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FYI: EM Kasaven requests to RBG

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CatLord

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Outcome of EM meeting as it relates to RBG, simplified:

1. The EMs would prefer the guild RBG to be non-TB so that those not wishing to join a faction or those with characters in other factions can still be a member of the RBG guild. RBG members will still have a vote to determine if they will stay in factions.

2. EMs will not support RBG the guild as part of RBG the idea if RBG the guild is biased in any way.

3. EMs will accept other RBG regiment guilds to be created as a compromise if RBG the guild stays factions.

4. EMs want a purpose for RBG the guild if RBG the idea has separate regiment guilds. They do not want RBG the guild to be the over seeing guild for RBG the idea. (The EM was uncertain of RBG the guild's function when he learned that RBG didn't have Haven as its town). EMs also presumed RBG the guild would be a good fit for Britain. Britain had been sought by another player but then declined. The RBG (Guild) GM declined protectorate of Britain.

5. Anyone is able to make a RBG regiment guild as long as they go through the proper application process.

6. RBG regiment guilds will not be allied (game technicality anyway as faction and non-faction guilds are not supposed to be allied).

7. Sonoma boot camp is NOT to be enforced as a method of training/recruiting.

8. The crown will recognize RGB regiment guilds that are Minax or Shadow Lord factions as rogue RGB units, they will not have the Crowns support or blessing. They would be roleplaying a turncoat. It may be possible to be Council of Mages faction.

9. Non-RBG guilds and individual characters would be accepted as RBG when they help with RBG related events. Being in a RBG guild is NOT a requirement for RBG recognition.

10. EMs wish to stress that RBG is a theme, not a guild. Because there is a guild called RBG there can be confusion. When the EM talks about RBG, they talk about the theme that everyone is part of. RBG the guild is but one regiment.

11. PGoH recognized as protectorate of Trinsinc. In the EM's words PGoH is a lot like RBG's function except they are not considered RBG as their claim precedes what is currently being established and they do not wish to be recognized as RBG.

12. These theories and others are up in the air, the EMs had a lot to consider.


My reply, to our cheered EM, after carefull consideration and meeting with the guildmates, other RBG guilds and several GMS...



"mind your own business"


Those that want to help, help... those that dont, dont.


Thank you.
 

Giggles

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There went that good idea.
 

Slickjack

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I'm on the sidelines here, since I missed the meeting, but it just seems as if Kasaven was explaining the way it IS. Not asking for approval from anyone...

RBG, the guild, is something that I will never join. That being said, my guild participates fully in every event arc as heavily as any guild on this shard. So by your definition Pitr, are we not worthy of recognition by the Queen if we aren't members of the GUILD RBG?

It seems like a few people are trying to dictate the way things go instead of following the path that the EMs have set for us.....
 

Aedon Durreah

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The EM made it clear that to have the full backing of the EM program, the RBG had to be open and inclusive to all. I think it made a great deal of sense. Also, training for the Catskills RBG would take place on Catskills, not Sonoma.

I cannot understand what the problem is here. The Royal Guard has been around for many years, I am sure a lot of us have our sashes still from past events. If we want to ride as a guard, show up at events, and wear your sash. In this way all can participate without the restrictions being imposed, and the Royal Guard remains autonomous of all guilds, and under the direction of the EM's.
 

Giggles

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The EM made it clear that to have the full backing of the EM program, the RBG had to be open and inclusive to all. I think it made a great deal of sense. Also, training for the Catskills RBG would take place on Catskills, not Sonoma.

I cannot understand what the problem is here. The Royal Guard has been around for many years, I am sure a lot of us have our sashes still from past events. If we want to ride as a guard, show up at events, and wear your sash. In this way all can participate without the restrictions being imposed, and the Royal Guard remains autonomous of all guilds, and under the direction of the EM's.
Hrm.. How do I word this....

Its the same problem it has always been. Control, dominance, dictatorships under the facade of being something else.

The first time I saw the RBG tag... I knew this right here would happen. No one person should have ever made a RBG "guild", or required anyone else to join it. It was never meant to be a certain group or guild for one person to have total control over (though of course it was said to be a open non dictatorship).
But if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then.... its a duck!

