Bags of Sending

[RavenWinterHawk]

With all the changes with trial accounts coming with Publish 58, are you planning to revert the Bag of Sending to its original state as well?

Yes, it will be reverted to its original functionality, and not take extra charges for higher weights. Bags of Sending will not be available to trial accounts, however.
-Draconi


I think you might want to rethink this. Trial accounts never really abused BOS. Its the scripting of set accounts that use BOS to farm gold.

With the lack of follow through "on away from comp gold farming", all I see the BOS doing is bringing in millions of scripted gold.

Why change it?

This doesnt really make sense to me. I get the BOS legit player arguement, though I dont agree. But why bring something back that screams abuse.

 

[^Wolfie^]

As much as I'd like to kick myself because I want sending bags back to their orignal style, I agree with Raven. Trial accts were NOT the ones abusing them, developed chars for gold scripting were. Maybe a limit on how many times a day or per hour you can use them would help?

 

[Nystul]

No i'd like to be able to send my gold from doom or something while I'm casually playing at a decent rate per charge.

Fact is it's not going to matter what they do with gold. There is very little of a "gold sink" in UO anymore so gold isn't being removed from the game at a rate in which it should. A million gold will ALWAYS be a million gold. UO most likely don't have too long as a life span left, the "UO economy" gold wise was ruined from dupes long LONG ago and in which time UO has left, a bag of sending revert isn't going to dramaticly effect it any more.

Scripters will ALWAYS benefit from some sort of "AFK operation". Wether it's from chopping trees, mining ore/stone, heartwood etc. they will ALWAYS benefit from the outcome of their actions that will result in gold and/or $$$. If they want to "ruin" the "UO gold economy" who cares, the only thing it's going to DIRECTLY effect are the actual sellers of it. Your arties arn't going to go up, your armor won't either. In fact it all goes down the longer it's in game. So how does it effect you? If it's just the fact of knowing than that's just plain idiotic...

 

[Aboo]

I have to respectfully disagree with you on this.

Bags of Sending are completely worthless right now. I have, in the past, used them all the time but since the changes I haven't used a single one. In fact I don't even carry them with me anymore.

Reverting them back to their original use would be wonderful. I don't get to play near as much as I used to or would like to because of my work and grandkids, so the little time I do play I hate having to spend half of it going to and from the bank especially in the areas that you CANNOT recall back to.

 

[Bardie]

I agree with this helps out the casual player, hell i don't even pick up gold @ spawns anymore besides what i can carry out...yes of course there will b those that abuse it, but like Nystul said if not one thing they will do another...

 

[^Wolfie^]

I'm not asking that they don't take them back to original use, I'm asking for a perhaps a limited use a day. Really, does the "casual player" need to use 200 or more charges every 24 hours? No, but a gold scriptor will...

 

[Bardie]

I'm not asking that they don't take them back to original use, I'm asking for a perhaps a limited use a day. Really, does the "casual player" need to use 200 or more charges every 24 hours? No, but a gold scriptor will...

I can agree with a limited amount of use per day... hell give me 20 uses a day i b happy

 

[Green Meanie]

Yes i can agree that bos make it ezier for a scriptor to move gold to the bank.

That being said the script can just as easly pathfind to the nearest recallable spot. (where they stand in tram now that monsters dont spawn faster in fel). recall to the bank say bank deposite gold recall back to closes recall spot for where they were farming gold and resume killing monsters. resulting in total loss of maybe 20k-an hour from illeagal forms of income. Bos allot legit players to make money and compet with that of a scriptor much easier.

so point is scriptors are still going to make the gold at a SLIGHTLY reduced rate and regular players are going to miss out all together or at an even higher rate becouse there not as effecint as a good script. BOS is a win all around for the legit player compaired to the scripting player.


while im here can i ask we please revert the spawn in tram so scriptors will be tempted to come back there and i can at least have a chance of taking there gold and BOS. I used to love killing my time hunting the fel gold hot spots for scriptors and taking everything they would drop.

 

[Kellgory]

I would agree that limiting the number of uses per char per day would be a solution to some of the gold farming. Even 15-20 uses per day is probably to much for the average user, and even then they could just jump on another char and continue doing whatever they were doing. Otherwise, your going to have the same problems as before and that is the scripters with heartwood suits and soulseekers auto-killing, looting, and sending gold from one spot all day. It used to be a joke in a guild I was in that anytime someone mentioned they were going to the painted caves, fan dancer dojo, or get keys to do crystal effusion, we would tell them to say high to a certain char, and never failed they would come back a couple minutes later and ask how we knew that char would be at that location.

