an idea to cut down on script mining

[Belanos/Icicle]

have a chance to spawn a blackrock elemental when you mine, no matter where you're mining at (as long as its outside of a town). Give them an anti-recall effect for like 5 tiles out so a script can't automatically recall away from their presence, but don't have them aggro for a few seconds so that a real person mining can run off.

thoughts?

 

[Dermott of LS]

...

They already did this for a while. It sucked for normal miners.

The problem with automated anti-scripting measures is that thet tend to adversely affect the NON-scriptors on a MUCH bigger level than they do the scriptors.

 

[Belanos/Icicle]

...

They already did this for a while. It sucked for normal miners.

The problem with automated anti-scripting measures is that thet tend to adversely affect the NON-scriptors on a MUCH bigger level than they do the scriptors.

they didn't go far enough with the original blackrock elementals.
As long as they don't aggro instantly and prevent recalls within a few tiles, it would work I think.

 

[Maplestone]

I had mixed feelings about it ... it did drive me away from mining for a while (mostly because I was dabbling in other things and trying to avoid gaining blackrock), but it was also an interesting experience. I think that it would be good to have an area of richer resources where blackrock elementals spawned (say, somewhere in the lost lands?) as a balance against say pure veins of elemental ore?

 

[Hanna]

they didn't go far enough with the original blackrock elementals.
As long as they don't aggro instantly and prevent recalls within a few tiles, it would work I think.

And make them killable or make them disappear after a few minutes.

 

[UOKaiser]

have a chance to spawn a blackrock elemental when you mine, no matter where you're mining at (as long as its outside of a town). Give them an anti-recall effect for like 5 tiles out so a script can't automatically recall away from their presence, but don't have them aggro for a few seconds so that a real person mining can run off.

thoughts?

Script
if blackrock elemental
move coords *.* -6
cast recall next spot.
Well you get the point problem solved.

poor macro miner.
press macro mine mine mine blackrock ele mine mine
stop macro run away from area
new miner comes around ahh blackrock ele run from area
soon all areas are infected with blackrock ele
mining grows to stand still
all ingots prices raises 1000x %
a) resources gatherers are forced to have high end combat skills on templates
if killable.
script miner includes high end combat on template automatic attack blackrock ele loot continue.
No more non script miners on mining. towns will be overfload with the only area to mine.
Only non script miners will be affected.
b) If unkillable
All resources down to 10% time to ingot efficiency
More crafting on the onset of SA
ingots-gems raise 3000% price.
Most will horde any ingots made. Market for ingots go south
unable to have enough resources for new and old craftables.
Prices on all craft items increase to reflect.
Players with low income completly solo
players run to buy gold from gold sellers
gold seller prices increase

Well thats my take on it.

 

[Bomb Bloke]

There's no need for miners to leave gaurd zones due to the ore randomisation.

 

[UOKaiser]

There's no need for miners to leave gaurd zones due to the ore randomisation.

Sadly 30 miners strip mining the guardzones in trammel and getting wacked in fel because the guardzones are down there will be alot of people in line waiting.
Lets see umbra is one minoc cave is another brit mountain side I think. Any others?

 

[Rand Althor]

Why not just set maximum mining an account can do per day or week?... say 20 hours per week... I'd find it hard to believe that most miners mine more then 3 hours per day??.. so this type of quota would not hurt the average Miner, but would hurt most scripters who mine 24/7?..

 

[UOKaiser]

Why not just set maximum mining an account can do per day or week?... say 20 hours per week... I'd find it hard to believe that most miners mine more then 3 hours per day??.. so this type of quota would not hurt the average Miner, but would hurt most scripters who mine 24/7?..

