So Kat

[Vaelix]

*Here ya go, now i know your not gonna fight me, this is more of an Example thing.*

hey kat! Where are ya sweetie, lets fight, you've got your wish! (Btw feel free to suit up in a 100% Bad Ass Faction Suit, it wont make a difference, because its the player, not the suit.

Suit Stats are :

70 70 67 70 70
40% LMC
100% LRC
55% DCI
MR 4
HPR 2
2/6 Casting
+14 Magery
HP Inc 16
Dex 5

 

[CroakerTnT]

IBTL

 

[Vaelix]

IBTL

*Is Confused* Hmm? This isnt gonna some kinda Biased thing is it?

FYI, if this is Locked / Removed for Trolling..

Thats why i added the "Example" Thing.. Its not super hard to make a Non faction suit. This is an example.

Edit : Btw, the suit would of been even more Nuts, but i like my LRC.

 

[Elfstone]

Trammier and Trammier. Pfft

 

[Kat]

*Here ya go, now i know your not gonna fight me, this is more of an Example thing.*

Ahhh your lack of intelligence has reared its ugly head yet again, eh? You can't debate an issue like a civilized human being, so instead you challenge me to a fight ? LOL You are such a joke.

You are correct, Vaelix. I will not be accepting your little offer. You and I both know I can't PvP my way out of a wet paper bag and I have never claimed to have that ability, but here is the bottom line...

As much as you hate it, I do not have to fight you, duel you or anyone else in order to have an opinion, but I'm so so so sorry that my opinion leaves you feeling so threatened. As much as I love factions, I care more about the shard as a whole and that is why I put my efforts into keeping this shard balanced for all players, not just the aspect that I happen to enjoy the most. I'm sorry that has you so angry, bitter and so fire-hoppin' mad that you'd come here and challenge me to a fight.

So, to that end, you can go stroke your little epeenie elsewhere. Atlantic, perhaps?

 

[Sprago]

Kat you missed his point all together it wasnt the fight he wanted

he was pointing out the fact that his suit is comparable to that of any faction suit and he did this without any FACTION ARMOR proving that it can be done that is all

 

[Kat]

Kat you missed his point all together it wasnt the fight he wanted

he was pointing out the fact that his suit is comparable to that of any faction suit and he did this without any FACTION ARMOR proving that it can be done that is all

Yes, Sprago, I see that, which ALSO indicates that he doesn't need faction arties to compete. Guess ya both missed that, eh? So how about removing those faction arties permanently instead of crying to keep the overpowered crap? Hmmm?

Oh wait... what was i thinking?! You guys are in factions and DESERVE better equipment!rolleyes:


The real question here is: Would he give up his faction arties and be happy with this suit?

Suit Stats are :

70 70 67 70 70
40% LMC
100% LRC
55% DCI
MR 4
HPR 2
2/6 Casting
+14 Magery
HP Inc 16
Dex 5

I think we all know the answer to that.

 

[Sprago]

lol kat relax
simple fact is i dont think they are ever gonna change the faction arties so we need to adjust to it not complain till our keyboards wears out

 

[Timothy_SP]

Kat you missed his point all together it wasnt the fight he wanted

he was pointing out the fact that his suit is comparable to that of any faction suit and he did this without any FACTION ARMOR proving that it can be done that is all

I guess the real question is how cheap and easy is it to get this suit? Is it easier, or cheaper, than farming/buying Silver?

 

[Draxous]

Kat you missed his point all together it wasnt the fight he wanted

he was pointing out the fact that his suit is comparable to that of any faction suit and he did this without any FACTION ARMOR proving that it can be done that is all

I guess the real question is how cheap and easy is it to get this suit? Is it easier, or cheaper, than farming/buying Silver?

I dunno about that suit with the costs of imbuing, but the non-faction suit I ran before SA is comparable in price to the faction ones I ran too. If you consider the inflation on the value of silver and the prices of buy backs - the faction one was more expensive, but more convienent to replace.

