Should EA make vendor search engine?

[RavenWinterHawk]

Yep D. Your arguments are weak. Why? They arent anything more than quoting me and making a silly statement to show how its a worthless statement. My arguments on the other hand are superior.

1. The original posters does state a single vendor system you can search.

2. You imply everywhere that Luna is whatever. Get of you lazy game butt and look around and you will find great vendors out there.

3. You dont even know what blackrock is.

4. Do you really think a single search system won't be abused? Thats my point. It wont hurt me in anyway. It will make vending stupidly easy. I get up for work at 5:30 am. That up time for Atlantic. I have time to pick through the vendors and plop my stuff on a Luna vendor. That is what people would do.

5. You don't really know the game. If you did, you would get it. Its not your fault. To you - you want an easy game where you can do what you want. That isnt what UO is. Well it wasnt. But every month it gets closer to what you want. Sadly.


Sorry my opinion is my opinion. Make all the silly statements you want about me. What do you need so badly you can find in game. I dont get it. GEEZ the game just aint that hard.

Maybe you need that piece of armour or something. I cant figure out what the heck you really need that you cant find in LUNA, through a gate, or at any of the vendor villages around. Walk my friend and mingle in the monsters of UO.

Maybe thats it. What is it you need a vendor search for? Maybe I can help.

Ah well.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

And yes #3 was me be sarcastic and obnoxious. But come on. You dont know what blackrock is. Come on. You have been playing less then a year right.

 

[D'Amavir]

1. The original posters does state a single vendor system you can search.

Yes. And that started the discussion of having a searchable vendor base. Which, you may not have noticed, doesn't necessarily mean that it would have to be ONE vendor location. The current third party search site doesn't mean one vendor location either. You still have to manually go to the vendor and buy the item.

2. You imply everywhere that Luna is whatever. Get of you lazy game butt and look around and you will find great vendors out there.

I don't imply anything. I state pretty clearly that Luna has diminished the vendor playstyle that used to exist. I also say that it doesn't completely end it. But, again, I clearly say that it has been a large part of why most people now shop in vendor and why most non Luna vendor houses are no longer around.

3. You dont even know what blackrock is.

Again, if you want to make up things to support your weak point, feel free. My exact words were 'What is it good for'. I know what it is. But I don't see as much value in having it as others seem to. But, that's just me.

4. Do you really think a single search system won't be abused? Thats my point.

Abused how? By people doing exactly what you admit to doing in game already? Sure. People will buy low and sell high. Others will lower prices to undercut others. You know, sorta like it is now. That's my point.

It wont hurt me in anyway. It will make vending stupidly easy. I get up for work at 5:30 am. That up time for Atlantic. I have time to pick through the vendors and plop my stuff on a Luna vendor. That is what people would do.[/quote

Like they do now? Sure. People will continue to play just like they do now. The only difference, which you can't seem to grasp, is that it would also make non Luna vendors more successful.

5. You don't really know the game. If you did, you would get it. Its not your fault. To you - you want an easy game where you can do what you want. That isnt what UO is. Well it wasnt. But every month it gets closer to what you want. Sadly.

So, to you, running around 4 facets to find a vendor selling the item you want for a price you would pay is challenging? Cool. I am glad you are challenged by minor things like that. Some people are challenged by basic math. Some are challenged by simple grammar. Different people find different challenges in life. To me, searching through 4 facets hoping to find an active vendor then hoping to find an item I want on that vendor and hoping to find it at a price I would pay is boring. Its not about 'challenge' as you seem to think. Its not about 'easy' as you seem to think. Its about fun. I have much more fun interacting with other people. You don't. You have fun, as you admit, waking up early and buying things low then selling them high. More power to ya. Really. I support your playstyle.

Sorry my opinion is my opinion. Make all the silly statements you want about me.

Me? Reread the things you wrote so far and tell me silly. Let's just toss out some minor examples of your intellectual prowess in this discussion.

"Does anyone work for anything in this game anymore? Anyone?"

"Lazy L-A-Z-Y"

":loser:"

"Nothing left to do but dance. "

Yes, brilliant.

What do you need so badly you can find in game. I dont get it. GEEZ the game just aint that hard.

Who said anything about being hard? Again, besides you of course. Its not hard to find anything, except good non Luna vendors houses like there used to be in the past. What is hard, for non Luna vendors, is competing with the Luna strip mall that has its own search function while non Luna vendors don't.

Maybe you need that piece of armour or something. I cant figure out what the heck you really need that you cant find in LUNA, through a gate, or at any of the vendor villages around. Walk my friend and mingle in the monsters of UO.

You really don't get it. Really really don't. You honestly haven't seen the number of vendor houses on your shard lessened since Luna? Really? If not, then sure, I get your viewpoint. You are ignorant. Nothing wrong with that. I am ignorant about some things too. I don't know Chinese for one. For you, your ignorance is about not knowing that the game changed, on most shards, when the Luna strip mall started.

Maybe thats it. What is it you need a vendor search for? Maybe I can help.

Ah well.

Sure. Find me a good vendor outside of Luna or Zento selling silver for a better price than what Luna vendors sell it for. Then find me a good vendor outside of Luna or Zento that sells PoF for a better price than what Luna vendors sell it for. You seem to have fun searching through 4 facets to find places like that so feel free to do so for me. I can meet you at any Trammel gate for a rune for those vendor shops on Cats whenever you want.

