President backs Islamic complex near Ground Zero

[G.v.P]

Received this in my mail this morning:

Washington Post News Alert: President backs Islamic complex near Ground Zero in New York
08:30 PM EDT Friday, August 13, 2010

President Obama said on Friday that he supports the construction of a mosque near Ground Zero in New York, saying that opposing the project is at odds with American values. "Let me be clear: as a citizen, and as President, I believe that Muslims have the same right to practice their religion as anyone else in this country," he said at a White House ceremony marking the traditional breaking of the daily Ramadan fast, according to prepared remarks. "That includes the right to build a place of worship and a community center on private property in lower Manhattan, in accordance with local laws and ordinances." Some leading Republicans have urged that the mosque project be halted.


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I don't normally talk politics, but I have to say I feel President Obama is being disrespectful unless this complex supports all religions and denominations. No matter if people can understand the difference between radicals and those whom also fell victim on 9/11, an Islamic-only complex is going to raise lots of unnecessary heat and turmoil.

 

[StaticOnAtlantic]

I read this article when I was flying out of JFK this morning and I was at a complete loss for words, Not only does our president not give a flying F about our country he understand its an election year, and even msnbc isint backing him, polls slipping he needs to gain ground somewhere.

And why not the worlds largest Religion? right....

 

[Omnius]

The Roman Catholic Church should do us a favor and buy the land... They can afford it...

 

[uoBuoY]

How can the President ask other countries for more religious tolerance (eg.: stop killing catholic missionaries) if he won't allow the building of a mosque?

Prohibiting the building of a mosque would only alienate more mainstream Muslims, the people the US needs to help in the eradication of Muslim extremists and terrorists.

Obama was also doing one other small thing...upholding the US Constitution.

 

[G.v.P]

How can the President ask other countries for more religious tolerance (eg.: stop killing catholic missionaries) if he won't allow the building of a mosque?

Prohibiting the building of a mosque would only alienate more mainstream Muslims, the people the US needs to help in the eradication of Muslim extremists and terrorists.

Obama was also doing one other small thing...upholding the US Constitution.

Freedom of religion is thought of as a pillar of our nation, although it was an amendment to the Constitution. I suppose if I wanted to be crass I could say the original Constitution would have supported Islamic treatment of women moreso than our current Constitution, which has probably angered the "extremists" of Islam since the women-empowering 1920s. That's why I hate when politicians name drop the founding fathers, as if they had all the answers. They didn't. That's why the Constitution is, at times, open to interpretation.

I wonder if any "mainstream" Islamic women are held back from their right to vote in the United States. I worked the polls in 2008 and don't remember seeing any absentee walk-ins. Of course, that was a very small sample size.

Anyway, per your example, how is one side killing the other comparable to a situation in which President Obama would have said "no" to the proposed Islamic complex? If President Obama said no to the build site, he wouldn't be killing imams in the process. He has a big enough reason (nearly a decade of terrorist attacks on our soil in the name of Islam) and enough charm to say no and explain why an Islamic-only complex two blocks off from ground zero is a bad idea. That's why, for true tolerance, it should be inter-faith.

 

[Old Man of UO]

A few more facts to consider:

1) The state of New York has offered to provide speedy assistance to the imam Feisal Abdul Rauf to relocate the masque. No one is trying to prevent the Cordoba House group, which the imam founded, from building the masque only asking it not to inflame an already sensitive issue by building so close to Ground Zero. The imam has not responded to the state's request to relocate the masque.

2) Feisal Abdul Rauf has suggested the Cordoba House be under sharia law, and not subject to USA law, citing religious freedom. This would certainly be unconstitutional, not to mention controversial, using religious law to supersede secular law.

3) The US State Department is financing a 3rd trip for Feisal Abdul Rauf to visit the Middle East and promote interfaith moderation, tolerance and cooperation. It is not supposed to be used to solicit donations for the Cordoba House, though the past two trips were used for that. So far, the USA has not got anything in return for financing these trips.