The real question is why people who can't PvP out of a wet paper bag are thinking their opinions are just as valid as those who can PvP when it comes to discussions about PvP.....?

Someone please answer me that question?

 

[MerchantAtHome]

The real question is why people who can't PvP out of a wet paper bag are thinking their opinions are just as valid as those who can PvP when it comes to discussions about PvP.....?

Someone please answer me that question?

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg289/limenats/blackrain.jpg

Yes, please. Someone answer that question. Cue the story about how it was 15 people that worked for hours to kill you...

 

[Draxous]

The real question is why people who can't PvP out of a wet paper bag are thinking their opinions are just as valid as those who can PvP when it comes to discussions about PvP.....?

Someone please answer me that question?

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg289/limenats/blackrain.jpg

Yes, please. Someone answer that question. Cue the story about how it was 15 people that worked for hours to kill you...

Cue the emo dude who's never killed me but screen shots himself standing over my empty corpse.

Here's a screenshot of you getting your ass kicked and running away from me 1 on 1

Holy crap... I'm even doing it in a non-faction uber suit

 

[Vortex]

To me that suit proves the opposite point that you intended.

To make that suit you needed:
Orny - so either tons of hours in Doom, or a cursed orny (which no longer spawn)
Crimson Cincture - arty drop from peerless, so tons of hours killing peerless to get that one.
Ancient Samurai helm - which no longer spawns.

Not to mention all the time it takes to get the stuff for all the imbuing you did.

I'm pretty sure you could farm the silver for a similar suit in less time then it would take just to get the Crimson Cincture (and tons less time then it takes to get the Orny).

So, wouldn't that suggest silver prices are too low?

 

[MerchantAtHome]

Cue the emo dude who's never killed me but screen shots himself standing over my empty corpse.

I appreciate the worship.

Right, I didn't kill you.

Someone else did and left all your stuff for me to loot and lock down on my front steps.

LMAO

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg289/limenats/blackrain2.jpg

Good luck finding a PvPer to answer your questions bud. In the meantime, work on better lies. Your act is played out.

 

[Vortex]

lol kat relax
simple fact is i dont think they are ever gonna change the faction arties so we need to adjust to it not complain till our keyboards wears out

Probably true, but that doesnt justify lowering silver and making it worse.

 

[Draxous]

Cue the emo dude who's never killed me but screen shots himself standing over my empty corpse.

I appreciate the worship.

Right, I didn't kill you.

Someone else did and left all your stuff for me to loot and lock down on my front steps.

LMAO

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg289/limenats/blackrain2.jpg

Good luck finding a PvPer to answer your questions bud. In the meantime, work on better lies. Your act is played out.

ROFL. I'm sure you REALLY believe people think you've killed me 1 on 1.

 

[Hugibear]

Vortex

You can right now go and buy all those pieces off a vendor in yew. For cheaper than it would take you to buy back them if you lost your faction gear. I saw ornies for 75-100k, crimson for 100-125k, sammy helms still spawn you just need to buy the token and there are soo many of them around there were about 50-75k.
And you must not have farmed silver, the best you can hope for is 13k per hour. That is max and is very dangerous becuase everyone checks blighted. The other places you can get about 5k per hour because of the slow spawn.
So vortex you are wrong.

 

[kelmo]

I am curious... Can the Sammy helm still be imbued?

 

[Hugibear]

yes they can

 

[Vortex]

Vortex

You can right now go and buy all those pieces off a vendor in yew. For cheaper than it would take you to buy back them if you lost your faction gear. I saw ornies for 75-100k, crimson for 100-125k, sammy helms still spawn you just need to buy the token and there are soo many of them around there were about 50-75k.
And you must not have farmed silver, the best you can hope for is 13k per hour. That is max and is very dangerous becuase everyone checks blighted. The other places you can get about 5k per hour because of the slow spawn.
So vortex you are wrong.

And when the cursed arties run out?

I have farmed silver, I currently have 100k rotting in my bank. I easily got more than 5k per hour and have never even been attacked farming silver.

