What would you like done to improve the 2d client?

[Gellor]

No, it doesn't. I was specifically talking about your suggestion of using red, not any other color. So, as far as red is concerned, background color has NOTHING to do with it.

Connor, your reading comprehension is lacking greatly. Let me highlight something you missed in the sentence you quoted: "background AND marker color have EVERYTHING to do with it" Please notice the AND in that sentence. This means BOTH items mentioned not just one.

The current white marker sucks when you get onto white background zones such as snowy areas. There is no way to argue this. If the marker and background color are the same, you will see no difference.

Red was just an initial suggestion as that is what I use. Red in green field could be an issue for SOME people.

If not red, pick a unique color that is NEVER used as a background color on the map.

 

[mjolnir131]

why would you use red in a post directed to somebody with green-red color-blind issues?

 

[Connor_Graham]

Connor, your reading comprehension is lacking greatly.

No, that would be you. You're talking in generalizations, while I'm speaking of specifics. Big difference.

Red in green field could be an issue for SOME people.

"Some" in this case would be 40% of the male population of the world. Hardly an insignificant number. Additionally, it doesn't have to be red in a green field or green in a red field. Red (or green for that matter) against most colors is invisible to someone that is color blind of red & green. This is how the color vision test that uses dots on a page that have a number you're supposed to see works.

 

[In Flames]

yes and the peoples of central and souther Europe believed that world was flat for many century's.

Why the SA client over 2D ? OK it's simple they have added so much stuff that 2D has basically been rendered a viewer not an interface it lacks so much.and there is no way to hook up these things without causing 2D to become a worse crash monkey or a lag monster or both.

i agree that the art needs some work again, i hope that is what they spend most of there time on now.

2D is the old Ford Probe you see on the interstate in everybody's way. it's old and you can't push it to hard or it quits, the guy driving is in love with the car because he knows where everything is, but for the rest of the world he's a minor nuisance to some a major one because the car is now where close to green.

I've live threw 3 client changes now and wish i had not gotten ticked at KR and quit it was my loss not the games Britiana is still here. she looks good no matter what client you use so if you want all those nifty features then sell the Probe use the SA client

I'm not really sure your argument is making much sense. At least to me. What parts of UO does 2d have trouble interfacing with?

Are you talking hot keys and such? If so then I'm not sure how you can see it as a "viewer" and not an "interface". I'm not even really sure how that's supposed to make sense but...

If so then yes, UO 2d needs some updates there, like the ability to chug potions/apples/etc without the use of UOA or your mouse.

Other then that, I really can't agree with your analogy of calling 2d a ford probe. To me UO 2d is a 1960's lincoln continental with the suicide doors and all leather interior. The paints a bit rough in spots, looks like they tried to cover a few dings with nail polish, the engine could be running better but it's still strong, and it's missing some of the more pleasing modern comforts, but it's a classic that just needs some love. KR/SA (to me) is like the Hummer H3, it's got a great name backing it but past iterations and rehashes on the original have not been stellar. Sure it's flashy but all in all just underwhelming.

 

[Potgut]

I'm with many of you, for me, if there is anything I would like changed on the 2d, it's the organization of the MACROS, expecially the cast spells, I don't think I have to explain why.

As for the EC, I wish I could try the EC client but i'm stuck with an ancient computer that can't run it. My laptop recently broke and i'm not going to spend money on a new comp right now just to be able to play one game.

 

[mjolnir131]

I'm not really sure your argument is making much sense. At least to me. What parts of UO does 2D have trouble interfacing with?

Are you talking hot keys and such? If so then I'm not sure how you can see it as a "viewer" and not an "interface". I'm not even really sure how that's supposed to make sense but...

If so then yes, UO 2D needs some updates there, like the ability to chug potions/apples/etc without the use of UOA or your mouse.