4) The imam Feisal Abdul Rauf has publicly support Hamas and refuses to denounce them as a terrorist group, which the USA does list as a terrorist group. He prefers to remain "neutral" to negotiate with all groups. Some of the imam's past anti-US statements also make many American's uncomfortable and shows he really isn't that neutral - such as blaming US political stance for the 9/11 attacks.

No one was trying to prohibit building the masque, just asking it to relocate and be sensitive to those who died or suffered lost ones in the 9/11 attack. The imam's political stances hasn't been one of reconciliation even though he is considered a moderate Islamic Muslim.

If you have been following the news on the mosque, none of this is new or news. The President should have just kept his mouth shut on the topic and let local politics resolve the issues.

 

[Sadrith Mora]

I can't remember the last time hearing the news i got so furious. There is no good enough reason for any american to accept an islamic mosque being built anywhere near ground zero after the horrific events of 9/11.

To me, this is despicable to even consider. There should be an exception to the constitution because of what happened in the name of islam.

Obama just killed his second term in office.

 

[Tobyone]

A few more facts to consider:



4) The imam Feisal Abdul Rauf has publicly support Hamas and refuses to denounce them as a terrorist group, which the USA does list as a terrorist group. He prefers to remain "neutral" to negotiate with all groups. Some of the imam's past anti-US statements also make many American's uncomfortable and shows he really isn't that neutral - such as blaming US political stance for the 9/11 attacks.

He'd be correct in doing so..

 

[Aran]

Wahh someone who owns land is doing something I don't liiiiiiiike

 

[Roland Of Gilead]

u cant condemn everyone of a certain ethnicity or religion based on the actions of someone within that ethnicity or religion thats just stupid.And people who seem to think that are racist fools.If u hear of a black man killing people does that mean all black people are bad? How about a fat white guy are all fat white guys bad?lol Seriously people listen to yourself.You make yourselves sound ignorant to our own laws and constitution.We as americans have the right to practice whatever faith we choose wherever the heck we choose to do it at and changing that for one group isnt cool no matter what a few bad seeds who may have practiced that religion may have done...How much death has been caused over Christianity?...They have the right to build what they want where they want.Just as much as anyone else does even if it causes them grief for doing so...i rest my case...

 

[Nexus]

So? If the people who own the land decide to build a Mosque there it is their property.

I wish people would get it through their thick skulls though, not all Muslims are connected with terrorists, only a hand full of radical groups. And most importantly The United States of America is not a Christian Nation. I really with the Politicians would catch on to the last one. Freedom of Religion is just that, Freedom of Religion, our government should take a step back and tread carefully in order not to show favoritism for one action or another where religion is involved as long as they are peaceful actions. In other words if they build a Mosque there, and people get uppity and start defacing the place, or otherwise attempt to cause damage to the structure or those attending it then they should step in and stop those causing the harm.

Then again I believe the US should pass a law requiring legally eligible individuals to exercise their 2nd amendment right to the extent of each and every qualifying house hold should be required to own and maintain a firearm of some type. So I might be considered a little crazy by many folks.

 

[G.v.P]

If you have been following the news on the mosque, none of this is new or news. The President should have just kept his mouth shut on the topic and let local politics resolve the issues.

It was more newsworthy when I posted it two weeks ago, but yes, it's been brewing for quite some time. The President's remark just took it over the edge for me.

Thank you for supplying facts for discussion and for giving your opinion as well. I agree the President should have kept his mouth shut, however, he desperately wants to appeal to Muslims in my opinion. It hasn't made the extremists like America any more, and they still want us (Americans) to all die, but liberals tend to believe we can all sit and talk things out for some reason.

Obama just killed his second term in office.

I wouldn't miss him ... I've disagreed with most of his principals so far when it comes to national defense, and I'm disgusted at how he constantly finds new ways to expose us on his quest to somehow gain the trust of the world.

He'd be correct in doing so..

Correct in what? Believing it was the US's fault for 9/11? Huh?

