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[Stealing] New Stealing FAQ

Oriana

Babbling Loonie
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Thanks to Petra for copying and expanding this over from the old FAQ that was done by Neon Ninja.

1. Getting Started
Ideally you would start your character with 50 stealing as a starting skill, but if you are re-working an existing character, or prefer to put your starting points into other skills, this is the alternative way.
Unless you are playing on Siege Perilous or Mugen you can buy your first 30 (approx) skill points from an NPC Beggar, Brigand, Gambler, Gypsy, Thief or Thief Guildmaster.

2. Training
The correct weight to steal in order to gain in skill is usually considered to be 10% of your skill level, so at 30 skill steal objects weighing 3 stones, 40 skill, 4 stones etc. You can use stacks of objects, such as gold (50gp = 1 stone) or you can steal specific objects of the correct weight. Here is a list of examples:
shirt, 2 stones.
robe, 3 stones,
skirt, 4 stones,
cloak, 5 stones,
bronze shield, 6 stones,
metal kite shield 7 stones,
heater shield, 8 stones,
war fork, 9 stones,
lap harp 10 stones.
Training is usually done from a pack horse. You must be in Felucca and you must 'target' steal, not 'random' steal.
Tell your pack horse "all guard me" or "[name] guard me" and check for the message "[pet's name] is now guarding you". If you are in a guild your pet's health bar/name will turn green.


3 Error Messages
The two most common error messages seen by training thieves are:
"the creature blocks your attempt" - You will see this message if you try to steal in Trammel, or other facet with a trammel ruleset. The solution is, move to Felucca.
"You caught yourself red handed" - You will see this message if the object you are trying to steal is already in your pack. Check that you re-target onto a new object after each successful stealing attempt.
4. Why would I join the NPC Thief Guild?
There is no requirement to join this guild to steal static objects, such as from town containers or stealable artifacts, or to steal from npcs or monsters, however you must join in order to be able to steal from other players.


5. How do I join the NPC Thief Guild
There are some requirements to be met before you can do this:
• Your character must have a total of 48 hours in-game time.
• Your stealing skill must be 60 minimum.
• The Thief Guildmaster requires a fee of 500 gold
To join you must find the NPC Thief Guildmaster. Each town has a Thief Guild Master, or Mistress, but they can be hard to find. Cove, having the smallest guard zone area, is the most preferred town to seek him out. Having found the Guild Master/Mistress, address him by name: ‘(name) join’. If you meet the time and skill requirements he will ask for 500 gold. Simply drop the gold on top of him. If you wish, you can then ask, ‘name buy disguise kit’ this will cost a further 700 gold, which you again drop on to the npc. There is no 'buy' context menu on the Guild Master npc's, using this phrase is the only way to purchase this item.


6. What are the drawbacks of joining the Thief Guild?
Thieves cannot report a murder, ie can not give a count. This means anyone can kill you with no fear of penalty.
Thieves are freely lootable on ANY facet.


7. How do I leave the Thief Guild?
Find a Thief Guildmaster, when you have address him/her by name again with the phrase, "(name) resign guild"


8 How does the disguise kit work?
Disguise kits can only be used by members of the Thieves Guild. Double clicking the kit brings up a hair style menu, select a style and apply it. Your hair will lose its colour, becoming white and your name will change to a generic npc name. You can check out your new name by opening your paper doll and can continue to use the kit repeatedly until the name is one you find acceptable. A hairdye bought from an npc provisioner will restore your hair to a more natural color. Your disguise will stay in place for 2 hours (real time, in game). It can NOT be removed, While disguised, you cannot cast incognito or any shape changing spell such as polymorph, wraith form, animal form etc.
WARNING!
If you log off while under the effects of the disguise kit the disguise name will appear in your character list. A new folder will be made for that name and generic macros only will be available.
To access your normal macros you will need to follow these steps:
Log in to the character, selecting the 'disguise' name.
Log back out.
Go to your desktop folders (My documents/EA Games/Ultima Online Legacy)
find the character's normal folder, copy the contents then paste them into the new, disguise name, folder.
If you use uoassist you will also need to copy the character's uoa settings in the same way.
You can then log back into your character with full access to your macros.
 

