Everyone's a Millionaire

[Megilhir]

On Pacific I have about 18 Million and have not actively played there in around 5 years.

On Atlantic I recently returned and began playing my characters again. Inside of two weeks I went from 100K to over 2.5 Million.

Similar story in some respects on Drachenfels, Arirang and Oceania.

Simply disgusting really.

My account is of the age that each house on each shard is grandfathered and thus I have a home of varying size on each shard I frequent.

My point is that I can understand how UO can be intimdating to a truly new player.

On player vendors (except mine usually) most items are listed starting around 25K and going up to the millions. How is a true noob supposed to earn that cash? I know a few techniques but seriously!

120 Magery, Tailor or Smith scrolls go for millions of gold. Even single weapons or armor go for that.

Some players have so much gold their banks are full and they are storing the cash on vendors.

Ridiculous really.

So, you are a UO development team member. How do you fix or adjust this?

One idea is a new shard with a fresh new start that does not allow tranfers into it.

Another is using a simple price fixing code on player vendors that only allow price caps 10 levels above retail of an item.

But these are just random thoughts. What are some of your ideas?

 

[Ally Oop]

There is a shard with no transfers to it. Its called Siege Perilous.

 

[Kaleb]

A noob will find ways, you work your way up. a newb has no real reason for a 120 magery or any other scroll for that matter. not to mention the 100's of helpful people in game who offer help to those with the [young] tag. But like you said before its not hard to make gold and sooner or later the new player would learn to just like everyone does in every game.

 

[BeefSupreme]

I started back up in sept. After being gone for 8 years.
I had a couple hundred thousand in the bank.
It was a little rough getting back into things,
but for example, i've made a couple hundred million
off my vendors in the last two weeks.

 

[Megilhir]

There is a shard with no transfers to it. Its called Siege Perilous.

Come see me there sometime. Name's Megilhir

Well your ghost can at least.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

Your not a millionare.
You have 1 million gold.
I give new plays a few million to start.

The games not intimidating. Its speculative intimidation that clutters this board.

New players can get up and going in days. Millions in a month. Fifty million in a year. All the time having fun.

Geez.

 

[Mephistos]

Just out of curiosity, as I see this term used a lot. When people refer to a new player, etc etc, are they referring to:

1. Someone who actually just bought the game, and have never played UO before.
2. A new player who has established him or herself on a shard, but are "new" to another shard.
3. A returning player.
4. Something other than the previous 3.

I seriously cannot see the amount of actual "new" players being all that large, perhaps 1-2/month, if that.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

I started back up in sept. After being gone for 8 years.
I had a couple hundred thousand in the bank.
It was a little rough getting back into things,
but for example, i've made a couple hundred million
off my vendors in the last two weeks.

Ding Ding Ding Winner winner chicken dinner.

Now wait for everyone to call you a scammer. Argh. Good job.

 

[Megilhir]

Just out of curiosity, as I see this term used a lot. When people refer to a new player, etc etc, are they referring to:

1. Someone who actually just bought the game, and have never played UO before.

Number 1 please.

As far as someone giving millions away. I call Butter Scotch! You absolutely KNOW you don't pass out millions. If you do let me know where to make a character and when I can pick up mine please.

Besides, talk about totally ruining the new player experience. "Here mate, take everything and don't apply and skill or knowledge to work and figure this entrancing game for yourself."

Sheesh!

 

[BeefSupreme]

Number 1 please.

As far as someone giving millions away. I call Butter Scotch! You absolutely KNOW you don't pass out millions. If you do let me know where to make a character and when I can pick up mine please.

Besides, talk about totally ruining the new player experience. "Here mate, take everything and don't apply and skill or knowledge to work and figure this entrancing game for yourself."

Sheesh!

You'll find good people passing out 2 million to newbies in haven all the time.

I just ran into a person who just started UO from scratch a few weeks ago. First I've seen in a long time. He was given 2 million by some other vet to help get him started.

 

[hawkeye_pike]

The only way to fix this would be a shard wipe, and a complete overhaul of the economic system. And that will never happen. So wei either have to live with it or play a different game.

Sad but true.

 

[hawkeye_pike]

You'll find good people passing out 2 million to newbies in haven all the time.

I just ran into a person who just started UO from scratch a few weeks ago. First I've seen in a long time. He was given 2 million by some other vet to help get him started.

Honestly, how likely is it that someone hands out 2 million to a newbie?

I returned to UO 2 years ago and had to start from scratch. I had given all my belongings away, I only had my characters. It took me one year to figure out how to make good money and what had changed. After one year I had accumulated 500k and was proud of it. Now guess how a newbie feels who has no clue of the game.

Then again, no true newbies come to UO anymore. The only newbies I see are returning players who lost their account data. And they already know the basic mechanics of this game.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

Number 1 please.

As far as someone giving millions away. I call Butter Scotch! You absolutely KNOW you don't pass out millions. If you do let me know where to make a character and when I can pick up mine please.

Besides, talk about totally ruining the new player experience. "Here mate, take everything and don't apply and skill or knowledge to work and figure this entrancing game for yourself."

Sheesh!

Dude 2 million is nothing.
Find Jessica Rose or Ravenwinter Hawk at Luna bank. Have a new tag on your name or just be polite and strike up a conversation..

And bingo 2 million richer. Atlantic.

And 2 million helps get the new experience going. A little home. Some deco money. Fun stuff to by. Skills. Regs. knick knack patty whacks.