Oh, and I wouldn't mind a vendor that has a regular supply of powerscrolls at prices comparable to Luna's. Again, any moongate to get those runes. I will be the one with the last name D'Amavir.

Now. Does that mean that those things DON'T exist? Not at all. But since you enjoy looking for them and I enjoy other things, I think its a win win for you to do my shopping while I enjoy other things in game. Thanks!

 

[D'Amavir]

Heya,

Most of us know the search engines which search items from Luna vendors. Then problem is that this gives the Luna vendors Huge advantage compared to other vendors. Atleast I can't be arsed to be going through tons and tons of vendors and items when I can just use search engine which shows exactly where I find the item I'm looking for.

EA has the vendor item info on servers all the time, so making a search engine should be possible. I honestly think EA should make engine which covers all vendors, since the Luna search engines are there to stay. That would be the only way for EA to balance the situation.

Just thought I would remind certain people what this discussion is actually about. I won't even attempt to speak for Splup. However, it seems like his/her idea was the have a place to search for items on vendors the same way that the third party one allows for searching Luna vendors now.

It doesn't, I believe, mean that there should be one central location where vendors will be. Or that someone can just search the database and hit a button to buy what they want. The buyer would still have to go to the vendor in question and purchase the item.

Again, this is just a reminder because it seems as it certain people aren't understanding what the original poster was asking about. At least, in my opinion of what they were asking about.

 

[Elric_Soban]

NO NO NO. He will raise his price up because now the whole freaking land has become one large centralized LUNA. (laughing). Now prices go up everywhere.

.....psssst..

Kindergarten economics: Competition drives prices down, not up.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

Well Okay.

There are tons of vendors selling PoF for 40k. I assume thats fair.


I buy my silver for 850k per 5000. Where? Well thats a secret but I can tell you they drop runes all the time. Its a pretty nice place with 60 vendors. On atlantic.



OH WAIT because I have some knowledge and wheel and deal in game that must make me what?



Its a game. COME ON. Play it. Work it. Learn it. Have fun.

 

[D'Amavir]

Well Okay.

There are tons of vendors selling PoF for 40k. I assume thats fair.


I buy my silver for 850k per 5000. Where? Well thats a secret but I can tell you they drop runes all the time. Its a pretty nice place with 60 vendors. On atlantic.



OH WAIT because I have some knowledge and wheel and deal in game that must make me what?



Its a game. COME ON. Play it. Work it. Learn it. Have fun.

I thought you wanted to work and have fun. Come to Catskills and find me a non Luna vendor will comparable prices. Share your fun by making me not have to 'work' so hard in this game. You do know where the moongates are right? I am pretty sure they are the same spots as they are on atlantic. Come on, have fun and work like you want.

 

[D'Amavir]

Well Okay.

There are tons of vendors selling PoF for 40k. I assume thats fair.


I buy my silver for 850k per 5000. Where? Well thats a secret but I can tell you they drop runes all the time. Its a pretty nice place with 60 vendors. On atlantic.



OH WAIT because I have some knowledge and wheel and deal in game that must make me what?



Its a game. COME ON. Play it. Work it. Learn it. Have fun.

And, fyi, I 'asked a friend' and he found silver for 750k per 5000 on Atlantic. Coincidently I am sure, it was in Luna. So, you can't even find the best price on your own shard. No wonder you can't take up my challenge to find it on mine.

Thanks anyway though.

Oh, that same friend also found powder for 30k per. Again, in Luna. How convenient for you. Why haven't you bought all those up and sold them on your super duper non Luna vendor already? Since that is what you do, right?

 

[wanderer1origin]

LOL

poor raven and vendoritis and the backfire u ahve built in to playstyle
it is! and the backfire u have built in to playstyle!

And, fyi, I 'asked a friend' and he found silver for 750k per 5000 on Atlantic. Coincidently I am sure, it was in Luna. So, you can't even find the best price on your own shard. No wonder you can't take up my challenge to find it on mine.

Thanks anyway though.

Oh, that same friend also found powder for 30k per. Again, in Luna. How convenient for you. Why haven't you bought all those up and sold them on your super duper non Luna vendor already? Since that is what you do, right?

 

[HD2300]

I declare D'Amavir the winner by a landslide


An ingame vendor search system would kill the reseller playstyle. A system that benefits "99950" people where they are more likely to be able to sell and buy goods at a fair market price, is far better for UO than the current system that the 50 other people that dont want any competition want to keep in place.

 

[D'Amavir]

I declare D'Amavir the winner by a landslide


An ingame vendor search system would kill the reseller playstyle. A system that benefits "99950" people where they are more likely to be able to sell and buy goods at a fair market price, is far better for UO than the current system that the 50 other people that dont want any competition want to keep in place.

I thank you. I would be proud but it wasn't much of a challenge really.

Raven=Baby
This discussion=candy
Me=Taking


Most people against this idea are the Luna greedies. I get the concern about it taking too much coding effort but people claiming that MORE people selling thing is a bad thing just makes no sense.

And that's not to say everyone in Luna is some greedy cheat. But it just seems like the most vocal people against this idea are the ones that benefit from not having it put in place.

 

[Dermott of LS]

...

You assume it would undercut. I wish you were right. It wont undercut anything. Two things would happen. For some reason everyone in Luna is considered a thief and steals gold by charging high prices. Well thats not true... But what will happen is the lone vendors NOT in Luna will either... raise their prices or be bought out. Very little price chance once the system has been up.

