Tamer Shadow Ele Training

[slaveone]

Just curious. But does it seem odd to anyone else that tamers can unattend train pets on shadow ore elementals that take no damage from their pets. Yet player made golems were nerfed so that 100% posion weps do 1 damage to them.

Devs this needs to be addressed!

Pets should do 1 hp damage to these types of enemies per hit rather than 0. I understand there may have been some original reasoning to make certain eles unharmable via pets but this has become a very exploited trick for many tamers and mostly unattended. This is especially prevelant in the Tokuno Mines where tamers will lead the Shadow Elemental from deep in the cave to the entrance so they can group unattend train. Please fix this bug/cheat. Some of these newer pets are FAR to powerful as it is and to then let players max these stupidly powerful pets out with little to no effort is just plain dumb. Players should have to train their pets skills in a similar manner to players skills. This means that the enemy their pets attack should ALWAYS take "some" damage even if it is only 1hp per hit.

 

[Turdnugget]

Killed by a tamer lately?

 

[Maggie]

If these tamers are unattended then all you need to do to spoil their fun is kill the shadow elemental. That isnt hard and if they are afk they will not notice. Golems take damage yes but you can also heal them.

 

[goodgimp]

It can't be completely unattended, not by everyone. The tamer pets take damage, so someone's got to be at the helm healing them. That's not to say others without aggro can't UM.

That being said, I have nothing against making them take 1 damage, I don't use them to skill up anyway. Boooooring.

 

[Turdnugget]

Seriously... kill the shadow el if you think they're afk,if they complain, just say you thought they were in trouble and you were trying to help out.

No need to be a Scrouge about it.

Essentially someone could AFK train a pet on the Spyhnx too, do you want them to nerf that too?

 

[Smokin]

Just curious. But does it seem odd to anyone else that tamers can unattend train pets on shadow ore elementals that take no damage from their pets. Yet player made golems were nerfed so that 100% posion weps do 1 damage to them.

Devs this needs to be addressed!

Pets should do 1 hp damage to these types of enemies per hit rather than 0. I understand there may have been some original reasoning to make certain eles unharmable via pets but this has become a very exploited trick for many tamers and mostly unattended. This is especially prevelant in the Tokuno Mines where tamers will lead the Shadow Elemental from deep in the cave to the entrance so they can group unattend train. Please fix this bug/cheat. Some of these newer pets are FAR to powerful as it is and to then let players max these stupidly powerful pets out with little to no effort is just plain dumb. Players should have to train their pets skills in a similar manner to players skills. This means that the enemy their pets attack should ALWAYS take "some" damage even if it is only 1hp per hit.

Its nothing like golem training much like everyone has said in this thread, you must heal your pet to keep it alive, also if you want to train a weapon skill just put spellweaving on your char and use a ice ogre lord. It will do what old golems did. So why complain.

The second part of your statement, if you believe that then pets should never loose skill when they die and should gain as fast as a player does.

 

[Fink]

if you want to train a weapon skill just put spellweaving on your char and use a ice ogre lord. It will do what old golems did. So why complain.

You can also use Gift of Renewal on a Golem, seems to heal it even though it's a machine.

 

[MalagAste]

Unless the pet being trained using this method is a Cu.... it's going to take enough damage to require it's "owner" to heal it...... Personally while I have used this method to train my pets there is ALWAYS some idiot there trying to ruin it.... so going unattended isn't possible.... there will always be the guy who's stealing coming by bringing about 3 or more monsters in tow when he leaves as well as some jerk killing the shadow ele out of some sick spite... so I wouldn't be too concerned.

If someone is sitting there unattended then well... they deserve whatever they get.

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

I agree with the OP its an exploit, though I don't find it odd that they're allowed to get away with it.

 

[Kazumi the Wild]

Seriously... kill the shadow el if you think they're afk,if they complain, just say you thought they were in trouble and you were trying to help out.

No need to be a Scrouge about it.

Essentially someone could AFK train a pet on the Spyhnx too, do you want them to nerf that too?

Um... why not ASK if they're AFK first, before killing the shadow ele? Shooting first, asking questions later works better for old westerns, and is not particularly good etiquette otherwise.