GEEZ

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

The only way to fix this would be a shard wipe, and a complete overhaul of the economic system. And that will never happen. So wei either have to live with it or play a different game.

Sad but true.

Hawk argh.

Take all the gold and divide it out by 10. So we all have less.

Would that make you feel better.

Then everything falls in line.

Whipe out all gold. No one has anything. What does that do? Seriously.

So now I sell thinks for 5k instead of 1 million. And just work my way up.

GOLD SINKS BUDDY GOLD SINKS. Nothing to do with gold. Thats the problem.

Illusions Illusions Illusions.

 

[UOKaiser]

Number 1 please.

As far as someone giving millions away. I call Butter Scotch! You absolutely KNOW you don't pass out millions. If you do let me know where to make a character and when I can pick up mine please.

Besides, talk about totally ruining the new player experience. "Here mate, take everything and don't apply and skill or knowledge to work and figure this entrancing game for yourself."

Sheesh!

Like I said before give a inexperience player millions and he will just waste it whithin a short time with no knowledge or care of optaining more. They just need to read stratics, experience all aspects of game,grow,and shoot for the stars.

 

[UOKaiser]

The only way to fix this would be a shard wipe, and a complete overhaul of the economic system. And that will never happen. So wei either have to live with it or play a different game.

Sad but true.

And then the players that were rich before will be rich again only this time they will have 1mil while everyone else has 1k. The new 100mil is 100k. Doesn't really matter. If a player has no desire in making gold then they will not make gold. If they have no knowledge or care or drive then they will stay poor.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

And then the players that were rich before will be rich again only this time they will have 1mil while everyone else has 1k. The new 100mil is 100k. Doesn't really matter. If a player has no desire in making gold then they will not make gold. If they have no knowledge or care or drive then they will stay poor.

Bravo. Exactly.

 

[popps]

My point is that I can understand how UO can be intimdating to a truly new player.

It is refreshing for me to see that I am not the only one concerned about this issue.

An issue, mind you, which I think is devastating for the well being of the game as a whole.........

Some players have so much gold their banks are full and they are storing the cash on vendors.

Ridiculous really.

So, you are a UO development team member. How do you fix or adjust this?

I'd also love to understand :

#1 - Whether the Developing Team also realized the same issue ;

#2- Whether they see it as devastating for the game as a whole as I do ;

#3- Whether they intend to do anything about it and what.

I am not holding my breath though to get my questions ansered....

One idea is a new shard with a fresh new start that does not allow tranfers into it.

As long as scripting, duping, hacking and cheating is still possible making a new shard is useless. Players using those, will always jump ahead in no time.
A fresh new shard with no transfers could ONLY be done after scripting, duping, hacking and cheating is no longer possible in Ultima Online.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

It is refreshing for me to see that I am not the only one concerned about this issue.

An issue, mind you, which I think is devastating for the well being of the game as a whole.........





I'd also love to understand :

#1 - Whether the Developing Team also realized the same issue ;

#2- Whether they see it as devastating for the game as a whole as I do ;

#3- Whether they intend to do anything about it and what.

I am not holding my breath though to get my questions ansered....





As long as scripting, duping, hacking and cheating is still possible making a new shard is useless. Players using those, will always jump ahead in no time.
A fresh new shard with no transfers could ONLY be done after scripting, duping, hacking and cheating is no longer possible in Ultima Online.

Scripting is fine. But should be stopped

Dupes and hacks wreck things.

They will always exist.

What is the devastation popps? A bit extreme. Concern yeah. Devastation no.


1 gold is the same as 1000000 gold in the game.

12 blegs was once 120 blegs but it was divided by 10 across the board - so now 12 blegs still has the buying power of 120 blegs.

Think about it.

 

[Pawain]

I played for more than five years and did not have 1M on a single character.

I guess I thought I was having fun....

 

[UOKaiser]

I played for more than five years and did not have 1M on a single character.

I guess I thought I was having fun....

Well that depends what you consider fun? In the last 5 years do you constantly pvm high end? Do you craft? do you have a vender? Do you own a large house? Do you mine?Do you cut wood? Do you sell anything? Do you collect anything?Do you tame anything? Do you run any events? Do you loot items? Are you on siege? Do you hunt for rares? Do you decorate others people houses for gold?
In essence what do you consider fun in the last 5 years?

 

[Pawain]

Well that depends what you consider fun? In the last 5 years do you constantly pvm high end? Do you craft? do you have a vender? Do you own a large house? Do you mine?Do you cut wood? Do you sell anything? Do you collect anything?Do you tame anything? Do you run any events? Do you loot items? Are you on siege? Do you hunt for rares? Do you decorate others people houses for gold?
In essence what do you consider fun in the last 5 years?

I cant stand repetition. I have crafters but they have skills less than 85 same for taming. I dont collect things, I pack rat things. I have an 18x18 house that is full of crap. I dont high end anything.

For fun:
I run around and kill non boss monsters. I grow plants. I have non-Luna vendors so I have to drop runes. I shop vendors and find armor to wear for <100k that I see for millions in Luna. I stuff objects in Cyrahs mailbox.

I guess I am easily amused.

 

[popps]

Think about it.

It can act as a deterrant for new players from the game, I am worried.

It can make those approaching the game anew feel depressed of what lays ahead of them until they can play at a competitive level.

This is why I think it can be devastating for the game, because it makes it way harder for the game to get and, mot importantly, keep new subscribers.

 

[popps]

I played for more than five years and did not have 1M on a single character.