Oriana

Babbling Loonie
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Because stealthy movement requires a knowledge of hiding and moving
within shadows, you must be skilled in the art of hiding before you
find success at stealthy movement. To begin learning Stealth, you must
have a Hiding skill of 30 or greater.

To gain in Hiding:


To use the Hiding skill to become invisible to others: make yourself a macro for using the skill hiding.
Hiding is a fairly easy skill to gain at first. It can be bought up to around 30 through various NPCs: Gypsy, Ranger, Ranger Guildmaster, Thief, Thief Guildmaster. Or you can just stand there and hold your macro to gain up those first 30 or so points.If successful, you become invisible to other players and monsters. Hidden doesn't mean undetectable! You may be revealed by others using the Detecting Hidden skill, or by casting the Reveal spell, and you may be tracked using the Tracking
skill. You may also reveal yourself through your actions, such as
moving, speaking, casting spells, looting bodies or attacking monsters
or others. You may loot your own body and remain hidden.
Hidden doesn't necessarily mean safe. In addition to being
revealed by others, while hidden you may also take damage from
area-effect spells or purple potions.

Hint: Hiding requires your full concentration, so it may be
impossible to hide while being attacked. It can be more effective to
run away from your target, exit War mode, and then attempt to hide.



Thieves have a chance to snoop and remain hidden. This is based on a
check against their Hiding skill. At zero Hiding skill, a player is
revealed when failing Snooping 100% of the time. At 100 Hiding, a
player is revealed 50% of the time when failing Snooping.
The best way to gain hiding is to use it constantly. Since it's required for stealth, you can gain both skills at once by just walking around in a safe place. Making a macro for hiding and holding it down while you walk. Remember to make sure the Always Run option is off, since running will only reveal you.

To gain in Stealth:
To use the Stealth skill to move silently throughout the lands:

  • Hide using your macro for hiding.
  • Once you have hidden successfully, begin to walk, not run.
If successful, you can walk a small distance while remaining
hidden. Your character appears gray to you as long as you remain
hidden. Running, or any act that would normally reveal you from Hiding,
also reveals you while using the Stealth skill.
The number of steps your character can take while using the Stealth
skill is equal to your Stealth score divided by 5. So, if your Stealth
skill is at 80, you will be able to take 16 steps before becoming
unhidden.


And just what does the fashionable stealther wear while gaining in their skill?


0-30 Buy from Thief Guildmaster
30-65 Stealth with only newbie clothes and a robe on
65-95 GM Full Studded Leather Suit
95-GM GM Full Studded Leather Suit and GM Close Helm

Hint: Mastering Stealth requires agility and flexibility. The
heavier and more cumbersome your armor, the more difficult you will
find it to move in stealth. Sneaking about in a full suit of plate mail
is never going to be easy ...
 

Basara

UO Forum Moderator
Moderator
Professional
Stratics Veteran
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Wiki Moderator
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Oriana, I believe you CAN run and stealth at high levels - but if you run, even 1 step, your amount of steps before the next Stealth check is cut in half. AND, there is a chance that attempting to run in the first place will reveal you.
 

Oriana

Babbling Loonie
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Opps, I forgot the disclaimer :) I'm going on what I can find. Which honestly is a bit of a pain to find. But please feel free to correct or add anything to that information. That's what a good FAQ should be. Everybody shares. :)

Thanks Basra!!
 
Y

YuriGaDaisukiDa

Guest
what skills do you need before you will auto stealth when walking while hidden? stratics sais 25, but it is wrong
 

Oriana

Babbling Loonie
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Rico was kind enough to send me this link on Seige ROT training, specifically for thieves. If you ever think of visiting Seige this is good to know information.

Thanks Rico.
 
C

cheerful

Guest
*wonders why it still says that you have to be in Fel when myself and others have said that it is not the case*
See Shadow's thread re;stealing.
 

Basara

UO Forum Moderator
Moderator
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A list of alternative items by location might be nice, for those who refuse to do packy training.

For example, one can find items weighing 2, 3, 5, 7, 10 and 12 stones, in containers (crates & chests will typically be locked and trapped) at Blacksmith shops (especially the ones in Serpents hold).
 