Unless you're philosophically against the use of shadow ele training whether someone is there or not, at which point, well, you're entitled to kill anything and everything you encounter that is an NPC not under anyone's control or ownership.

Personally, I much prefer training on actual hostiles. I can get 100-120k an hour on Miasma, and Miasma can take a pet all the way to their max (I maxed one of my greater's wrestling at 119.9 and his tactics at 120.5 on Miasma). I haven't done shadow ele training for a long time.

 

[Turdnugget]

I was implying that you'd first ASK. Not just automatically think they're afk...

I was hoping someone would have more manners than that.

I always train pets on Shadow Elementals. Easier for me to do, don't get bothered, and don't have to worry about someone wanting to farm where i'm training.

 

[Aboo]

I agree with the OP its an exploit, though I don't find it odd that they're allowed to get away with it.

How do you figure it's an exploit?

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

How do you figure it's an exploit?

Logic.

 

[Wenchkin]

Thing is, EA can't keep up with the AFK macro trainers, to uphold their rules about 3rd party apps while unattended. Rather than depend on a handful of GMs and players taking time to page, just break these methods of parked training. They serve no purpose other than to encourage AFKers. EA can't cope with the workload of dealing with cheats, so why have code that merely requires a vetting/healing script to get in the game?

If I took a sword to my pet or a normal monster for a few minutes he'd be dead, so why should shadow eles or golems have an exemption card allowing them to survive indefinately? It's like satyrs forgetting that they were attacking you while you remain in disco. The satyr should realise they're still fighting while that disco is in effect and keep voking mobs onto the player. The list of these "parking" options grows steadily.

Now, I'm not trying to make everything horribly difficult (though some will scream I am), I just want to see fewer cheats and more players getting off their backsides and using dusty unloved dungeons again. We have areas in UO which are barely touched because they're "newbie" areas. Yet even the newbies don't venture into them. They park golems too. This just doesn't make sense to me. Why empty out dungeons in favour of unkillable training dummies? You may as well make crafted training dummies train all the way to 120. Make a version for pets craftable too *mumble* Or cut out the golems and shadow eles entirely and simply make certain skills raise without the player doing anything so they hit GM purely for being in game.

I wonder some days quite how much effort player are actually willing to spend these days in training a character or pet. Because the answer seems to be a resounding "*&%^ all" and "give me items please". Soon TC will be harder than prod shards...

Wenchy

 

[rwek]

This community has moved toward too much crying against other players.


People doing something that is not hurting you is, unfair? Lets page and get them in trouble? Where is your logic. It's an old game with a shrinking player base. Ease up UO police. NO one ever liked you and ever will. You're only hurting yourself.



Sure, page on the guy thats actually hurting your game play experience somehow.


A friend got banned for having a over loaded quiver......whooopie. Dev's should fix the bug and not ban people over it after 1+ years. And you know no GM by luck saw him, some cry baby had to page.


I dont get it. Show some love.

 

[Black Majick]

I dont afk train on them, but I do train pets on them...go ahead and make em take one damage...wont hurt me anyway....Ill just continue to train pets in fel and then GH the shadow elemental....problem solved....

 

[Abigail LeFay]

A friend got banned for having a over loaded quiver......whooopie.

I have a couple of quivers that will hold way over the limit they are supposed to have.

Is having these bannable?! I didn't do anything to them to make them that way.

That seems rather silly.

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

Yes its bannable. (the bugged quivers, not the shadow eles)

 

[Black Majick]

This community has moved toward too much crying against other players.

QFT...

People doing something that is not hurting you is, unfair? Lets page and get them in trouble? Where is your logic. It's an old game with a shrinking player base. Ease up UO police. NO one ever liked you and ever will. You're only hurting yourself.

Apparently the UO Police wanna eventually play by themselves....everyone at one point breaks one of the RoC....even if you didnt mean too and dont realize it...UO police ease up...unless it is directly affecting your game play let it go...

A friend got banned for having a over loaded quiver......whooopie. Dev's should fix the bug and not ban people over it after 1+ years. And you know no GM by luck saw him, some cry baby had to page.