Nope is like setting a quota for hunting,crafting,rp,venders, pvp. It's saying no player can pvp for more 3 hours a day.It' not that hard to mine with kr any more. press 1 button and strip mine a area. Im typing this right now and am mining all I need is to press my hot key. Or I can use my advance macros that i set up takes a few more hot keys but i can mine as long as my macro finger don't hurt anymore.
Lets see being mining last 2 hours plan to mine 4 hours more.
Those players that can only play 2 day a week or whatever dedicate maybe one whole day to mining and the next day to do whatever else.. distributing there time.
My fellow average miners mine alot and I mean alot and do other things less. Maybe because am in a large mining guild but as the name says it's a mining guild. Just like rp guilds rp more than anything else, pvp guilds pvp more than anything, pvm hunt more than anything etc..

 

[Bomb Bloke]

Sadly 30 miners strip mining the guardzones in trammel and getting wacked in fel because the guardzones are down there will be alot of people in line waiting.
Lets see umbra is one minoc cave is another brit mountain side I think. Any others?

Not all Felucca guardzones are down at present. For example, Cove is quite safe.

 

[UOKaiser]

Not all Felucca guardzones are down at present. For example, Cove is quite safe.

Oh yea cause it's not a faction town. Im gonna check the mining range over there. Is there floor mining there? Either way I enjoy marking those spots where I can mine multiple veins whithout moving a inch cuts alot of time.

 

[BadManiac]

Maybe if you knew how scripts worked, and what a script is capable of, it would be easier to come up with countermeasures.

The suggestion above is painfully easy to avoid.
*scan for a blackrock elemental
*pathfind 5 tiles away if detected
*recall to the next mining spot
*keep mining


No the solution to scripting is to make it fun. Since Mining, Lumberjacking, Fishing, BOD's, Heartwood Quests and Community Collections are all nauseatingly repetivie, and often with little to no reward at the end (heartwood kit crafted bows anyone?), people will always want to macro/script/simplify them. Hell even UOAssist and the KR Client itself now enable you to do stuff that was a bannable offense once. It's the way forward for UO.

UO just needs to embrace that way of thinking. Make all these things more simple, engaging, fun and interesting, and make the rewards both achievable and worth the time. No one will script if they are actually having fun.

 

[Rand Althor]

Nope is like setting a quota for hunting,crafting,rp,venders, pvp. It's saying no player can pvp for more 3 hours a day.It' not that hard to mine with kr any more. press 1 button and strip mine a area. Im typing this right now and am mining all I need is to press my hot key. Or I can use my advance macros that i set up takes a few more hot keys but i can mine as long as my macro finger don't hurt anymore.
Lets see being mining last 2 hours plan to mine 4 hours more.
Those players that can only play 2 day a week or whatever dedicate maybe one whole day to mining and the next day to do whatever else.. distributing there time.
My fellow average miners mine alot and I mean alot and do other things less. Maybe because am in a large mining guild but as the name says it's a mining guild. Just like rp guilds rp more than anything else, pvp guilds pvp more than anything, pvm hunt more than anything etc..

yes you may mine 6 hours today... but how many hours do you mine in a week?.. that's the weekly quota, and it would effect a few people vs. the masses, plus hurt a high percentage of scripters..

I can't believe you would even contemplate comparing quota's on mining, as the same for PvP, and other activities... the only thing common in those is the "time" people spend, they both have different game effects.. PvP all day effects you and the poeple you PvP... mine all day and it has a larger economy effect, huge differences between the two..


How many hours a week do you mine, or how many hours a week does your guild mates mine?.. this would go for any resource gathering activity..

 

[BadManiac]

How will quotas hurt scripters? They'll just set their scripts up to auto login, mine 100% of their quota, then log out. Since the same restriction applies to non scripting players too, it changes nothing, it just changes the total amount of resources generated. Scripters can still take full advantage. The percentage of scripted to non scripted resources remain identical.
We've just wasted a lot of effort for no results.

 

[UOKaiser]

yes you may mine 6 hours today... but how many hours do you mine in a week?.. that's the weekly quota, and it would effect a few people vs. the masses, plus hurt a high percentage of scripters..