A

AngelOz

Guest
This list might be helpful for you, was for me. (It could already be in the FAQ, it used to be in the old one... but I couldn't find it here in the new Stratics... SO... I reposted. :) SOrry if it's already here.

(Author was Neon Ninja)

I hope you find it useful
Ozzie (PAG)
__________________________________________

Armor and Shields

Bascinet 127 - 5 stones
Bone Arm Plates - 2 stones
Bone Gauntlets - 2 stones
Bone Helm - 3 stones
Bone Leg Plates - 3 stones
Bronze Shield - 6 stones
Buckler - 5 stones
Chainmail Coif - 7 stones
Chainmail Leggings - 7 stones
Chainmail Tunic - 2 7 stones
Chaos Shield - 5 stones
Close Helm / Close Helmet - 5 stones
Heater Shield - 8 stones
Helmet - 5 stones
Kite (Metal) - 5 stones
Kite (Wooden) - 7 stones
Leather Armor (Female) - 1 stones
Leather Bustier (Female) - 1 stones
Leather Gloves - 1 stones
Leather Gorget - 2 stones
Leather Leggings - 4 stones
Leather Shorts (Female) - 3 stones
Leather Skirt (Female) - 1 stones
Leather Sleeves - 2 stones
Leather Tunic - 7 stones
Metal Shield - 6 stones
Norse Helm - ? stones
Nose Helm - 5 stones
Open Helm - stones
Orc Helm - 5 stones
Order Shield - 6 stones
Plate Armor (Female) - 4 stones
Plate Helm - 5 stones
Platemail (Breastplate) - 10 stones
Platemail Arms - 5 stones
Platemail Gloves - 2 stones
Platemail Gorget - 2 stones
Platemail Legs - 7 stones
Ringmail Gloves - 2 stones
Ringmail Leggings - 15 stones
Ringmail Sleeves - 15 stones
Ringmail Tunic - 15 stones
Studded Armor (Female) - 6 stones
Studded Bustier (Female) - 1 stones
Studded Gloves - 1 stones
Studded Gorget - 1 stones
Studded Leggings - 3 3 stones
Studded Sleeves - 4 stones
Studded Tunic - 1 stones
Wooden Shield - 5 stones

Weapons
Arrow - 1 shaft, 1 or 1 feather 1/10 stones
Axe - 4 stones
Bardiche - 7 stones
Battle Axe - 6 4 stones
Black Staff - 6 stones
Bola -- -- 4 bola balls, 3 leather -- Unknown
Bolt -1 shaft 1 feather - 1/10 stones
Bow - 7 stones
Broad Sword - 6 stones
Butcher Knife - 1 stones
Cleaver - 1 stones
Club - 9 stones
Crook, Shepherd's - 2 stones
Crossbow - 7 stones
Cutlass - 8 stones
Dagger - 1 stones
Double Axe - 8 stones
Executioner's Axe - 8 stones
Gargoyle's Pickaxe - stones (unknown)
Gnarled Staff - 3 stones
Halberd - 16 stones
Hammer Pick -9 stones
Hatchet - 4 stones
Heavy Crossbow - 9 stones
Katana - 6 stones
Kryss - 1 stones
Large Battle Axe - 6 stones
Longsword - 7 stones
Long Sword (Thin) - 1 stones
Mace - 14 stones
Maul - 14 stones
Pickaxe - 11 stones
Pitchfork - 10 stones
practice weapon (rare) - 1 stones
Quarterstaff - 4 stones
Scimitar - 5 stones
Short Spear - 4 stones
Skinning Knife - 1 stones
Sledge Hammer - 9 stones
Smith's Hammer - 8 stones
Spear - 7 stones
Two-handed Axe - 8 stones
Viking Sword - 6 stones
War Axe - 8 stones
War Fork -9 stones
War Hammer -10 stones
War Mace - 17 stones