Sorry for your friend....its a shame they ban people for this....some folks might not even know that it is a bug...think its a "Pre Patch" item...seen them on vendors before like that....sad part is it is still fully functional bug and requires almost no effort to do it. The even sadder part is that I have emailed EA about it and they have never fixed it....guess thats the okay for me to get and own the 37 Quivers I got that can hold 400 Stones worth of Ammo each...

 

[Smokin]

Thing is, EA can't keep up with the AFK macro trainers, to uphold their rules about 3rd party apps while unattended. Rather than depend on a handful of GMs and players taking time to page, just break these methods of parked training. They serve no purpose other than to encourage AFKers. EA can't cope with the workload of dealing with cheats, so why have code that merely requires a vetting/healing script to get in the game?

If I took a sword to my pet or a normal monster for a few minutes he'd be dead, so why should shadow eles or golems have an exemption card allowing them to survive indefinately? It's like satyrs forgetting that they were attacking you while you remain in disco. The satyr should realise they're still fighting while that disco is in effect and keep voking mobs onto the player. The list of these "parking" options grows steadily.

Now, I'm not trying to make everything horribly difficult (though some will scream I am), I just want to see fewer cheats and more players getting off their backsides and using dusty unloved dungeons again. We have areas in UO which are barely touched because they're "newbie" areas. Yet even the newbies don't venture into them. They park golems too. This just doesn't make sense to me. Why empty out dungeons in favour of unkillable training dummies? You may as well make crafted training dummies train all the way to 120. Make a version for pets craftable too *mumble* Or cut out the golems and shadow eles entirely and simply make certain skills raise without the player doing anything so they hit GM purely for being in game.

I wonder some days quite how much effort player are actually willing to spend these days in training a character or pet. Because the answer seems to be a resounding "*&%^ all" and "give me items please". Soon TC will be harder than prod shards...

Wenchy

Your not trying to make things horribly difficult, your satyr thing is, go train lock pick and carto the old fashion way and tell me its not disgusting. As for other skills and pets what people mostly forget is that most of the player base has trained these skills the hard way many times before, its not very often you see a new player.

I am sorry but I guess basically I should just quit playing because I have done things all before so the challenge is gone and I don't want to bother taking weeks and months to train again, running around dungeons which are mostly dead and still would be, because how often do you really see people training any skill. I agree that people should not be doing things unattended but leave others alone that are at the computer just trying to get the boring parts out of the way.

 

[Basara]

You know, the funny thing about shadow ele training, is that the only time I ever used one to train, it was attended, and it was NOT to train my pet, but to train my Tamer's Vet skill - from 85 to 90. Been gaining the normal way ever since (and finally hit GM Vet & Lore last week, after having the character 6 years)

The only character I ever satyr trained was my THIRD lockpicker (yes, I'm insane enough to train 3 different characters with the skill), and that was mostly because my lockpicking boxes got bugged at some point in the THB house (the key rings somehow had their access FUBARed, and the character - the HOUSE OWNER - couldn't use the keys to lock the boxes back).

The short-cuts aren't the issue - its those that do them unattended, that are the problem.

 

[Faeryl]

I use Shadow Eles to train my Cus quite often so they can work their healing a bit. I tend to be cleaning my houses as they train so I'm not standing there twiddling my thumbs, but I've had a few people decide to "help" my Cu and kill the ele... I'm sure they assumed I was afk or something to that effect

 

[WildWobble]

Shadow ele + training a cu = no need to watch cu will heal itself other pets you need to heal manually or as some might do with a script i agree with the kill the elemental option if they are there they will ask you not to then all good if not there well now they get to sit and look dumb.

if your training on a shadow ele for skill well why bother go out and hunt sit at bank and rez pets for ppl or better yet go spawn and find some sot's to eat they are so handy

 

[curlybeard]

Um... why not ASK if they're AFK first, before killing the shadow ele? Shooting first, asking questions later works better for old westerns, and is not particularly good etiquette otherwise.