But I was wrong in my assumption about the prices of cursed arties, I really thought a cursed orny was going for more than that. I also didn't know you can still get the samurai helms. Which token gives them?

*edit* Oh, and I didn't even count the fey leggings, don't think those are real cheap are they?

 

[Hugibear]

You make do. It is really simple, if you think that the faction arties are op. Than join faction and use them. It is your choice, if you choose not to use them that is your choice. Complainin about them isnt going to do you any good. If you think you need them to compete then join factions.

Going back to my make do comment, I could easily modify that suit and do it on the extreme cheap. Lets not forget he has 100% lrc on there. So you could take off the lrc on the ring and put dci on it, than use a throwaway weapon sc no pen mage weapon with maybe 10dci. Than you could buy a real orni and bless it.

As far as my silver rate drops per hour, they are dead on. Sammy helms are 7ae tokens, feys are pretty cheap I have seen them on vendors for about 75k (yes the humans).

If most of you people that are complaining actually went and played, maybe even pvped than y'all might have a leg to stand on. But y'all dont so please until you do shhhhhhh.

 

[Draxous]

Vortex

You can right now go and buy all those pieces off a vendor in yew. For cheaper than it would take you to buy back them if you lost your faction gear. I saw ornies for 75-100k, crimson for 100-125k, sammy helms still spawn you just need to buy the token and there are soo many of them around there were about 50-75k.
And you must not have farmed silver, the best you can hope for is 13k per hour. That is max and is very dangerous becuase everyone checks blighted. The other places you can get about 5k per hour because of the slow spawn.
So vortex you are wrong.

And when the cursed arties run out?

I have farmed silver, I currently have 100k rotting in my bank. I easily got more than 5k per hour and have never even been attacked farming silver.

But I was wrong in my assumption about the prices of cursed arties, I really thought a cursed orny was going for more than that. I also didn't know you can still get the samurai helms. Which token gives them?

*edit* Oh, and I didn't even count the fey leggings, don't think those are real cheap are they?

And when the cursed arties run out?

So we're basing our thoughts on "what ifs" rather than "what is"

????

Your entire argument for not reducing silver costs is crap.

You can't even logically state why this would make things worse. The same people who are SHOWING YOU how to put together a decent non-faction suit are the same people who will run good gear with or without these changes. The only thing this could possibly do is improve factions for everyone ELSE.

It's the same thing with non-faction gear. Boosting non-faction gear helps everyone, but that's a completely different issue that needs to be addressed. This I can't support one with out the other crap is the most pathetic display of ridiculousness I've ever seen on this forum. The argument doesn't even make sense.

If reducing silver costs doesn't go through because of people like you. I can guarantee you that a large chunk of players you'll be counting on to help push for your non-faction crap will no longer.

I'd rethink your position before you become the reason this shard remains broken.

 

[MerchantAtHome]

You can't even logically state why this would make things worse. The same people who are SHOWING YOU how to put together a decent non-faction suit are the same people who will run good gear with or without these changes. The only thing this could possibly do is improve factions for everyone ELSE.

It's the same thing with non-faction gear. Boosting non-faction gear helps everyone, but that's a completely different issue that needs to be addressed. This I can't support one with out the other crap is the most pathetic display of ridiculousness I've ever seen on this forum. The argument doesn't even make sense.

If reducing silver costs doesn't go through because of people like you. I can guarantee you that a large chunk of players you'll be counting on to help push for your non-faction crap will no longer.

I'd rethink your position before you become the reason this shard remains broken.

I'll take a shot at logically stating how things will get worse with this change. First, what has happened to the population on Siege since the introduction of faction arties? No one disputes that the population died. No one. You argue that the population died because people got tired of farming silver for faction arties. I argue that faction arties radically changed PvP because faction arties are really only designed to help mages.