 

[Warpig Inc]

As much as I'd like to see the bags return I'd have to say no. I'd rather suffer then reward the cheats. Just another one of those things in the game that wouldn't be an issue if there was an active in game GM support. Sneaky GM goes hunting in spawn area to see a fighter in one spot circle by corpses. Observes for 5-10 minutes while in sneaky mode. Decides time to pluck the BOS from the backpack to see if he keeps fighting. Puts it back moves off. Returns appearing as any other player to ask to join in. Dead air return and off to a cozy cell. Account is not banned but the character to work off a set time af active game time in the cell. Have a random four color wall generator and four colored boxes in the cell to arange to match. During this lock up the accounts house is Player bann zone. Gm gets to check in on the stable of logged in heros. Tack on some extra time if they have anything wise to say to their jailer.

Those that became one thos eplodding cows that just fell into line will do their time and stop the BS. Those that never intended to play the game without cheating..........there cancelled account is no loss.

The BOS has seen its time and just may need to stay hanging on the wall with my Blade of Insanity. Hell here's one. The BOS is gotten from a once per day quest per character. The bag has set amount charges but has a timer also to aviod hoarding them. Who can go for more then a few hours of killing WWs or smacking a tree before they move onto something else. BOS just need to reflect honest game play.

 

[UOKaiser]

I'm not asking that they don't take them back to original use, I'm asking for a perhaps a limited use a day. Really, does the "casual player" need to use 200 or more charges every 24 hours? No, but a gold scriptor will...

Of course people need to use 200 charges a day or more, Some people hunt for 1 hour others spend the whole day at it. Not to mention it's just not gold sending to the bank it's wep,armor,arts,regents,everything. Not to mention stygin abyss is right around the corner and we all gonna be collecting even the junk items for embuing, Also those who like smelt everything. Added to that miners and lumberer,and leather gatherers can easily go through 500 and up charges per day.

 

[Aboo]

I’m not sure how many charges I would go through but I used to love to hunt in the Dark Wisp dungeon. Not only can you get a fair amount of gold there, but also occasionally paragon chests. Both of those add up to some weight! I quit going because I usually only get to play on my lunch hour and I was spending more time recalling to the bank and then having to RUN back to the dungeon than I was hunting. The bags of sending, back like they originally were, would be a god-send for those times

I also like to get barbed and horned leather from Destard. Although it’s not as bad as having to recall to the bank and run back to a dungeon, it would be so much easier to collect the leather for my tailor if the bags of sending worked the way they used to!

 

[^Wolfie^]

Of course people need to use 200 charges a day or more, Some people hunt for 1 hour others spend the whole day at it. Not to mention it's just not gold sending to the bank it's wep,armor,arts,regents,everything. Not to mention stygin abyss is right around the corner and we all gonna be collecting even the junk items for embuing, Also those who like smelt everything. Added to that miners and lumberer,and leather gatherers can easily go through 500 and up charges per day.

I said a casual player, not a junk collector.

 

[Aboo]

I said a casual player, not a junk collector.

I consider myself a casual player but it's possible I could go through way more than 15-20 in a day.

 

[rwek]

We want bags of sending back.


I saw no change in the economy when they were nerfed. So let it be just like it was.


YOU (whom ever it may pertain to) ruin the economy from buying gold in the first place.



I was shocked as I joined a trammy guild for kicks to find out how many people buy gold. Someone asked for help with their order, and people start naming off all the websites they use, etc.



You support scripting by buying gold. Period.

 

[Gheed]

*inserts shameless plea to revert the mining rng nerf here*

 

[Basara]

the only change I saw from the BoS nerf, was most Horned & Barbed leather vendors increasing their prices by 100+ GP per piece (going from the 40-50k per 1000 range to the 150-250k range).

I'd support a partial revert of the resources randomization as follows: Resources stay static in areas with no recall-in ability (Fel Dungeons, Ilshenar, Yomotsu mines, ML dungeons, etc.). Leave it random in all places where a person can book mine.

 

[Aboo]

*inserts shameless plea to revert the mining rng nerf here*

I'll add my 2¢ to this too!

 

[TheScoundrelRico]

Just make the bags stealable and I'll be thrilled...la

 

[Aboo]

Just make the bags stealable and I'll be thrilled...la

Ah but that's incentive to NOT make them stealable!