I agree with asking before taking action against someone you think is unattended scripting. Numerous times I've had someone pop by the Jehlom Stables and launch a couple EVs killing the bull I was training taming and killing pretty much everything in the pen (man those EVs move quick when there are a lot of low HP critters to kill). They ALWAYS are surprised when I immediately confront them and Mr. EV Happy-trigger-fingers makes up some BS excuse. Now that I believe is considered griefing.

Also, I've had a couple people accuse me of script mining because of how I have my macros set with KR. KR is much more efficient than 2D for mining and some people just refuse to believe that I am not scripting. (See Dermotts post on how to set it up if you don't believe me). Unless KR is considered an illegal program.

 

[Diomedes Artega]

I agree with asking before taking action against someone you think is unattended scripting. Numerous times I've had someone pop by the Jehlom Stables and launch a couple EVs killing the bull I was training taming and killing pretty much everything in the pen (man those EVs move quick when there are a lot of low HP critters to kill). They ALWAYS are surprised when I immediately confront them and Mr. EV Happy-trigger-fingers makes up some BS excuse. Now that I believe is considered griefing.

Also, I've had a couple people accuse me of script mining because of how I have my macros set with KR. KR is much more efficient than 2D for mining and some people just refuse to believe that I am not scripting. (See Dermotts post on how to set it up if you don't believe me). Unless KR is considered an illegal program.

I have to agree with you. Actually, to me it seems that it seems to be the NORM if a person is training...meaning they are away. I have too many times been training and had someone come up and start killing the monsters I was fighting.

You would figure they would be listening to the "vetting" sound, but apparently not. Ears turn deaf once they feel like grieving.

 

[Diomedes Artega]

Additionally, as far as the cu dogs go...unless they are high in stats already, they will need vetting. Anyone who would stay longer than that anyhow...shame on them. There are other various QUICKER methods where you have to stay ATTENDING to the creature, than to continue and stay at the shadow elemental once the doggie gets that high in stats.

I can't say it really needs addressing though in terms of the 1 tick damage the OP suggested. A dog trained up to said level that I already mentioned...1 tick per hit won't do anything to the dog.

Most any pet will take enough damage from the shadow elemental that they will need vetting.

I would just have it so you would have to say all kill again after so long. Which you do when you are at peerless after so many people are attacking since, only so many people can attack a mob at once. I don't recall the number, but believe it is 8.

So, after so long if you didn't say all kill again, the dog could just stand there and you could make it so the elemental would lose interest and go away. Maybe not a great idea, but is a suggestion as far as the dogs.

 

[Wenchkin]

Your not trying to make things horribly difficult, your satyr thing is, go train lock pick and carto the old fashion way and tell me its not disgusting. As for other skills and pets what people mostly forget is that most of the player base has trained these skills the hard way many times before, its not very often you see a new player.

Sorry, but I don't agree that skills being difficult is reason enough to plonk down a training dummy. The skills themselves should be looked at first, not handed over to bots. Training through normal gameplay shouldn't be the least effective method in this case. Players like myself don't want to use what we feel is an exploit just to get gains to flow. So I'm not training carto/lp any time soon, because I don't cheat for gains. Even if it is deemed legal by EA, to me that's a cheat...

I am sorry but I guess basically I should just quit playing because I have done things all before so the challenge is gone and I don't want to bother taking weeks and months to train again, running around dungeons which are mostly dead and still would be, because how often do you really see people training any skill. I agree that people should not be doing things unattended but leave others alone that are at the computer just trying to get the boring parts out of the way.

I've played nearly 10 years, there are few skills I haven't GMd several times. I realise vets don't want to train repeatedly, I'm one of them! But surely as a vet you don't want to sit at a golem or shadow ele for hours even if you went unattended either. You would rather gain by playing and having fun surely? These parking methods are like scripts, players will use them rather than make enough noise to get the skill gain system changed. So nothing improves for players who would like to train through gameplay/fun, they either cheat too or gain slowly. That is wrong.

Wenchy

 

[Turdnugget]

I train on golems, shadow elementals, arctic ogre lords, blue pets for ninjitsu/bushido.

I've played since 99'. I do it to enjoy the game AFTER my skills are sufficient enough that I can actually go do the things I deem are fun.

I don't find it fun or exciting going to kill ettins for awhile, then go kill titans yadda yadda yadda.