Sadly, people think LUNA BAD and other vendors fair and GOOD. Human nature leans toward greed. Even more so in a game. I would love to think the market gets better balance. It won't.

I have already explained how the market system would in fact fluctuate ratlier in the thread. As others have pointed out, your understanding of a free and fluid market system OUTSIDE of Luna is very lacking.

Please refer to my example in the earlier post in this thread for more information.

 

[Harlequin]

I'd only be in favor of a minimalist search system:

1. One that is only updated during server downtime (after all, it's common in the real world to miss out on a sale price from the seller selling out of the item before the ad circular gets delivered in the mail, 2 days into the sale - similarly, sometimes, one can luck into a nice buy that hasn't been advertised yet)
2. One that does NOT allow you to direct-buy from anywhere, but instead, gives you the facet and coordinates of the shop you want. You could even theoretically have KR/SA able to automatically add a waypoint to your map, for directions there. This would encourage people to go places they otherwise would not go.
3. One that charges gold every query.
4. Add a feature that makes it to where any item bought from a vendor, can not be put on another player's vendor for 24 or 48 hours (in like of coding such as the vendor penalty, this should not be all that hard). This would reduce the amount of speculation buying, as trying to do this on a large scale to corner the market would result in a person eventually running out of house lockdowns.

1) I agree with no real time updates. But I suggested 1 hour instead of something longer so that the in-game system has an advantage over the external search sites.

ie imagine the external search sites having to walk a bot all over Luna plus Zento every hour just to keep up with the built-in system. To beat it, they would have to run that bot every 30 mins. That's 30 mins to finish cataloging the every single vendor's entire inventory in both Luna and Zento. There are ways to do this of course, but it's going to be very detectable

If server performance is impacted by the 1 hour searches (I don't think hourly queires will have that great an impact), the update interval can be tweaked further to find an optimal balance.

2) My suggestion for the guildmasters charging a fee to directly buy stuff is intended to encourage people to set up vendors in Fel too. Maybe this option can be limited to only Fel vendors.

3) Agreed, for a healthy economy, we need more gold sinks. I believe removing gold from the system should be done via methods like paying for a service (as opposed to a blanket wipe of the gold reserves in players' banks). It must be optional and there must be a benefit to players so that they pay it willingly. It should also be scaled to the cost of the item that's being bought.

4) Good idea!

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

I declare D'Amavir the winner by a landslide


An ingame vendor search system would kill the reseller playstyle. A system that benefits "99950" people where they are more likely to be able to sell and buy goods at a fair market price, is far better for UO than the current system that the 50 other people that dont want any competition want to keep in place.

You have no idea what you are talking about. It would perhaps create a fair market at SERVER up. Geez. Unless you figure out a way to prevent anyone that resells from using the vendor search system, you are going to create 1 massive LUNA.

You think everyone is just going to put their items up nicely and price fairly. You live in lalala land.

Why do you think some LUNA vendors can charge high prices. BECAUSE there are tons of shoppers with billions of gold.

Open a vendor search your short sightedness will be rewarded. Now every vendor will have the ability to jack up the price.

You idea is great for me as a merchant and reseller. If you want to destroy immersion, make vendor RP house useless and shop from a single point. Its a great idea.

It wont achieve what you think.

If the argument is to find stuff. Do you really think someone is going to want a sit there and read through 6000 pieces of armour.

Oh are you talking about a filter now. This will never happen. There will never be a searchable vendor. For the reasons I stated and because it is a waste of the DEVS time.

Sorry. I win by default.
The baby wins. Silly.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

I thank you. I would be proud but it wasn't much of a challenge really.

Raven=Baby
This discussion=candy
Me=Taking


Most people against this idea are the Luna greedies. I get the concern about it taking too much coding effort but people claiming that MORE people selling thing is a bad thing just makes no sense.

And that's not to say everyone in Luna is some greedy cheat. But it just seems like the most vocal people against this idea are the ones that benefit from not having it put in place.

So now you have the ability to know who is greedy and cheat. Nice skill. Like I said you cant see a tree because of a forest and you cant see a forest because of a tree.

I admirer your attempt but you just dont know the game well enough from a players end or a merchants end.

Now perhaps this would work. A search engine that only identifies the item but not the cost. Why? Wait... no one would use it to buy and resell the items. Everyone would be honest and fair. Fair in the sense I guess there is a rule of what you can charge.

Didnt you say its a game?

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

And, fyi, I 'asked a friend' and he found silver for 750k per 5000 on Atlantic. Coincidently I am sure, it was in Luna. So, you can't even find the best price on your own shard. No wonder you can't take up my challenge to find it on mine.

Thanks anyway though.

Oh, that same friend also found powder for 30k per. Again, in Luna. How convenient for you. Why haven't you bought all those up and sold them on your super duper non Luna vendor already? Since that is what you do, right?

SO YOU FOUND what you need and you still want more? Hmm.

Dude I dont care if you found it for cheaper. As a merchant you dont care what you pay, you care what you can sell it for. If you cant resell it, you dont buy it. I know that is hard to understand. By the way I get a lot of my silver by killing demons. Hmmm. Free but for the time.

If I buy it for 750k for 5000 I sell it for more. If I buy it for 1 mill per 5000 I sell it for more.

