Bushido and chivalry changes??

[Goodoljoe]

Iv read somewhere ,I think a town hall meeting log,that changes were going to be made to Bushido and Chivalry prior to SA release in early 2009.While I understand whatever anyone but a developer may say is just pure speculation,id like to know opinions,and maybe even some comment from a dev.Bushido for example has a few abilities that are hardly used(to not say absolutely,horribly,monumentally and colosally bloody useless,and more perjudicial to use than beneficial i.e Honorable Execution).Counter Attack is not very popular either,and while Momentum Strike is useful,most people use Whirlwind since it hits all targets in vicinity and the bushido skill applies a damage modifier to it...What I never
understood either is WHY only ONE person is allowed to honor a target,which makes it fine and dandy to solo,but a joke in a situation like a peerles or doom.And while I personally consider parry very underpowered in high end PvM content,i think that Confidence geting interupted if a mosquito manages to fart on your arm is prety silly,but thats open for debate like everything else.

Chivalry,OK I wont be the one to say chivalry is underpowered,id go as far as say its a must have in any dexer template nowadays because with very low skill you can use a plethora of extremelly powerful abilities.Even with a actual vamp template that sacrifices 100 points into necro,you can still slap 65 chiv into it and be efective keeping 90 anat and tactics which is generally considered acceptable.To this point I havent complained about anything,just been saying how powerful and how beautiful life is with chivalry,so whats the point of this part of the post you may ask? well,devs said they dont like how chiv works now and plan to adjust it so people need higher skill to get things done.Well its no state secret that melee dexers (basically anything that doesnt shoot arrows) arent exactly abundant in free skill points in most templates,and even then a person need considerably good gear,a great knowledge of game and quick fingers to kill the things per say a tamer or mage can do (OK no i wont turn this into a tamer discussion dead horse beating ) .

In resume,what Im saying is that I think dexers actually need love in PvM,not get things taken away from them.And if not improved,at least fixed.They have not been very popular since ages and those who try go straight into a sampire or wammy which says a lot.

 

[InspectorGadget]

Most of what you said is true, apart from the dexxers needing love.

Chivalry is overpowered both in PvM and PvP, low chiv and high karma = high chiv and high karma. The amount healed/duration of spells/ability to cure should be based on skill over karma not the other way around.

Bushido is fine, balancedish in PvM and PvP. Counterstrike is a very usefull spell, if not misunderstood thus underused. Honorable strike is a bit pointles as no damage increase is gained from the spell. Momentum strike is great if you dont want to switch out your heavy hitting weap. Confidence is fine, honour is fine if not annoying at times, evasion is fine(maybe a little overpowered).

As it stands all dexer templates are overpowered in pvp and pvm(not as much as tamers), but this isnt cry to nerf them. More an eye opener that some other classes, mages/bards, need a boost to bring them in line.

Since necro/SW there has been no significant addition to mages/bards, they are limited on equiptment and slayers. Many slayers are only available to melee, 5mod weapons are melee only. What i would like to see is a scribe runic to allow some mods(maybe even a "hands-free" spellbook to allow wrestle parry mages to use a book and chug)to be added to books, the way scribe works at the moment needs love.

 

[Old Man of UO]

...
Chivalry is overpowered both in PvM and PvP...

As it stands all dexer templates are overpowered in pvp and pvm(not as much as tamers), but this isnt cry to nerf them. More an eye opener that some other classes, mages/bards, need a boost to bring them in line.

...

This really isn't the forum to discuss warrior issues, but as far as your comments on Chivalry, I have to disagree and say it is all bull and nonsense. So few skills are useful at lower levels, leave it alone.

 

[Fink]

This really isn't the forum to discuss warrior issues, but as far as your comments on Chivalry, I have to disagree and say it is all bull and nonsense. So few skills are useful at lower levels, leave it alone.

Some top-end benefit would be nice also. There are a lot of "dead" skillpoints between 65 and 120 Chivalry.

I have Chiv on three characters at 75, 65, and 120. The 120 is for RP purposes & paladin title, but this being an RPG it shouldn't be a disadvantage to invest points into such things and not take the gimp route. Perhaps make Holy Light tend toward what it once was for higher skill levels. Speaking of HL I'd like it to work like an area effect if you target yourself with it, and like a concentrated single point attack if you target a (pvm) mob.

 

[aoLOLita]

"The 120 is for RP purposes & paladin title,"

Fink, I have a 120 archer I am slowly but surely raising to 120 Chiv. How would I change the title once I am there, do I have to drop archery by one real point?

 

[RichDC]

"The 120 is for RP purposes & paladin title,"

Fink, I have a 120 archer I am slowly but surely raising to 120 Chiv. How would I change the title once I am there, do I have to drop archery by one real point?

Lock archery and have chivalry pointing up.

 

[kaylun]

I sincerely hope ea is smart enough to balance pvp since its almost impossible for a mage to compete against any half way descent dexer. Its funny how the over powered make fun of people that play handicaped classes(mages) when they beat them. These dexers actually think they are good lol. Takes no skill at all for a dexr to kill a mage now. So ea let the imbalances go at your own peril to your pocket book lol

 

[Cloak&Dagger]

I sincerely hope ea is smart enough to balance pvp since its almost impossible for a mage to compete against any half way descent dexer. Its funny how the over powered make fun of people that play handicaped classes(mages) when they beat them. These dexers actually think they are good lol. Takes no skill at all for a dexr to kill a mage now. So ea let the imbalances go at your own peril to your pocket book lol

Define compete, Because I know some mages can, make sure you read that last statement correctly "I know" not "I can" just had to clarify for a few of you here. Also take note that I personally prefer to play my mages than my dexxers when I pvp, just a bit bias really.