EA has made this game item based. Why waste my time working up skills on piece of crap monsters that don't give jack in return (other than skill gain) when I can attack the same creature for hours on end, gaining the SAME amount of skill, if not more so I can enjoy the game sooner by being able to kill higher end mobs that actually give almost mediocre loot that EA has created for us?

I'm sorry, but after having created a crapload of characters, and working up lots of different skills. It's not fun to me, having to go out and kill low end monsters/creatures to work my skills up. Been there, done that. The only thing enjoyable anymore is PvP and high-end PvM. Can't do either anytime soon by taking weeks to build up a decent character or a pet by the old school method.

I don't see it as cheating when you find something that works, and makes gameplay that much easier. Are you going to tell me that doing Heartwood quests in the KR client is cheating too? Since I can chain the Simple Bow quests 100x over by the click of a couple buttons?

Make bow
Amount to make: 10
Mark as Quest item: Yes

All I gotta do is cycle through the quests until I get the Simple Bow quest, everything is set, I click Make Now, it makes me 10 bows, and marks them as quest items at the SAME TIME. OMGOOSE IT'S A CHEAT!!!

 

[RichDC]

Wow this whole thread is SAD!!!

I dont really have much else to say, another nerf cry by someone with a hate for tamers!!!

 

[Aboo]

Logic.

My logic disagrees with you. So in other words you don't really have an answer to my question other than YOU THINK it is or should be?

 

[Alvinho]

Just curious. But does it seem odd to anyone else that tamers can unattend train pets on shadow ore elementals that take no damage from their pets. Yet player made golems were nerfed so that 100% posion weps do 1 damage to them.

Devs this needs to be addressed!

Pets should do 1 hp damage to these types of enemies per hit rather than 0. I understand there may have been some original reasoning to make certain eles unharmable via pets but this has become a very exploited trick for many tamers and mostly unattended. This is especially prevelant in the Tokuno Mines where tamers will lead the Shadow Elemental from deep in the cave to the entrance so they can group unattend train. Please fix this bug/cheat. Some of these newer pets are FAR to powerful as it is and to then let players max these stupidly powerful pets out with little to no effort is just plain dumb. Players should have to train their pets skills in a similar manner to players skills. This means that the enemy their pets attack should ALWAYS take "some" damage even if it is only 1hp per hit.

Elemental slayer wepon works great, and 25 shadow ore each one to boot

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

"My logic disagrees with you. So in other words you don't really have an answer to my question other than YOU THINK it is or should be?"

You're disagreeing with a reason you haven't heard, so the answer wouldn't matter. I already knew this which is why I didn't elaborate. You're not interested in an answer to your question, you're just looking for an argument - I can't be bothered with one - so 'in other words' (words other than mine) you'll have to fill out my half of the conversation by yourself.

 

[uoBuoY]

This has been proposed many times before and I endorse the idea...

Once one of your chars has level X in skill Z:

1) You can have the same level X in skill Z on any char in that account

Or

2) Any other char in that account gains 2x/3x/4x as fast in skill Z up to level X

Training your 4th Tamer or Bard is just tedious torture.

 

[Littleblue]

Good ideas, uoBuoY.

I am partial to the increased gain rate for skills already worked/completed on the account.

Makes sense, too... The veteran character experienced in a certain skill would be able to train or mentor the new character that decides to learn that skill, giving them tips and tricks of the trade to help gains and experience come faster.

Perhaps the increased skill gain that a new character receives in New Haven areas could be also implemented for training a skill over again on the same account. This could be modified to help increase gains throughout the entire duration of training, not just to 50 like New Haven.

Soulstones at least help out a little, although if you want two seperate but complete tamers, for instance, you would still need to gain 2x the Taming, Lore and possibly Vet. Definately room for improvement...I wish we could see skill gain reworked to be less tedious and boring, and more fun.

I'd like all skills able to be learned through regular gameplay at a decent rate. Tedious skill gain and success that is only attainable through hours and hours of repetition that doesn't include any adventuring or fun only encourages Unattended Macroing and Scripting.

I would someday like to see those activities limited - at the very least, punishable and detectable. Making skill gain and character development less of a grind could only help make those activites less desirable.