I'll explain. What faction arties did was allow mages to easily max out defense chance. By max out, I don't mean 45, I mean 70. At 70 DCI, even with HCI at max and HLD, a dexxer has at best a 50 percent chance to hit a mage who is standing still. Now, add in parry to that you reduce the chance for a dexxer to hit to 1 in 3. At 35 damage per hit, a dexxer has to hit three times in a row to kill a mage who hasn't healed at all. The odds of hitting a mage three times in a row are about 3 percent. 3 percent

Do you want to know why your guild thinks faction arties are the best thing in the world and everyone else hates them? It is because the vast majority of the shard played dexxers. When you reduce a dexxers chance to kill you to almost nothing, people stop fighting, then they quit.

Cursed arties don't allow for the same templates that faction arties do. The extra mods on the crystalline ring, orny, leggings, etc... allow for mages to run max dci, with max casting, and a mage wep. Before, you had to choose. Do I want to kill people or do I want to be a tank. Now, with this equipment you can do both.

Uncursed arties will never fix that because they don't allow anyone to reduce a 70 DCI'er below the "cap". If they changed the way HLD works, that would help. Or, if they made 45 a "hard" cap, that would help. Adding more faction arties only works if everyone plays a mage, unfortunately, almost no one does (except the people endlessly posting for cheap faction arties).

Let me ask you something, let's say faction silver cost is reduced. I don't think that will help, I think that will make things worse. You disagree. OK. What is your plan B? When this change goes through and you still don't have anyone to fight, what will you scream about then? Because, IMO that is what you should be asking for now.

 

[Vortex]

This I can't support one with out the other crap is the most pathetic display of ridiculousness I've ever seen on this forum. The argument doesn't even make sense.

I'd rethink your position before you become the reason this shard remains broken.

When you learn to control your emotions like Hugi and Vaelix can, I will discuss things like this with you. Until that day, I'm not wasting any more time being insulted by you.

I'll go play the game, you stay here on the boards like you usually do.

Good points Vaelix and Hugi. You guys are a credit to a discussion. I hope you get the change and I hope it works out for you. I've given my opinion and I stand by it. I agree that it would be a benefit to current faction players, and might even bring a few back. I also think it will drive more away as I know several people who have left because of faction arties.

See you all around.

 

[MerchantAtHome]

*Here ya go, now i know your not gonna fight me, this is more of an Example thing.*

hey kat! Where are ya sweetie, lets fight, you've got your wish! (Btw feel free to suit up in a 100% Bad Ass Faction Suit, it wont make a difference, because its the player, not the suit.

Suit Stats are :

70 70 67 70 70
40% LMC
100% LRC
55% DCI
MR 4
HPR 2
2/6 Casting
+14 Magery
HP Inc 16
Dex 5

I'll take my chances against 55 DCI and a one handed mage wep. 70 DCI and a shield? No way.

Plus, if I kill you in that suit, I can use everything you are wearing. What fun is there in killing you if I can't use your stuff (faction gear with your name on it)?

 

[Vaelix]

I'll take my chances against 55 DCI and a one handed mage wep. 70 DCI and a shield? No way.

Plus, if I kill you in that suit, I can use everything you are wearing. What fun is there in killing you if I can't use your stuff (faction gear with your name on it)?

Every single piece is Hero Dyed, you just cant see it.

 

[MerchantAtHome]

Every single piece is Hero Dyed, you just cant see it.

Hero dyed is fine. I'm in and out of factions (usually hero) so it doesn't go to waste.

Alternatively, I can always trade it to someone in factions for something I want. Can't do that with the named stuff.

Now, if you could melt the named stuff down for resources that would be helpful.



Edit: Wonders if hero/evil dyed items will still be wearable with the new factions???

 

[Vaelix]

Btw the Argument of

70 DCI / Parry Mage
vs
45 Hci Dexxer

Faction gear thing, really holds no water.

Prodo dexxers have no trouble fighting 70 DCI Parry Mages.

What makes their 120 Weapon skill / 45 HCI / HLD different than ours?

 

[MerchantAtHome]

Btw the Argument of

70 DCI / Parry Mage
vs
45 Hci Dexxer

Faction gear thing, really holds no water.