But I am sure the argument will be... "Well this is how OUR group is deciding to participate, though we hold no control or authority over RBG *cough*, HOWEVER if you want to be a part of RBG you should join this guild we made for it!"

Wait, what?
 

Flutter

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RBG, the guild, is something that I will never join. That being said, my guild participates fully in every event arc as heavily as any guild on this shard. So by your definition Pitr, are we not worthy of recognition by the Queen if we aren't members of the GUILD RBG?
We umm... "disagree" a lot Lykor but some things we just agree spot-on with.
 

Flutter

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The EM made it clear that to have the full backing of the EM program, the RBG had to be open and inclusive to all. I think it made a great deal of sense. Also, training for the Catskills RBG would take place on Catskills, not Sonoma.

I cannot understand what the problem is here. The Royal Guard has been around for many years, I am sure a lot of us have our sashes still from past events. If we want to ride as a guard, show up at events, and wear your sash. In this way all can participate without the restrictions being imposed, and the Royal Guard remains autonomous of all guilds, and under the direction of the EM's.
Exactly. Many of us have characters we consider representative of the "Royal Guard" no guild necessary. As it should have stayed. (IMO)
 

Aedon Durreah

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Hrm.. How do I word this....

Its the same problem it has always been. Control, dominance, dictatorships under the facade of being something else.

The first time I saw the RBG tag... I knew this right here would happen. No one person should have ever made a RBG "guild", or required anyone else to join it. It was never meant to be a certain group or guild for one person to have total control over (though of course it was said to be a open non dictatorship).
But if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then.... its a duck!

But I am sure the argument will be... "Well this is how OUR group is deciding to participate, though we hold no control or authority over RBG *cough*, HOWEVER if you want to be a part of RBG you should join this guild we made for it!"

Wait, what?
Agreed fully.

RPing RBG is a great thing It opens up many avenues for interaction and RP. But it should be an offshoot of the EM program. That is the only way to keep it independent and above board.
 

Aedon Durreah

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Typical disinformation. That's the same old problem from the same few people here on the boards and ingame.

No one was or is or will be *required* to join RBG the guild in order to RP a Royal Britannian Guard.

Anyone at any time is welcome to join RBG public events - because RBG events are always public - wearing the old RBG sashes, proclaiming themselves Royal Britannian guards. Do you imagine they would be made fun of or turned away as "not one of us"? Quite the contrary.

How could RBG the guild possibly enforce any requirement that people wanting to RP a guard must be members of RBG the guild? Connive with the devs to disallow any other references on Catskills in names, tags, and ingame discussion? Of course not, so your claim makes no sense.

PS. Pitr does not have "total control" over the RBG. Believe what you will. On the other hand, by your own choice, you never got involved so you have no direct knowledge - but you certainly do have your prejudices. Those show so very clearly in your posts.
I have no prejudices against Pitr. I think he has a lot of ideas knocking around in his head. He just has issues with follow through and implementation.
But I also see many problems associated with any one player speaking for the Royal Guard.

All that can come of attempting this is confusion and problems. The Royal Guard should be just that. Control of the unit falls to Queen Dawn and her advisors, and not to any of us. It is the best way to follow through on this.
 

Slickjack

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I think I'm just pissed that our EMs are treated like dirt in game and on the boards sometimes.
I think we've had a few EMs leave Catskills already.
I think being an EM is a thankless job and they put up with enough **** without someone sayin "mind your own business"
I think that this crap is the number one reason why Pitr and I don't see eye to eye anymore.
I think even though I missed Sundays meeting, Podo's recap was pretty insightful.

I know I've attended RBG meetings on other shards where the EMs set the tone and lead and there weren't issues like this.

I know certain things I'm hearing and in the past I ignored, I'm seeing very differently now.

I know crap like this will only keep the number of "new" RPers down because most wouldn't want their limited play-time to be consumed with more BS like this thread.

Toodles.
 

Aedon Durreah

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I think I'm just pissed that our EMs are treated like dirt in game and on the boards sometimes.
I think we've had a few EMs leave Catskills already.
I think being an EM is a thankless job and they put up with enough **** without someone sayin "mind your own business"
I think that this crap is the number one reason why Pitr and I don't see eye to eye anymore.
I think even though I missed Sundays meeting, Podo's recap was pretty insightful.