 

[Aboo]

"My logic disagrees with you. So in other words you don't really have an answer to my question other than YOU THINK it is or should be?"

You're disagreeing with a reason you haven't heard, so the answer wouldn't matter. I already knew this which is why I didn't elaborate. You're not interested in an answer to your question, you're just looking for an argument - I can't be bothered with one - so 'in other words' (words other than mine) you'll have to fill out my half of the conversation by yourself.

You do realize how ridiculous you sound, don't you?

I asked a question because I DIDN'T know the answer to it. You said it was an exploit I asked how because I could not see any way that it was. I was truly interested in what you had to say because I thought maybe you knew or saw something different from what I thought or saw.

Instead of answering intelligently you make an inadequate statement and when I call you on it you insult me. Go figure.

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

"You said it was an exploit I asked how because I could not see any way that it was."

Then so theres no more confusion heres a more elaborate answer. I am not interested in explaining how, I see it as an irrelavent point. You say you can't see any way that it is an exploit and I accept that thats how you see it. I am not interested in influencing your opinion. I replied to this thread because I agree with the OP.

"I thought maybe you knew or saw something different from what I thought or saw."

I do. I see him as right, you see him as wrong, or me as wrong or both of us, either way I accept it.

"Instead of answering intelligently you make an inadequate statement and when I call you on it you insult me. Go figure."

I'm not sure "answering intelligently" and "Go figure" can be said in the same paragraph without a certain amount of hypocrissy.

However, I am truly sorry that you found the answer inadequate, I was trying to subtley indicate that I have no interest in discussing my reasoning as it nearly always lead to pointless arguments. As this one has. I am equally sorry that you feel I have insulted you even though it is your initial phrasing of the question that I felt insulted me. As does your latest reply.

Hopefully this is now clear so we can stop derailing his thread with nonsense.

 

[Old Man of UO]

Who turned the UO-PETA loose again?

Might I assume that the Op and everyone who agrees with his proposal, also agrees that something needs to be done about unattended Golem training?

Archery, mace, swords, fencing and even magery can be trained unattended on a golem in 1/3rd the time it takes a tamer to tame and train a cu sidhe on a shadow elemental. I've trained over a dozen cu sidhe, mares and even a bake or two on ele's all while attended, no macroing... after a short while healing isn't even needed for cu sidhe. It takes 24-30 hours to fully train a cu sidhe (maxing healing at 90, the rest at 100) and much longer for other critters. Done right, you can have a fully trained warrior using a golem and sheep in one day.

THAT is just training your pet skill, not to mention weeks and months to train taming skills. Sure, you can jewel up to enable yourself to tame a higher end pet, but you can also jewel up to be any warrior.

And there are alternate ways to train warriors that are even faster than a golem, but you have to actually be there.

So, either fix all of it, or leave it alone. There are MUCH more important things to be worried about in UO.

 

[RichDC]

Most players know as well that if you use either a pre-patch golem or an Arctic Ogre Lord you do 0 damage to them, so in essence thats the same thing.

What your asking is for the developers to change an in game monster to adversly affect MANY players (its not just tamers mages/ Sw's have been known to use them to raise skills as well) for the sake of satsfying your hate for tamers and the effort that they put in.

 

[Old Man of UO]

...What your asking is for the developers to change an in game monster to adversly affect MANY players (its not just tamers mages/ Sw's have been known to use them to raise skills as well) for the sake of satsfying your hate for tamers and the effort that they put in.

That's the way I read it also.

 

[Aboo]

However, I am truly sorry that you found the answer inadequate, I was trying to subtley indicate that I have no interest in discussing my reasoning as it nearly always lead to pointless arguments. As this one has. I am equally sorry that you feel I have insulted you even though it is your initial phrasing of the question that I felt insulted me. As does your latest reply.

Hopefully this is now clear so we can stop derailing his thread with nonsense.

I will make this as short as possible.