I guess I thought I was having fun....

A few questions if I may.......

You mean 1M in bank in checks/gold coins ?

Or you mean overall in worth of items stocked up ?

Because I can have no gold but then have tons of artifacts, imbuing high end resources, runic tools and so forth.

That is, as soon as I have money I spend it in high end gear/weaponry.

I am pennyless, but I have top notch stuff to use........

Other question, you PvM only/mostly or you also actively PvP ?

Thanks.

 

[popps]

I cant stand repetition. I have crafters but they have skills less than 85 same for taming. I dont collect things, I pack rat things. I have an 18x18 house that is full of crap. I dont high end anything.

For fun:
I run around and kill non boss monsters. I grow plants. I have non-Luna vendors so I have to drop runes. I shop vendors and find armor to wear for <100k that I see for millions in Luna. I stuff objects in Cyrahs mailbox.

I guess I am easily amused.

From this brief description I take it that you do not PvP, is that correct ?

 

[UOKaiser]

I cant stand repetition. I have crafters but they have skills less than 85 same for taming. I dont collect things, I pack rat things. I have an 18x18 house that is full of crap. I dont high end anything.

For fun:
I run around and kill non boss monsters. I grow plants. I have non-Luna vendors so I have to drop runes. I shop vendors and find armor to wear for <100k that I see for millions in Luna. I stuff objects in Cyrahs mailbox.

I guess I am easily amused.

Ah. I couldn't play like that. I set a goal and after I get to it I head to a harder goal. I simply must have the best even though i may never use it. I love rares because i can look at one and memories pop up of older times. 11 years later and Im still increasing the difficulty of my goals and end game.

Though your worth is higher as the 18x18 you own is at least 18-20mil more if it's in a semi-desirable spot. I can't imagine the stuff you collected in the time you played that you stuffed away in that home. You might be a billionear and not even know it. This is usually the case of many UO players that don't really get into the vendering and marketing aspects. One big reason why so many Idocs drop with fortunes on the floor.
We all started with a little bit a gold and no skills and no knowledge in this game. Some like myself kept getting robed at the crossroads and killed by dogs and cats, when getting that first boat was a memoral moment and then the first home and amasing the first 100k-1mil-10mil-50mil-100mil. Each one was a challenge and im proud of having to be able to do it, the feeling from each accomplishment is as good as a PVP feeling of first killing a player that has killed them for years and they always lost to. Ah the memories.

 

[Mairut]

I started playing again last January after a five year break.

My old character...yes, one character...is on my dad's account; I had started playing at around 12yrs old, played for 4 years and then quit playing after I moved out (my dad and I didn't get along, so I moved in with my aunt).

When I started my own account (last january), I hardly remembered how to do anything besides walk. I think I killed mongbats for about 3 days before I remembered I could buy the skills up.

Some guy I met in Trinsic asked me if I was new, told him I was just returning and he gave me 50k to help me get started again... I had found a rune for Rachel's Runes and went there to get a Dungeon runebook.

A month or two later, I got into MGM and one of my guildies got me some better armor to train in. Several months after that, another guildy gave me a little bit of gold to get my first (small) house, which he'd found the spot to. It wasn't long before I'd made my first mill because the GM of my guild made vendor spots available to the guildies. Guess what I'd made my mill off of? Crap that people had dropped on the ground at banks. Sure, most of it isn't worth a nickel alone, but there's lots of it.

The best thing you can do for brand-new players is to go to Haven and help them out. Give them some extra armor I'm pretty sure most of us have lying around (if they haven't already found some lying around), help them by explaining how to walk, go through a moongate, train up whatever skills they're interested in training up (and maybe actually help them train those skills), maybe even guild them so others can help them when you're not on or when you need to log. Maybe a runebook to cities and dungeons, unless you feel they'd get a better feel for things if they learned how to walk from one town to another. Give them the address to this website, uoguide and uo.com.

You don't need to explain to them much else, except perhaps stay out of Fel until you get a steady income to afford insurance. The rest is stuff they'll pick up as they go along.

You think that a newb is going to go into Luna and see all the 2mill+ items on the vendors and get discouraged... first of all, not many newbs I've met in Haven are that worried about all the items they can't afford at that moment. They don't have a house to put that fancy deco in, they have no need for that 120 because they haven't even reached GM yet. That fancy armor? Whatever. I can kill harpies in Cove just fine with this stuff you guys drop here at haven bank.

Secondly, you're assuming they're too dumb to figure out that if there are that many mill+ items on vendors, then it's only a matter of time before they could afford said items for themselves.

I know it's hard to remember waaayyyy back when you first started...were you concerned with trying to get that higher-priced item? No... probably not. You were probably excited about playing, wanting to explore and train up your skills, maybe make friends or join a guild.

Honestly...it's not that big of a deal.

I don't think we need to fix pricing on vendors.
If a Dev said they were nerfing Luna on the morrow, however... well, I'd bring lots of ale and those old firecrackers, and make a day of it

This isn't a personal attack on the OP, it's just general observations where I used the "you"s to sound as though I was actually talking to someone...LoL

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

It can act as a deterrant for new players from the game, I am worried.

It can make those approaching the game anew feel depressed of what lays ahead of them until they can play at a competitive level.

This is why I think it can be devastating for the game, because it makes it way harder for the game to get and, mot importantly, keep new subscribers.

What I dont understand is "competitive level". There are to many aspect of UO that don't require competition. I play all pieces. PvP stopped interesting me when killing had no consequence.

