• Hail Guest!
    We're looking for Community Content Contribuitors to Stratics. If you would like to write articles, fan fiction, do guild or shard event recaps, it's simple. Find out how in this thread: Community Contributions
  • Greetings Guest, Having Login Issues? Check this thread!
  • Hail Guest!,
    Please take a moment to read this post reminding you all of the importance of Account Security.
  • Hail Guest!
    Please read the new anncouncement concering the upcoming addition to Stratics. You can find the annoucnement Here!

[Discordance] Template Questions and hunting timeline....

BlueBard

Visitor
hello and well met. i played a bard in early 2001 where a beginner bard can starting hunting shadow wryms as soon as there stats was maxed 100/100/25.. i am trying to become a support bard that when i cant find a group to learn from i can try and solo.

The following is my temple so far i have figured out so far. my skill / what i will be driving to
Music 100/120
Disco 65/120
Peace 90.1/120
Provoke 50/120
Magery 90/100 (for travel and mage heals)

my gear i have is the basic 100 lrc suit i found on VS for 5k gold and store bought harps.

So i would like some advice on what my final template should look like with maybe Mysticism or weaving maybe
And maybe like a timeline on what to kill solo with a bard to maybe try and earn my living as a bard.

Thanks for any advice in advance.
 

fonsvitae

Journeyman
@BlueBard A few little things on outset: having 120 skill in each bard skill allows for a bonus when using these skills; you're aiming for that already and that is great. Other bard bonuses include: a) a bonus for the bard skill whose mastery is active, and b) a bonus for the use of an exceptional instrument.

Regarding what to add to your template, I played a bard w/ Spellweaving on Atlantic years ago and enjoyed it. With SW, you will need 120 Meditation as well as the 120 SW (the mana draw is huge). SW has the advantage of Word of Death, a spell which may be utilized once a mob is down to 30% health and which does a lot of SDI based damage. You will need excellent mana regen and 120 Med (as well as maxed out SDI) to make this one happen, but it is a nice ability. SW also has a pretty decent Nature's Fury spell: w/ a level 6 Arcane Focus, 4 to 5 of these does more damage than two EV's (plus, NF have pack instinct). Oh, and SW has some neat and handy AoE spells. There are some downsides to SW: the healing is limited (the spell does burst healing and waits on a timer before one may recast), you'll have to time your hunting to coincide w/ getting a full (level 6) Arcane Focus (a group is necessary to make this) and you will have 0 defensive capabilities. Those negatives are really not so bad, but they are there and what they are.

The Magery route, which you are already taking, isn't one I entertained much. I got around without it and just didn't see the appeal or usefulness. Some good things about Magery, though, include: you will be able to dependably travel via spells, heal and even have defensive ability via a -0 (preferably) mage weapon. Also, I have a feeling that Magery is less mana intensive than SW; that said, you will likely still want 120 Med (except for certain situations; more on that below). Also, it is good to keep in mind that you will not likely be able to fit Evaluate Intelligence in any meaningful way which means that damage for many (not all) Magery spells will be underwhelming.

I have heard good things about Mysticism (a lot of people use this on all kinds of templates) but I myself have never used it. I can tell you it relies on Focus and Imbuing to power some of its spells (much like EI powers Magery), so I am not sure how useful this skill will be without properly backing it up. I'm sure others can speak more to this.

Now, mixing two or more of these spell skills on a bard template really crowds it out and dilutes things. Sure, one may drop a bard skill... but now, the bard skills, being absent a bonus, are less effective. Also, being that you'll likely be running bard masteries in one form or another most of the time, the mastery buffs will require 120 Med & 30 Mana Regeneration to be able to run constantly and also be able to do other things w/ your mana pool; these same bard mastery buffs give their greatest benefit when all bard skills are at 120, something you will no longer have once you start dropping skills. This is one of the key reasons I went with SW as a supplement to my bard back when I did: SW is a standalone skill for the most part.

Nowadays, I do not use a SW bard.... nor do I play on Atlantic. I play on Siege and, though I didn't expect to make or even like a bard on this shard, I have found that the shards limitations give birth to interesting and fun templates. For me, this is such a fun template; here is what it looks like:

120 Wrestling
120 Musicianship
120 Discordance
120 Provocation
120 Peacemaking
120 Meditation

The 120 Wrestling means that one may utilize both defensive & offensive ability... the defensive ability of withstanding many hits comes in handy because there is smaller chance of having a bard spellsong knocked off, and the offensive ability means that one may spam disarm, landing it often: this renders potential pk's toothless. Not to mention being able to take advantage of 45 HCI & DCI... it's a cool situation.

Maybe the above Wrestling setup doesn't look very appealing for most shards. It works nice for me and I have found myself (unexpectedly) playing a bard again, but its magic is probably Siege specific. Try going on test center and maxing all the bard skills. Next, do the same w/ SW and Med and see what that feels like (don't forget the level 6 arcane focus & to stack the SDI). Really, trying each of the above in their most undiluted forms will begin to give you an idea of what you can live with and what you can't live without, thereby directing your path more and more with each step.