I know I've attended RBG meetings on other shards where the EMs set the tone and lead and there weren't issues like this.

I know certain things I'm hearing and in the past I ignored, I'm seeing very differently now.

I know crap like this will only keep the number of "new" RPers down because most wouldn't want their limited play-time to be consumed with more BS like this thread.

Toodles.
Toodles, If I could + rep you I would. Well said.
 

hawkeye_pike

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What's all this quarreling about? Can someone explain, in 2 sentences?

To my understanding, the RBG is a role playing guild that wants to support the town guards against illegal activities in the cities. I assume they target mostly activities of criminals and other scoundrels (i.e. evil players/guilds).

I find this idea quite interesting and fun since the NPC guards are quite redundant in Trammel, and I don't see what's there to quarrel about. Technically, nobody can "claim" or "own" a town in UO, it is impossible. And as long as the RBG guarantee safety in the cities, they do have a right to exist. (There may be certain guilds that will put this goal to a test in the near future, hehe.)

Can't we all leave it at that and put the personal issues aside?
 

Podolak

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I think when RBG, the guild was in its infancy its leaders were not exactly sure how things were going to work, in relation to RBG the RP event from the EMs. I think there were mistakes made by RBG leadership and members, myself included. I also believe there were misinterpretations made by those outside of RBG.

I do not mind being criticized but I do feel very bad for those who have stayed away from the RBG EM program because of mistakes made by me and others. I also feel bad for People like Pandora who were made to feel they had to join Factions and RBG, the guild. Pandora fortunately can roll with the punches and will continue to support the RBG program. I hope others who were put off by my and others actions will reconsider being part of the EM events.

If anyone is made to feel the need to join RBG the guild please let me know. You should never feel the need to join RBG the guild to be part of the RBG program.

It should also be pointed out that any guild can apply to be a protector (or RBG regiment if you wish) of a town. As long as you support Queen Dawn's efforts and report to the EM played Commander this is fine. I would have liked to see CoD protect Umbra instead of Pandora having to create a satellite guild.

I hope to see more supporting this EM program, The Royal Guard. I also hope that some support the opposing side to allow for enhanced conflict. We need bad guys too. If you wish to see the direction I am taking my involvement in the "bad" side I can point you to my Ickles the Insane thread.
 
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KodozPGoH

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I sincerely hope that Elder EM Kasaven and EM Barnaby understands that Pitr and whomever else thought it would be a good idea to tell them to mind their own business are far from representative of our fine shard, and that we want any and all assistance that the EM's can give us, and look forward to all future events even as we are extremely thankful for those that have been done previously.
 

Scarst

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Saying "mind your own business" to a person whose sole purpose is to bring great events and stories to our shard is just being a ****.
Agreed, the EM's can't play favorites and honestly they had to do that in order to try to help you.

I sincerely hope that Elder EM Kasaven and EM Barnaby understands that Pitr and whomever else thought it would be a good idea to tell them to mind their own business are far from representative of our fine shard, and that we want any and all assistance that the EM's can give us, and look forward to all future events even as we are extremely thankful for those that have been done previously.
Wha.... rr Kodoz I think you mean EM Natheal not sure who EM Barnaby as we've never had an EM Barnaby.
 

Podolak

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Perhaps Catlord is a secret agent of Ix Tab? Do we know who's side the Meer are on?
 

Slickjack

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Agreed, the EM's can't play favorites and honestly they had to do that in order to try to help you.
Help who? I think you're referring to RBG, maybe?

I can't recall the EMs ever helping me on anything, although I'm counting on them during the November Rares Festival, although that will be a game-wide event that Catskills is hosting, so hopefully that won't be considered a "personal" favor....

I don't think I have any more to add, and I'm sure you'll see more of us participate in our own limited "RP" way during future events.
 

Giggles

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Hrm.. all I saw in regards to my comment was this responce...

"We are sorry to inform you that you don't know what you are talking about. Please leave the discussion to those of us who attend the meetings and take UO as serious business. We all know you play UO simply for profit. You are not one of us. Pitr is god-cat bow down to him. That is all."

Yea, I think that is a fair translation :p .
 

Podolak

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Hrm.. all I saw in regards to my comment was this responce...