Items and Other Misc Things

a backpack - 3 stones
a bag - 2 stones
Barrel - 25 stones (Closed or open)
Bear Mask - 5 stones
Basket (Empty Fruit basket) - 1 stone
Black Dye Tub - 10 stones (Reward Tubs can't be stolen)Pre-Patch tubs can (Rare though!)
Bracelet - 1 stone
Bottle of Pink Champagne - 1 stone
Bucket - 5 stones
Bulk Order Deeds - 1 stone
a champagne glass - 1 Stone
checks (Gold Checks) - 1 stone
Copper Wire - 5 stones
coupon for a free hair restyling - 1 stone
crates (small, medium, or large) - 1 stone
Crystal Ball - 10 stones (The Future Telling Balls are blessed)
deed for a holiday tree - 1 stone
Deer Mask - 4 stones
Dried Herbs/Onions/Flowers - 1 stone
Dye Tub - 10 Stones
Earrings - 1 stone
Empty Tub - 1 stone
Ethreal Statue (Horse, Llama, Ostard) - 1 stone
Fireworks Wand - 1 stone
Forged Metal - 5 stones
Full Jars - 2 stones
Fruit Basket - 5 stones
Fur - 10 stones
Horseshoes - 5 stones
Holiday Bells - 1 stone
holiday timepiece - 1 stone
House deeds - 1 stone (Can be stolen if it's a deed from a redeeded house)
Iron Wire - 5 stones
Jaana's Hangover remedy - 1 stone
Gold piece - 1/50 stone.
Gold Wire - 5 stones
Light - 1 stone
Pile of snow - 1 stone
Pillow - 1 stone
a pouch - 1 stone
Power Scrolls - 1 stone
Rings - 1 stone
Rock - 1 stone
Rocks - 1 stone
Rope - 20 stones
Scattered Hay - 1 stone
Ship Key - 1 stone
Silver Wire - 5 stones
Snow Globe - 10
Tribal Paint - 1 stone
Whispering Rose - 1 stone
 
S

Shinobi

Guest
The following will tell you how to go about joining the Thief NPC Guild, and will give you info on using disguise kits:

Find the Thief Guildmaster or Guildmistress. It is a YELLOW NPC, ignoring blue NPCs should make things easier for you. Set a macro for All Names, and go into different towns repeatedly hitting the macro.

The hot spots to check are Fel Skara Brae, usually near the tailor shop, Fel Moonglow, usually near the healers' guild, Fel Cove pretty much anywhere since it's so small, and New Haven near the entrance or above the bank. Either Fel or Tram towns are fine, but I tend to check Fel more often.

When you find him/her, get within "touching" distance, and say their name, followed by "join". So if he's named John, it'd be "John join".

In order to join, you must have at least 60 REAL Stealing, and must be at least 48 in-game hours old on THAT char (they might have changed it to being 48 in-game hours AND have had that char for a week, not sure, haven't tested it). If you aren't 60 Stealing, he'll say you must at least be a Journeyman Pickpocket to join (at least I think he says Journeyman), and if you aren't old enough, he'll say you're too young, and to return in a week. Ignore this, because you could be one hour away from being allowed to join, and he'll still tell you to return in a week. This is just his macro, and should be changed because it can be confusing.

A good thing to do when trying to get to 48 in-game hours on your thief, is to just leave him online as much as possible. The best place to do this would be a well-populated bank, such as Luna or New Haven, where there is constant traffic. This traffic should keep you from being disconnected.

When he accepts you, he'll ask for 500 gold. You'll need to drop it on him within about 10 seconds, before the offer expires. Then, when in the guild, say "disguise" near him. Disguises cost 700 gold, and can be used multiple times.

After using a disguise, it'll change your name to some random NPC name. You can keep using it to "scroll through" the names, until you find one you want. There are a ton of names, so finding a certain one each time would be annoying.

It will also allow you to pick your new hair/facial hair. Your new hair will be white, which is a dead giveaway to anyone paying close attention, so use a normal hair dye after going into disguise. You can buy normal hair dye extremely cheap (I think like 30 gold) at an alchemist NPC vendor, like the one past the maze in moonglow.

The disguise lasts 2 in-game hours, and is extremely annoying when waiting for it to go away. If you log off and back on while disguised, your char name on your char list will be the disguised name. This is normal and will fix when it wears off. Odds are, when you use the disguise, your in-game macros will mess up. This is a stupid bug, just set them again.

After your disguise FINALLY wears off, your name changes back, and so does your appearance/macros. And yes, your dyed hair will go back to its original color. I only suggest using disguises when absolutely necessary, because they're pretty annoying, haha.