Bards are still cool and very much viable so it is definitely a space worth entertaining. Good luck.
 

kaio

Lore Master
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
you want either a tamer-bard, or a mystic bard. those are the cookie cutter pvm templates. Arguable there is also the disco-archer, but you dont see many of these around anymore.
Template wise they go something like this

Disco-tamer
120 tame (115 will do)
120 lore (115 will do)
120 disco
120 music
120 mage (100-120 will be fine)
120 medi (100-120 will be fine)

Disco-mystic (use a garg, they really shine on this template)
120 music
120 disco
120 magery (100, or 110 will do just fine)
120 mystic (110 will be ok, u will fail RC a lot, mystic pces are fairly cheap so u want one eventually)
120 focus (110++ will do till u get the cash for a 120)
120 medi, or whatever you like

Pure bards are nice n all, but if you are without a group you're template wont be able to solo the cool stuff.
 

Nero

Journeyman
UNLEASHED
I agree. Pure bards even at 4x120 bard skills, vol III masteries and slayer instruments are not powerful enough for the harder critters. Sure, you can add firehorns, but have fun restocking loads of reagents.

A fun template I used for a while was 4x120 bard + meditation + magery and two pre-patch vollems (2 slots each) or 1 post-patch vollem (3 slots) which require no taming skills. But I just ended up dropping the bard mastery, replaced peacemaking with spellweaving and then summon a reaper and cast word of death at the end. You do more damage and have less gameplaying stress (don't have to heal the reaper unlike the vollems), while the mana consumption is nearly the same compared to running a bard mastery non-stop. Provoke and disco is really all you need on a bard. I finally just moved the bard skills to my tamer with soulstones, so my bard is more of a tamer-bard than bard-tamer nowadays.

If they ever made firehorns benefit from the 100% lower reagent costs, I might switch back to a pure bard from time to time, as this would help me to finish off the last mob standing (the one I cannot provo on another). But even then, I would only do up to 90 fire damage at 4x120 bard skills, and realistically 30-60 after fire resists of the mob is calculated. I can do 30-60 already now with mind blast and 0 eval int, so probably not worth it.
 
Last edited:

Nero

Journeyman
UNLEASHED
Also another issue with 4 bard skills and a running bard mastery I encountered was that I was waiting for mana all the time due to the upkeep costs of the mastery and occasional spells I casted. I was also waiting for the cooldown timer of the bard skills all the time. So by the time I could put all 3 active bard skills into effect, either the mob was dead or I was dead. So when it comes to using active bard skills, less is more. I nowadays go with music+ provo or music+disco only on my tamer.
 

Innoxicated

Journeyman
I would also recommend a mystic bard, perhaps similar to the one posted above. Since you do mention playing with a group as part of this characters playstyle, with solo play as a secondary (hopefully you are in or will find a good guild), I suggest picking 2 bard skills (plus music) then med, mystic, focus.

Rather than deviating fully away from the pure bard setup, you'll be sacrificing the utility of magery to retain disco+peace or provo (I recommend provo) and can use these masteries to buff your party for group hunts, then rock the very powerful discord masteries for solo outings. Provo buffs also do a good job beefing up that rising colossus!

The bard masteries are really nice, and as a newly returned player you will have access to bard masteries even without the time of legends expansion.
 

Nero

Journeyman
UNLEASHED
I suggest picking 2 bard skills (plus music) then med, mystic, focus.
Well, how are you supposed to earnestly heal and cure yourself (and others if in a group)? Cleansing wind is super slow and got low hitpoint restoration while healing stone is on a timer after the first use. Also, no recalling. He already got a 100 LRC suit, and I don't think he wants to use scrolls or pots for that (I might be wrong).

For a semi-pure bard (one without peace but 3 bard skills), I suggest:

Template 1:
120 music
120 provo
120 disco
120 magery
120 meditation
120 spellweaving
Mastery: Spellweaving (where summon reaper replaces rising colossus as tank) or switch to one of the bard masteries if in a group.
Maybe add slayer instruments. Spellweaving doesn't benefit from slayer spellbooks, so don't bother. Try to get a high SDI book (e.g. scrapper) and a mage weapon for ideally 120 passive wrestling which you use until everything is provoked.

Template 2:
120 music
120 provo
120 disco
120 magery
120 meditation (or eval int or even peace)
60 necromancy
60 spirit speak
Mastery: Magery (death ray & vol III mastery & high int & slayer spellbook does decent damage even without eval int). No tank. so you need to provoke mobs on each other before you start nuking one with death ray. Human would probably best to benefit from the +20 eval int (jack of all trades ability) unless you want to invest into skill bonus gear. You can also always switch to one of the bard masteries if you are in a group. Similar to template 1, equip a mage weapon until you got the mobs provoked. Then, definitely equip a slayer spellbook (the single slayer ones without SDI don't cost much and do triple damage). Most importantly, you leech mana in wraith form (100% chance to cast at 60 necro) and get a lot of mana back from the death ray damage. I find this most useful, because once you have discorded and provoked everything, the 3 bard skills become useless. So instead of waiting it out (that is, watching monsters fight each other), you boost your damage output with death ray while regaining most of the mana you need for this through leeching. I suggest meditation over eval int (or even peace) because in case you just dumped a large amount of mana into death ray but the mob does not have any mana left to leech back, you can quickly replenish your pool with meditation.