But as for competition beyone PvP. What do you mean?

 

[popps]

What I dont understand is "competitive level". There are to many aspect of UO that don't require competition. I play all pieces. PvP stopped interesting me when killing had no consequence.

But as for competition beyone PvP. What do you mean?

As in regards to PvP I guess being competitive to me means at least being geared up to be able to win at least an equal number of fights as compared to those that might be lost versus other players..........

 

[Gowron]

Blah blah blah.

I'm tired of hearing about the "plight" of new players coming to the game. Now, if there had been no kidding new box items on store shelves within the last 3+ years, I'd change my line.

1. I don't give "new" players 2 million gold.
2. As this is an MMO (seems folks forget this alot), new players should be getting into guilds as quickly as possible.
3. I know most guilds are eager to accept new players and are typically good at schooling them up.

That's how it was when I was a new player. Heck, when I was new, something that cost 10K was a stretch out of my price range. Dungeon crawling was something one person NEVER did alone. Shoot, if you were even mining/lumberjacking, it was prefered that you had company because PK's might be about.

With changes in the game, for good or bad, and the longevity of the game, gold is quite a bit easier to come by. Dungeon crawling can be done solo (though there may be limits). Mining/lumberjacking can be accomplished solo. Heck, even when doing it in Fel, PK's are so rare, that even if they do show up, there's enough time to buckle up and get out before the first blow lands.

Nah, the game economy is fine, even for the casual player.

 

[UOKaiser]

As in regards to PvP I guess being competitive to me means at least being geared up to be able to win at least an equal number of fights as compared to those that might be lost versus other players..........

You mean geared up and have skills. Face it if a person sucks at fighting then they suck at fighting. They can be geared to the best but if they have no idea how to counteract attacks and other skills they get with experience then they should expect to lose to a naked mage 99% of the time.

 

[DoranM]

The dupe needs to be fixed.

Rare items need to be RARE again.

Item insurance needs to cost more, and UO needs to take a bigger cut.

Dying needs to mean something.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

As in regards to PvP I guess being competitive to me means at least being geared up to be able to win at least an equal number of fights as compared to those that might be lost versus other players..........

Do you make the determination between an arena battle like heavy weight boxers that match VS. a PVP land where you can run into anything.

I think a lot of player think PvP should be equal. Its not. In a tournament or arena sure.

But in the context of walking a hostile land. Bring on the gangs. The pairs. The theives. The set up men. The traps. Etc.

Lots to do and many ways to die.

PvP isnt meant to be 1 on 1 equality. Yeah cheats and hacks arent okay.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

You mean geared up and have skills. Face it if a person sucks at fighting then they suck at fighting. They can be geared to the best but if they have no idea how to counteract attacks and other skills they get with experience then they should expect to lose to a naked mage 99% of the time.

Right.

Swig chew run cast swing duck hide

bandage cast cast swing chug.

It does take some skill not just gear.

 

[Trebr Drab]

As in regards to PvP I guess being competitive to me means at least being geared up to be able to win at least an equal number of fights as compared to those that might be lost versus other players..........

You mean geared up and have skills. Face it if a person sucks at fighting then they suck at fighting. They can be geared to the best but if they have no idea how to counteract attacks and other skills they get with experience then they should expect to lose to a naked mage 99% of the time.

But you can reverse that too. A person can be good at PvP, but if they don't have the gear they will lose...unless the other PvPer sucks at it. Gear is important. And it takes a lot of riches and time to build it up to a competitive level. And that's the problem.

Except for some of the UO gods who can take a newbie and do it in a few days. *chuckle*

 

[THP]

Its crazy days....

Just try and the new EM events on any shard and if u hit/drop an event ''limited'' rare it seems u hit the BIG magic millons....items seem to be selling for 100m plus..LOL... to the elite collectors...I for sure will be sniffing around these events a lot lot lot more...LOL

 

[KalVasTENKI]

Your not a millionare.
You have 1 million gold.
I give new plays a few million to start.

The games not intimidating. Its speculative intimidation that clutters this board.

New players can get up and going in days. Millions in a month. Fifty million in a year. All the time having fun.

Geez.

Indeed.

Advanced or experienced players can make 100mil in a day! And then spend it all right away...

I make alot alot alot of gold but am broke instantly after obtaining wealth.

 

[Megilhir]

If you think inflation is not detrimental to the game then you are probably one of the “haves” that inflate.

UO may not be dying but is definitely stagnant.

A couple of ripostes to some of the comments posted above:

PvP is not the end-all and even then UO PvP is so unbalanced and limited that it simply cannot compete with other venues such as WoW or LotR or those types. Period!

I state that strongly because I do (did) PvP on LoTR (WoW) and have been playing UO since December of 1999 when there was no Trammel. I killed and was killed. Most of you reading this never faced the rabid hordes of naked Deadly Poison GM Katana wielding players on Arirang either.

You want PvP? Go to an Asian based shard and move off the Indo-European (IE) centric ones. And yes Megilhir on Arirang was (and still is) a role playing Dread Lord highwayman.

There are IE players on the Asian shards too by the way. One of my favorite memories was after I killed a poacher who was ninja looting (back in the day). I was invisible in Shame when he went past with some mates (hunting me for revenge I guess) and I saw the following words appear: “I dunno man, I think he dissed me in RP.”

Back on point. Some people replied to this post stating they give XX items/gold to new players. Excellent and well done. Not that I recall such generosity, though I have had good experiences.