I can't believe you would even contemplate comparing quota's on mining, as the same for PvP, and other activities... the only thing common in those is the "time" people spend, they both have different game effects.. PvP all day effects you and the poeple you PvP... mine all day and it has a larger economy effect, huge differences between the two..


How many hours a week do you mine, or how many hours a week does your guild mates mine?.. this would go for any resource gathering activity..

Let's see 6 hours today.Tommorrow is a holiday gonna hit another 6 tom. tue-friday work though my work is with computers so i get a hour or so while at work get home do what i need to do put up a movie so i'll get in 3 hours a night 6 more on sat average 34 for this week. I usually can't sleep too much so really late night I might stay till server down if no work the next day. If I have to go out hang with my girl i'll subtract that time. So some weeks 34 hours other weeks 12 other boring weeks i might spend 3 days mining straight with normal breaks to replenish stock which gives me a good 15 hour a day giving 45 hours for that week then wont mine for the rest of week maybe another hour or so. So thats my averages spend one day filling my bods stop to collect bods each hour for a few minutes turn in at the end of the month.
Got a few more things that changes the routine alot it's on a day to week basis depending what I feel like doing.

Well my routine. Not sure about my guildmates but they usually around when I am. Now those people that are more obsessed or have even less things to do i expect them to be mining 4 days or so. Especially if they got into a accident and are stuck behind the pc.
The biggest point in being is someone can mine for 3 days blow there 30 hours of mining and have nothing to do the rest of the week because they prefer to mine and need to get a certain quota of ingots ,gems for crafting,bods,there vender or whatever that week.

And I agree with the above post scripter will log in for 30 hours a week all the time won't efect them just will effect the resource in the market increasing the price of everything more. Which in a way it will be good for me and my guild cause we can charge a arm and a leg for what we usually do but bad for other players who for some reason doesn't have the wealth that most of us vets have.

 

[Rand Althor]

How will quotas hurt scripters? They'll just set their scripts up to auto login, mine 100% of their quota, then log out. Since the same restriction applies to non scripting players too, it changes nothing, it just changes the total amount of resources generated. Scripters can still take full advantage. The percentage of scripted to non scripted resources remain identical.
We've just wasted a lot of effort for no results.

It makes it more equal... the scripters can only mine what most honest miners would mine... natural economic principals would come into play... less resources in circulation would increase pricing which would also benefit honest miners, more people may mine due to in price increasing... my proposal is intended to limit scripting, not get rid of it (I don't believe you can). By reducing the amount scripters can script to a balance point on what the 90% of miners mine in a set time.. It's a simular approach to how we create most legislation... It may hurt a "few" honest people, but would have significant impact on the 24-7 scripters...
I find it hard to believe honest resource gathers would have an issue with this... I could see a whole bunch of scripters screaming loudly though..

so you've bashed my idea... now's you turn, the problem identified in the title is "idea to cut down on scipting mining"... stand up and tell us your idea..

 

[UOKaiser]

It makes it more equal... the scripters can only mine what most honest miners would mine... natural economic principals would come into play... less resources in circulation would increase pricing which would also benefit honest miners, more people may mine due to in price increasing... my proposal is intended to limit scripting, not get rid of it (I don't believe you can). By reducing the amount scripters can script to a balance point on what the 90% of miners mine in a set time.. It's a simular approach to how we create most legislation... It may hurt a "few" honest people, but would have significant impact on the 24-7 scripters...
I find it hard to believe honest resource gathers would have an issue with this... I could see a whole bunch of scripters screaming loudly though..

so you've bashed my idea... now's you turn, the problem identified in the title is "idea to cut down on scipting mining"... stand up and tell us your idea..

I think it will increase script mining actually come to thing about it. The average player can only mine with one account at a time. The script player will open up more accounts "good for ea" and mine with 6 accounts at a time.
Assuming the average player mines 50k ore in the 30 hours the script player will mine 300k ore in the same 30 hours keeping the prices down instead of what I said before and raising the price. It will make it harder for average or above average or super player to compete against 6 accounts.