Other then that, I really can't agree with your analogy of calling 2D a ford probe. To me UO 2D is a 1960's lincoln continental with the suicide doors and all leather interior. The paints a bit rough in spots, looks like they tried to cover a few dings with nail polish, the engine could be running better but it's still strong, and it's missing some of the more pleasing modern comforts, but it's a classic that just needs some love. KR/SA (to me) is like the Hummer H3, it's got a great name backing it but past iterations and rehashes on the original have not been stellar. Sure it's flashy but all in all just underwhelming.

OK make it that car less efficient and bigger gas guzzler,results are the same something you don't drive to work each day maybe for special week trips but mostly sits in the garage,under a trap unused

yes they talk to the client differentially same info yes, it would be like putting a new type motor in the lincon, if you add all those features to 2D you have SA.
does it really not make sense or is it you don't want it to make sense.

 

[Vhyle]

Other then that, I really can't agree with your analogy of calling 2d a ford probe. To me UO 2d is a 1960's lincoln continental with the suicide doors and all leather interior. The paints a bit rough in spots, looks like they tried to cover a few dings with nail polish, the engine could be running better but it's still strong, and it's missing some of the more pleasing modern comforts, but it's a classic that just needs some love. KR/SA (to me) is like the Hummer H3, it's got a great name backing it but past iterations and rehashes on the original have not been stellar. Sure it's flashy but all in all just underwhelming.

Haha, great analogy.

 

[DarkScripture]

I would like to have the Macro GUMP cleaned up and sorted better. I don't like scrolling lists. Spells should be on a button GUMP. Similar to the inscribe GUMP.
All the spells are in the same field. At least a option for new vs. classic menu styles.

There was a way to make macro click-able tabs in the old 3RD Dawn. Would love to have a tab for custom macros, not only the ones for skills as they are now. How you can pull out a tab icon for the hiding skill. I still teach this to even old vets that have never pulled one out to click on the fly.

Desktop save on the main Options for new players to back up the desktop & restore it.

Lock your icons in place so as not not right click them.

Have set of icon art importable. Would love to have my spell icons colored.

 

[In Flames]

OK make it that car less efficient and bigger gas guzzler,results are the same something you don't drive to work each day maybe for special week trips but mostly sits in the garage,under a trap unused

yes they talk to the client differentially same info yes, it would be like putting a new type motor in the lincon, if you add all those features to 2D you have SA.
does it really not make sense or is it you don't want it to make sense.

Ok, your continued car analogy is getting more confused.

UO is not an intensive program, graphically or otherwise. In fact if we continue with the car analogy both clients would be somewhere in the Mini-coupe area of gas consumption. While things like Crysis would be the H3 or Escalade. Saying UO's a metaphoric gas guzzler is untrue, no matter what client you're referring to. And just so we're clear it's not for "special trips" as I use 2d everytime I log into UO.

 

[Kiwillian]

I honestly think that a lot of "hardcore" 2D uses don't *want* to like the new client. They try it out, maybe, and just instantly hate it because they don't want to even give it a chance.

The graphics are fuzzy or whatever and give you a headache? You hate hotbars? Do these people even play any other video games? Or is UO the only game they can stand to play these days with it's old 2D pixel art. If you can play other games without moaning about how it doesn't look like 2D UO then I'm failing to see what the problem is.

It's like trying to get children to eat their vegetables...

 

[Brucie Kibbutz]

*No dismount while in war mode. Is it really such a huge change?

*Auto open corpses that die, it's bad enough that we have to drag stuff one at a time and don't have the "loot all" option ala WoW. Just open the corpse for me, please, it's all I want.

*Blessed items equip when auto-looted similar to how your insured/uninsured items do. Why do I have to pay UOA to do this for me?

*A bandage self macro that really works, as well as a bandage other macro that works (not counting UOA)


Probably lots more, but those are in the order that I want more than anything.

 

[In Flames]

I honestly think that a lot of "hardcore" 2D uses don't *want* to like the new client. They try it out, maybe, and just instantly hate it because they don't want to even give it a chance.

The graphics are fuzzy or whatever and give you a headache? You hate hotbars? Do these people even play any other video games? Or is UO the only game they can stand to play these days with it's old 2D pixel art. If you can play other games without moaning about how it doesn't look like 2D UO then I'm failing to see what the problem is.