Great point. You got me. You are clever.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

I thought you wanted to work and have fun. Come to Catskills and find me a non Luna vendor will comparable prices. Share your fun by making me not have to 'work' so hard in this game. You do know where the moongates are right? I am pretty sure they are the same spots as they are on atlantic. Come on, have fun and work like you want.

Id be glad to help you on atlantic. What exactly are you having trouble with?

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

.....psssst..

Kindergarten economics: Competition drives prices down, not up.

Psst its a game economy. The game is based on demand with no exiting of gold. Prices go down when more crap arrives true. Look at the arties but during the 1-2 weeks new stuff arrives in game the prices are out of here.

If a player can wait a month competition will drive prices down.

Because its a game economy and players have billions there is that 2 week period when the market is violatile.

And you forget resources and ingredients change based on what recipes and thing come into game.

Dont confuse a real life market with a game market. They are not the same.

 

[D'Amavir]

SO YOU FOUND what you need and you still want more? Hmm.

You clearly missed the point. Again.

Dude I dont care if you found it for cheaper. As a merchant you dont care what you pay, you care what you can sell it for. If you cant resell it, you dont buy it. I know that is hard to understand. By the way I get a lot of my silver by killing demons. Hmmm. Free but for the time.

Still, point missed.

If I buy it for 750k for 5000 I sell it for more. If I buy it for 1 mill per 5000 I sell it for more.

Great point. You got me. You are clever.

You finally said something that was right. Two things in fact. I got you and I am clever. Correct.

The point, and I know you won't follow it, is that the items were found cheaper and easier to find not by traveling through 4 different facets and walking around for hours trying to find them. They were found by 'asking a friend'. Now that I have found what I am looking for from this 'friend', do you think I am going to then go and travel those 4 facets and walk around for hours or am I just going to use what the friend told me was the better price? Think about it, for two seconds. Just think.

 

[D'Amavir]

Id be glad to help you on atlantic. What exactly are you having trouble with?

Well, first off, I am having trouble making some nobody on this board understand simple things. Second, I am having trouble getting a certain nobody on this board to come have fun like they claim that they have by running around 4 facets and spending hours looking for vendors. See, I don't have fun doing that and since they do I assumed they would want to do it. But, apparently they are incapable. As I thought but I try to see the better in people. I am, however, often disappointed.

 

[D'Amavir]

Psst its a game economy. The game is based on demand with no exiting of gold. Prices go down when more crap arrives true. Look at the arties but during the 1-2 weeks new stuff arrives in game the prices are out of here.

If a player can wait a month competition will drive prices down.

Because its a game economy and players have billions there is that 2 week period when the market is violatile.

And you forget resources and ingredients change based on what recipes and thing come into game.

Dont confuse a real life market with a game market. They are not the same.

Let's assume you are right and a search engine run by EA will be the downfall of the game economy. You aren't, but for the sake of argument and hopefully to make you actually make a point for once let's say you are.

Why is that not a major issue already? There is a search engine. People like you already buy low and sell high. But, as you admit, you can still find deals. What will change other than more people being able to sell outside of Luna and more people being able to buy outside of Luna? Honestly, you keep refusing to answer any questions with anything other than 'Cause I said!' type comments. Explain the difference between how the economy works now with Luna being the central vendor hub with a search tool and people like you buying low and selling high and how the economy would work with all 4 facets having vendors with a search tool and people like you buying low and selling high. Please.

I can 'ask a friend' right now and get a large variety on prices for most items for sale in the game. The only difference is that my 'friend' only tells me about vendors in a couple of locations.

 

[Maplestone]

Dont confuse a real life market with a game market. They are not the same.

Because the real world would never have money dumped on the market using exploits? Because the real world has so many gold sinks? Because there would never be wealth huge disparity between distributors and consumers?

Hang on, hang on, I'll find it ...

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

D

A search engine wont be the downfall of the economy. It would not create what you want. Yes and I agree some sort of search engine for armour and jewelry would be nice.

I know you enjoy cutting and pasting and making trivial rebuttals. You are very good at that.

Listen.
Luna has shoppers. They pay 100k a month to 500k a month to rent. Or lucky players own homes.

Luna is pricey because it is centralized and has shoppers.

Follow me.

Add a searchable vendor system and LUNA gets competition. Right? I agree.
Vendors stay at luna and the players also use home vendors now to get more stuff into a massive vendor search system. Right. I think youll agree.

Instead of free market which doesnt exist purely in UO, you get a way for the billionaires to buy up key items. Sure you might find that set of armour or your PoF.

It just doesnt do anything but cater to your style. You dont want to waste your time looking for items. You want them now. You want them quickly. You want them easily. As you said you don't want to work. You want to play the game. You actually want to play your style. Thats fine.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

Because the real world would never have money dumped on the market using exploits? Because the real world has so many gold sinks? Because there would never be wealth huge disparity between distributors and consumers?

Hang on, hang on, I'll find it ...

Because of the massive amount of gold via exploits and lack of gold sinks, the huge disparity in wealth would further hinder the new player or player that doesnt have lots of gold.

In the end a vendor search system that allowed players to locate items, buy items and see the cost of items would be abused.

It only takes a handfull of players to snarf up relevant items, mark them up and constrict their flow.