Wahh someone who owns land is doing something I don't liiiiiiiike

Says message board terrorist Aran.

u cant condemn everyone of a certain ethnicity or religion based on the actions of someone within that ethnicity or religion thats just stupid.

Read the thread, particularly Old Man's post. No one is trying to condemn Muslims, it's just a simple fact that most of the "terrorism" of the last decade has been in the name of Islam, and building a Mosque two blocks from ground zero is disrespectful because either way you slice it the extremists are Muslim and possibly connected to the potential owner of the plot. Just like building a Taco Bell inside the Alamo would be disrespectful. Just like Swede cartoonist Lars Vilks was disrespectful of prophet Muhammad. Just because you have the right to do something doesn't make it right.

How much death has been caused over Christianity?

Please reference a few Christian terrorists over the last decade for me. If you're an extremist, I'll give you George Bush Jr.. Otherwise, if you're talking about colonization, or worse, something like the crusades, that's apples and oranges. Yes, most of the organized religions have a propensity towards hating other religions. But the Islamic extremists simply want all Americans to die.

I wish people would get it through their thick skulls though, not all Muslims are connected with terrorists, only a hand full of radical groups. And most importantly The United States of America is not a Christian Nation.

Constitution wise, yes, America was founded, after a quick amendment, to have freedom of religion and freedom from religion. However, the Islamic extremists view America as a Christian nation, which is largely why they target us. This is because statistically America is a white, Christian nation, no thick skulls about it. The US polled nearly 80% white and nearly 80% Christian in 2007.

 

[wee papa smurf]

Although not all muslims are terrorists i still think building a mosque close to ground is a big disrespect to all those who lost there loved ones on 9/11, im not religous or racist and im not in America but 9/11 touched everyone over the world and i see it as a slap in the face to the American people, just my quids worth rolleyes:

 

[Nestorius]

The 9/11 victims died nearly nine years ago. The relatives need to get over it.

 

[Roland Of Gilead]

Hi again u asked me to reference a few "christian terrorists" for ya as if such a thing couldnt possibly be.So i looked it up this is like a tiny bit o what i found -Hope it helps."The Bible Book Of Judges tells a story of the hero Sampson and how he killed himself to bring down a temple of the Philistines in order to kill 3000 Philistines." Now im not saying saying the Philistines werent bad guys i dont know i wasnt there but it seems people have been suicide attacking for a very long time and of all religions. I was actually kinda amazed when i looked it up just how many Christian terrorists groups there were even. You should type it into any search engine if u dont think its out there -prepare to be astonished.
Im not trying to talk smack about any religion or another here but u quoted me and asked me to refrence some for u so here i am...National Liberation Front of Tripura are listed by the National Memorial Institute For the Prevention of Terrorism as one of the 10 most active terrorist groups in the world and are accused of forcefully coverting people to Christianity.Lords Resistance Army's soldiers wear rosery beads and recite passages from the bible before battle.They have been accused of using child soldiers and numerous crimes against humanity including ;massacres,abductions,torture,mutilation,****,porters and sex slaves.Led by Joseph Kony who proclaims himself the spokesperson of God and a spirit medium- primarily the Christian Holy Spirit.
Anyways sorry so longwinded but u asked...Feel free to check out any random search engine to see if im full of crap but what i listed are only a few-like u asked -out of a gigantonormous list thats right there for everyone to see.FYI im American and Christian- though not hardcore about it-and i still say we all are equal here and anyone should have as much right to do whatever anyone else can do where ever anyone else can do it!Also that u cant hold a grudge against an entire religion because some jerks within that religion did something stupid no matter how horrible it may have been.If they wanna build a building even though it may get a negative response from some people i think it should be their choice to do so.Its even a few blocks away from ground zero u ever seen a new york city block?

 

[G.v.P]

The 9/11 victims died nearly nine years ago. The relatives need to get over it.

I guess you would tell people they have to get over the Holocaust as well, huh?

