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UO - Too much based on items?

hawkeye_pike

Babbling Loonie
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I've been playing UO since its release in 1998. I made a long break from 2002 and 2007. After my return, I noticed how much the game had changed. First, I first want to say that many many changes have been a great enhancement of UO, and increased the breadth and the diversity of UO. So, I do not want "the good old days" back!

However, one thing has destroyed a lot of the gaming experience, to my opinion. And that's the artifacts, rare uber-items and insurance. Let me explain, why:

  • When I returned, I was looking for fellow adventurers in vain. Nobody cared about visiting a dungeon, working yourself from top to bottom level, or exploring the landmasses. All people did, was recalling to a handful of hotspots (preferably Melisande and Doom Gauntlet) to get an artifact. I've seen groups doing the Melisande quest 15 times in a row in order to get an artifact.
  • The way people were playing seemed a lot more boring than it was back in 2001. Back then, people were playing for adventure, community, PvP. Today, most people are playing for items. This has changed the character of the game immensely, and not for the better.
  • Also, in order to explore the new content (paragon, peerless, new dungeons, events), you NEED those rare uber items. And the items you need cost millions and millions of gold. A halfway decent equipment is worth at least 20 millions. And this stuff won't even be good enough for PvP. Back in 2001, you could buy a very good suit and weapon for less than 10,000 gold.
  • For those who have such items (which are 99% of the players), about 90% of the game content gets boring, because it isn't challenging anymore. Those who don't use such items (1% of the players) will end up alone.
  • Of course, if your equipment is worth 20 million, you don't want to lose it. That's why insurance is needed. Back in 2001, when you lost your whole stuff to a PK, you were annoyed, but then you'd contact the dedicated smith or tailor in your guild, and he'd supply you with new items. Death had a consequence! And crafters were needed.
  • Insurance made classic thieves and murderers obsolete. Today, murderers don't fight to loot you and sell your items, but to prove their equipment is more uber than yours. Thieves have nothing to steal from players anymore. They now schedule their weekly or monthly dungeon trip to get the rare stealable artifacts from Doom.

While artifacts and rare items surely are a nice enhancement to the game, they have some serious disadvantages:

  • They have become too important, even vital, for decent gameplay.
  • They require very bad makeshifts, like insurance and PoF.
  • They destroy the profession of a crafter.
  • They make people addicted, and make people focus more on items than on other players.
  • They penalize players who focus more on community and adventure.
  • They unbalance PvP. (PvP today is only for the rich players.)
  • They encourage duping, they unbalance the economy.

I thought about a solution for a very long time. I am aware that you cannot just remove those items from the game, as people have spent a lot of time and effort to get those. My suggestion would be:

  • Make rare items much less rare, and better available for EVERY player. More precisely:
  • Abolish runic crafting (it is an annoying, unimaginative and boring!)
  • Make ALL artifacts craftable. High-end arties should require legendary skill and special ingredients. Allow only rare exceptions (like earrings, talismans, shoes, jewelry, sashes as event rewards), and make sure those exceptions are useful but not too powerful.
  • To make crafting a more challenging and interesting, make it more random (to avoid ingredient farming) and more adventure-like. (As an example, see the quotes of previous postings below, referring to new craftables.)
  • Limit insurance to 5 insured items per character. As all items can be crafted now, they can be replaced with not too insane an effort. You still could insure your favorite weapon and talisman.

I could also imagine ways of making Trammel less "care-bear-like". (For example: Make bone corpses lootable. Make looters attackable. Resurrect the profession of the detective, who can identify persons who looted corpses, which would have consequences for the looter. Etc. etc.)

I think, the focus on items is bad for the game. I think that UO would improve a lot if items were less important. What do you think?

- - - - - - - -


Just a few minutes ago, while digging in the sandy beach in front of my house for glassblowing ressources, I accidentally dug up an old tattered scroll. Things you find on the beaches these days! The scroll was very encrusted and indecipherable.

I remembered the past event (the massacre of the Royal Council) and went to find some speckled poison and some zoogi fungus. My alchemist actually managed to create a potion out of these ingredients (it took him a while and he burned a lot of poisons and fungi, although he is grandmaster). It was a yellowish liquid and was named Solvent. Using three of these potions on the scroll suddenly revealed an inscription.