From my perspective I get it. I log in. I search for the new items. I recall. I buy them. I mark them up. I put them on my vendor at home or in Luna. And Someone comes and uses the vendor search and buys my stuff. Maybe they mark it up and the process continues. Maybe they use the stuff.

Its a bad fix for a real problem of trying to find that one thing you may or may not really need in game.

Aside from a piece of jewelry or armour, I see no value in a search system.


SOLUTION
Set up jewelry search systems via the jewelers in the towns. A specific display case that links all the jewelers together is searchable by players like BOD book searches. A player pays 5k to drop a piece of jewelry into to system and the jeweler takes 10% of the sale. Gold sink. Searchable. Reach every UO player.

Do the same for weapons and armour.

Now you have a linked system for harder to find items.

D
I know you dont want to pay 5k for a piece of jewelry to be displayed and you think 10% is to much. So spare me the cut and paste and cutsie rebuttal.

They address players needs, can add a bit of travel and immersion and creates an option for selling.

 

[D'Amavir]

Because of the massive amount of gold via exploits and lack of gold sinks, the huge disparity in wealth would further hinder the new player or player that doesnt have lots of gold.

In the end a vendor search system that allowed players to locate items, buy items and see the cost of items would be abused.

Like now? Again, shocking how you are so anti anything that takes away Luna profits. Shocking I tell ya.

It only takes a handfull of players to snarf up relevant items, mark them up and constrict their flow.

This coming from a self admitted buy low sell higher player. Of course you don't want competition.

From my perspective I get it. I log in. I search for the new items. I recall. I buy them. I mark them up. I put them on my vendor at home or in Luna. And Someone comes and uses the vendor search and buys my stuff. Maybe they mark it up and the process continues. Maybe they use the stuff.

You do that now. You just don't want other people to be able to bypass your Luna hideout. We definitely get it.

Its a bad fix for a real problem of trying to find that one thing you may or may not really need in game.

Aside from a piece of jewelry or armour, I see no value in a search system.

Maybe that's why no one uses the current search system, huh?

SOLUTION
Set up jewelry search systems via the jewelers in the towns. A specific display case that links all the jewelers together is searchable by players like BOD book searches. A player pays 5k to drop a piece of jewelry into to system and the jeweler takes 10% of the sale. Gold sink. Searchable. Reach every UO player.

Do the same for weapons and armour.

How does that add to vendors outside of Luna getting more visitors? It sounds like it will cut down the few visitors they get already.

Now you have a linked system for harder to find items.

Of you can have a search system to help find those harder to find items.

D
I know you dont want to pay 5k for a piece of jewelry to be displayed and you think 10% is to much. So spare me the cut and paste and cutsie rebuttal.

Nope. Unlike you, I am able to address people point by point without ignoring points they might make. However, you haven't made any. But I keep trying.

They address players needs, can add a bit of travel and immersion and creates an option for selling.

So you want people to be able to buy out all the jewelry and armor and weapons then turn around and mark them up until they corner the market on them? Wait, weren't you just against that sort of thing since it would kill the economy? Wait again, aren't you a buy low and sell high player? Really, I can't follow your contradictions very well. Can you at least attempt to stick to one point of view? Even if it is a flawed point of view?

 

[HD2300]

From my perspective I get it. I log in. I search for the new items. I recall. I buy them. I mark them up. I put them on my vendor at home or in Luna. And Someone comes and uses the vendor search and buys my stuff. Maybe they mark it up and the process continues. Maybe they use the stuff.

(paraphrased) blah blah blah ... but lets do it for jewels and armor

Why dont you just say, no I dont want it because it will kill my playstyle, but its ok if we have a vendor search for jewels and armor because I dont resell them. LMAO.

Wouldnt that have been alot easier than making up all sorts of illogical nonsense like having a vendor search like what WOW has would kill the economy.

 

[ColterDC]

Ah c'mon........it's funny watching the Luna vendors try to defend why they should have such a huge advantage over non-Luna vendors.

Much like most of UO's problems..this argument is based solely on GREED.

 

[D'Amavir]

Ah c'mon........it's funny watching the Luna vendors try to defend why they should have such a huge advantage over non-Luna vendors.

Much like most of UO's problems..this argument is based solely on GREED.

That's enough out of you. I refuse to be part of any discussion where I agree with you.

 

[EnigmaMaitreya]

Just my 2cp's.

As populations decrease and as ... Cheating etc decrease and as "Monopoly" players decrease, in my opinion, the single best tool for the players is a centralized Vendor Listing.

This simply puts more vendors into the system selling a broader range of things, in touch with a broader range of players looking to buy things.

 

[Maplestone]

It only takes a handfull of players to snarf up relevant items, mark them up and constrict their flow.

I think you underestimate how many of us would start harvesting and selling if we noticed people snarfing

(I'm not going to claim a search engine would be the end of all ills, but right now the market is not liquid for most casual sellers)

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

Why dont you just say, no I dont want it because it will kill my playstyle, but its ok if we have a vendor search for jewels and armor because I dont resell them. LMAO.

Wouldnt that have been alot easier than making up all sorts of illogical nonsense like having a vendor search like what WOW has would kill the economy.

Well it wont kill my play style. Read my posts. It actually makes it easier. Its just a bad idea.

Jewelry and armor is much more difficult to identify. You have to click each one. Id'ing other stuff is easy.

Never said it will kill the economy.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

Like now? Again, shocking how you are so anti anything that takes away Luna profits. Shocking I tell ya.