As I mentioned above, you can also use firehorns to add area of effect damage or even to finish off a single target (just 3 tile radius), if you don't mind restocking reagents (ash).

The largest disadvantage of the two templates is that they are mostly on foot (summon reaper = 5 slots, wraith form = cannot mount). If you need to bridge larger distances or want to hop on and off a mount during combat, you also need an ethy or be a gargoyle to fly (works for template 1 only as template 2 relies on wraith form in which gargoyles cannot fly).

The largest disadvantage of template 1 is that you need a strength bonus 5 to 6 for spellweaving to make the spells effective. Also, you got a high damage spell (word of death) at the end and a number of low damage spells (mind blast, wildfire, etc.) but no in-between damage spell or alternative high damage spell like death ray.

The largest disadvantage of template 2 is that if the last standing mob got too many hitpoints left, you cannot finish it off with death ray, as you will get interrupted without a tank (or provoked mob tanking). So make sure you finish off the last mob with 2-3 mind blasts for which you do not need eval int --- or get 120 eval int at the costs of 120 meditation and use the 7th and 8th circle damage spells as well as summons of magery.

@Innoxicated made an excellent comment by mentioning that you do not need the Times of Legends expansion for the bard masteries. So without the expansion, my two suggested templates are void.
 
Last edited:

Innoxicated

Journeyman
That's true, magery's gheal is much more practical for spamming heals. The two templates Nero posted honestly look like a blast to play to me, lol! Especially the Death Ray Bard. Any template utilizing Mysticism heavily also suffers from the same disadvantage, as stone form and rising colossus also leave you unmounted.

Id say the OP has some good options if he chooses to follow any of the advice posted, and id like to know which direction @BlueBard decided to take!
 

Cork

Seasoned Veteran
Professional
My cheapy pure bard build is the following.
120 Music
120 Peace
120 Provo
120 Discord
90 Mysticism (120 with jewelry)
90 Focus (120 with jewelry)
60 Magery (105 with jewelry and +15 magery spellbook)

The jewelry is cheap imbues +15 magery, mysticism, +10 focus, and 3 fcr on both ring and bracelet.
Mystic's memento talisman for the +10 focus.
Crafted reforged studded leather non med armor to get 55lmc, 100lrc, 20+ mana regen.
One random brittle legendary artifact piece to fill in stats and resists.
Hephaestus shield for the +15 phys resist.

With self repair on the shield and not imbuing the reforged pieces they can be pof'd and never have to be replaced.
This is great for a support character in groups or for your main character. Not great for doing high end content solo though.
 

Valenthe

Visitor
hello and well met. i played a bard in early 2001 where a beginner bard can starting hunting shadow wryms as soon as there stats was maxed 100/100/25.. i am trying to become a support bard that when i cant find a group to learn from i can try and solo.

The following is my temple so far i have figured out so far. my skill / what i will be driving to
Music 100/120
Disco 65/120
Peace 90.1/120
Provoke 50/120
Magery 90/100 (for travel and mage heals)

my gear i have is the basic 100 lrc suit i found on VS for 5k gold and store bought harps.

So i would like some advice on what my final template should look like with maybe Mysticism or weaving maybe
And maybe like a timeline on what to kill solo with a bard to maybe try and earn my living as a bard.

Thanks for any advice in advance.
I know old Q&A,

I have been around the block with bard - tamer - mage- spellweaver - mystic..

The build i love the most is a necro bard.
Valanthe - Baja
music 120
Discodance 120
provocation 120
peacemaking 120
necromancy 98(120)
Spiritspeak110(120)

str 110
ing 110
dex 40

discord + corpse skin + bard mastery discord with the fire element for damage.. you can solo loads of things If you are hurting for gold frost ogres are really nice. Keep in mind buying and using any slayer instrement is worth it. So a little prep is required for hunting. Also if you discord and corpse skin mobs fire horns do loads of damage.
need mana wraith form leeches enough to keep the discord mastery afloat much longer.(also with 50-100%LRC wraith form can cast recall as long as you have the spell in a mage book.. so getting around is not a problem if you have a few rune books.
single wisp helps loads... pop over to lich for for a regen boost. I also reccomend elf for this build the int buff is nice.
need a mount raise dead is nice... it also give you followers to help shield you from other mobs.
Not to mention spirit speak is a wicked good heal. The only thing you lack in this build is the ability to res people. though you can cast off dead players to an ank... probably should not do this to your friends.
 

Cork

Seasoned Veteran
Professional
I know old Q&A,

I have been around the block with bard - tamer - mage- spellweaver - mystic..

The build i love the most is a necro bard.
Valanthe - Baja
music 120
Discodance 120
provocation 120
peacemaking 120
necromancy 98(120)
Spiritspeak110(120)
What are you doing with the leftover points if you are not running real 120 ss/necro? Also what are you doing when fighting mobs with no mana pool to leech from? And what are you using to invis yourself? And finally are you running 55 lmc since you have no meditation?
 
Top