Template Critique: PvP Theif

[Taylor]

One of these days, I plan to finish my PvP thief on Europa. All I have left to train is poisoning (ugh) and a bit of hiding (booo). The great Tony Emerald helped set me up with some scrolls and gear. What I really need now is some template critiques from Britannia's l33t thieves.

Here's my current build:

120 fence
120 steal
110 ninja
100 hiding
100 snoop
92 mage
80 poison
80 stealth

I was thinking of dropping mage to 85 (throwing on tome of lost knowledge when I need to gate) and raising stealth to 100. Planning to use a cloak of silence, burglar's bandanna, shadow dancers, and an imbued ring skill ring.

Any and all comments are invited. You guys are the experts, after all.

 

[Viper09]

Don't really need to raise stealth that much. 80 stealth with shadow leggings is just perfect.

I would instead recommend maybe dump the skill into tactics. Maybe make some room for around 50 chivalry since it works much better for healing, cure, and recall than magery with 0 eval.

 

[RichDC]

Don't really need to raise stealth that much. 80 stealth with shadow leggings is just perfect.

I would instead recommend maybe dump the skill into tactics. Maybe make some room for around 50 chivalry since it works much better for healing, cure, and recall than magery with 0 eval.

Normally i would agree with the 80 stealth, but, in this instance i have to respectfully disagree.

My reason is because of your PvP Set up.

You should be aiming for, 120 stealth 120 ninja for those all important deathstrikes. After a DP and a few ar ignores your mark will run, Deathstrike for a 40hit and you win!

For your template i would suggest a difficult one, unless you can get the required skills/armour from imbuing.

I would suggest,

120 fence
90 stealing (boosted to 120 with burglars and shadow dancers)
120 ninja
100 hiding
90 snoop (gm with bandana)
80 poisoning
120 stealth

You have 40 points left over, i would definatly suggest getting an imbued ring/brace combo giving max HCI, DCI, +30chiv(25minimum), and either go Mana increase/HP increase or LMC

You would be best to look for a Kryss with mods as follows.

40+hld
40+hit spell(probs best to go for fireball vs mage...delayed damage = greater disrupt chance)
20SSI (no need to go more this will cap you ss at i believe 30 stam)
HCI
and the DI.

Its a hard weapon even with imbuing but i do believe possible.

Its going to be a hard suit to make, youll want to get as close to max DCI. Max HCI, as much mana/hp increase and regen, as much LMC as you can as well!

This of course is just my opinion but i see your template as the attempt to steal, then kill your mark! (my advice would be steal the cure pots/bandies, then kill them and take it all!!!)

 

[Cruxshadow]

this sounds alot like my template, except i dont run with poison or magery, instead i have tacts and chiv. The suit wasnt to hard to make, but as far as pvp, i dont ever plan on killing anyone, due to the fact that these days its hard to find someone solo in fel so as soon as you steal from someone, everyone starts blastin on you. If you do find someone solo, chances are they are versed in kickin some ass, you so will probably end up runnin away smokebombin. My temp is:

(numbers WITH added skill included)
120 steal (SD legs, Burg Band, and a +5 ring (i had +15, but realized i didnt need it all))
100 snoop (burg band)
120 stealth (+5 robe, sd legs, bb)
115 Ninja (+15 on jewls with 2fc)
120 fencing (+20 dreads revenge kryss)
100 tactics
100 hiding
70 chiv (i think 70, might be 60 or 80) (this is for the recalls, heals, cures, and sometimes consecrate and EoO)

stats 120ish hp, 30stam (doesnt matter, kryss is like 50 ssi), and 90 mana

Suit is burg bandana, sd legs, gaunlets of anger (for dci), heart of the lion (dci) runic gorget and arms for resists (all 60+), +5 replica robe, nocturne earings (cuz im human and need night sight), and my jewls have +5 stealing, +15 ninja, 2fc, 10+ DCI and i think maybe some EP and resists on em.

Anyways, the weapon skill mostly ends up bein used for defense as i equip my kryss after a steal whil i run away waiting to hide. I feel like it helps me get hit less while im being chased. Also, its fun to grief people a little bit by killing unattended pets. I definitely love playin this type or thief though, hard to kill, and really able to **** people off.

 

[Cruxshadow]

oh ya, another reason for chiv over magery, no need to incorporate LRC

 

[Taylor]

Right, I don't expect to kill anyone with this template. Poison/weapon skill is to make them stop to cure, hopefully deterring them from chase. Of course, as a member of Tony Emerald's THIEF Europa, its your gp or your hp.

Really loving the suggestions. More are welcome!

 

[RichDC]

I actually missed a hugely improtant skill of the template, you require 70 tactics real(for the ar ignores to force the person to run).

So, all you need is to get 30 skill points in your jewels(say in stealth) and use those 70 points for tactics.

It will leave you slightly exposed in terms of healing but if you can afford to have EP imbued on the jewels you should be ok.