 

[TheScoundrelRico]

Stalk much?...la

 

[Phaen Grey]

I will go for stealable, I know they are not insurable. If they work like before I would use the hell out of them. I've not bothered hunting for anything since the nerf. Too time consuming to bank what I get every 15 mins.

 

[Basara]

Oh, and Raven, I'd be happy with a 1 chage per send, but 50 GP charged per stone weight of gold sent limitation (50 gold = 1 stone)

 

[Nystul]

I wouldn't mind a limited uses per day deal either. As long as I'm able to farm a few hundred Cu Sidhe if I'm in that kinda mood that day or hunt Coil in my max luck suit etc. Right now the gold just gets in the way and it would be nice to loot it again and know I can use it to cover insurance or for more powder of fortification, potions, etc.

People need to stop caring about the scripters etc. It really don't effect us as much as people think it does. No matter what the scripters will ALWAYS have something to script. Why should the casual gamers continue to suffer just to stick it to the scripters? (Resource changes, BOS, etc...). Also didn't they fix a loophole with getting mass amounts of bulk powder? I thought I remember it, if so it will make it not as easily obtainable I guess in crazy bulk amounts for these people who want to AFK script for gold.

 

[Green Meanie]

agreed you can desine the code thinking it will stop a scriptor.

EXAMPLES

Heart wood- uped the drop rate of runics to something stupid so scriptors would get less

resources - randomized resources so scriptors would get less

Bags of sending- made useless so scriptors would get less


RESULTS

Heartwood- scriptors still get more runics than everyone else becouse there the only ones with the pacients (becouse there not there) to get the items

Resources- In the past you could farm out a scriptors spot so they wouldnt get resources for it. Now scriptors still get more becouse they spend more time out there hitting random spots (the same spots they always have hoping today it will be valorite or heart wood or whatever) and you cant even farm to spot out to keep the scriptor from getting the resources

Bags of sending - The scriptors still get the most gold becouse there scripts have adapted to run the gold to the bank and there not at the computer so what do they care about the 2 min inconvence where as players just dont loot gold or have there time that they can play if limited reduced even farther by multiple bank runs

 

[Saris]

i ask for a revert the only thing it does for me not having them, is makes me not loot gold and hope or that drop every week that will make a small profit over issurance lol, I refuse to buy gold, but it would be nice to be able to farm my own in less hunted spots again. As far as UA gold farmers, ban them, why scerw over a good thing for a few ppl beaking the tos, I dont see a bunch of 2 day old chars farming trogs btw so whats with the 14 day trial thing? kinda getting on a trial bashing kick lol

 

[Ravahan]

As much as I'd like to see the bags return I'd have to say no. I'd rather suffer then reward the cheats.

Well, while I understand where everyone who feels like this (not just replying to you) is coming from, I really really wouldn't. A lot of my favorite hunting spots were those hidden nooks in Ilsh or deep in some dungeon where its a pain to get to and from, but once you're there you can stay and have fun for a good long while until your BoS ran out. You can't do that these days, and I'd like to see that ability brought back. This would not only benefit the "casual" player (they pay as much as the rest of us!), but also the folk who like a little variety in their farming.

Personally, I think limitations on charges per day is reasonable. If BoS were limited to being recharged once every 24 hours, much like Soulstones can only be used once every 24 hours, it would prevent scripted abuse while allowing the casual player to have a meaningful play session and bringing back those out of the way spots.

 

[laurlo]

I am glad they are changing it back, my BOS is useless right now otherwise, and I am a legitimate player..

 

[Lunaticus]

Stalk much?...la

Ummm. . . Those of us who stalk you are much more stealthy. Mwuahahahahaha!!!

 

[Uvtha]

Well, I play siege, where gold scripting was never an issue in the first place, and where we dont have recall, and the BOS change effected me quite a good deal, as I used to run a fairly busy GM leather suit vendor, and I had to do a lot of barbed leather gathering. After the change it took like twice the time, running in and out of dungeons with gold and leather every 5 minutes. It just became too annoying, so I quit, and shut down the vendor.

As well all of the places I liked to hunt were out in the boondocks, and with the change they became basically impossible places to hunt because I would be loaded up with gold and other misc treasure in under 10 minutes, then I have to run, like 5 minutes to get to the bank, then back and it just became too much of a hassle. I stopped enjoying it, so I stop doing it. So as a result of the 2 things I spent most of my time on becoming incredibly annoying, my play time dropped by about 90%.