 

[Splup]

Define compete, Because I know some mages can, make sure you read that last statement correctly "I know" not "I can" just had to clarify for a few of you here. Also take note that I personally prefer to play my mages than my dexxers when I pvp, just a bit bias really.

Mages can compete with dexxers, problem is that they just can kill them. I can often take dexers low health with my mage. Getting the final blow is the hard part, actually very hard. Usually dexers start running when they go under 50 % health and when they are running there's not much you can do. Then when they have gotten enough bandies in to be 100 % health they come and try again. This is in open spaces ofc.

But in places where there's lots of narrow spaces and places where to teleport, mages get the advantage. Getting dexers fielded and dumping em there, teleporting away when dexer is getting too many hits in etc.

But yeah, in open spaces in extremely hard for a mage to kill a decent dexer.

 

[Cloak&Dagger]

Mages can compete with dexxers, problem is that they just can kill them. I can often take dexers low health with my mage. Getting the final blow is the hard part, actually very hard. Usually dexers start running when they go under 50 % health and when they are running there's not much you can do. Then when they have gotten enough bandies in to be 100 % health they come and try again. This is in open spaces ofc.

But in places where there's lots of narrow spaces and places where to teleport, mages get the advantage. Getting dexers fielded and dumping em there, teleporting away when dexer is getting too many hits in etc.

But yeah, in open spaces in extremely hard for a mage to kill a decent dexer.

I agree with you spulp, my comment was only to those who said mages can not compete, in open areas yes it is hard but I would not go as far as to say it is impossible or that "mages can not compete", at the end of the day if you can't kill the dexxer but they can't kill you, that makes it equal and balanced thus the competition is fine. I of course agree it is much harder for a mage, but I have no gripes about the current mage vs dexxer situation, I do however feel archers should have ALL the same restraints that magery does, shooting while moving is just not acceptable if i have to stop to do the same thing.

 

[Scratch]

explosion-evil omen-flame strike-painspike is preety large amount of damage in a short time frame and some will follow with a quick wither if needed to finish the kill. id hardly say that mages cant compete, rather some people just cant play the template.

Dexxers whiff enuff on mages stacked with dci alone yet a mage will never miss a spell unless the dexxer can hit evasion which doesnt last that long and cant be recasted for what....20 seconds? So one dexxer has a chance to not get hit by a spell.

Archers have hard hitting two handed weapons that they can chug with. where is the two handed dexxer weapons to chug with of the same damage caliber as a heavy xbow?

Tamers with gd's or dread horses....well they just cant pvp anyway so ill stop here.

mages are by far not underpowered, they just think that mages should be superior and cry wolf alot. mages with sw and necro are almost impossible to kill 2vs1.

fortunately for all of us. the useful spellweaving skills can be used by anyone if human and having done the quest. cmon gift of renewal-attunement talk about adding a big boonus for the toon with no skill required

 

[Sassassin]

explosion-evil omen-flame strike-painspike is preety large amount of damage in a short time frame and some will follow with a quick wither if needed to finish the kill. id hardly say that mages cant compete, rather some people just cant play the template.

Dexxers whiff enuff on mages stacked with dci alone yet a mage will never miss a spell unless the dexxer can hit evasion which doesnt last that long and cant be recasted for what....20 seconds? So one dexxer has a chance to not get hit by a spell.

Archers have hard hitting two handed weapons that they can chug with. where is the two handed dexxer weapons to chug with of the same damage caliber as a heavy xbow?

Tamers with gd's or dread horses....well they just cant pvp anyway so ill stop here.

mages are by far not underpowered, they just think that mages should be superior and cry wolf alot. mages with sw and necro are almost impossible to kill 2vs1.

fortunately for all of us. the useful spellweaving skills can be used by anyone if human and having done the quest. cmon gift of renewal-attunement talk about adding a big boonus for the toon with no skill required

First of all you do not play a mage as you dont even have the combo typed right.

Second, on open field, only stupid dexers that dont offscreen dies to mages. I will play a dexer with a tbox and 120 weapon skill and 90 tactics 80 healing 80 anatomy thats it 370 skill point and you can have any mage with 720 skill points you want. Come to TC with me and do an open field fight with me 370 skill points melee dexer vs 720 skill mage. I might not be able to kill you but you can NEVER EVER kill me, I am willing to wager a billion gold or more on you will not be able to kill me on an open field fight while I will have a good chance killing you depending what kind of weapon I have.

Third, "great" mages ARE viable but not as efficient as a decent played dexer. Mages requires much more player skill, timing and interations yet they do not match the mobility, power and survivability of a dexer in 1v1 situation. Just because you might die to mage because you dont run doesnt mean other, better/smarter dexers dont offscreen.

On the SW topic I run an SW Archer, with 4 pixies. I can tell you Id rather play a SW archer than SW mage as archer is much more efficient in killing AND surviving than going-everything-frozen-in-place mages.

This is from a 10-yr hardcore mage player that started to play dexers for the nearly godlike survivability, especially when against other mages.

I dont care how good you are on a mage, if I have the room to run you will never kill me.