But you simply do not, nor cannot do it for the greater amount of new players that appear. So individual generosity, though nice, is not the answer.

Guilding verse soloing. Any game that depends on Guilding fails. As does one that depends on Soloing. Maybe sooner, maybe later. They fail and I define fail as not growing in a competitive finance profile.

People like to hunt alone and others like to group up. As an aside, MMO is not defined as guilding. It means massive multi-user and that has evolved as many people playing in the same environment at the same time.

The reality is simple. UO has had a series of changes on their staff and none more vital than dissolution of the vision of what the game is to be. Though I have one vision I assure you that all reading this have theirs and they may or may not coincide. This is the single greatest challenge. Just look at the replies to this post to confirm the assessment.

So where are we? UO is stagnating. The UO economy simply isn’t. Scripting and exploits (Speed-hack anyone) serve to unbalance the game.

So how do to fix it? One option is to hire people who will provide a consistent vision and leverage technologic advances to keep the game widely accessible yet not alterable by third party programs and so forth. I have other concepts but quite honestly, ideas are money and I am not employed by EA.

Thus I play the game as I define it, at times like the gentleman posting above who wanders around with skills at 85 (though I have bit more power player in me) and at other times, a crafter, adventurer, PK, explorer or a combination of those types and more.

This does not change the initial arguement that everyone (many) being a millionaire unbalances the game. It can and does regardless of the “one plus one = three” and null hypothesis arguments. Again, just factual debate and no ad hominine intent.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

If you think inflation is not detrimental to the game then you are probably one of the “haves” that inflate.

UO may not be dying but is definitely stagnant.

A couple of ripostes to some of the comments posted above:

PvP is not the end-all and even then UO PvP is so unbalanced and limited that it simply cannot compete with other venues such as WoW or LotR or those types. Period!

I state that strongly because I do (did) PvP on LoTR (WoW) and have been playing UO since December of 1999 when there was no Trammel. I killed and was killed. Most of you reading this never faced the rabid hordes of naked Deadly Poison GM Katana wielding players on Arirang either.

You want PvP? Go to an Asian based shard and move off the Indo-European (IE) centric ones. And yes Megilhir on Arirang was (and still is) a role playing Dread Lord highwayman.

There are IE players on the Asian shards too by the way. One of my favorite memories was after I killed a poacher who was ninja looting (back in the day). I was invisible in Shame when he went past with some mates (hunting me for revenge I guess) and I saw the following words appear: “I dunno man, I think he dissed me in RP.”

Back on point. Some people replied to this post stating they give XX items/gold to new players. Excellent and well done. Not that I recall such generosity, though I have had good experiences.

But you simply do not, nor cannot do it for the greater amount of new players that appear. So individual generosity, though nice, is not the answer.

Guilding verse soloing. Any game that depends on Guilding fails. As does one that depends on Soloing. Maybe sooner, maybe later. They fail and I define fail as not growing in a competitive finance profile.

People like to hunt alone and others like to group up. As an aside, MMO is not defined as guilding. It means massive multi-user and that has evolved as many people playing in the same environment at the same time.

The reality is simple. UO has had a series of changes on their staff and none more vital than dissolution of the vision of what the game is to be. Though I have one vision I assure you that all reading this have theirs and they may or may not coincide. This is the single greatest challenge. Just look at the replies to this post to confirm the assessment.

So where are we? UO is stagnating. The UO economy simply isn’t. Scripting and exploits (Speed-hack anyone) serve to unbalance the game.

So how do to fix it? One option is to hire people who will provide a consistent vision and leverage technologic advances to keep the game widely accessible yet not alterable by third party programs and so forth. I have other concepts but quite honestly, ideas are money and I am not employed by EA.

Thus I play the game as I define it, at times like the gentleman posting above who wanders around with skills at 85 (though I have bit more power player in me) and at other times, a crafter, adventurer, PK, explorer or a combination of those types and more.

This does not change the initial arguement that everyone (many) being a millionaire unbalances the game. It can and does regardless of the “one plus one = three” and null hypothesis arguments. Again, just factual debate and no ad hominine intent.

UO isnt stagnant its a game. You may feel the experience has become stagnant. Sorry. But that happens in games. So sometimes people quit.

You don't understand the economy. Minus dupes that bring in hidden gold, the economy is fine.

Why? Oh brother. Try this.

A sword of shamalama ding dong was worth 10k - 10 years ago. However a dupe occured and the economy adjusted that sucks. People continued to earn gold. The sword of shamalam ding dong now sells for 500k. See the 000's dont matter. Its relative buying power.

It only matters when you think 1 million is a lot because you think in real life terms. In a game it doesnt matter if you have 50 billion klinkabpids or 10000 klinkabids. The buying power of the klinkabids and in this case UO gold is what matters.

Why isnt a new player effected. BECAUSE what they acquire sells for current market price. They get a Xmas gift ticket it sells for 300k not 1k or 2k but 300k. The enter the market at market price. They now have 300k in 10 minutes of selling. It took me a year 10 years ago to raise 300k.

ITS NOT THE 000's it buying power. Dupes do mess things out. The gold dupe has been gone a long time.

 

[UOKaiser]

But you can reverse that too. A person can be good at PvP, but if they don't have the gear they will lose...unless the other PvPer sucks at it. Gear is important. And it takes a lot of riches and time to build it up to a competitive level. And that's the problem.

