. sober comments and thought the same thing. You should become a reporter, SK. I also agreed with the content of your post and echo the sentiment.

I love the randomness of Baja. We are a unique shard and because so many of us have become like family, we tend to bicker like family too. I don't know about the problems RP'ers are having with the storyline and I choose to remain ignorant of it. I go to the events and enjoy them for what they are. If I choose to *cheer*, *hiss* or *scowl* at someone's comments, they are in reaction to what is happening at that very time. Nothing is planned in advance and that's the beauty of it. As for me, if someone says something that is out of line, I either ignore or go with the flow and take the opportunity to do a little RP'ing myself. If that doesn't work, I'll just go into 'goblin' form and bite them on the kneecap.

 

[Cadsuane Sedai]

Anya, there is a world of difference between having an opinion and trash talking and putting people down. This is proving Cal's point that anyone who has an opinion other than acceptance of matters as they currently stand, is attacked and blacklisted by certain people in the community, the effect of which carries down through the community as a whole. This results in the person with the contrary opinion having their own rp, storyline, character(s), and game ruined because they don't hold with the views and opinions of a handful of individuals who would state otherwise and would enforce involvement in character storylines upon others.

These sorts of accusations to people having an opinion (or even their characters having an opinion IC) contrary to matters (or even not having one at all by choosing not to get involved in the storyline) and the subsequent exclusion or risk of exclusion by certain members in a community is why those who you would accuse of trash talking and putting people down have not stepped forward and spoken out about their upset over the hijacking at EM events.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but the issue becomes very wrong when matters are forced blantantly into the face of other players in a manner where the only choice that they have to make is to choose one way or another to partake of an enforced interaction/involvement where they may not wish to interact at all as is their right.

This choice of uninvolvement or unacceptance should not result in the entire community blacklisting another, but it seems to and it is rude to the other players around who want to enjoy their game, it is rude to the EMs, it is just rude to the general player-base.

"what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."


Little tounge in cheek to break some tension....


But seriously most of what you said was bollocks and I think not in possession of all the facts.

The only one being blacklisted if you want to call it that is the poor individual in question not the people causing all this drama.

also the said person tried to resolve it when the issue emerged. its threads like this that make it impossible for ppl to move on.

and I'd like to point out the character didn't just spring up and this was before the dawn thing ever happened, and she has no designs whatsoever on the throne or has tried to hijack any events.


On a side note SK I thank you for your post while i had hoped the em and a certain uo official could make those decisions and respond maturely they apparently couldn't.

 

[Calyndrell]

Firstly I thank everyone who has responded.

And I think my points are well proven with this

 

[Cymidei Fier]

If some player got made Queen, everyone would want to be Queen. Therefore a player cannot be Queen officially because it would cause too much upheaval. What would happen to the realm if the player who is Queen quit? It's very logical why this is not going to happen.

You all know that is the way it is and it is a good thing. Include with Queen "dowager" and all the other claims and titles associated with Lord British's persona and throne in the category of "no dice".

Now if Widow or anyone else wants to run a player run government that is a win for Baja! Baja could use some role-played intrigue, backstabbing, politics and warfare. We need another battle for the outhouse, now that was fun!

Why fight on forums when you could raise hell in a fun way in game? By raising hell I do not mean acting foolish at the next event either, I mean REAL role-play and RPVP because that is where the fun is at. Blacklisting is NOT fun and we should all be better than that.

 

[Cadsuane Sedai]

http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=159918