Anyways sorry so longwinded but u asked...Feel free to check out any random search engine to see if im full of crap but what i listed are only a few-like u asked -out of a gigantonormous list thats right there for everyone to see. [...] so.Its even a few blocks away from ground zero u ever seen a new york city block?

Not longwinded and don't think you're "full of crap" (could have also referenced the KKK in general as well, I'd say they're "Christian" terrorists). I just wanted to put some modern examples on the board. I'll look into the group you mentioned. And yes, I've been in the city a few times.

 

[Nexus]

Constitution wise, yes, America was founded, after a quick amendment, to have freedom of religion and freedom from religion. However, the Islamic extremists view America as a Christian nation, which is largely why they target us. This is because statistically America is a white, Christian nation, no thick skulls about it. The US polled nearly 80% white and nearly 80% Christian in 2007.

And that's exactly why I wish we could outlaw organized religion in the US. Faith is fine I have zero reserves about it, but once you organize it's an abomination prone to corruption. Political parties are no better, and not much different they both have the same end goal. Control of the minds of the population, one just does it by latching onto faith, the other does it by creating law.

 

[Sadrith Mora]

This is a Christian country. My research shows 75-78% of all americans today are Christian whether protestant or roman catholic, and quite frankly, i'd prefer it to stay that way, or grow to a higher percent.

The founding fathers were 100% of Christian background roots. Mostly protestants, and a few roman catholics. They were intelligent, deeply religious and most of them were regular church goers.

I was born and raised in this country, and Christianity is my faith. It is a free country, of course, for those who want freedom and accept it. But it's not available for those who wish to destroy what we stand for, and hate us for our beliefs. (probably out of jealousy)

Building an islamic mosque near the 9/11 disaster which cost us nearly 3000 innocent lives will never be acceptable now. It will be a victory flag for them, and a potential breeding ground for new problems if it happens, not to mention a b-slap in the face of this great country in the name of islam.

Build it somewhere else or get the f out!

And that's exactly why I wish we could outlaw organized religion in the US. Faith is fine I have zero reserves about it, but once you organize it's an abomination prone to corruption. Political parties are no better, and not much different they both have the same end goal.

If both are the same, then what's your point? What kind of country would that be like? This is life. Life is full of choices and beliefs. I love this country and what it stands for, and i love that it's christian dominated. I'm sorry if you disagree...

 

[Tobyone]

He'd be correct in doing so..

Correct in what? Believing it was the US's fault for 9/11? Huh?

That the us political stance for decades brought it onto you, yes..

3000 people? so ****ing what?

 

[Sadrith Mora]

3000 people? so ****ing what?

That's the kind of mentality that is unacceptable in this country.

F off.

 

[Taylor]

Please restrain discussion to the original topic.

 

[Magdalene]

OK I will repeat a question I asked somewhere else, to no avail: what would be a "comfort zone" around ground zero?
And what sort of establishment should not be allowed within that hallowed ground?
No mosques, sure, how about hindi temples, atheist academies and masonic lodges?
How about strip bars? Would that be disrespectful? Any bars serving alcohol? Escort services? Street hookers and dealers should be moved away out of respect? No grafitti in 5 block radius?
Oh, and for how long - the next 50, 100 years? Or 10 years would be enough?

 

[Aran]

I would greatly enjoy someone moving a strip joint into my neighborhood.

 

[Sadrith Mora]

Magdalene,

Can i ask a question to your question?

How many attacks on this country has there been in the name of a religious group that actually caused significant damage to our country, and nearly 3000 deaths sparking a war that is still going on today? How many billions for cleanup, lives lost, and the continued attempt to bring to justice the responsible in this war effort?

Aran: F off

PS: For me there is no "comfort zone" near ground zero, and now there never will be for muslims.

As long as there are peaceful, american loving (for what we stand for) muslims, they can build their BS somewhere else among the already 2500+
mosques scattered around the country. Just not anywhere near ground zero!

What's the problem with that? Oh yeah, the constitution. Which is why this is such a big issue...

Once again, Obama is toast.