Except for some of the UO gods who can take a newbie and do it in a few days. *chuckle*

I guess to think of it reversed would be a sucky pvp naked against a good pvp with gear still the same. The way you mention your example would be a really skilled naked pvp against a ok geared up pvp. There is different levels of people skills sucky,newv some experiece,below average.average,above average,excelent,awesom,whatever. Both gear and skill is impostant especially how you organize your gear to work with your uo skills and your own experience that would make the player from good to awesome.

Even in the old days there was alot less gear-stats and weapons to keep track up but people would of need to be careful of losing said gear so many battled in common gear that they can replaced, But that was back then now people battle in much varied gear whiout fear of loss well except siege but thats a whole different topic.

Either way I think my long rant here is probably summarized by this. Gear is easy to get and it takes experience,skills and gear toghether to be great.
Ya I think that summarize my long post lol.

 

[Megilhir]

UO isnt stagnant its a game. You may feel the experience has become stagnant. Sorry. But that happens in games. So sometimes people quit.

You don't understand the economy. Minus dupes that bring in hidden gold, the economy is fine.

Why? Oh brother. Try this.

A sword of shamalama ding dong was worth 10k - 10 years ago. However a dupe occured and the economy adjusted that sucks. People continued to earn gold. The sword of shamalam ding dong now sells for 500k. See the 000's dont matter. Its relative buying power.

It only matters when you think 1 million is a lot because you think in real life terms. In a game it doesnt matter if you have 50 billion klinkabpids or 10000 klinkabids. The buying power of the klinkabids and in this case UO gold is what matters.

Why isnt a new player effected. BECAUSE what they acquire sells for current market price. They get a Xmas gift ticket it sells for 300k not 1k or 2k but 300k. The enter the market at market price. They now have 300k in 10 minutes of selling. It took me a year 10 years ago to raise 300k.

ITS NOT THE 000's it buying power. Dupes do mess things out. The gold dupe has been gone a long time.

You are incorrect as the base-line has not adjusted to a realized potential across the spectrum of viable acquistion and distribution.

A simple example may help?

Let us look at a house location. Say a modest 7 x 7.

First: It needs to be accessable, if not by location then by advertising.

Second: Accessibility = traffic = % of profit/gain.

Third: A new player (aside from the wonderous common gift of gold that most do not see) must earn the initial cost of a home to even place a vender and then subsidize the vender's life (maintainance).

The logic path proceeds but that is not the real issue.

Because you have a lot of gold/assets does not mean a new player has anywhere near the capital power that you possess. That is barring another player simply giving them everything.

Here is a prime example in effect;

Based on my assumption that you are of Indo-European descent nad primarily an English speaking individual, I suggest you start a character on Arirang. It is not based on Seige P. rules so the general conditions aside from terrain modification are relative to Atlantic (by the way, I play on both shards and am pleased to pursue this in-game if desired).

Now go forth with your NEW Toon AND equipped with your knowledge of the game.

Today is January 27th 2010.

I will wager right here right now (barring being gifted gold/items/or a home) you WILL NOT earn a million gold in a week as you suggest EVERY new player can. That part is based on your integrity of course. Another person on these boards may have a few million on Arirang as do I and them GIVING you a hand negates the wager.

So take the test. Post your new Arirang character's name, I can (optionally) meet with you as we do a controlled study of your progress instead of merely thumping our respective virtual chests.

And as an aside, Arirang players generally throw what they do not want out onto the bank floor. Powerscrolls included by the way. Got a nice 120 Smithing scroll one day in Skara Brae. So there will be even more "gimmes" available.

Today is January 27th 2010.

 

[popps]

You mean geared up and have skills. Face it if a person sucks at fighting then they suck at fighting. They can be geared to the best but if they have no idea how to counteract attacks and other skills they get with experience then they should expect to lose to a naked mage 99% of the time.

Ultima Online is nowadays, unfortunately, heavily item based........

That is, there is something which makes it for the win called "modifiers".......

The higher the modifiers, in defense, offense, multiplication of skills (and so of special moves and flexibility of combat strategies), the higher the chances of winning fights.

Thing is, that items carrying the best modifiers or combination of well assorted modifiers, sometimes even exceeding CAPs to take into account negative effects, come at a price tag, quite high, often......

So, those who can sport better items and have more gold to spend can always be on top of the rest and have higher chances at winning fights.

This, CAN be a strong deterrant in having new comers to the game want to stick with it and they might well decide to move onto other games, less troubled for new players to catch up with existing ones.

So, the way I see it, this status of things can be of harm to the game, overall.

 

[popps]

PvP isnt meant to be 1 on 1 equality. Yeah cheats and hacks arent okay.

But at the very least new comers to the game should not so heavily play with such a gross handicap determined by not only their lower experience but also by their vast inferior wealth and stock of high end items necessary to survive the PvP lands and be competitive.

With PvP Arenas we could help players train up PvP combat, but it is also necessary to make it less troublesome for new players to be able to "gear up" to the competition of experienced players without this looking a nightmare task.

 

[popps]

Why isnt a new player effected. BECAUSE what they acquire sells for current market price. They get a Xmas gift ticket it sells for 300k not 1k or 2k but 300k. The enter the market at market price. They now have 300k in 10 minutes of selling. It took me a year 10 years ago to raise 300k.

ITS NOT THE 000's it buying power.

A high end PvP suit with all the bells and whistles which give that extra gear to win fights can cost 150-200+ millions easily.
Hell, some top notch weapons can easily cost, only 1 weapon, over 50 millions.
And, on top of that, come also the costs for the upkeeep of the suit.