Prodo dexxers have no trouble fighting 70 DCI Parry Mages.

What makes their 120 Weapon skill / 45 HCI / HLD different than ours?

I wouldn't know about that since I haven't played a prodo shard in a LONG time. I'd suggest that part of it is that Siege has fewer people. If you have a lot of dexxers whaling on you, someone is going to hit you eventually. On Siege, where the fights are so small, you really notice that 3 percent chance.

Honestly, this never occured to you?

 

[Vaelix]

I wouldn't know about that since I haven't played a prodo shard in a LONG time. I'd suggest that part of it is that Siege has fewer people. If you have a lot of dexxers whaling on you, someone is going to hit you eventually. On Siege, where the fights are so small, you really notice that 3 percent chance.

Honestly, this never occured to you?

So faction gear is overpowered because there's less people attacking you?

 

[MerchantAtHome]

So faction gear is overpowered because there's less people attacking you?

That is one way to think about it, yes. Pets are another example.

Faction gear would be less of a problem if there were more people playing. But, a lot of people quit because of the gear so round and round we go...

 

[Vortex]

Ok, can't help it, one more thought before I go...

Vaelix, you claim that by lowering silver costs more people will come back because they will be able to get faction items easier and re-equip faster.

Couldn't the same thing be achieved if you quit wearing faction items yourself? Then they wouldn't need faction items to compete and it would be faster for them to equip when you kill them?

 

[Vaelix]

The truth is, it is harder for players *Who havent been playing here forever, and do not have access to Tons of Gold* to suit up without access to faction gear.

In all honestly it does take more time to suit up non faction, even more so if you didnt stockpile the gear like some of us did, hell look at Nyms Castle, hes set for a long time, but, others.. have maybe what.. 5 Cursed arties *Total*?

The Non Faction suit i made, I already had All of that, except a cursed orny, stockpiled and ready to go. I only needed to buy, Cursed Orny, 3 Cryst Blackrock, all the other arties, and imbue ingres, i already had waiting for me.

And the reason behind that is, ive been here for a while, ive had time to stockpile my stuff and prepare.

New players who havent had time to do any of this, or players who cannot play as often as I do, do not have access to this kind of thing. It took me 20 mins to put that suit together, only because i had access to the stuff.

However, someone else, who doesnt have access to that stuff, it would require much more time.

Now... We introduce faction arties, and Boom, they can make a competitive suit without the need to of played here for 3+ Years like I have. They have access to arties which will put them on the same level as everyone else in factions.

However!

Players who only play 3 Hours a Day do not have to Farm 3 Days a week to be able to PvP Once.. If they were to die, then they would have to Farm for 3 More days to PvP again.. And what kind of PvPer wants to spend their week like this : 6 Days Farm / 1 Day PvP ( and the PvP could last 5 Minutes if they die).

Factions are good, the arties are good, the problem is that at the time it requires to farm them now, regular players, which is mostly JsV / TnT, (Not an insult, im just saying most of you arnt Hardcore Powergamers) do not have the time to spend on this game to Farm as much as required to be able to get onto the field.

 

[Vortex]

Your post is 100% true. It is the same arguement for the removal of arties altogether.

So if the Dev's don't make this change, my question stands. Will you then fight in GM armor so that people who don't have time to farm can compete?

 

[Vaelix]

I will not, without DCI Arties, bushy dexxers eat any mage alive, and Running around healing 100% Of the time, is not Fun PvP.

Either that, or i would just have to stand on the wall and trap people like I used to, and no one wants that.

In todays PvP, we Need arties to be able to fight the power that skills offer.

Factions offer the best possible way to get them.

 

[MerchantAtHome]

The truth is, it is harder for players *Who havent been playing here forever, and do not have access to Tons of Gold* to suit up without access to faction gear.

In all honestly it does take more time to suit up non faction, even more so if you didnt stockpile the gear like some of us did, hell look at Nyms Castle, hes set for a long time, but, others.. have maybe what.. 5 Cursed arties *Total*?