The issue is pretty simple you have to do one of 3 things:

1) Revert bos to some useable level
2) Lower weight on gold and resources
3) Lower ammount of gold and resources you can gather in a reasonable period of time.

When you get filled up in UNDER 10 minutes of playing... there has to be something done.

And I say just give us back the BOS.

(Oh, and make them stealable)

 

[jtw1984]

Maybe thats what should be done. Revert bags of sending but only allow a certain usage of charges within a 24 hour period. Not per bag, but per character?

 

[UOKaiser]

I said a casual player, not a junk collector.

Reason people have multiple houses filled whith junk most of uo players are junk collectors. " How many of us have every color suit for the invasion or houses filled with things we might need later. "One mans junk is anothers man treasure"
That is casual player after the abyss expansion. Lets see 5-15 item per corpse all imbuable. 1 charge per corpse or 2.Easily going to 500 charges a day. Casual player. We do not consider players that only play 1 hour a week in uo casual ether "wasnt there a poll out here with the average time a week a player from stratics play?".
Either way any limitation on bods will still make them useless. How many different characters people use a day. Usuallyif you gonna hunt for the day you stick with one if you gonna resource collect for the day you stick with another. Limiting charges will limit only the legit players. Those that use bos unattended don't care if they have them or not they are not there anyway it doesnt matter. Hasnt slowed them down at all unlike the poor player base wich have abandoned many areas especially in ish and worth less for players who are not powergamers to run resource venders.
The nerf of bos was not aimed at unattended gold farmers, it was a badly implemented way to try to curb the economy. It failed.

 

[It Lives]

I say Bring the BOS back and keep them how they were.

As many have said, it became such a pain in the arse to go hunting only to have to break up my game play every 5 minutes or so just to get my loot to the bank.

If any are like me I loot it all, smelt what I can and toss the rest. Doing so I overload quite fast and I am at the point now that I don't even bother to hunt.

Occasionally I will break down to get some leathers but only if i need them.

Bos are already limited you can only recharge them so often till they cannot be used at all(time to get more bos).

If the Team Does anything to the bos it should be a way to track and flag extreme usage of the Bos, to help locate script farmers/cheaters.

* Mabey make them 1st year vet rewards, tied to accounts and tracked and monitored. Leave them at 30 charges but infinitely rechargeable with fooogi so the quest for foogi can stay in game* Just a thought:]*

 

[Flora Green]

Casual players who only have 1-2 days a week to play long lengths of time will still be hurt by a limit on charges. Just revert BoS already to what they were and make them stealable.

 

[Karthcove]

Make the BOS a gold sink in itself - instead of having to charge it up just make it use so much gold per transaction. So many GP per stone sent sorta thing.

 

[Abyss]

BOS were never the problem. Revert them back and let the players be able to make their own gold again. Since BOS changes I'd say 7 out of 10 players stopped looting gold which made people need to buy it that much more. Gold is virtually worthless now anyway...people who do buy it can get it for 50-75 cents per mil now. Not a real good market to get into.

 

[Cogniac]

Yes. Limited uses per day. Yet another complicated limitation that has to be memorized and tracked by players. Certainly.

Also, this:

Just make the bags stealable and I'll be thrilled...la

One of the few things I agree with Rico about.

 

[Lady Aalia]

aye i think they should be stealable...

the globes are , right?

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

I'm not asking that they don't take them back to original use, I'm asking for a perhaps a limited use a day. Really, does the "casual player" need to use 200 or more charges every 24 hours? No, but a gold scriptor will...

This is the right kind of thinking.
Limits can be set up to let the caz player play and the scriptor foiled.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

Oh, and Raven, I'd be happy with a 1 chage per send, but 50 GP charged per stone weight of gold sent limitation (50 gold = 1 stone)

Im open to a mix that supports caz play. I just dont think going back to as was is smart.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

I have to say this was one of the most polite well thought out response threads I read in a while. Good job to the posters.

 

[hawkeye_pike]

When I returned to UO (Dec. 2007) the bags of sending had just vanished from the game. I never had the pleasure to actually utilize them. Thus, I do not miss them. And I keep asking myself if we really need them.

The only good reason for using Bags of Sending is that there are places where you cannot easily get back to (like the Doom Gauntlet or the Ilshenar dungeons). Even though, I didn't really consider it to be annoying if you have to return to the bank when your bags are full.