When someone asks a question it is usually because they don't understand or already know the answer. That was my point for asking. I didn't see and don't see now how it can be exploit. I asked because there are times when you don't see something that someone else does and the other person could enlighten you to something you have failed to see or overlooked. Obviously you have no interest in sharing your knowledge or you don't have any knowledge, you just feel it's an exploit (which is fine). But to just state it's logic is, in my opinion, a cop-out where you don't have any info to back up what you say.

As for derailing this thread, isn't the thread about shadow elemental training on a pet? You said it's an exploit, I wanted to know why you thought so because I have, in the past, trained a pet on one and if it is indeed an exploit I want to know why because I would never willingly do one. So, contrary to your belief, I believe it is right on track with the original thread.

However, since you just assumed that it would lead to an argument, you have lead it in that direction. I will remember for future reference to never ask for help from you.

Now if anyone else can or will explain to me why they might think it's an exploit, I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[slaveone]

The problem i see here is that the only people to respond are other tamers who are deafly afraid of losing the cheapest easiest way to train high level pets up with little to no effort. All i'm saying is that the shadow ore eles should take 1hp of damage per hit from "ANY" pet type. That doesn't seem unreasonable. What does seem unreasonable is tamers being able to so easily train their pets to MAX stats this cannot have been intended. The fact that there are ANY enemys that a pet can sit on train on and vet can also be macroed on is just plain crazy. I have a tamer myself and I still don't agree with this. It's cheap and anyone who wants to try to argue otherwise is full of it and they know it they are only trying to protect their precious precious cheese. I could care less if they nerf ogre lords who "really" uses those to train? And the golems were nerfed unless you have some prepatch golem which barely anyone has and even if you had one you wouldn't unattend on it cause you wouldn't want to lose it.

No the only people that have a problem with this change would be people who are currently exploiting this glitch in the shadow ore elemental programming and there are MANY! It needs to be fixed soon. As it stands now it trivializes all work anyone puts into pet training. There is really no reason to train pets on anything else. No matter how you try to dice it the fact that a superdragon or cu can sit and train all day long on some enemy makes absoultely ZERO sense. Tamers always seem to get the benefit of the doubt it's time to nerf this bogus training method.

DEVS step up to the plate for once!!!

 

[Turdnugget]

Maybe they feel it's an exploit because it's the 'easy' button for training a pet?

If that's the case, LRC is an exploit, LMC is an exploit, MR is an exploit... oh wait... they were implemented by developers to 'help' game play.

I wish people would quit pancakes about the fact some people have found a way to use game mechanics to the best of their abilities in a LEGAL way. Never once have I seen a GM or Dev come out and say training on a golem/elemental is illegal or an exploit in any way, shape or form.

If the person is using an illegal program to keep them attended sure, that's an exploit. But there is no harm in someone power training their pet so they can enjoy their new pet. Not everyone finds it FUN to kill low end mobs, then mid-grade mobs, then higher mobs JUST to get to where they can use their pet in high-end PvM.

Who is this hurting anyways? It's not like people training on shadow elementals are hoarding a farming area not allowing you to get your gold for the day.

 

[Turdnugget]

What's to stop a tamer training on a shadow elemental in Felucca and just healing it when it gets low?

 

[Turdnugget]

Seriously...As I said before, you could essentially do the same thing chaining the Sphynx all day long too.

I think his hate lies with those who would do things the easy way.

Next they're going to complain that being able to store stuff in a blue beetle and ride it is an exploit.

I mean c'mon, in all seriousness, where is the beetle carrying the goods?

 

[Aboo]

Okay for the sake of this post just think of me as completely ignorant because I am sooooo confused.

I have trained my cu sidhe some on a shadow element, only enough so it wouldn't die so quickly when I took it out hunting hard things. I know they won't gain healing past 90 (I think) except on rotting corpses. So you can't train a cu sidhe to max stats on a shadow element in every skill, correct?

I took my very first GD to train on a shadow element too. I trained a bit more with her on the SE because I wasn't sure what she could do. I did get to a point where no skills were raising so I took her to fight other things. The harder things got for her to fight the more her skills would raise. I eventually had to take her to GDs because that is the only thing that keeps raising the few skills that she can gain in. So, in my observations you cannot raise a GD's skills to the max on a SE either, right?