This coming from a self admitted buy low sell higher player. Of course you don't want competition.



You do that now. You just don't want other people to be able to bypass your Luna hideout. We definitely get it.



Maybe that's why no one uses the current search system, huh?




How does that add to vendors outside of Luna getting more visitors? It sounds like it will cut down the few visitors they get already.



Of you can have a search system to help find those harder to find items.



Nope. Unlike you, I am able to address people point by point without ignoring points they might make. However, you haven't made any. But I keep trying.



So you want people to be able to buy out all the jewelry and armor and weapons then turn around and mark them up until they corner the market on them? Wait, weren't you just against that sort of thing since it would kill the economy? Wait again, aren't you a buy low and sell high player? Really, I can't follow your contradictions very well. Can you at least attempt to stick to one point of view? Even if it is a flawed point of view?

I get you got a little mind. Im not sure where you find me defending Luna. I made gold before luna and will if it goes. Its quite easy. Like me make it simple. Buying low and NOT HIGH but higher then you buy is good. If you pay 1k for something and sell it for 900 gold. You do lose money. Right? If you buy something at 1k and sell it for 20% that 200 more gold or 1200 you make a profit. Right?

IF you want to call me whatever feel free.

Read my last post for armor and jewelry. It is a pain to highlight each piece, searching for that makes sense.

Competition is fine. Luna is competition. Every vendor out there is. If you knew anything about being a merchant in game youd get it.

To each his own. You want it now. I get it. You have a lazy game style. Nothing wrong with that. You want stuff right away to go play factions I suppose.

So go on with your quotes. I enjoy them. Why dont you cut and paste my contradictions. People would really think your cool.

Anyway. The search will never happen so I suppose its moot.


So what do you want help with on atlantic. You never answered the question. What are you trying to get in game that lets you play quicker vs. searching for stuff? You found a friend that can find you 5k of silver for 750k and Pot 35k. What else are you looking for?

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

Just my 2cp's.

As populations decrease and as ... Cheating etc decrease and as "Monopoly" players decrease, in my opinion, the single best tool for the players is a centralized Vendor Listing.

This simply puts more vendors into the system selling a broader range of things, in touch with a broader range of players looking to buy things.

Why do you think that would increase vendors? Or should I say vendors with useful stuff.

I never found it hard to get a shop in Luna. Origin was free, nice owners there and when I was on Sonoma I got 2 for free. Luna plots.

I mean if people think setting up in LUNA is hard. It takes some talking but you can find stuff.

Maybe people are talking about finding furniture or stone chairs. I dont know.

Never seemed hard. Tokuno vendor on atlantic has everything craftable there. AU vendor or atlantic outlet has everything too. The purple mini mall is packed.

I would agree maybe with your term broader. I suppose I am naive but Im sure a vendor system would be exploited for hot items/in demand stuff.

I guess Im just a big Luna defender. Maybe a previous poster is right. If someone tried to buy up all the new arties, 100's of more would be put on by players that have them but cant sell them.

I doubt it. But maybe.

 

[ColterDC]

I get you got a little mind.

Are you trying to insult someone by saying they have a little mind?

Personally, I would reframe from even the simplest insults if you're unable to form a coherent sentence.

 

[D'Amavir]

So what do you want help with on atlantic. You never answered the question. What are you trying to get in game that lets you play quicker vs. searching for stuff? You found a friend that can find you 5k of silver for 750k and Pot 35k. What else are you looking for?

You still haven't caught on have you? Yes, I found a 'friend' that let's me buy silver for 750k per 5000. Now I don't have to run across 4 facets in order to find that price. My 'friend' told me its right there in Luna. Really, think hard. I know that's difficult for you but please try. My 'friend' found a better price for what I mentioned in seconds. What I want is for you to do the same thing on Cats. I did it on Atlantic. You do it on Cats. Find me a spot in Cats that sells silver for that price outside of Luna and Zento. That's what I want. Can you do it or are you just going to keep asking me what I want?

 

[EnigmaMaitreya]

Why do you think that would increase vendors? Or should I say vendors with useful stuff......

By more Vendors ....

By definition, this proposal would be inclusive of ALL vendors on the shard and not just the Luna Vendors. *Shrug* just go outside Luna itself and it becomes obvious there will be more vendors.....

There is the chance that the "Monopoly" players will try to "Corner" the market on items. They play a dangerous game when they do this and there is a Global Vendor Search Tool, just as to a lesser extent they play a dangerous game given the Luna Search Website. Just looking at some of the items and one sees ... price differences.

If they can not corner the market then they have their liquid assets (gold) bound to unmovable/slow moving assets and can not respond as fast and face the very real prospect of taking a loss.

BUT a Vendor based market place is in fact broad based, it is in fact not focused on 120 scroll's, Tokens etc. It brings in Archery items, ore, stones etc and believe it or not, people want to buy these things. They simply may not be able to or be willing to pay 1000gp's for a board so the Luna Vendor can make the rental fee ........

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

By more Vendors ....

By definition, this proposal would be inclusive of ALL vendors on the shard and not just the Luna Vendors. *Shrug* just go outside Luna itself and it becomes obvious there will be more vendors.....

There is the chance that the "Monopoly" players will try to "Corner" the market on items. They play a dangerous game when they do this and there is a Global Vendor Search Tool, just as to a lesser extent they play a dangerous game given the Luna Search Website. Just looking at some of the items and one sees ... price differences.