Maybe the UO world around me has changed too much while I was away. People gather things like crazy. Recalling out of Destard to store away the hides and recalling back is considered annoying, although it doesn't even take a minute. People are collecing magic crap items for imbuing??? (We don't even know whether these items will be useful at all! Besides, where do you store all that?) Running back into the Dark Wisp Dungeon takes maybe 3 minutes.

What's the big deal?

 

[Uvtha]

The only good reason for using Bags of Sending is that there are places where you cannot easily get back to (like the Doom Gauntlet or the Ilshenar dungeons). Even though, I didn't really consider it to be annoying if you have to return to the bank when your bags are full.

Maybe the UO world around me has changed too much while I was away. People gather things like crazy. Recalling out of Destard to store away the hides and recalling back is considered annoying, although it doesn't even take a minute. People are collecing magic crap items for imbuing??? (We don't even know whether these items will be useful at all! Besides, where do you store all that?) Running back into the Dark Wisp Dungeon takes maybe 3 minutes.

What's the big deal?

Well I cant recall on my shard, and you can't gate in many places, so that causes a lot of problems.
I mean do you think that it makes sense for a person to treck all the way into a place like a dungeon in ilsh. hunt for about 10 minutes, then have to treck all the way to the bank, then all the way back to the hunting spot? So that in an hour you are probably traveling just as much as you are hunting? That's ridiculous, and to me a clear indicator of a problem.
In the olden days it used to take at LEAST an hour to gather up 10k. Now it takes mere moments. If they decide to give us so much gold, they have to give us a way to move it around.

Its a much larger annoyance on siege, and yeah, its supposed to be the "hard" shard, but its not hard at all, its just annoying.
Its a problem with the game mechanics. Monsters are too weak, they give too much gold, the gold/resources weigh too much.
A good hunting experience should not be cut short in 10 minutes. There's a problem. BOS is a solution.

 

[Leaf]

The BOS nerf did nothing to hurt the scripters. It only screws up the honest players trying to play this game. Scripters will just create another script, push a key and walk away. They are not hurt by these nerfs because they have no personal time involved in playing the game. Those of us who are hunting in dungeons, trying to gather leather and walk back through and get out alive with our hides (no gating in dungeons where I play) are the ones the BOS nerf hurt. I personally am looking forward to having them back again.

 

[Aboo]

The BOS nerf did nothing to hurt the scripters. It only screws up the honest players trying to play this game. . .

Thank you for composing it so well!

 

[Connor_Graham]

Either bring them back the way they were or don't bring them back at all.

These half assed limitations that people seem to think would fit everyone's playstyle are nothing but that. Half assed.

 

[Aboo]

Either bring them back the way they were or don't bring them back at all.

These half assed limitations that people seem to think would fit everyone's playstyle are nothing but that. Half assed.

Now come on Connor don't mince words, okay? Tell us what you really think/feel! (I sure hope you realize I am teasing, you gave me a chuckle to read your response).

 

[^Wolfie^]

IMO, I don't feel a bos were introduced to send EVERYTHING to the bank. Gold, a few small items..yes. Leather? I'm not sure about everyone else...but I know what a PACK beetle/animal is really good for. Be damned if I waste my bos charges sending leather.... Don't pancake later when you see gold farming again.
As for whoever may think gold farming lowers prices on vendors?

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

I sell quite a few high end items on my vendors, the second I know gold is easily gotten again, the sooner my prices raise...not lower.

 

[Aboo]

IMO, I don't feel a bos were introduced to send EVERYTHING to the bank. Gold, a few small items..yes. Leather? I'm not sure about everyone else...but I know what a PACK beetle/animal is really good for. Be damned if I waste my bos charges sending leather.... Don't pancake later when you see gold farming again.
As for whoever may think gold farming lowers prices on vendors?

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

I sell quite a few high end items on my vendors, the second I know gold is easily gotten again, the sooner my prices raise...not lower.

I believe maybe they were intended for also sending leather, etc. with. I like to go to Destard to get my leather. When I take a blue beetle, at least 50% of the time, during the process of getting off loading the leather in it and then getting back on, some dragon, drake or wyvern has come along and killed it for me. So BOS are wonderful for leather, in my opinion.

Of course I only collect leather for myself, not to sell it to others and make a profit. I can see if you had a vendor selling it, you might have an issue with the BOS.

 

[Connor_Graham]

Now come on Connor don't mince words, okay?

I prefer to slice & dice rather than mince.

It's more fun that way.