It can really be a deterrant to new players who may want to stick with the game to play PvP.

 

[Ezekiel Zane]

Why isnt a new player effected. BECAUSE what they acquire sells for current market price. They get a Xmas gift ticket it sells for 300k not 1k or 2k but 300k. The enter the market at market price. They now have 300k in 10 minutes of selling. It took me a year 10 years ago to raise 300k.

ITS NOT THE 000's it buying power.

A high end PvP suit with all the bells and whistles which give that extra gear to win fights can cost 150-200+ millions easily.
Hell, some top notch weapons can easily cost, only 1 weapon, over 50 millions.
And, on top of that, come also the costs for the upkeeep of the suit.

It can really be a deterrant to new players who may want to stick with the game to play PvP.

PvP suits shouldn't be 150-200 mils since imbuing has been out now for more than 3 months. Once the initial demand has settled down, it'll be mostly replacement and new players placing orders for armor or weapons. Template changes too of course. My point is that imbuing has made it much easier for everyone to have excellent gear at a lower cost.

My craftsmen and BOD collectors are wearing all 70s suit with 100% LRC MR6 and other mods and it cost me nothing to make them.

 

[UOKaiser]

A high end PvP suit with all the bells and whistles which give that extra gear to win fights can cost 150-200+ millions easily.
Hell, some top notch weapons can easily cost, only 1 weapon, over 50 millions.
And, on top of that, come also the costs for the upkeeep of the suit.

It can really be a deterrant to new players who may want to stick with the game to play PvP.

Thats the problem there. this game has PVP but it's based on a RPG ultima series. PVP was never the major part of the game. Wasn't suppose to. It's a RPG. It take stime to build up your power in a RPG. If they play UO for the first time to just PVP they are in the wrong type of game. There are first person tournament shooers and stragtegy games out there for that. A new player should never have the same equipment that a player who played the game 1 year-5years-12 years has hell they shouldn't even be able to come close with out friends or guilds to help them.. Once again it's a RPG with a PVP aspect for the more experience.

 

[UOKaiser]

But at the very least new comers to the game should not so heavily play with such a gross handicap determined by not only their lower experience but also by their vast inferior wealth and stock of high end items necessary to survive the PvP lands and be competitive.

With PvP Arenas we could help players train up PvP combat, but it is also necessary to make it less troublesome for new players to be able to "gear up" to the competition of experienced players without this looking a nightmare task.

They are handicap cause there newbies, They don't have experience,gold,and subscription fees totallying over 2 grand over the years. They will need to play the game RPG or get friends to help. Even though theres like only 1 or 2 new players joining a month with only 1 staying every six month before joining less in deph games with pretty colors.

 

[Kirthag]

*firstly - know I didn't read every post as they all started sounding the same...*


The items listed below are, imho, what has made UO the shadow of what it once was...

• Ebaying of accounts/houses (itmes for real money)
• Death of the Counselor Program (Recognized Volunteerism)
• Creating Trammel
• Having more than 2 characters on a given shard (less dependency on other players)
• AOS and the dependency of items (Age of Stuff) which lead to duping and farming exploits
• Item Insurance (killer of blacksmiths and tailors)
• Death of Community

Ebay
I'm so GLAD this is done now! I've been screaming from these (and other) forums that mixing real world currency with virtual currency is VERY DANGEROUS without full control. Other online communities are actually built upon this exchange... but UO never was. EA needs to STOP selling items (UO store) for real money, and stick to their guns. If they want to create a gold sink, SELL THESE ITEMS FOR GOLD ONLY! They have the mechanics... they can set up vendors themselves that sell - at wowzer gold prices - thus forcing the internal market to change. Shoot... I can actually envision an EA mall with vendors selling all kinds of stuff... in limited release quantities that MUST stay on the shard (no cross sharding). Say an EA vendor is selling bomb-pillows, but on an entire shard, there can only be 1000 of them. So 1000 are bought... and the vendor will sell no more until a bunch of pvp pansies have a pillow fight with them... and *poof* as each bomb-pillow is detonated, the vendor can sell again.

Of course... this can still be abused by those "griefing merchants" who try to corner markets. Can make it so only 3 can be on an account at a time... and exercise in limitation as well as the ability to craft weaker firecracker pillows would at first, destabilize the pillow market, but in the end would balance it out and regulate the flow of gold for pillows.

Is what the FED does with interest rates.... drop rates and release more cash into the economy and it triggers spending. raise rates and limit cash release, and consumers respond by holding onto their money more. (I'm no economist but I think this is how it works).



Ther eis no more real risk... and that creates a prevailing sense of independence by the players. Couple that with the ability to just about create every major template on one account on one shard... well, who needs a group? No interdependence exists in UO anymore. Even those noobs getting handed 2mil to them... the intent is good, but it actually does hurt that player's experience and investment in what they are doing. Give & Take houses are the same. Unless you can flood a G&T house with hundreds of arties... why do it? Move away from self reliance and perhaps the players will start interacting again... and bartering/selling at more reasonable prices.



In my beginnings with UO (1997) it was the community aspect that utterly attracted me to this game. The fact that a group of people would hold domain over an area was totally awesome in my book. Some adopted dungeons (Ravuul adopted the caverns of Minoc as his), others adopted situations (kill a lich, suffer the wrath of the GUL!), and more formed ideals (The Cult of the midnight Wraith are a prime example).