25ep
15stealth
13hci
13dci
lmc 5-7

Use the above jewels x 2 and you should be ok, with the undead tali thats 36HCI use a HCI weap of at least 9 and your capped.

 

[Cruxshadow]

Also, instead of wasting skill points in poisoning, you could just run around with a ninja belt for of dp shuriken like i do. sorry guys if im wrong about this (i dont actually use them often) but i dont believe the success rate if from poisoning, but actually comes from your ninja skill level. or, depending on your jewels and suit, you could actually have points left over. and you could put a little into poisoning to get off a lesser poison with the kryss for mage interrupts, or you can dp with shuriken. I dunno if any of this makes sense, if not, someone correct my ass.

 

[RichDC]

It makes perfect sense.

The only problem, Shurikans are long distance. Ok so there fukiya darts for up close and personal. The real problem is that these are so "buggy" with there hit ratios ive fired of 5before with no poison.

The idea of dropping the poisoning to inflict lesser is ok, however i believe then you would need tactics at 90.

If you get your tactics right that template could be awesome fun (with DP)!!!

Imagine the fear running through someone when they realise they are Dp'd and they have no pots or aids because you just stole them...in this time youve ar ignored and deathstrike...they are now low health so they start to run...BANG! 30-40points on the deathstrike and they are a corpse! If not they are still dp'd with no way to cure. If you make the steal mounted you can just chase them down!

 

[Cruxshadow]

ya, that makes sense about the darts. thats been one reason i havent been using the shuriken is the chance of it not poisoning at all lol. Also, someone told me here on the boards not to long ago about i think it was shadowstrike? i need to start incorporating this into my template because from what i understand, and i could def be wrong, but apparently it is a way to hide right after you steal from someone without having to run around waiting to hide. I need to test this out a little bit, but if anyone knows the answer right away that would be cool too. You steal, equip the assassin spike, shadow strike (which hides you upon success). sounds pretty awesome to me. Only reason i havent tried yet is my fencing is only 100 real so i kinda shy away from not using the dread.

 

[Taylor]

The kryss I have atm is:

Should work ok?

Chiv would make my suit easier, due to no lrc requirements. However, my concern is getting enough fc/fcr to make chiv effective. Also, no ability to mark runes with chiv if I notice someone on a track.

 

[Chad Sexington]

Right, I don't expect to kill anyone with this template. Poison/weapon skill is to make them stop to cure, hopefully deterring them from chase. Of course, as a member of Tony Emerald's THIEF Europa, its your gp or your hp.

Really loving the suggestions. More are welcome!

Eh. I forgot Tony made a guild on Europa. He never writes. (I'm lonely.)

And yeah, it looks pretty good to me. That's almost exactly what I had on Napa. It depends on what you want to do.

(You know you could ask this question on the THIEF forums =P)

 

[Chad Sexington]

The kryss I have atm is hld 48, hl 48, ssi 15, di 44, SC -1. Should work ok, huh?

Chiv would make my suit easier, due to no lrc requirements. However, my concern is getting enough fc/fcr to make chiv effective. Also, no ability to mark runes with chiv if I notice someone on a track.

Dagger >>>>> Kryss

Shadow Strike will save your life more than anything. It's the one thing I miss having on Siege. Without skill+ items, I can't fit fencing & tactics.

 

[Cruxshadow]

i was runnin with chiv without much fc or fcr before i added the fc2 recently. i didnt have any issues with it, but that also went along with how i used it. I never used it in the heat, i just run like crazy until i can hide or smokebomb, if i carried pots i could chug. but then once im hidden and stealth out of harms way, ill heal up and head back into the fray. so if you use chiv this way, you dont really need any fc fcr. the main thing that keeps me alive is being hidden all the time while i rummage, and only bein visible long enough to take what i want, llama form, and run like hell. bth, the only reason i added the fc was for the llama shifting to be a bit faster. plus, fc and fcr is way easier to add than it is to get enough lrc to be usefull and still have decent resists.

haha, im really blowin this post up. Thats what happens when your bored as hell at work on a wednesday morning )o;

 

[Taylor]

Well, my resists are ok and I have 100 lrc and 1 fc, but I really threw this suit together in a hurry. Currently have no hci, dci, and only 10 lmc, which kinda makes it useless imo. I'll have to fix the suit a lot for it to be serviceable.

Still loving all the suggestions. I appreciate all of you folks' insight!

 

[Cruxshadow]

sounds good man, it will all just depend on your final template. The suit i described earlier post this post had worked out pretty well for me, but more importantly, it was pretty inexpensive. the heart or lion and burg banadana are cheap, sd legs and robe were the most expensive part, but still that was only a few mil, gauntlets were like 500k, runic stuff was cheap. i think in the end i ended up with almost or max DCI. i got lucky on my jewels since i didnt need a full 15 points in stealing. I found a bracelet that had like +10 stealing, +11 ninja (which i needed) i think fc1 and some DCI, and it was like 70k.