If you have any questions, or extra info, feel free to reply.

P.S. Please read the replies for additional info.
 

Touzoko

Certifiable
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
On Siege, you do not need 60 stealing.

When in disguise, you can not use ninja animal forms.

There has been discussion on attempting to enable us to remove the disguise- ie, perhaps with an oil cloth, or dbl clicking kit a second time, etc. This should be looked into.
 
R

RichDC

Guest
An additional thing to note is that if you do double click the disguise kit again and do no choose to change anything it still resets the timer back to 2in game hours.

Also on siege it appears that the majority of Thieves guildmasters are bugged or extremely hard to find, the one in cove, short walk north-west from minoc/vesper gate is your best bet.

On prodo they seem to be fairly easy to find, easiest in my experience is Havens.
 
N

Norenche

Guest
Seems that thief guildmasters are traveling around, I've found so far the thief gm on new haven, minoc and skara brae and when I saw them they weren't on any other city.
 

Harlequin

Babbling Loonie
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Full chainmail won't be enough, as a rule of thumb, I add a piece of unmeddable armour at every 10.0 skill point interval starting from 60.0.

IE at 60, I wear 1 piece of non-meddable armour. Once I get to 70, I wear a second piece. Then add a 3rd piece at 80 and so on.
 
D

DVDA

Guest
K...so....what do you wear at 100?

Can someone add a chart from 100 to 120, the last info posted here is 95-100
 
C

cheerful

Guest
Yuri - I think what it is saying is that at 25 you can 'attempt' to auto stealth, so at 75 with medable armour you will always be successful.


DVDA- I've not seen a chart for this and depending who you talk to you will get a different answer for this, basically add plate pieces until you get a 50/50 fail rate.


30 hiding before you can stealth? I thought it was 50.

Theres no need to stop and hide to then go into stealth mode, walking normally and then hitting the hide macro will automatically put you into stealth mode, assuming you pass the check.

You can also hide in full view of a monster providing there is a 7 tile gap in the distance between the two of you.
 

Omnius

Crazed Zealot
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
shin is one of the 5% of thieves currently still playing that know the white hair is a dead give away. the rest of us, old school thieves that just pvp nowadays, just use that knowledge to waste thieves.

The sad thing is, these days, every thief is a stealther.

Folks need to ressurect the Thug thief, the pure mage thief and the pimp thief(GOR members only)
 
M

Maximilliean

Guest
30 hiding before you can stealth? I thought it was 50.
I thought it was 50 too, but then again I haven't had a character below GM hiding in ages.

Theres no need to stop and hide to then go into stealth mode, walking normally and then hitting the hide macro will automatically put you into stealth mode, assuming you pass the check.
I thought it did it automatically. When I'm on my stealther I just hit hide and start walking. If he fails a check and becomes unhidden I hit my hide button and start walking again.

You can also hide in full view of a monster providing there is a 7 tile gap in the distance between the two of you.
I thought this only worked at high levels of hiding, like GM.
 
C

cheerful

Guest
Not sure what you are trying to say about auto stealth, we seem to be agreeing on it :)

You are most probably right about GM hide, I only told half the story *slaps wrist*
 
M

Maximilliean

Guest
Oh yeah, that college education has really paid off. *headdesk*

Sorry Cheerful, I totally misread the stealth part. Your are 100% correct I was agreeing with you. haha
 
N

NewYears1978

Guest
I hit 87 and just hit a huge wall..I can't gain anything.

I've tried Tubs, War Fork (9 stones) and other things..I even moved from my house to guard zone...nothing..

Any ideas?
 

Basara

UO Forum Moderator
Moderator
Professional
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Wiki Moderator
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Campaign Supporter
1. Make sure you aren't at skill cap with nothing turned down.

2. Try stealing from NPC containers - (medium ore, coils of wire, horseshoes, smith hammers in Buc's den Balacksmith shops, for example). Will need to be able to unlock the crates and chests, but the barrel is fair gain, if someone else hasn't stole it empty, then filled it with water to take it off that day. Large ore can be combined with smaller ore outside the crate, to get it to reset.
 