It's like trying to get children to eat their vegetables...

Don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to be closed minded about the new client at all. I tried it for a whole week and try to give it another shot after each patch. Sure you may think some of these reasons are silly, but there are more reasons, and they really compound into a monumental disappointment (at least in my case) that can't live up to the 2d legacy.

My other games as of right now include CS:S, League of Legends, Left 4 Dead, and Team Fortress 2. All of which are rendered in 3d. I'm not opposed at all to the idea of playing another 2d game. I bought Spolsion Man on XBLA when it came out (great game btw). Now, Take Splosion Man and UO2d and they both have a style to the art direction.

Now, As many people have pointed out the new graphics look ridiculous. Sure, some of the things LOOK awesome (IE: Swamp Dragons) but how you SIT on them looks absolutely awful, and the UI and such is absolutely terrible. As I understand, we're still using sprites, so I highly doubt that they will FIX that (how players sit, as a specific example) as it would include fixing 100's if not 1000's of individual sprites. My point is if they really wanted to do it right, it would have looked better. Anyone that really loves this game, would not have allowed that client out the door until it was at least up to par of the original. And call it close minded (which would be incorrect, but whatever) but I don't like it, it doesn't look, feel nor play like UO so no, I don't like it being my "UO".

 

[In Flames]

*No dismount while in war mode. Is it really such a huge change?

*Auto open corpses that die, it's bad enough that we have to drag stuff one at a time and don't have the "loot all" option ala WoW. Just open the corpse for me, please, it's all I want.

*Blessed items equip when auto-looted similar to how your insured/uninsured items do. Why do I have to pay UOA to do this for me?

*A bandage self macro that really works, as well as a bandage other macro that works (not counting UOA)


Probably lots more, but those are in the order that I want more than anything.

And a great list to be sure.

 

[Serine]

World maps . uoam to old

 

[Jhym]

Overall both clients need a really good macro system. EC has some of the elements but I'd like to be able to record a set of actions, SAVE them and be able to edit them quickly and easily.

I'd love to be able to use conditional macro code -- so if I'm one char my "heal" code is a bandage macro, if it's a mage it's a GH, if it's something else perhaps use a potion or spirit speak. Note, I'm not talking about just individual char actions, but that I can bind a key to a macro code set that then figures things out based on MY criteria and does what I want --- but have a set of overall macro keys that I -know- are the same for all my chars without me having to cut and paste macros all over the place and recode them.

We need save and restore desktop actions, preferably autosave ala microsoft restore points.

We really do need a filtering/sorting mechanism added to all container code. It is ridiculous in this day and age that we still have no way to quickly look in a chest of jewels or items and pick out the thing we are interested in (or a group of them.) Instead you have to mouse over everything looking for that one jewel with the +10 magery or the leather pants that had the 24 physical resist to complete a suit.

They need to either completely convert the artwork to new formats or ensure that the sprite artwork is consistent AND up to date. It is just unprofessional to put out a patch and realize that you didn't make ONE frame for an animation, or that you only made two views for a chair. We are also still using mostly the same animations for most actions -- we've had 12 years, even if they had one person working on it we could have had a few dozen more animation types in that time.

I really don't mind the sprite layout and how things work, but they need to come up with better multi-tile mechanisms for the client (boats, housing, some special items.) -- so that the client isn't overwhelmed by moving that stupid boat and the idiot crew and that it looks COOL. It's a bit sad when a game these days looks like something from 1989 at times.

Perhaps have two art versions -- regular rez, and super hi-rez (HD). The high end art would be fully zoomable and show things to their best light, the low end would be good for those whose systems can barely handle turning on in the morning.

 

[Thangorodrim]

This is not constructive and you are creating false expectations in petitioning for a refactor of 2d.

Why don't you start a thread about *exactly* what the rational portion of the '2d-til-i-die' demographic requires to accept the EC.