The Non Faction suit i made, I already had All of that, except a cursed orny, stockpiled and ready to go. I only needed to buy, Cursed Orny, 3 Cryst Blackrock, all the other arties, and imbue ingres, i already had waiting for me.

And the reason behind that is, ive been here for a while, ive had time to stockpile my stuff and prepare.

New players who havent had time to do any of this, or players who cannot play as often as I do, do not have access to this kind of thing. It took me 20 mins to put that suit together, only because i had access to the stuff.

However, someone else, who doesnt have access to that stuff, it would require much more time.

Now... We introduce faction arties, and Boom, they can make a competitive suit without the need to of played here for 3+ Years like I have. They have access to arties which will put them on the same level as everyone else in factions.

However!

Players who only play 3 Hours a Day do not have to Farm 3 Days a week to be able to PvP Once.. If they were to die, then they would have to Farm for 3 More days to PvP again.. And what kind of PvPer wants to spend their week like this : 6 Days Farm / 1 Day PvP ( and the PvP could last 5 Minutes if they die).

Factions are good, the arties are good, the problem is that at the time it requires to farm them now, regular players, which is mostly JsV / TnT, (Not an insult, im just saying most of you arnt Hardcore Powergamers) do not have the time to spend on this game to Farm as much as required to be able to get onto the field.

Since you used JSV and TnT as examples, let me ask you this: Who in JSV or TnT will be helped by the addition of easily available faction arties? Are there mages in JSV? Mages in TnT? You can give them faction arties, they will get lots of DCI. Great, now we'll have dexxers who still won't be able to hit you and additionally, they won't be able to hit each other. WoOOhooO. What fun!!

 

[MerchantAtHome]

I will not, without DCI Arties, bushy dexxers eat any mage alive, and Running around healing 100% Of the time, is not Fun PvP.

...and finally, we have the truth. This isn't about being selfless and giving others a chance. It is about preserving the advantage that faction items gave mages and then making that advantage virtually free.

 

[Vortex]

I will not, without DCI Arties, bushy dexxers eat any mage alive, and Running around healing 100% Of the time, is not Fun PvP.

Either that, or i would just have to stand on the wall and trap people like I used to, and no one wants that.

In todays PvP, we Need arties to be able to fight the power that skills offer.

Factions offer the best possible way to get them.

hey kat! Where are ya sweetie, lets fight, you've got your wish! (Btw feel free to suit up in a 100% Bad Ass Faction Suit, it wont make a difference, because its the player, not the suit.

I salute your honesty, but not your consistency.

 

[Vaelix]

Parry counters dexxers, yes, Does it make it impossible for Dexxers to kill mages? No

Most parry mages do not run Resisting Spells, because they need that 120 Skill to be able to Run parry.

70 DCI and Parry has existed since the introduction of DCI Items, there are ways around it.

Casting Templates, Conflag Potions, Explosion Potions, Pets, Disarm *If they are Bush/Parry*, Curse (Or other Dex Lowering Affects), Purge Magic (Their Dex Potion), Dismount (With them on foot, more swings due to slow speed)

Various others..

The thing is, you cannot use 70 DCI / Parry on a Template to justify Artifacts being "Overpowered", As i said, People on Production shards dont seem to have a problem with it. More players? Maybe

However, I had more than a Couple 1v1s over there as a parry mage, where the dexxers ate me up.

Bottom Line, We (I do not) Run parry to counter Dexxers, Because we are fighting 95% Dexxer Templates.

If you guys ran 50% Dexxer Templates, 50% Mages templates, this would make it much more difficult for us to counter you completely.

 

[Vortex]

...and finally, we have the truth. This isn't about being selfless and giving others a chance. It is about preserving the advantage that faction items gave mages and then making that advantage virtually free.

I believe you hit the nail on the head. I would even extend that it does the same thing for pk'ers who join factions only for the right to wear the artifacts.

 

[Vaelix]

I salute your honesty, but not your consistency.