 

[Maplestone]

The trick (and not an easy trick) is designing systems that feel rewarding to people playing for a couple of hours a week, a couple of hours a day or 8 hours a day, regardless of whether or not scripters co-exist in the world or not.

 

[Rand Althor]

I think it will increase script mining actually come to thing about it. The average player can only mine with one account at a time. The script player will open up more accounts "good for ea" and mine with 6 accounts at a time.
Assuming the average player mines 50k ore in the 30 hours the script player will mine 300k ore in the same 30 hours keeping the prices down instead of what I said before and raising the price. It will make it harder for average or above average or super player to compete against 6 accounts.

I'd debate the economics of opening 6 accounts to mine for ingots 80 hours per month/account converting it to gold and selling gold @ about $.55 per mil... but it's not worth the time, the math is too easy and anyone going this route would have a low IQ, they would make multiple times the money per hour working a McD's......


I also disagree with this making it harder on the new guy to gain gold... this is an opportunity for prices to increase, which would alow new players to gain gold faster, since they can't kill high end monsters to gain gold fast... In the "old" days, mining was the best way to get rich along with smithing.. a few tweeks and it could help new players gain gold fast.. like the old days.. one of the first characters you made if you wanted gold was a miner... Anything that increases the price of items that new players can get will help the new players..


As I asked above, what is your idea for a solution to this problem?..

 

[Rand Althor]

The trick (and not an easy trick) is designing systems that feel rewarding to people playing for a couple of hours a week, a couple of hours a day or 8 hours a day, regardless of whether or not scripters co-exist in the world or not.

Excellent point..

 

[UOKaiser]

I'd debate the economics of opening 6 accounts to mine for ingots 80 hours per month/account converting it to gold and selling gold @ about $.55 per mil... but it's not worth the time, the math is too easy and anyone going this route would have a low IQ, they would make multiple times the money per hour working a McD's......


I also disagree with this making it harder on the new guy to gain gold... this is an opportunity for prices to increase, which would alow new players to gain gold faster, since they can't kill high end monsters to gain gold fast... In the "old" days, mining was the best way to get rich along with smithing.. a few tweeks and it could help new players gain gold fast.. like the old days.. one of the first characters you made if you wanted gold was a miner... Anything that increases the price of items that new players can get will help the new players..
As I asked above, what is your idea for a solution to this problem?..

See thats the thing I don't believe script miners sell ingots for gold and then sell the gold for real$. The real money for gold thing is on another level as uo is not nearly popular enough to actually make money of it at least not anymore. The people who would run 6 accounts would be players who play just like us just like to do it alot easier they make the gold to use it in uo.
Back in the days is different. Not many new players if at all in this game anymore just vets who lost money or never was interested in making money or returning.
These days is still very profitable to make money selling runic crafted armor and resources.
The scripters never bother me in my endeaveours. I mine and sell my excess at luna market rate so am always making good gold. If there is a sudden influx of low price ingots I go into reseller mode and buy it all out over and over again if it's so much of a influx that my funds can't handle it then thats when my guild-alliance comes in to buy out the vender or venders who is trying to charge too low for the resources and we resell everything at the going rate we feel is right for our troubles. Of course others of the guild do the reselling as well but if we need to come toghether we do after a alliance wide meeting depending how bad the influx is. So we learn to live with those who decide to bring the market down be it regular players or scripters we don't know or care as they will become our suppliers.
But dupers well we can't compete with that as they can dupe anything how many times they want in very little time. So they are my biggest vein I hate them as there is no solution to out compete them and we are powerless. They have unlimited supply and will bring the market down we just can't buy them out or compete at those prices.
Now I can't present any sort of solution as I know of non that will help without harming the regular players.

 

[Dermott of LS]

...

The only real answer is the aggressive tracking down of the scriptors by the GMs and banning them right then and there.

Any "automated" system will affect the normal player as much as if not more than the scriptors.