 

[Nestorius]

No this is not a Christian country, it is a secular country. Move to Europe or the Middle East if you want a state religion, I prefer religious freedom. I'm not too afraid of Muslims taking over this country, however Christian extremists have a good chance.

Also, by the way, comparing 9/11 to the Holocaust is an example I am talking about with this 9/11 victim fetish. There is NO COMPARISON.

 

[Zezak]

It's not at ground zero and it's a couple blocks away.

It is the man's land, as long as he is breaking no laws he can do whatever he wants with it. Hell if he wants to make a monument to the men who flew the planes into the twin towers that is his right (not that it'd be a good thing).

The people who flew the planes into the twin towers were part of a group of Islamic extremists, manipulated and twisted from birth. While I do not support any religion I hardly see the point of attacking this mosque for any reason other than bigotry and ignorance. The actions of those men do not reflect the actions of millions of decent Islamic humans.

Quote from this article: http://www.cracked.com/blog/3-reasons-the-ground-zero-mosque-debate-makes-no-sense/

You Can’t Simultaneously Acknowledge A Right And Insist That Your Government Suppress It

 

[Aran]

I support Muslims buying all the property around Sadrith Mora (That's an awful middle eastern sounding name there, by the by...) and building a huge mosque and religious complex.

In fact, I'll chip in $10.

 

[Aran]

How many attacks on this country has there been in the name of a religious group that actually caused significant damage to our country, and nearly 3000 deaths sparking a war that is still going on today? How many billions for cleanup, lives lost, and the continued attempt to bring to justice the responsible in this war effort?

A religious group, unaffiliated with a government, attacks a country. Two buildings are destroyed, one damaged. Body count roughly three thousand.

In response, said country's leader, a man whose defining personality trait is his bible thumping religious beliefs, calls for attacks on and invasions of several countries, country's military murders not only their leaders but women and children, not to even bring it in the ****s and tortures. Body count of its own soldiers alone is well over four thousand.

Who's the bad guy again?

 

[Beer_Cayse]

How many attacks on this country has there been in the name of a religious group that actually caused significant damage to our country, and nearly 3000 deaths sparking a war that is still going on today? How many billions for cleanup, lives lost, and the continued attempt to bring to justice the responsible in this war effort?

How many times has the US butted into a religiously-based conflict? While we (us civilians) certainly didn't ask for it, that conflict arrived here because we allowed our "leadership" to involve us. Instead of voting the imbeciles out, we kept them in power far longer than deserved.

PS: For me there is no "comfort zone" near ground zero, and now there never will be for muslims.

Not bigoted at all are we? So here's what I have been able to glean over the last few days of media "he said, she said" antics:
1. Obama is in favor of the religious freedom for Muslims based upon the very Constitution you profess to love.
2. Gov. Paterson and others are in favor but would prefer it somewhat removed from the proposed location - too close to GZ.
3. While 51% of polled Americans are NOT in favor of the mosque as proposed, 68% or more ARE in favor of the mosque as a religious presence - again allowed in our Constitution.
4. The Imam has stated that the US is the best place for allowing religious freedoms as their religion teaches.

Keep in mind that Muslims also died in 9/11 when the towers fell. Your attitude is seriously needing adjustment. And don't misunderstand me ... I lost two good friends in that attack, another several were on the cleanup efforts, my company and others in my industry supplied hazmat suits, robotics and even the electrical power for the cleanup. I and many around me were most certainly affected by it, too.

Me? I'm thinking why not allow it to be built ... but in some other location not quite so ummm, problematic. Yup, I'm with that blind feller in Albany on this one ... see #2 above.

An offered constructive word to you and those like you: If you profess to be a citizen of the United States with a belief in one Supreme Diety, then I strongly ask you to reassess your feelings to get closer to the tenets of the Constitution and whatever is your religions text (Koran (sp?), Torah, Bible).

Really ... intolerance as you show is not what this country is predicated on.