If they can not corner the market then they have their liquid assets (gold) bound to unmovable/slow moving assets and can not respond as fast and face the very real prospect of taking a loss.

BUT a Vendor based market place is in fact broad based, it is in fact not focused on 120 scroll's, Tokens etc. It brings in Archery items, ore, stones etc and believe it or not, people want to buy these things. They simply may not be able to or be willing to pay 1000gp's for a board so the Luna Vendor can make the rental fee ........

I agree with your concerns.

My biggest concern is that it would be easy to run a market with a vendor search without constraints. Now I take into account more vendors might mean more product and the influx could make cornering impossible.

But here are some examples..
Phillips Wooden Steads from 5k to 500k with hithching post introduction.

Black Rock for 100k to 1 million when the blackrock merchants showed.

Easter Eggs limited amount selling now from 4 to 15 million. Players initially put them out for a lot less. They didnt know.

People with infomation and knowledge can run the short term market.

Anyone in BETAs like SA? They would know whats going to be hot. They could come to vendor search and scarf up the needed items.

That would be the abuse.

As for weapons, Jewelry and armor as sortable search or match search via the specific houses would be great. Searching through 100 pieces or armour is a bit much. I take this type of search feature as (like) actually talking to a vendor and saying this is what i need and they bring it out to you.

Thats why Id suggesting having search access points at the Jewelers, Armourers etc might help. Fees are charged but it helps save us time.

I have spent hours looking for BOD books. I finally found a vendor shop in TOK. Now I have tons.

I think finding the crafted items can be tuff. I actually was spamming 5k a BOD book at the bank.

A solution for that that would be great.

Between everyones points in this thread (well almost everyone) and game needs, I think some cool things can be created.

There are ways to pull more vendors in and not turn the game into standing quiet at a search terminal and scanning the realms.

Ah well. I figure Im done with this. As SA is coming in the summer and UO has other needs. A vendor search function is low man on the pole. Though I would like a house function to search the houses vendors.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

You still haven't caught on have you? Yes, I found a 'friend' that let's me buy silver for 750k per 5000. Now I don't have to run across 4 facets in order to find that price. My 'friend' told me its right there in Luna. Really, think hard. I know that's difficult for you but please try. My 'friend' found a better price for what I mentioned in seconds. What I want is for you to do the same thing on Cats. I did it on Atlantic. You do it on Cats. Find me a spot in Cats that sells silver for that price outside of Luna and Zento. That's what I want. Can you do it or are you just going to keep asking me what I want?

Ah no. Im not going to Cats. That would be silly. So your whole idea for a search is so you can find silver for 750k. I figured there were tons of hard items you couldnt find and you were wasting hours searching for a bracelet, weapons, armour, PoF or some sort of deco.

Im not really reading your posts that closely. Im not going to Cats to help you find silver for 750k per 5000. Im sure there is plenty at 1 million per 5000k. For all your concern, Im sure 250k more is not sweat to you.

Youre quite good at debating. Short and masterful key strokes and quips. Its one thing to attempt to negate an opinion, its another thing to provide ideas.
I found your comments fun. I enjoyed watching you satisfy yourself. And I apologize for egging you on. I dont normally do that but you had so much energy.

I get it
Search good
Me bad
Im a baby that loves Luna and price gouging
Luna is what I love and I will do everything to save my play style.

You know if you quote this out of context you can paste it everywhere without the sarcastic backing and people might hate me. Yikes.



See you at the next thread.

 

[Lady Aalia]

the market explorer in DAOC worked great.

not every vendor would be lisyed automatically you had to manually list it , so if you didnt want it on there it did not have to be

Also it listed the item with the Cordinates of the vendor so you could go there and buy it , or you could buy it right of the market explorer with a considerable charge.

 

[RichDC]

One of the main reasons i would like to see a search engine, isnt because of cheaper high end goods, its to see more low end goods for sale and know where to find them.

Carpentry deco for example, those type of items just arent viable on a luna/zento vendor, they simply wouldnt sell enough for the rental. However smaller niche shops may still be selling these items...would be nice to know where they are.

Of course some players will always be able to speculate and maybe make alot of money with inside information. The point isnt that, at the moment the whole vendor market is restricted to high end items due to the high rental fee of most places, a shard wide vendor database could allow the smaller priced items, the carp deco aforementioned, clothing whatever you can think of, to be placed on vendors for "free" at a players house.

 

[Mistura]

Personally, I would reframe from even the simplest insults if you're unable to form a coherent sentence.

I do always try and reframe from pointing out mistakes but this was just too funny to pass up

 

[RichDC]

Personally, I would reframe from even the simplest insults if you're unable to form a coherent sentence.

I do always try and reframe from pointing out mistakes but this was just too funny to pass up

LOL the Troll gets Trolled!

 

[D'Amavir]

Ah no. Im not going to Cats. That would be silly. So your whole idea for a search is so you can find silver for 750k. I figured there were tons of hard items you couldnt find and you were wasting hours searching for a bracelet, weapons, armour, PoF or some sort of deco.

You still missed the point but, ok. I can very easily find just about anything I want on Cats by talking to my 'friend' and walking to Luna. The point, and again you won't get it, is to make it to where vendors outside of Luna can get the same benefit. That's all. Its not about shutting down Luna or about me personally not being able to find something. Its about adding MORE people to the vendor pool besides those that do so in Luna.