Oh, i have a question for everyone, what kind of talis do yall use on your thieves? I dont have anything in that slot right now and i cant really figure out what i should throw up in there if anything.

 

[Taylor]

First steal attempt was successful: made off with one whole enchanted apple, lmao.

Thanks for the advice, everyone. Greatly appreciate your help and expertise.

 

[Chad Sexington]

Oh, i have a question for everyone, what kind of talis do yall use on your thieves? I dont have anything in that slot right now and i cant really figure out what i should throw up in there if anything.

Ferret Talisman.

 

[RichDC]

Dagger >>>>> Kryss

Shadow Strike will save your life more than anything. It's the one thing I miss having on Siege. Without skill+ items, I can't fit fencing & tactics.

Chad im surprised at you!!!

My idol has to be taught!!!

Last time i checked, shadow strike requires no tactics. It requires stealth and weapon skill. Much like infectious strike, which only requires weapon skill and poisoning.



It is an awesome special, especially at say a rat spawn. Even with low level fencing, you make your steal shadow strike on a slime(pretty much 100% hit chance) and your stealthed!

 

[RichDC]

Oh, i have a question for everyone, what kind of talis do yall use on your thieves? I dont have anything in that slot right now and i cant really figure out what i should throw up in there if anything.

Ferret Talisman.

This and a bake kitsune summoning tali, throws people into a little confusion when im in bake form and have 5mirror images...one that bites back!

 

[Touzoko]

Chad im surprised at you!!!

My idol has to be taught!!!

Last time i checked, shadow strike requires no tactics. It requires stealth and weapon skill. Much like infectious strike, which only requires weapon skill and poisoning.



It is an awesome special, especially at say a rat spawn. Even with low level fencing, you make your steal shadow strike on a slime(pretty much 100% hit chance) and your stealthed!

That is correct- tactics isn't necessary. It is great when your timer hasn't expired for a smoke bomb, too. As long as you have mana, you can always shadow strike

 

[Chad Sexington]

Oops. You're right. I never had tactics. I've just been off production for too long.

It's also good for looting bodies in the middle of critters. It'll auto-hide you when they attack, toggle it back on, and loot some more. Repeat and repeat.

 

[Taylor]

I like shadow strike very much - helped me complete the sanctuary spellweaving quest chain easily (did it for gift of renewal while golem training). Sadly, the only dagger I have atm is an invasion dagger - hit lightning, ssi, di. Nothing worth buying on Europa, either. However, I'll definitely keep an eye out.

So...insurance and elves...arg...enough said.

Thanks very much for the advice, everyone. Much appreciated.

 

[Touzoko]

I like shadow strike very much - helped me complete the sanctuary spellweaving quest chain easily (did it for gift of renewal while golem training). Sadly, the only dagger I have atm is an invasion dagger - hit lightning, ssi, di. Nothing worth buying on Europa, either. However, I'll definitely keep an eye out.

So...insurance and elves...arg...enough said.

Thanks very much for the advice, everyone. Much appreciated.

It is always a great idea to have the best dagger/spike you can have. But also remember, that you can get a blessed quest dagger- "Someones" dagger", that is always handy to keep in your pack.

 

[Taylor]

Okies, after a a full day of experience (lmao), I think I'm going to run this template:

Fencing 120 (120)
Stealing 110 (80)
Ninjutsu 110 (110)
Hiding 100 (100)
Snoop 100 (90)
Mage 90 (75)
Stealth 80 (40)
Poison 80 (80)
Necro 20

I found myself marking a lot of runes for mining tracks last night, so I decided to stick with mage. 75 is enough to recall 100% - can throw on Tome of Lost Knowledge for 90% mark, 60% gate. Decided to keep stealing at 110, but can bump it up to 120 with ferret tally if I need. Necro is for wraith form.

Even though I like the idea of armor ignore (Mmm), it would be hard to fit all the skill in and I'd rather err on the thief side than the thug side. Besides, I made around 20 or 25 successful steals yesterday (mostly worthless crap, lol), primarily from folks at the yew gate, and have not been attacked yet. The fencing/poisoning will be reserved for folks who fail to comply with gentle reminders regarding their protection donations.

Suit wise, I'm trying to keep it simple. It's much harder to piece together runic-made suits on Europa than on Atlantic. Thinking this:

Shadow dancers, burglar's, stitcher's, totem of the void, pendant of the magi, orny. This puts me at 47/12/30/32/47, 2/3, 3 mr, 30 lmc, 80 lrc.

Now I'm in need of Europa's help, hehe. Need to find a) runic chest and arms to fill out my resists and b) an artificer/imbuer for hire. Looking for an imbued ring with 0/3, 15 hci, 20 lrc (should be easy, expect will need lots of relic frags). Also looking for a dagger with 40 hld, 40 hl, 40 di, 15 hci.

Where are you, Europan crafters?