My Point still remains Valid, Against someone like Kat (The Player) 55% DCI is more than enough to fight.

Against someone like Asty (The Player) 55% DCI Isnt enough.

"Its the player not the suit" Holds true in most aspects of the game..

Only when you are fighting the best of the Best *Dexxers* Does the suit make the difference, However, it does not Make *All* the difference.

Against The mages on this shard, i could fight with GM Armor and Do fine, The Dexxers, No.

Let me clear that up a bit..


Mage vs Mage, its the player

Mage vs Dexxer, its the player and the suit.

 

[Vortex]

Parry counters dexxers, yes, Does it make it impossible for Dexxers to kill mages? No

Most parry mages do not run Resisting Spells, because they need that 120 Skill to be able to Run parry.

70 DCI and Parry has existed since the introduction of DCI Items, there are ways around it.

Casting Templates, Conflag Potions, Explosion Potions, Pets, Disarm *If they are Bush/Parry*, Curse (Or other Dex Lowering Affects), Purge Magic (Their Dex Potion), Dismount (With them on foot, more swings due to slow speed)

Various others..

The thing is, you cannot use 70 DCI / Parry on a Template to justify Artifacts being "Overpowered", As i said, People on Production shards dont seem to have a problem with it. More players? Maybe

However, I had more than a Couple 1v1s over there as a parry mage, where the dexxers ate me up.

Bottom Line, We (I do not) Run parry to counter Dexxers, Because we are fighting 95% Dexxer Templates.

If you guys ran 50% Dexxer Templates, 50% Mages templates, this would make it much more difficult for us to counter you completely.

Thats a circle, if you didn't need all those artifacts, then running a mage wouldn't be so expensive. If it wasn't so expensive more people would run mages.

 

[Vaelix]

...and finally, we have the truth. This isn't about being selfless and giving others a chance. It is about preserving the advantage that faction items gave mages and then making that advantage virtually free.

This "Advantage" You speak of.. Is more of a, Even the Field kinda thing, than anything else.

Play a mage with 0 DCI and fight a Bushy dexxer.. You will die 100% Of the time.

Play a mage with 70% DCI, and its a throw up, because then.. at 50% Chance to hit (70DCI vs 45HCI, 120 Wep vs 120 Wep) It becomes completely Even.

Add Parry, and you do have an Advantage over dexxers, However! You have a ** Disadvantage ** Against mages.

 

[MerchantAtHome]

Parry counters dexxers, yes, Does it make it impossible for Dexxers to kill mages? No

Most parry mages do not run Resisting Spells, because they need that 120 Skill to be able to Run parry.

70 DCI and Parry has existed since the introduction of DCI Items, there are ways around it.

Casting Templates, Conflag Potions, Explosion Potions, Pets, Disarm *If they are Bush/Parry*, Curse (Or other Dex Lowering Affects), Purge Magic (Their Dex Potion), Dismount (With them on foot, more swings due to slow speed)

Various others..

The thing is, you cannot use 70 DCI / Parry on a Template to justify Artifacts being "Overpowered", As i said, People on Production shards dont seem to have a problem with it. More players? Maybe

However, I had more than a Couple 1v1s over there as a parry mage, where the dexxers ate me up.

Bottom Line, We (I do not) Run parry to counter Dexxers, Because we are fighting 95% Dexxer Templates.

If you guys ran 50% Dexxer Templates, 50% Mages templates, this would make it much more difficult for us to counter you completely.

I don't disagree with that. The thing is, how does the introduction of easily available mass DCI help the situation? A returning dexxer would find that he still can't hit mages and guess what, now he can't hit dexxers either.

What your little guild needs to understand is that honestly, the best thing for the shard is whatever benefits dexxers because most of the shard plays dexxers. Giving an advantage to mages makes dexxers go bye bye. The proof is in the pudding I'm afraid.

 

[Vaelix]

Thats a circle, if you didn't need all those artifacts, then running a mage wouldn't be so expensive. If it wasn't so expensive more people would run mages.