"We are sorry to inform you that you don't know what you are talking about. Please leave the discussion to those of us who attend the meetings and take UO as serious business. We all know you play UO simply for profit. You are not one of us. Pitr is god-cat bow down to him. That is all."

Yea, I think that is a fair translation :p .
OMG! Giggles RPs a merchant and real-estate broker!

Blacksmiths used to be the ultimate evil but I think we've found a new one.
 

Giggles

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OMG! Giggles RPs a merchant and real-estate broker!

Blacksmiths used to be the ultimate evil but I think we've found a new one.
Who Me!?!?!

Nah I simply sit on the balcony laughing at the performance and on occation I throw popcorn. :lol: :popcorn:

However, if you happen to know the date/time that your house will fall in the future, please send me a PM. For research purposes only of course :p .
 

Podolak

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However, if you happen to know the date/time that your house will fall in the future, please send me a PM. For research purposes only of course :p .
My castle full of rares and gold checks has "In Danger Of Collapsing" on the sign, should I be concerned?
 

Giggles

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My castle full of rares and gold checks has "In Danger Of Collapsing" on the sign, should I be concerned?
Nope that's perfectly normal! Where is it located? :lol:
 

Giggles

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Quoting myself:

"The quarreling is about the animosity on these boards that always crops when Pitr, myself, and a few others post here.

We could leave the quarreling behind but we won't, as our history shows."
Whos quarreling?

Just because I am not an active RP member, does not mean I cannot comment on my thoughts and feelings behind it. I comment on many threads and discussions every week. I'm sorry if my opinion bothers you, or makes you uncomfy, or makes you feel threatened. Apparently disagreeing with you amounts to quarreling now?

My opinion is just that... my opinion. Some people agree with it, some people don't. Stop getting so defensive. After all, I just misunderstood what is going on because I am a feeble outsider who is not tuned in to the super secret uber intelligence I would receive by going to meetings. You have nothing to prove or disprove to me :) .
 

AnneNomilly

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First, let me say, this has nothing to do with anyone who is involved or posting on this matter. I would feel exactly the same way and make exactly the same statements if it were, say, Aedon who I consider a friend, or even Vallend who is like a brother to me. The only difference being, if I were saying it to them, I'd most likely be hurling something at their heads as well.

I also have to say that I really do not care what has been done on any other shard. This is not any other shard. Quite simply, it is Catskills and it is my home and has been for quite some time. The matters of Baja, Sonoma, Chessy, Atlantic, etc. do not concern me over much.

What does concern me greatly is when an honorable, long standing institution such as the Royal Guard becomes the basis for sniping and arguing and telling the Event Moderators to "mind their own business". Actually, the Royal Guard IS their business. If you go to the UO Herald and do a search, you will quickly find the that Royal Guard is part of the lore of the land. Several members are introduced to New Players as important people in history.

Going on further with history, the Royal Britannian Guard has always been a part of the fundamental background of the Event Moderator stories and has always fallen under their command/authority. It is an extension of the Crown and the commander has long been considered an important part of the Ruling Council. I believe this gives the basis to say that the Royal Guard is open to all and is above any one guild or collection of guilds as we know them.

Since the discussion has been about role playing, please bear with me while I set a scene of how I, personally, have always seen the Guard. Please believe the names I use here are only for the purposes of illustrating a point I'm trying to make which I hope will become clear.

--------------------------------------------------------
A discreet cough interrupted the argument currently becoming overheated between the normally genteel ladies Anne and Flutter. Glaring at the intruder, they both shouted, "WHAT?!"

The messenger looked extremely uncomfortable and more than a little wary, especially as both ladies had heavy jars lifted over head as though ready to bash each other or anyone else that might try to come between them.

"My apologies but there is urgent news and you are needed," he said clearing his throat so as not to appear cowed. "Skara has come under attack and the citizens are being slaughtered in the streets. Strange magical creatures are appearing and terrorizing all. The buildings burn even as I deliver the call."