 

[Beer_Cayse]

... While I do not support any religion I hardly see the point of attacking this mosque for any reason other than bigotry and ignorance. The actions of those men do not reflect the actions of millions of decent Islamic humans. ...

Oh, so true.

 

[G.v.P]

That the us political stance for decades brought it onto you, yes..

3000 people? so ****ing what?

So basically you hate the US and think 3,000 people dying is no big deal. I guess your viewpoints are set in stone, heh. Where are you from?

Also, by the way, comparing 9/11 to the Holocaust is an example I am talking about with this 9/11 victim fetish. There is NO COMPARISON.

The comparison is two otherwise unforgettable and unforgivable acts of hate. The way in which both went down is apples and oranges, but for anyone to say something as immoral as "the victims should get over it" needs to consider what they are saying. Nestorius, I'm sure if someone murdered your whole family tomorrow that you would forgive and forget your loses by next Tuesday, but the rest of the world, fortunately, doesn't operate like that.

 

[Tobyone]

That the us political stance for decades brought it onto you, yes..

3000 people? so ****ing what?

So basically you hate the US and think 3,000 people dying is no big deal. I guess your viewpoints are set in stone, heh. Where are you from?

No i dont hate the US, but i have no great love for it either. I have family there and know others who i greatly respect - so hate, no. I do think that its difficult to find such ignorance, hypocracy and biggotry in other western countries though.

In a broader perspective than you are probably able to understand, 3,000 is insignificant.

4,000 innocent children die every day simply because they are born in the wrong country. They dont have access to clean water - so they die.. so 3,000 dying because of a terror attack? While im sure those left behind are sad it shouldnt be more than a foodnote in history.


And im Danish, though im not sure how thats significant to the discussion?

 

[G.v.P]

A religious group, unaffiliated with a government, attacks a country. Two buildings are destroyed, one damaged. Body count roughly three thousand.

In response, said country's leader, a man whose defining personality trait is his bible thumping religious beliefs, calls for attacks on and invasions of several countries, country's military murders not only their leaders but women and children, not to even bring it in the ****s and tortures. Body count of its own soldiers alone is well over four thousand.

Who's the bad guy again?

Really depends on your viewpoints, and not quite sure you can say Al Qaeda was/is unaffiliated to any government because several countries have protected them thus far (while at of fear or out of allegiance, of course, leans towards fear more often than not). However, if you start any war, then innocent people will die. President Obama's efforts in Afghanistan will also put innocent people under the gun. That's just the nature of modern warfare.

The terrorist attacks were "bad," George Bush Jr., motive, in which he did not find nuclear weapons, was also "bad." However, once again, it depends on your viewpoints (should everyone have a "choice," or is "choice" destruction of their "culture?") whether all of that was worth ridding the world of Saddam Hussein. I encourage everyone to check out Oliver Stone's W., it's pretty interesting given Stone is liberal yet portrays the accounts even-keeled.

 

[Taylor]

A religious group, unaffiliated with a government, attacks a country. Two buildings are destroyed, one damaged. Body count roughly three thousand.

In response, said country's leader, a man whose defining personality trait is his bible thumping religious beliefs, calls for attacks on and invasions of several countries, country's military murders not only their leaders but women and children, not to even bring it in the ****s and tortures. Body count of its own soldiers alone is well over four thousand.

Who's the bad guy again?

Really depends on your viewpoints, and not quite sure you can say Al Qaeda was/is unaffiliated to any government because several countries have protected them thus far (while at of fear or out of allegiance, of course, leans towards fear more often than not). However, if you start any war, then innocent people will die. President Obama's efforts in Afghanistan will also put innocent people under the gun. That's just the nature of modern warfare.

The terrorist attacks were "bad," George Bush Jr., motive, in which he did not find nuclear weapons, was also "bad." However, once again, it depends on your viewpoints (should everyone have a "choice," or is "choice" destruction of their "culture?") whether all of that was worth ridding the world of Saddam Hussein. I encourage everyone to check out Oliver Stone's W., it's pretty interesting given Stone is liberal yet portrays the accounts even-keeled.