To not need the artifacts would require a Total revamp of the HCI / DCI and Weapon Skill based combat system, and that is not going to happen.

However, what will (Might) happen is lowering the price of the Faction gear, which gives easier to obtain arties (Less Expensive).

And the DCI / HCI Arties, do exactly the same thing, as a Total revamp of the HCI / DCI combat system.

 

[Vortex]

This "Advantage" You speak of.. Is more of a, Even the Field kinda thing, than anything else.

Play a mage with 0 DCI and fight a Bushy dexxer.. You will die 100% Of the time.

Play a mage with 70% DCI, and its a throw up, because then.. at 50% Chance to hit (70DCI vs 45HCI, 120 Wep vs 120 Wep) It becomes completely Even.

Add Parry, and you do have an Advantage over dexxers, However! You have a ** Disadvantage ** Against mages.

And so how does a dexxer kill a mage that is all artied out? I'm sorry, but I don't see a dexxer killing a mage with 70 dci when he has 45 hci. Unless there is a mechanic I don't know, thats not a 50% chance to hit.

Then, even worse, take a necro mage. The necro mage artied out can waste a dexxer in seconds.

 

[Vortex]

To not need the artifacts would require a Total revamp of the HCI / DCI and Weapon Skill based combat system, and that is not going to happen.

That or everyone agree to quit using them, which is also not gonna happen

 

[Draxous]

I'll take a shot at logically stating how things will get worse with this change. First, what has happened to the population on Siege since the introduction of faction arties? No one disputes that the population died. No one. You argue that the population died because people got tired of farming silver for faction arties. I argue that faction arties radically changed PvP because faction arties are really only designed to help mages.

I'll explain. What faction arties did was allow mages to easily max out defense chance. By max out, I don't mean 45, I mean 70. At 70 DCI, even with HCI at max and HLD, a dexxer has at best a 50 percent chance to hit a mage who is standing still. Now, add in parry to that you reduce the chance for a dexxer to hit to 1 in 3. At 35 damage per hit, a dexxer has to hit three times in a row to kill a mage who hasn't healed at all. The odds of hitting a mage three times in a row are about 3 percent. 3 percent

Do you want to know why your guild thinks faction arties are the best thing in the world and everyone else hates them? It is because the vast majority of the shard played dexxers. When you reduce a dexxers chance to kill you to almost nothing, people stop fighting, then they quit.

Cursed arties don't allow for the same templates that faction arties do. The extra mods on the crystalline ring, orny, leggings, etc... allow for mages to run max dci, with max casting, and a mage wep. Before, you had to choose. Do I want to kill people or do I want to be a tank. Now, with this equipment you can do both.

Uncursed arties will never fix that because they don't allow anyone to reduce a 70 DCI'er below the "cap". If they changed the way HLD works, that would help. Or, if they made 45 a "hard" cap, that would help. Adding more faction arties only works if everyone plays a mage, unfortunately, almost no one does (except the people endlessly posting for cheap faction arties).

Let me ask you something, let's say faction silver cost is reduced. I don't think that will help, I think that will make things worse. You disagree. OK. What is your plan B? When this change goes through and you still don't have anyone to fight, what will you scream about then? Because, IMO that is what you should be asking for now.

Logically speaking. This whole post of yours is total crap.

Look at the prodoshards where all the players (dexers and mages a like) PvP against each other in your 'scenario' and it's balanced.

In fact... this whole game is balanced and tailored to that kind of play.

Try again.

 

[MerchantAtHome]

To not need the artifacts would require a Total revamp of the HCI / DCI and Weapon Skill based combat system, and that is not going to happen.
.

Really? I'd say a few little tweaks to archery would go a long way.

 

[MerchantAtHome]

Logically speaking. This whole post of yours is total crap.

Look at the prodoshards where all the players (dexers and mages a like) PvP against each other in your 'scenario' and it's balanced.

In fact... this whole game is balanced and tailored to that kind of play.

Try again.

Do you want to come back after you catch up? Or not. That would be fine too.