It was a recipe! It contained a list of 10 ingredients, which are partly commonly available, partly found only as loot on special monsters. It took me some investigation and about 2 hours to gather 5 of each ingredients. Using the scroll while having 5 empty bottles and a mortar and pestle in my backpack, my alchemist was able to create 5 potions. Then I noticed that the document was charged, and now lost 5 out of 10 charges. After creating another 5 potions, the recipe scroll crumbled and vanished. I was not able to create any more of these potions.

I took a closer look at those 10 potions. The liquid was dark black. As I identified the taste of these potions, they said "Darkness Potion". I tested them in the Painted Caves and was amazed by the effect: When using this potion, an area of about 10 tiles around you became dark for approximately 10 seconds. During this time, my health, mana and stamina regeneration doubled, while the swing speed of the agressors around me was lowered a bit. However, I had to wait 5 minutes before being able to use another of these potions.

After some more digging, I found out that dozens, if not hundreds of different kinds of recipes could be found (only on rare occasions), each one of them yielding different kinds of potions. Some of them raised a certain skill for 5 points for a limited amount of time. Some of them caused monsters to go after their own kin for a short time. Some could be applied to my weapon and gave it 5 Mind Blast charges. Some would Incognito me for 10 minutes after drinking. Some would surround me by swarms of bees for my own protection for a minute. The list is endless...
Let us dig holes in the wilderness to discover an old skeleton with a secret message inside.
Let us cut down a bush to discover a lost pouch containing a riddle.
Let us examine trees to find an engraving on the trunk.
Let us dig up an old grave to find a trace of a lost treasure hunter.
Let us fish up an ancient casket from a pond somewhere in the jungle, containing mystical items.
Let us mine some rare ressuorce from the depth of a dungeon, that is needed for a quest.
Let us find a secret message of a castaway while digging in the sand of a beach.
Let us find lost journals leading us on challenging and rewarding quests in dungeon treasure chests.
Send us on journeys, quests and adventures, to discover the beauty and the secrets of Britannia.[/B]
 
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DuttyD

Guest
I think, the focus on items is bad for the game. I think that UO would improve a lot if items were less important. What do you think?
- - - - - - - -
I agree....
But it appears to me that they might be trying to become a little less item dependent.
High doom arty drops.
Replicas
Imbuing coming along with Stygian Abyss.
 
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Dalton4902

Guest
I fully agree, Hawkeye, as I have with your other posts. I don't think they should abolish runics, though. Just make the kits and hammers much much easier to obtain. Plus, you said yourself, you can't very well remove a bunch of items from the game, and abolishing runics would do just that.
 
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RichDC

Guest
I really like the quotes from another post...the idea of bringin little min-quests, that maybe have little or no reward but are extremely challenging would be fun!!
 
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Dalton4902

Guest
I really like the quotes from another post...the idea of bringin little min-quests, that maybe have little or no reward but are extremely challenging would be fun!!
You can't very well put in a quest with no rewards, especially a hard one. What would be the point in doing it? You always have to have something you are working for, otherwise, there's just no point.
 
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RichDC

Guest
well this is where you and i disagree...

I enjoy just having something to do, after about a year back i have pretty much everything i need(being able to solo or 2man every peerless(bad move on devs part there)) and i get Bored so some quest that is hard would be fun to me!

Ive even gone round and done all the old pointless quests like the finding the voids!
 

Mistura

Lore Keeper
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I totally agree with much of what you've said Hawkeye, BUT, i think its gone past the stage where UO will be anything more than an item based game.

(PvP today is only for the rich players.)
So true and it should not be the case!
 
K

kennykilleduo

Guest
The large part of the fun of playing UO was hunting for the items ( Vanq weapons :D ).. Sadly miss those days..
 

Maplestone

Crazed Zealot
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Abolish runic crafting (it is an annoying, unimaginative and boring!)
Imbuing will provide an alternative route to building items. There is no need to remove systems when adding new ones.