N

NewYears1978

Guest
Im on GL, I went to BS in Bucs..and all there is is 2 empty barrells..theres no chests or crates here..

Any other locations that might work? I don't have lockpicking.
 
F

Fingers of Cats

Guest
I am making a PvP thief but was checking the FAQ here and noticed that when training, I didn't gain when stealing trying to steal 250 gold (5 stones) or 350 gold (7 stones) at 55 skill but gained when stealing 550 gold (11 stones) what is up with that? I always thought that 100g was 1 stone and always gained by stealing the equivalent of one decimal move worth of gold... 500 skil - 500 gold etc.
 
O

Old Man of UO

Guest
...
The correct weight to steal in order to gain in skill is usually considered to be 10% of your skill level, so at 30 skill steal objects weighing 3 stones, 40 skill, 4 stones etc. You can use stacks of objects, such as gold (50gp = 1 stone) or you can steal specific objects of the correct weight. ...
I've found that for my character, this part of the guide was wrong. I need to steal things that weighed (10% of my skill +5 stones) for best gains, and NO gold piles. Stealing from gold most of the time I just stole part of the pile and got no gains.

Try using single heavier items than recommended in the guide, and adjust weight up and down until you gain.
 

Miriandel

Seasoned Veteran
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
The keywords to join the thief guild seem to be JOIN GUILD instead of JOIN like in the past.

At least, the guildmaster I just talked to never answered when calling his name followed by join and required join guild.
 

Lefty

Lore Keeper
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
One thing that is missing. Steal in front of as many NPC's and Players as possible. It effects the difficulty, thus better gains.
 
O

Old Man of UO

Guest
One thing that is missing. Steal in front of as many NPC's and Players as possible. It effects the difficulty, thus better gains.
I've heard this before, but can anyone else confirm this? When I trained stealing about two years ago, I found absolutely no difference between training around NPCs' and training in my house or in a dungeon. Skill gains for me were just as fast outside of town.
 

Lefty

Lore Keeper
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
After posting that I took a look on the net for the very old publishes. I found a site a few months ago that had all the Publishes since Beta but I couldn't find it. I could of swore I bookmarked it.

Till I find the proof all I can go on is memory. I did get more burst gains around a crowd of NPC's. I roved around not staying in one spot.

From what I remember from the old days INT was a factor of getting noticed. Back then before UO:R the towns were crowded with a good number of mages training their skills in town.

I will try to track down some of the old publishes and if not we might have to solicit a Dev to get the actual formula and see. This way either it will be proven one way or the other, and I sure do not want to be responsible of spreading an old wives tale. :]
 

Lefty

Lore Keeper
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Here is a faster way to GM hiding (finish it up faster)

Requisites

50 + hiding
50 + stealth
50 + Ninjitsu

Mana regen suit

4/6 casting

shadow jump.

Every 2 seconds it will make a hiding check. It is good a 80 or so hiding. A lot faster than waiting 10 seconds to hide.
 
O

Old Man of UO

Guest
... This way either it will be proven one way or the other, and I sure do not want to be responsible of spreading an old wives tale. :]
Many, if not most of these "old wives tales" have a basis in fact. A lot of the original designs were noted but never actually implemented. The original design for the thieving skill included a difficulty check based on your dexterity, with higher dex giving a bonus. That never made it to a publish.
 

solembow

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Can you gain off of the same item twice while packie training?Otherwise I could get rather expensive.
 

Guardian KX

Lore Keeper
Stratics Veteran
There's 2 pieces of backwards leather in a tailor shop. Each weigh 11 stones and are in a stack of 2 totaling 22 stones. I have 120 stealing and I either fail or get guard wacked. I cannot seperate the leather nor cut it up (not in my pack).

I want the container to reset with new items but it refuses unless its been emptyed, its been a week with the same 2 pieces of leather in it. I know i've gotten these peices in the past but cannot remember how (or they changed the rules).

I sat here for 3 hours getting GW'd too many times to count.

Suggestions anyone?
 

Gildar

Babbling Loonie
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
*Edit*
If anybody thinks the 10% of skill weight thing is wrong... make sure you aren't wearing jewelry that has plus stealing on it that you are forgetting about ;)
 
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