Or am I missing something here? Keep in mind as I posted above I have trained, in a limited capacity, exactly 3 pets on SEs, one cu sidhe and two GDs so I have no experience with any other pets and how high they can go on a SE.

Do some people consider it an exploit simply because it's an easier way to train a pet than taking it out hunting other things?

 

[Turdnugget]

Some feel it's not the 'true' nature of a tamer to park their pet at a SE all day and let it train. They feel that a 'true' tamer takes their pet out and hunts with it so it gains skill.

I took my first GD all the way to it's max skills on a SE. It just took forever.

If training on a SE is an exploit, so is LRC for gaining magery. It's an 'easy' way to gain magery w/out the cost of reagents.

I guess people just don't appreciate the quicker/easier methods for skill gain these days and feel that everything should be role-played to build your character.

Right... like I want to go kill ettins to gain tactics/wep skill/anatomy when I can hit a golem/AOL for less time and go kill bigger things a lot sooner than I could working it up the slow, tedious, 'role-playing' way.

 

[Aboo]

Some feel it's not the 'true' nature of a tamer to park their pet at a SE all day and let it train. They feel that a 'true' tamer takes their pet out and hunts with it so it gains skill.

I took my first GD all the way to it's max skills on a SE. It just took forever.

If training on a SE is an exploit, so is LRC for gaining magery. It's an 'easy' way to gain magery w/out the cost of reagents.

I guess people just don't appreciate the quicker/easier methods for skill gain these days and feel that everything should be role-played to build your character.

Right... like I want to go kill ettins to gain tactics/wep skill/anatomy when I can hit a golem/AOL for less time and go kill bigger things a lot sooner than I could working it up the slow, tedious, 'role-playing' way.

Okay maybe that's where I fell short, I only trained my GD on a SE for a couple of hours, the same with my cu sidhe. I find it incredibly boring to do, so I didn't stick with it. I just wanted to give them a little head start before I took them into the real world.

Thanks for the response and helping me understand why some people think it's an exploit. Now have we had a Dev say one way or another regarding whether this is an exploit or not?

 

[Turdnugget]

No problem =)

It is incredibly boring to train on a shadow elemental...but i'd rather do that then have to tell my pet to All Kill every couple minutes.

That and I know how much damage the shadow el does, so I know how to time my vet heals and i'm not all the sudden suprised by some viscious combo and i'm frantically vetting.

 

[Old Man of UO]

... I took my very first GD to train on a shadow element too. I trained a bit more with her on the SE because I wasn't sure what she could do. I did get to a point where no skills were raising so I took her to fight other things. The harder things got for her to fight the more her skills would raise. I eventually had to take her to GDs because that is the only thing that keeps raising the few skills that she can gain in. So, in my observations you cannot raise a GD's skills to the max on a SE either, right?...

You can get your GD to max on a Shadow Ele, but that's not the fastest way. It will gain faster fighting high end mobs like a wild GD. What other people are calling an "exploit" is that the Shadow Ele takes no damage and actually gains skills as it fights your pet. By the way, your pet or the ele won't gain skills if there is more than about 25 points difference in wrestling or tactics. That would also be a cause for slow gain.

Here's another "exploit" for you... discord your own pet and it will gain even faster as long as there isn't more than the 25 points difference. You can even use discord on cu sidhe to gain healing above 90.

There are hundreds of so called "exploits" in UO that were not intended... literally hundreds. Are we going to nerf them all, or just the tamer ones?

 

[slaveone]

There are hundreds of so called "exploits" in UO that were not intended... literally hundreds. Are we going to nerf them all, or just the tamer ones?

Dude just because there are hundreds of said "exploits" in UO doesn't mean that ones so blatent and easy to fix as this one shouldn't be addressed. I agree there are more important things to worry about but come on this fix shouldn't be very hard to implement. How hard would it be to modify the Shadow Ele code to take 1hp damage per hit from a pet? You trying to tell me that out of all the Dev's not one of them can devote 10 minutes to fixing something that is being abused on a daily basis by many many tamers across many many shards and making a joke out of everyone who spent hours of time training their pets legitly? Give me a break!

FIX THIS EXPLOIT DEVS!!