What needs to change is the mentality of players. That can be driven by the risk factor, something that has been taken away from UO many years ago. The attempt to bring risk back (more resources in Fel) is shallow and doesn't engage the real need here - to have a REASON.


UO is fixable... if we want it fixed. Devs don't necessarily need to be there to do it...

 

[Slayvite]

This topic can be brought up as many times as you like. (which is very often)
The fact of the matter is a Newbie will never contend with those that have been ingame for years.
The inflation or 'currency' in UO has been dead since AoS and we all know it.
I myself often whip round the 'newbie' training areas dropping checks for 100k for them to find.
It means nothing to me as i often have to drop checks just to use a bank account.

THE ONLY CURE is a complete game wipe of all gold (which id be for even though id lose close to 800 mill) and the immediate stop to x-shard transfers.
They should not and never should have been allowed.
They killed the econemy and we all know it.

No biggy for me as any 'Vet' can make 1mill in about 5 hours of gameplay these days.

Wipe it all and start again.....oh sorry, the kids would quit and no more subs from them......and god forbid a game where the actuall players have a say...

 

[UOKaiser]

You are incorrect as the base-line has not adjusted to a realized potential across the spectrum of viable acquistion and distribution.

A simple example may help?

Let us look at a house location. Say a modest 7 x 7.

First: It needs to be accessable, if not by location then by advertising.

Second: Accessibility = traffic = % of profit/gain.

Third: A new player (aside from the wonderous common gift of gold that most do not see) must earn the initial cost of a home to even place a vender and then subsidize the vender's life (maintainance).

The logic path proceeds but that is not the real issue.

Because you have a lot of gold/assets does not mean a new player has anywhere near the capital power that you possess. That is barring another player simply giving them everything.

Here is a prime example in effect;

Based on my assumption that you are of Indo-European descent nad primarily an English speaking individual, I suggest you start a character on Arirang. It is not based on Seige P. rules so the general conditions aside from terrain modification are relative to Atlantic (by the way, I play on both shards and am pleased to pursue this in-game if desired).

Now go forth with your NEW Toon AND equipped with your knowledge of the game.

Today is January 27th 2010.

I will wager right here right now (barring being gifted gold/items/or a home) you WILL NOT earn a million gold in a week as you suggest EVERY new player can. That part is based on your integrity of course. Another person on these boards may have a few million on Arirang as do I and them GIVING you a hand negates the wager.

So take the test. Post your new Arirang character's name, I can (optionally) meet with you as we do a controlled study of your progress instead of merely thumping our respective virtual chests.

And as an aside, Arirang players generally throw what they do not want out onto the bank floor. Powerscrolls included by the way. Got a nice 120 Smithing scroll one day in Skara Brae. So there will be even more "gimmes" available.

Today is January 27th 2010.

Disagree. I tell you why.
Your first and second example. If the player can affort a house what are they 60k to place forgot how much 7x7 cost it would be more benefitial to rent a vender in a vender mall where they do the advertising for them. They will know this if they do the leg work of researching.

Your third example as a newbie player in a rpg the first thing they gonna do is pvm to generate gold into the system. It will take them time to work there skills while they do that they will earn gold and save it while learning more in about the game and looting better items. There first achievement might be a boat or house so they wait till they earn money for that. With a goal they can strive for they will stay interested and continue to pay monthly to EA.
Once they level up there skills using looted items selling to people at free rented venders or very low cost rentel venders they buy there first home and place it. They have finaly achieved that goal now they need to set another goal. Eventually they will finaly rent a place at luna and have items to sell there generating revenue like never before. While building up other characteristics of there adventure.

No new player should start rich. NON of us did it took us a long time. It will also take them a long time. Thats the essence of a RPG game.
Now the economy is scaled. When back in the days it took us a year to earn 300k gold but everything was worth 10k-5k-1k. So the items we sold to people took us a while to generate income. Not to mention gold from monsters was one of the only ways to generate gold and selling to npc. We didn't even have venders. So it was very difficult to aquire gold. But the market knows this and sold the most powerful weapons ,armor ,rares for 50k-30k etc..
The gold dupes happen and increase the player base gold dramaticaly in a short time. Before that 1mil gold was like 50-100 dollars real cash. As more gold became easily available the value decreased and selling the highest end item for 50k anymore made no sence. Then over the years gold continue to decrease in value so it took more gold to buy same items. But at the same time It took more gold to sell the same items as well so people bough-sell-bought-sell. Money being redistrubuted between the population untill most of the population was in the same range.
The gold that enter the game rarely ever leaves so one day one person is rich the next day that gold gets redistrubuted to another person and that person is rich while the one who gave is gold gets poorer. New gold into the system is generated from PvM and NPC. That rate has being curved and in control. At it stands till this day getting new gold from the system is the slowest way to make any gold. Which is good as there is enough gold out there already to be redistrubuted.
A new player how rare they are will have to start from scratch and work there way up just like everyone else had to. Though this time when a artifact drops in there pack they can sell it for 100k instead of 1k to slowly make there way up.
Unfortunetely there has being a dev. major impact on the economy these past couple of years maybe they fire the dev who monitor the way Uo economy works. They have made many profitable items worth much less yet gold at the same time has increased in the sytem. This in turn has made it harder for the poorer people of UO to sell there goods to the richer people of UO for higher amounts so that more gold is redistributed downward. So in turn the richer people remain richer and the poorer remain poorer it will take them much longer to get to where we at now than it would of taken them just a couple of years ago.