Another point would be that, pursuant the tenants of Just War Theory, only legitimate, state authorities are authorized to conduct war. This doesn't mean that the U.S. invasion of Iraq was just - many just war theorists believe that it was not. However, this would imply that any attack by a terrorist organization is similarly unjust.

 

[G.v.P]

4,000 innocent children die every day simply because they are born in the wrong country. They dont have access to clean water - so they die.. so 3,000 dying because of a terror attack? While im sure those left behind are sad it shouldnt be more than a foodnote in history.

If you began with the premise of 4,000 dying daily due to poverty, instead of saying "so ****ing what" to 3,000 dying, I wouldn't have perceived your sentiment as "hate."

As for asking for your identity, it helps to understand where your viewpoint is coming from. If you were from Africa, for example, your above statement would make a lot of sense, since genocide, AIDs, and other factors pit many African countries on top of the global death rate. However, life expectancy is 78 years in both the US and in Denmark; no, you are not being "too broad to understand," hehe.

 

[Taylor]

4,000 innocent children die every day simply because they are born in the wrong country. They dont have access to clean water - so they die.. so 3,000 dying because of a terror attack? While im sure those left behind are sad it shouldnt be more than a foodnote in history.

I can comfortably call both of these events tragic.

 

[Magdalene]

Magdalene,

Can i ask a question to your question?

How many attacks on this country has there been in the name of a religious group that actually caused significant damage to our country, and nearly 3000 deaths ? How many billions for cleanup, lives lost, and the continued attempt to bring to justice the responsible in this war effort?

Which war effort is this? Iraq? Afghanistan or something else? Because none of those has anything to do with 9/11... You'd have to bomb Riyadh or Islamabad for it to make a little sense (like people/governments who backed Bin Laden and al-Qaida), so 9/11 sparking a war that is still going on today is a long stretch.

PS: For me there is no "comfort zone" near ground zero, and now there never will be for muslims.

As long as there are peaceful, american loving (for what we stand for) muslims, they can build their BS somewhere else among the already 2500+
mosques scattered around the country. Just not anywhere near ground zero!

Define "not anywhere near" radius. 2 blocks? 5? 10? All downtown? All of Manhattan? All of NYC? And back your definition with something other than your personal anger level, please...

 

[longshanks]

The 9/11 victims died nearly nine years ago. The relatives need to get over it.

i take it your not from n.y.c. i am. lost a cousin that day a few friends and quite a few aquaintances i had over the years. guys i went to grade school with, people whose only focus that day was working to make some dough for their family. My best friends firehouse lost 5 guys as they were first due at the North tower.

You have no idea what your talking about. 61 million people died in ww2. ww2 was not just about the jews. as for them, jews that died during ww2 are still not over it and it was 65 years ago.

People that lost loved ones on 9/11 will never get over it.

as for the mosque downtown. firstly its not a mosque. its supposed to be a community center with a small prayer room. if you ask me its a command center, and its assinine that they are considering it.

islam is not a religion of peace either. in the major countries where islam is dominant there is no religious tolerance.

people have to start calling a pig a pig.

 

[Sadrith Mora]

Which war effort is this? Iraq? Afghanistan or something else? Because none of those has anything to do with 9/11... You'd have to bomb Riyadh or Islamabad for it to make a little sense (like people/governments who backed Bin Laden and al-Qaida), so 9/11 sparking a war that is still going on today is a long stretch.

The war on terror? Afghanistan was #1 on the list due to the taliban harboring bin laden and al-qaeda allowing them to run terrorist training camps. The day before the 9/11 attacks, there was an agreement by the bush administration for a 3 year plan to gradually put pressure on their goverment to hand over bin laden, but apparently 9/11 changed that.

Define "not anywhere near" radius. 2 blocks? 5? 10? All downtown? All of Manhattan? All of NYC? And back your definition with something other than your personal anger level, please...

On second thought, how about nowhere...

YouTube - Michael Savage - Sick of Islam

YouTube - What Will Happen When Islam Takes Over Britain WAKE UP!