As the reality of what the messenger said sank in, both ladies looked at each other and nodded. Flutter ran to grab her armor and sword and whistled shrilly for her trusted mount as Anne grabbed her potions and bandages. Both knew that, regardless of their differences, their combined strengths would be needed if this threat were to be dealt with. Flutter reached for Anne who swung up behind her and they flew to answer the call. All thoughts of their arguments and differences were put aside as they prepared to stand together, side by side and back to back, to defend their homes and the homes of their friends.
--------------------------------------------------------

To me the Royal Guard is, and always has been, outside of petty differences and larger than one guild or one person. Do you wish to play a fully trained and seasoned soldier who has seen much of war? Do you wish to play a lord or peasant with their own lives and worries to contend with? To defend your homes, your lands, even your families, would you not drop every difference and band together to fight, to lay down your lives?

It's not our place to develop guilds stating we are RBG. It's not our place to tell the EM's this is none of their business. It's exactly their business. It's for the very security of our lands and it's for everyone. This land we live in is not called Pitr's Sosaria or Anne's Sosaria or Flutter's Sosaria. It is, quite simply, called Sosaria. It belongs to us all.

The RBG should never, ever be used as an instrument to divide us. The flag and sash of the Royal Britannian Guard should unite ALL when called to serve.

I truly believe in my heart our EM's tried to accomodate and help what they saw as something the players wanted. They made a very noble try at helping foster that while saying from the beginning that NO ONE could be excluded. However, Pitr, by your own words you declared that you look after your own first. Believe me when I say, that is truly how it should be. However, NOT under the auspices of the Royal Guard.

I believe in my heart this is why the Royal Guard was never before, and I do not believe ever intended, to be a guild. We all know the reality is that guilds are subject to fighting within and without, amongst themselves, their allies and, yes, even spies and infiltrators. But the Royal Britannian Guard is above that. It is above our squabbles and our differences. It is above and beyond looking out for your own. The Royal Guard is our one shining example to rise above all that and become one. Not under the tag of any one guild but under the proud banner of ALL guilds and people standing side by side.

If you truly believe the only way that you can role play a guard is by forming a guild, by all means, do so. Call it whatever you wish, short of calling it the Royal Britannian Guard. That name belongs to all who lay down their differences and even their lives to defend when called.

I apologize for being so long winded on this. This is truly a subject that is near and dear to me as a long time resident of Catskills and proud defender of our lands through many battles.
 

Giggles

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First, let me say, this has nothing to do with anyone who is involved or posting on this matter. I would feel exactly the same way and make exactly the same statements if it were, say, Aedon who I consider a friend, or even Vallend who is like a brother to me. The only difference being, if I were saying it to them, I'd most likely be hurling something at their heads as well.

I also have to say that I really do not care what has been done on any other shard. This is not any other shard. Quite simply, it is Catskills and it is my home and has been for quite some time. The matters of Baja, Sonoma, Chessy, Atlantic, etc. do not concern me over much.

What does concern me greatly is when an honorable, long standing institution such as the Royal Guard becomes the basis for sniping and arguing and telling the Event Moderators to "mind their own business". Actually, the Royal Guard IS their business. If you go to the UO Herald and do a search, you will quickly find the that Royal Guard is part of the lore of the land. Several members are introduced to New Players as important people in history.

Going on further with history, the Royal Britannian Guard has always been a part of the fundamental background of the Event Moderator stories and has always fallen under their command/authority. It is an extension of the Crown and the commander has long been considered an important part of the Ruling Council. I believe this gives the basis to say that the Royal Guard is open to all and is above any one guild or collection of guilds as we know them.

Since the discussion has been about role playing, please bear with me while I set a scene of how I, personally, have always seen the Guard. Please believe the names I use here are only for the purposes of illustrating a point I'm trying to make which I hope will become clear.

--------------------------------------------------------
A discreet cough interrupted the argument currently becoming overheated between the normally genteel ladies Anne and Flutter. Glaring at the intruder, they both shouted, "WHAT?!"

The messenger looked extremely uncomfortable and more than a little wary, especially as both ladies had heavy jars lifted over head as though ready to bash each other or anyone else that might try to come between them.

"My apologies but there is urgent news and you are needed," he said clearing his throat so as not to appear cowed. "Skara has come under attack and the citizens are being slaughtered in the streets. Strange magical creatures are appearing and terrorizing all. The buildings burn even as I deliver the call."