Make ALL artifacts craftable. High-end arties should require legendary skill and special ingredients. Allow only rare exceptions (like earrings, talismans, shoes, jewelry, sashes as event rewards), and make sure those exceptions are useful but not too powerful.
Again, I think there is room for a lot variety and variation, although I agree that the top tier of items should be craftables.

To make crafting a more challenging and interesting, make it more random (to avoid ingredient farming) and more adventure-like.
The essential ingredient of crafting is time - if there is to be any diversity between high-end and low-end items, it needs to take time to avoid items flooding the market. Currently, that's handled through grinds to get tools and ingredients. No matter how random you make it, someone who wants to be a crafter will need to grind through the randomness to.

Limit insurance to 5 insured items per character. As all items can be crafted now, they can be replaced with not too insane an effort. You still could insure your favorite weapon and talisman.
This is going to lead to a debate between solo vs team play. Loners are already heavily disadvantaged trying to recover from a mistake, bad luck or a client crash. Reducing insurance just exaggerates that.

I could also imagine ways of making Trammel less "care-bear-like". (For example: Make bone corpses lootable. Make looters attackable.

I struggle to understand how this would help ... it seems to go in the wrong direction, just adding a PvP aspect to Tram, where most players do not want to PvP. Surely this would simply drive people like me from the game? (I realize some may think that would be a good thing, but I leave that question to the bean counters to decide)
 

DevilsOwn

Stratics Legend
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
You can't very well put in a quest with no rewards, especially a hard one. What would be the point in doing it? You always have to have something you are working for, otherwise, there's just no point.

for some, me included, it's not the destination, it's the journey
 

hawkeye_pike

Babbling Loonie
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I could also imagine ways of making Trammel less "care-bear-like". (For example: Make bone corpses lootable. Make looters attackable.

I struggle to understand how this would help ... it seems to go in the wrong direction, just adding a PvP aspect to Tram, where most players do not want to PvP. Surely this would simply drive people like me from the game? (I realize some may think that would be a good thing, but I leave that question to the bean counters to decide)
The point is, that most people in Trammel do not want PvP like it is today. However, a game completely without risk may be boring. I know that this is hard to understand for people who haven't experienced the times before the split. The only "threat" in Trammel are monsters with very predictable AI. There is nothing unexpected, nothing random. Everything can be planned and avoided. If you know only Trammel, all my suggestions may seem like an offense to you.

However, I can tell you that (despite the bugs, the lags, the griefing) back in the Early Days, if you left the town, you were aware of a potential risk, and this added A LOT to the over all gaming experience. There was much more tension and excitement in the game. You still had the choice to avoid places where PKS were known to hang out.

I do not want the PK world back like it was in the Early Days! It also had many flaws, too many people were grieved. However, I'd like a system where evil players exist, where there's a (small) risk when you leave town, but where also being a PK has more consequences. Just splitting the world into Trammel and Felucca is the most unimaginative solution.

A long time ago, I made some suggestions, which were directing towards more realism. For example, the risk you take depends on the daytime (more risky at night), or on the places you visit (main roads are more safe). Detectives should be rewarded for examining a crime scene. If a detective finds out who the murderer was, it should have consequences for the murderer. This and more...

All this would make PvP not a mindless ganking system, like it is today, but a more complex and realistic system of interaction between good and evil.

That's what I dream of.
 
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Ceridwen

Guest
Also, in order to explore the new content (paragon, peerless, new dungeons, events), you NEED those rare uber items. And the items you need cost millions and millions of gold. A halfway decent equipment is worth at least 20 millions. And this stuff won't even be good enough for PvP. Back in 2001, you could buy a very good suit and weapon for less than 10,000 gold.
Um, no you don't. All you need for many peerless is a simple lower reagent cost suit, or a halfway decent bow (meaning SwingSpeedIncrease and Damage Increase). Either that or a tamer with a simple lower reagent cost suit. Build up the suit as you go along.
My tamer (which I use for most peerless) started with a simple lrc suit, then started adding luck when she could. No uber-mods, no special resist, just luck and lrc.
That's it.
If you know how to play a template right, you don't need any uber-armour for PvM.

Now PvP... there you've got a very valid point. *signs*
 
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