 

[GoodGuy]

This is an extremely slippery slope of religious debate and it comes down, at least for me, to EQUALITY AND FREEDOM. Unless you can prove in court that any leader of this center has helped plan or has committed "terrorist acts" then there is no argument.

If you do not allow this mosque then what about the mosque a few blocks away? What about all the mosque with 2 mile radius of ground zero? What about all the mosque in all of new york city? What about all the mosque in new york state? What about all the mosque in America?

Does anybody understand where i am going with this? If there isn't religious freedom everywhere, then there isn't religious freedom in America. If that is the basis of our country, i think it is sick that this debate is even taking place in America.

 

[hen]

i take it your not from n.y.c. i am. lost a cousin that day a few friends and quite a few aquaintances i had over the years. guys i went to grade school with, people whose only focus that day was working to make some dough for their family. My best friends firehouse lost 5 guys as they were first due at the North tower.

You have no idea what your talking about. 61 million people died in ww2. ww2 was not just about the jews. as for them, jews that died during ww2 are still not over it and it was 65 years ago.

People that lost loved ones on 9/11 will never get over it.

as for the mosque downtown. firstly its not a mosque. its supposed to be a community center with a small prayer room. if you ask me its a command center, and its assinine that they are considering it.

islam is not a religion of peace either. in the major countries where islam is dominant there is no religious tolerance.

people have to start calling a pig a pig.

you're

 

[Beer_Cayse]

you are both right and both wrong. there is no way anyone who lost loved ones will forget 9/11 ... however your intolerance to this concept of an Islamic community center **somewhere** (see my post below) is abhorrent to me as a Christian and US citizen.

It is that intolerant behavior that has gotten so many people of all backgrounds into wars of religion, politics and just plain greed. I do not like this persona.

 

[Aran]

As an atheist, the simple idea of anyone of any religion being anywhere in this country is sickening.

 

[longshanks]

you are both right and both wrong. there is no way anyone who lost loved ones will forget 9/11 ... however your intolerance to this concept of an Islamic community center **somewhere** (see my post below) is abhorrent to me as a Christian and US citizen.

It is that intolerant behavior that has gotten so many people of all backgrounds into wars of religion, politics and just plain greed. I do not like this persona.

Qur'an (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"

No reasonable person would interpret this to mean a spiritual struggle.

Im sorry sir, but I find no tolerance to a cult that preaches the above.

I say it again. It is not a religion and it has nothing to do with peace.

 

[Taylor]

People are complicated. Religious beliefs are complicated. Although I share your sentiment about the 9/11 attacks, longshanks, I don’t think any sweeping generalizations about a group of 1 billion people can possibly be accurate or charitable. Are all Christians the same? All Americans? I think that your representation of Islam is an oversimplification.

That's my perspective, anyway.

 

[Aran]

"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword."

Matthew 10:34

 

[Aran]

"You must destroy all the nations the LORD your God hands over to you. Show them no mercy and do not worship their gods. If you do, they will trap you. Perhaps you will think to yourselves, 'How can we ever conquer these nations that are so much more powerful than we are?' But don't be afraid of them! Just remember what the LORD your God did to Pharaoh and to all the land of Egypt."

Deuterotomy 7:16-18

 

[longshanks]

Religion, whatever denomination, causes a lot of trouble when said believers of said religion try to impose there beliefs on others or force their beliefs on others.

I'm a full believer that religion is one of the main cores of much of the strife in this world and has been since the beginning of time. Greed and gaining power/control are the others. Often these mesh well together and work hand in hand.

 

[Aran]

"When the LORD your God hands these nations over to you and you conquer them, you must completely destroy them. Make no treaties with them and show them no mercy. Do not intermarry with them, and don't let your daughters and sons marry their sons and daughters. They will lead your young people away from me to worship other gods. Then the anger of the LORD will burn against you, and he will destroy you."

Deuterotomy 7:2-4

 

[Aran]

Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. (Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT)