post on pvp

[Alex the Gray]

I dont understand the offense some peopele take at their opponents running away. You dont fight like a game of Irish stand down, where you trade punches until someone drops. You fight to win. If that include a strategic withdrawl, so be it, I would say.
In my opinion, if my opponent is stronger than me, Ill try to out speed him. If hes' faster than me, Ill try to overpower him. If he's both, Ill try to out trick him. If he is just all out better, Ill try to result to age-old treachery. You fight to win.
That's my thoughts on strategy. Now for my requesting YOYR thoughts on strategy.
I want to start playing some limited PvP. I joined factions, and this is just going to happen. Now, I have always played a dungeon rogue type template, and saw that those skills could be put to use for faction trap removal (as soon as I get a kit lol). But the accessory skills I built up to help me loot dungeons could also me used for an assasin type template. I have legendary fencing and ninitsu, and gm hide and stealth. I can stone my picking skills, and wear my alchemy and poisoning.
Here's the big glitch- I have dial up and point and click- UOa only slowed me down even further. They only offer satellite high speed internet where I live, and I cant afford that right now, so Im stuck with what I have.
Any assasins or pvpers out there with advice on strategy, tactics, combos, i would appreciate the advice. But it will be on dial up /point and click, so never mind about strings of macros.
Also, who are the people that enjoy PvP so much that if I see them, I can target them? I know that sounds kind of dumb, but I have no hard feelings about anyone here. Enemy faction is one thing- the membership makes it an open invitation. Im just talking here about general players. I read once that you learn to fight by fighting, so I guess I'd better put the picks down and pick up a pike or kryss if Im going to learn. I passed a guy today wrestling a mongbat- his hit points were low, but obviously there wasnt anything I could learn from backstabbing him, so I said howdy and went my way. I'd like to try my hand at some skilled pvpers that I could learn something from, and wouldnt be offended by the attack.
Oh, and by the way- dont worry about it if I run away lol. If I just wanted to donate items, I'd look for the local Salvation Army lol. If I'm dying, which is what Im going to do for quite a while until I learn if there is any way I can do this given my limitations, Im gonna runaway!! Those who fight and run away live to fight another day.
Hope to hear some advice, and maybe see some of you on the road somewhere.

 

[WhiskeyPriest]

I never mind dying. Just ask the groups of VMP or OTF. And most of the time w/ me, you'll get a 1v1 fight. Unless there are just a ton of people there, then there's never 1v1, because someone always has to jump in on one side or the other. So anytime you see me around feel free to attack at will. I give res's when the fight is over (most of the time I'm asking for one; lol).

Only advice I would give you about the template you picked is to add tactics w/ your fencing. Since you have GM hiding and stealth, and 120 ninjitsu, I would also advise you to keep a few smoke bombs w/ you. These will be worth their weight in gold for you since you're on a slow connection and will provide you w/ a great escape. Also, I didn't see a means for healing. So I'd also advise carrying pot's in your pack for curing, healing, and maybe a few total refreshes.

A few of the enchanted apples would also be a must for you. If you get strangled by a necro and try to hide or stealth, you'll be revealed w/ each piece of damage the spell does.

I'm not the greatest pvp'er (no smartass comments please), but I hope that this info helps you out. If you ever need anything, look me up. I'll try to help out.

 

[Guest]

Well, I personally don't like to fight, and running is my defense of choice. Aside from that, based on observation, it seems that "strategic retreat" is not part of the vocabulary of many 1337 PvPers until it applies to them.

I think what probably bugs more people who enjoy fighting is when people are quick to get the drop on them with a huge initial attack when they have the opportunity (basically like throwing a hand grenade at someone), and if that tactic for fast victory fails, they run like they are competing in an Olympic sprint. I can quite imagine it is no fun never getting a return swipe at someone who "fights" in this way as a practice. It is less fighting and more attempted killing I suppose.

Withdrawal, a/k/a running otherwise seems quite sensible to me, especially if one expects to lose all one's stuff if they fall to their opponent. Toe to toe power bashing is really only practical for sparring or good natured warring with people you know will treat you decently when you lose...or people that actually like to fight, which implies trading blows, and you sort of need to be on the same screen for that.

-Skylark

 

[Shadow Tamer-SP]

Just kill them, there is no great I got you feelings. Just strike from the shadows and kill them with poison and DS. If that doesn't work smoke bomb out of there.

 

[Mandolin]

<blockquote><hr>

Just kill them, there is no great I got you feelings. Just strike from the shadows and kill them with poison and DS. If that doesn't work smoke bomb out of there.

[/ QUOTE ]

What he said..

On a stealth/ninja/nox template you're going to be limited in a field fight.. basically you're going to cross your fingers, sneak up to somebody who is standing still long enough for you to get a LP in and perhaps a DS in as well if you're not already dead by then.

Assassin templates are great for surprise attacks on a single person who is unsuspecting. In a field fight you're going to find yourself dead and frustrated often. Not saying you won't kill anyone.. you're just going to die a lot more than they are.

 

[Guest]

That is basically what I was trying to point out...there is a difference in "fighting" and "killing/assassination". People are likely to be frustrated when they are practicing one, and encounter the other. It is simply 2 different approaches to PvP. Both are viable within the game mechanics.

-Skylark

 

[Lorddog]

on a side note you talked about satellite connection. If I am not mistaken it should be only 1-way at sat speed and the upload is modem and you have a higher latency so you might be worse off using sat. Anyone have it or used it to let us know?

Lorddog

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

Well, I personally don't like to fight, and running is my defense of choice. Aside from that, based on observation, it seems that "strategic retreat" is not part of the vocabulary of many 1337 PvPers until it applies to them.

[/ QUOTE ]

/agree

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

on a side note you talked about satellite connection. If I am not mistaken it should be only 1-way at sat speed and the upload is modem and you have a higher latency so you might be worse off using sat. Anyone have it or used it to let us know?

Lorddog

[/ QUOTE ]

Several years ago I lived in an area where cable and DSL were not an option. My dial up internet, on good days, would be 28.8 - I played Siege like that for years. PvP was not an option. lol

I tried satelite internet. It was WORSE that my 28.8 connection for gaming. It was nice for surfing the web, but for gaming, forget it.
I uninstalled it and went back to dial up.

Finally moved to an area where cable was available.

 

[Phish Phan]

Taming and archery.

That's about the only way you're going to kill anyone that isn't afk, ********, or also on dial-up.

 

[Masumatek]

Because it is cowardly. This whole playing to win philosophy is nothing but a bunch of BS created by players who want to make up excuses for their dishonor and wishes to play an easier game. It's nothing but a cover. A good fight should be more important than winning at all costs. It's a game. You're not bloody fighting for your life irl, so you don't need to win at all costs. You should play to fight good battles.

 

[Revvo]

<blockquote><hr>

********

[/ QUOTE ]

Well at least he will make the top 20% on the server then

 

[Guest]

lol

 

[Guest]

Hum...

Running is a valid tactic.

If your enemy outnumbers you and has the strength to defeat you easily, and they can't catch you, it is they who have lost the battle to your evasive tactics - this is why they are angry afterwards. They failed to capitalize on a "certain" victory.

If you are outnumbered, opportunity or escape is what you should seek. If you succeed in evading the enemy, you can enjoy the knowledge that they are somewhere behind you, cursing you and your parentage, and you are still breathing, maybe stopping to browse a shop. This is a victory. Not a glorious one, but it is a victory.

The other option is to go down in a blaze of glory. This can be enjoyable, if facing honorable enemies who will notice and appreciate it, and treat you with honor afterwards. If you are dealing with swine, I would just leave the area so they can get no enjoyment from ill-speaking your ghost. What I call a suicidal victory, meeting defeat on your terms.

In running from your enemy, you promote the illusion that he is stronger than you. The dog chases a cat down an alley only to find a tiger waiting for him. Or ten cats.

On Sun Tzu's advice:

Do not follow a feigned retreat.

 

[Sir Morder]

Feel free to take a shot or two or six at me

I will fight honorably or horribly depending on how many martini's i've had

Dont forget to bless your best item or wep before you go out fightin . Cya soon

 

[Rykus]

Well said Py. Couldn't agree more.

I personally enjoy the feigned retreat approach. Many times I will drop a corpse skin/strangle then run off a little bit. If the opponent isn't particularly experienced, they typically pursue unaware that this is exactly what I want. Once the strangle is about mid way through I will begin causing as much damage as possible, especially to their stamina. A few seconds later they either drop or I resort to plan B, whatever that is..

I am no supreme PvP'r, but if you would like to spar an honorable opponent, feel free to look me up. I would be happy to teach you what I know.. FWIW, I am working fencing right now and only at 103, so that should help level the field a bit in your direction.

 

[Alex the Gray]

Thanks very much- evry piece of advice helps.
For healing I was thinking 1)., potions, 2). cu sidhe form if time allows, and 3). using parasitic poison..Now this might be far-fetched, but remember- I'm new to this game. Just sounded like a plan.

 

[Alex the Gray]

People can bash Siege all they want- but where else could you play where other players will give you advice on how to possibly kill THEM.
Siege is great. People can also knock UO all they want, but I would challenge anyone to find another game (or shard for that matter) where the community and people are as nice.
They will slit your throat and loot your corpse in just the NICEST manner lol.
Thanks to everyone for every drop of advice. It is most appreciated.

 

[Sir Morder]

Honestly, unless your a mage castin heal or grtr heal, then nothin beats good ol' fashioned bandies. But of course high anat and healing are essential. Suppose you could always try the enhanced bandies.

 

[Alex the Gray]

What are anyones' thought on poison followed with bleed? Or poison followed with mortal strike? I have never used these combos, so was wondering if they might actually work.

 

[Alex the Gray]

BTW- if I actually do kill somebody- I cant rez, but please come back and get your stuff; my loot will be the experience learned. And if you drop me, please feel free to loot at will: I know I carry way to much stuff. Its become a hibit from not ever getting killed. I need to learn what is actuallu necessary to carry, and what isnt. It is my dues for lesson learned.

 

[imported_Magnolia]

<blockquote><hr>

What are anyones' thought on poison followed with bleed? Or poison followed with mortal strike? I have never used these combos, so was wondering if they might actually work.

[/ QUOTE ]

lp/bleed/ds with lightning is so much fun when it works... But I also enjoy chasing after those wonderful pvpers that are on the run except when they seem to jump ahead of me on the turns. How DO they do that?

 

[Alex the Gray]

better connection lol

 

[Feyre]

I personally know that my template can kill most people 1v1 in the field, but im no dueler and i dont care to have a mage complex. If i find an opponent and everyone else is on my vent also looking for an opponent, i will tell them where to find them, hell sometimes i will toy with them(i &lt;3 spinning in front of large groups of people) just so the others have time to gear or unflag so they can come play too. In the end if i can have someone like puffy show up and get a hit in and he gets to cut up all thier armor which he loves to do, its much more of a win for me.

 

[Alex the Gray]

I myself am a big fan of sun tzu, and some of the other asian tactians. Guerilla warfare works- witness from the time of the apache conflict (there are still lessons learned from that, that are taught at Westpoint to this day, but guess who doesn't get credit?) to Viet Nam to Iraq.
But, I think, it is still about the victory. When I was younger I participated in kyushiki-ryu kempo-jutsu. Not a style, way, or type of self-improvement. It translates "old-style hard-fist combat art", and was designed to take out the enemy, period. That is true "war". Musashi never wanted to just win- he wanted to KNOW that he won because he was better. He never engaged in sportsmanship, and often used psychology and deceptive trickery to win, including feigned retreat.
But if you are all into the blood and guts mentality of no retreat no surrender, dont forget that it was also Patton who said, "dont die for your country. Make the other poor sob die for his.
Yeah, its a game, but who wants to play someone, that isnt trying their best to win themselves? If that includes retreat, to try again later, sounds valid to me.

 

[Sir Morder]

So, when are you gonna be in the field? Enough talk, time to walk

 

[imported_Magnolia]

<blockquote><hr>

Agreed 100% running shouldn;t always been seen as a cowardly thing. In fact escaping from multiple enemies *especially if you manage to hurt them a little too maybe even kill a few could be seen as a victory not a defeat*



[/ QUOTE ]

Usually you do try to stay tight with your group. No. 1 rule in field fightings but of coarse that is not always possible as when a couple go down and you try to draw some of the attention away from corpses while someone else is attempting to rez the dead. This is when running and charging becomes strategy and you are indeed one on multi enemy. Being a tank is exciting. hahaha

And it is so funny when a bunch, I don't like the word gank, will stand over your dead body after you have had a round and round with them, not running but charging again and again, funny how they gloat. Well some will, the really stupid ones. You can tell which ones are not because they will usually thank you for the fun and give you a rez. Or at least behave more mature and say nothing for something that was nothing to brag about.

 

[Alex the Gray]

was out all last evening. Will be out tonight looking for someone to lay my bones to rest lol.

 

[Masumatek]

<blockquote><hr>

I consider it more of fighting on the move. There's no point standing toe-to-toe with someone doing massive damage to you. That's the difference between field fighting and dueling. You know that I'm one of the few people on siege in recent years that will fight and not worry about the consequences. I've never understood why people would call for help to keep from dieing and losing their throwaway gear. That all said...everytime I attempted to fight you before I left...it ended with me getting ganked. I was pretty disappointed, because there was a time when I could always count on you for a fair 1v1 fight.

[/ QUOTE ]

I see the difference between field fighting and dueling as a set of rules to eliminate basic "imbalanced" elements. Field fights are all things go sure. And yes duels prevent you from running. But I don't think you should run 1 on 1 even in a field fight. The way you fight ghost, people don't want to even stay. Is that your way of winning? To make them want to leave the field? You are on screen 1/20th of the time. What you do is beyond hit and run. Though I'll grant you it keeps with your name. It's like fighting a ghost. Or a stealther. You never see them. They just pop up for a bam every now and then and then go back into the shadows. Very cowardly way of fighting.

Btw, the second half of your post is utter bs. I rarely ever ganked you. The last times we fought my guildmate was watching, not ganking. We had a good laugh over the excuses you made for losing the fights, which were basically excuses of things that prevented you from running. Tough luck eh? "I got stuck on my wolf."