 

[It Lives]

I would loves to see, mapping, macro enhancement. Also I would like some creature art changed back that got crammed in 2d when they did the todd Mcfubar thing.

 

[In Flames]

This is not constructive and you are creating false expectations in petitioning for a refactor of 2d.

Why don't you start a thread about *exactly* what the rational portion of the '2d-til-i-die' demographic requires to accept the EC.

History would disagree with you.

UO2, Third Dawn, and UXO, have all failed (two of which failed before birth) while UO2d is still here.

They released KR and it bombed. They re-released it with a FEW fixes and call it SA. They rehash it for people who don't want to use it and call it EC.

2d is the client they need to focus on. It was a shame they took an opportunity to make our game better and squandered it on something as dreadful as KR/SA & EC but the team is talented (I still say the SA expansion is one of the best expansions to date, new client aside) and need to use their talents and do creative things with our game. Not spoon feed us a second rate rehash of our client that makes everyone's paperdolls look like neanderthalian baboon half-men. Or make it appear as though everyone on a mount is sliding around on the back of a wild creature with a stick implanted firmly in our back sides.

I really don't want to be this critical of it but you people keep demanding that I explain something I have already explained. Perhaps you should take a moment and read the thread.

 

[Thangorodrim]

History would disagree with you.

UO2, Third Dawn, and UXO, have all failed (two of which failed before birth) while UO2d is still here.

They released KR and it bombed. They re-released it with a FEW fixes and call it SA. They rehash it for people who don't want to use it and call it EC.

2d is the client they need to focus on. It was a shame they took an opportunity to make our game better and squandered it on something as dreadful as KR/SA & EC but the team is talented (I still say the SA expansion is one of the best expansions to date, new client aside) and need to use their talents and do creative things with our game. Not spoon feed us a second rate rehash of our client that makes everyone's paperdolls look like neanderthalian baboon half-men. Or make it appear as though everyone on a mount is sliding around on the back of a wild creature with a stick implanted firmly in our back sides.

I really don't want to be this critical of it but you people keep demanding that I explain something I have already explained. Perhaps you should take a moment and read the thread.

All those clients came and went .... and there have been virtually no major updates to 2d. As I pointed out initially.

EC is functionally a vast improvement over 2d and they are not done yet.

EC is extremely different from KR, especially its initial state, in that they have respected the look and feel of UO and its aesthetic.

 

[Uriah Heep]

I personally like the EC, but cannot use it for everything. Not sure what the answer is either, to make the problems go away.

1. If I load a vendor in the new client, and come back later in 2d, OMG what a mess. Remember how loading a vendor in 3D used to just leave it piled in the bottom of pack for a 2D user? EC is much worse, its just randomly jumbled everywhere.

2. I really like my t-hunter. But opening a t-map in EC was an exercise in frustration. On the 2d maps, you have details that are missing on the EC maps. YOu can open a 2d map and use the pin location, plus the lay of the pins shadow, to narrow down the field.
In the EC, opening the same map, showed a black dot on a field of green, with absolutely nothing to distinguish it from the other 5 in the same area.

Yeah, I know I'm OT...but eventually, lets face it, 2d is going away. What we need is to keep pointing out (tactfully) the shortcomings of the EC.

 

[Dermott of LS]

...

Just a quick correction Uriah on point #1.

As a 3d user I could stock a vendor and NOONE would even know it was done in 3d. The "2d zone" in 3d was the top left area box of about the same size as 2d... outside of that, yes, it did jumble at the bottom. However there WAS an area you could use.

In KR, that area was the bottom center, and while spacing was a bit different between KR and 2d, it was reasonably possible (if a little difficult) to use the freeform view to stock a vendor (provided you were giving yourself reasonable space between items).

As for SA, haven't really tried it since I have stopped running a vendor due to location and lack of traffic and that I CANNOT deal with the miniscule area provided in freeform, so I'm not sure how List or Grid views affect vendor item placement... although they make browsing MUCH easier IMO.