Im not really reading your posts that closely.

Clearly. As seen by your many failures to get a point even though its quite clear.

Im not going to Cats to help you find silver for 750k per 5000. Im sure there is plenty at 1 million per 5000k. For all your concern, Im sure 250k more is not sweat to you.

Again, its not about ME finding a better deal. Its about benefit other people when it comes to being able to run a vendor. I get that you are all about you and that no one else matters. That's fine and its pretty common these days. I accept that I am in the minority in wanting to increase the enjoyment of people other than just myself.

Youre quite good at debating.

While this is true, its not saying much in this situation. Like if I wrestled a two month old baby and won. I wouldn't feel very proud about that victory.

Short and masterful key strokes and quips.

Again, truth.

Its one thing to attempt to negate an opinion, its another thing to provide ideas.

Its not about negating an opinion. I fully accept your opinion that your game play is the most important thing to you. I just disagree.

I found your comments fun. I enjoyed watching you satisfy yourself. And I apologize for egging you on. I dont normally do that but you had so much energy.

My energy for dealing with people like you is endless.

I get it
Search good

Yes.

Me bad

Maybe. Or ignorant. Either are accurate though.

Im a baby that loves Luna and price gouging

As we know and as you have admitted. 'I price gouge but I don't want other people to be able to do so'. We get it indeed.

Luna is what I love and I will do everything to save my play style.

Agreed.

You know if you quote this out of context you can paste it everywhere without the sarcastic backing and people might hate me. Yikes.

That's the benefit of quoting everything like I do. No worry about things being out of context.

See you at the next thread.

Only if its a subject I am interested in. And, if you happen to actually make a valid point, I might even agree with you on it. Won't happen, but still.

 

[ColterDC]

Personally, I would reframe from even the simplest insults if you're unable to form a coherent sentence.

I do always try and reframe from pointing out mistakes but this was just too funny to pass up

LOL the Troll gets Trolled!

 

[monica33]

I think its a good idea for the main reason that lots of luna houses are owned by people who sell items for real money, but maybe its not realistic for them to do it in game. I would personally like to see a search engine available separtely like uo assist or automap which could be used to search vendors on a per house basis. So i could use my shopping books (created form runes dropped in Luna) to recall around and search for what i wanted myself without having to spend hours doing it! I never buy Luna Vendors period! Im not supporting people who play this game for real money profit!

 

[Lord Gareth]

145 yes so far x2 most people have two accounts = 290 accts at what 13.00? say $3,770 a month

 

[WootSauce]

Right.
Youd rather just stand in a corner and get all you want without working for it.

This game is so sugar coated. Why not just give everyone everything they want?

Maybe a search feature on monsters of the lands so you can identify pre-emptively what items they have on them. Now you dont have to fight random monsters. You can just recall to the location of the monster that has what you want. That would be cool.

Argh.

Oh wait lets have that feature on monsters and everyone that doesnt like it can just go and kill random monsters. That sounds fair.

Same thing... with land. Oh I hate looking for housing plots. Let me go to the available housing register in Brit and put in a search for 18x18. Once it shows me where it is... I can just recall there and place a house. NO NO. Let me place the house from the housing register and then I can recall to my newly placed house.

WHAT IDOCS... let me go to the IDOC register and scan the lands for locations of the houses that are falling. I will set a reminder to DING ME just before it falls. That sounds fair. Infact lets and insta recall that teleports me there 1 minute before it falls.

Does anyone work for anything in this game anymore? Anyone?

Lazy L-A-Z-Y

:loser: of an idea to have searchable vendors from a central location.

This post hurts so much it deserves to be quoted...

Throw all of your crap about trying to bring housing into the equation out the window, because no one but you suggested that.

"Maybe a search feature on monsters of the lands so you can identify pre-emptively what items they have on them."

Stratics creature monster search anyone? Or should i work hard killing mongbats so that i can find a five mod weapon?

I started playing UO sometime before ML expansion. The very first thing i bugged the hell out of my friends and guildmates about was - "how do i sell all this crap that i loot for some gold for things that i need" and "how do i know whats worth a damn".

The answer to the first question was pretty disheartening. The answer to the second just took time and experience. Using a search - you can get a ballpark on what the market is bearing on prices for jewelery, and weapons with very particullar arrangements of mods. You can have an idea of what your item may be worth to a person with a totally different playstyle than you. And also with this search function - you can be a total dolt, not use it and sell that item for 1/100th of its real value to someone who knows its real value.

 

[HD2300]

And also with this search function - you can be a total dolt, not use it and sell that item for 1/100th of its real value to someone who knows its real value.

Which is why resellers dont want it, unless it is only limited to items they dont resell like jewels or armour.

 

[WootSauce]

i dunno - i have sold single pieces of jewelry and single weapons - LOOTED, not crafted for 50 mil plus per...

part of what helped with that was looking at the items availabe with similar mods and undercutting by millions on a search site.

 

[Theo_GL]

.....psssst..

Kindergarten economics: Competition drives prices down, not up.

Amen Elric.

Its amazing to see the complete misinformation on this board in regards to what a search engine would do to overall prices. Its almost laughable about how little people understand supply/demand and prices.

Vendor Search = more suppliers
Demand remains constant
Result: Prices drop.

Simple simple simple econ model. First day of Econ 101.