On #2, haven't tested out the maps yet, but I don't see them being TOO big of an issue except maybe for absolute purists who refuse to use a rune library and coords or refuse to add in the locations into the Atlas as waypoints (which I had in KR, but not currently in EC).

 

[T'Challa]

*shrugs* I really enjoy the enhanced client. It has helped bring me back into the game. Just saying...

You played third dawn client exclusively from the time it was released til the time it was shut down. Your taste is suspect, methinks, sir!

 

[T'Challa]

I would like them to stop slowly breaking the classic client in order to add things to the enhanced.



It started with terrain. When KR was released many terrain tiles in the classic client became "broken". Many of these still aren't fixed.

My character cant decide what tile he is standing on; cast a spell and watch my character move one tile over. Try to run between two houses and end up stopping dead in my tracks because the client suddenly decided I was on an adjacent tile.

My overhead text in now left-aligned instead of center aligned. Subsequent text now overlaps the previous text making conversations more difficult to read.

Some of the recently released carpet tiles are able to block line-of-sight for skill use and spellcasting.

These are but a few examples.




Please don't get me wrong here. I want the enhanced client to succeed and I believe that it has the potential to do so. I just dont want that to happen at the expense of the playability of the classic client.

Ditto! X2! Seconded! Hear, Hear!

Seriously, quit busting my client.

 

[kelmo]

You played third dawn client exclusively from the time it was released til the time it was shut down. Your taste is suspect, methinks, sir!

*shrugs* I prefer function over form...

 

[Dermott of LS]

...

You played third dawn client exclusively from the time it was released til the time it was shut down. Your taste is suspect, methinks, sir!

Perhaps we should REMOVE all of the UI upgrades currently in the 2d client that came from the 3d client. You don't REALLY need those paperdoll slots for jewelry in the 2d client or object handles anyway

Seriously, quit busting my client.

You first

 

[T'Challa]

...

You played third dawn client exclusively from the time it was released til the time it was shut down. Your taste is suspect, methinks, sir!

Perhaps we should REMOVE all of the UI upgrades currently in the 2d client that came from the 3d client. You don't REALLY need those paperdoll slots for jewelry in the 2d client or object handles anyway

Not sure what that has to do with my comment...

-------------------------------


Seriously, quit busting my client.

You first

Mine was here first, and has remained through numerous attempts at client upgrades. You cannot say the same.

I realize this will result in another tirade of textual sarcasm from you, so don't waste your time. You really don't have an argument, all you have are jabs at other posters. A.K.A. "troll"

 

[Dermott of LS]

...

If you think that the taste for the 3d client was suspect, then they should remove the upgrades that were put into the 2d client directly because of the 3d client.

As for the second, you cannot in one post call someone's taste "suspect" then put up the "don't bash me" argument... doesn't fly... and again your last statement, don't do unto me as I am doing unto you... doesn't fly.

 

[GalenKnighthawke]

I actually want the Classic Client to remain as is, because having to learn a new interface is one of several things that keeps me from the Enhanced Client.

If I wanted to play a new game, I would.

-Galen's player

 

[T'Challa]

...

If you think that the taste for the 3d client was suspect, then they should remove the upgrades that were put into the 2d client directly because of the 3d client.

I don't think the UI of UO3D was suspect, I think the graphical dissimilarities were. Same for KR and same for SA.

As for the second, you cannot in one post call someone's taste "suspect" then put up the "don't bash me" argument... doesn't fly... and again your last statement, don't do unto me as I am doing unto you... doesn't fly.

First of all, what I can and cannot do isn't up to you, sir.

The great thing about being friends with Kelmo is that we can throw those kinds of jabs at each other and know that neither one of them means it in a truly hurtful manner. It is not my problem you cannot understand the dynamic of our friendship, so don't try and use it against me in a thread. But thanks for rolling this thread completely off-topic. I shall ignore any replies from you on this matter in deference to K & P.

 

[UltimateNoob]

They probably won't do this but I'd like to see EA buy the rights to UOAM and keep the maps updated with the new terrain.