As the reality of what the messenger said sank in, both ladies looked at each other and nodded. Flutter ran to grab her armor and sword and whistled shrilly for her trusted mount as Anne grabbed her potions and bandages. Both knew that, regardless of their differences, their combined strengths would be needed if this threat were to be dealt with. Flutter reached for Anne who swung up behind her and they flew to answer the call. All thoughts of their arguments and differences were put aside as they prepared to stand together, side by side and back to back, to defend their homes and the homes of their friends.
--------------------------------------------------------

To me the Royal Guard is, and always has been, outside of petty differences and larger than one guild or one person. Do you wish to play a fully trained and seasoned soldier who has seen much of war? Do you wish to play a lord or peasant with their own lives and worries to contend with? To defend your homes, your lands, even your families, would you not drop every difference and band together to fight, to lay down your lives?

It's not our place to develop guilds stating we are RBG. It's not our place to tell the EM's this is none of their business. It's exactly their business. It's for the very security of our lands and it's for everyone. This land we live in is not called Pitr's Sosaria or Anne's Sosaria or Flutter's Sosaria. It is, quite simply, called Sosaria. It belongs to us all.

The RBG should never, ever be used as an instrument to divide us. The flag and sash of the Royal Britannian Guard should unite ALL when called to serve.

I truly believe in my heart our EM's tried to accomodate and help what they saw as something the players wanted. They made a very noble try at helping foster that while saying from the beginning that NO ONE could be excluded. However, Pitr, by your own words you declared that you look after your own first. Believe me when I say, that is truly how it should be. However, NOT under the auspices of the Royal Guard.

I believe in my heart this is why the Royal Guard was never before, and I do not believe ever intended, to be a guild. We all know the reality is that guilds are subject to fighting within and without, amongst themselves, their allies and, yes, even spies and infiltrators. But the Royal Britannian Guard is above that. It is above our squabbles and our differences. It is above and beyond looking out for your own. The Royal Guard is our one shining example to rise above all that and become one. Not under the tag of any one guild but under the proud banner of ALL guilds and people standing side by side.

If you truly believe the only way that you can role play a guard is by forming a guild, by all means, do so. Call it whatever you wish, short of calling it the Royal Britannian Guard. That name belongs to all who lay down their differences and even their lives to defend when called.

I apologize for being so long winded on this. This is truly a subject that is near and dear to me as a long time resident of Catskills and proud defender of our lands through many battles.
Very, VERY well said. *Applauds*
 

Flutter

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I :heart: AnneNomilly, she's a smart chick. People should listen to her.



PS Everyone knows I woulda won the fight anyways...
 

Aedon Durreah

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First, let me say, this has nothing to do with anyone who is involved or posting on this matter. I would feel exactly the same way and make exactly the same statements if it were, say, Aedon who I consider a friend, or even Vallend who is like a brother to me. The only difference being, if I were saying it to them, I'd most likely be hurling something at their heads as well.

I also have to say that I really do not care what has been done on any other shard. This is not any other shard. Quite simply, it is Catskills and it is my home and has been for quite some time. The matters of Baja, Sonoma, Chessy, Atlantic, etc. do not concern me over much.

What does concern me greatly is when an honorable, long standing institution such as the Royal Guard becomes the basis for sniping and arguing and telling the Event Moderators to "mind their own business". Actually, the Royal Guard IS their business. If you go to the UO Herald and do a search, you will quickly find the that Royal Guard is part of the lore of the land. Several members are introduced to New Players as important people in history.

Going on further with history, the Royal Britannian Guard has always been a part of the fundamental background of the Event Moderator stories and has always fallen under their command/authority. It is an extension of the Crown and the commander has long been considered an important part of the Ruling Council. I believe this gives the basis to say that the Royal Guard is open to all and is above any one guild or collection of guilds as we know them.

Since the discussion has been about role playing, please bear with me while I set a scene of how I, personally, have always seen the Guard. Please believe the names I use here are only for the purposes of illustrating a point I'm trying to make which I hope will become clear.

--------------------------------------------------------
A discreet cough interrupted the argument currently becoming overheated between the normally genteel ladies Anne and Flutter. Glaring at the intruder, they both shouted, "WHAT?!"

The messenger looked extremely uncomfortable and more than a little wary, especially as both ladies had heavy jars lifted over head as though ready to bash each other or anyone else that might try to come between them.

"My apologies but there is urgent news and you are needed," he said clearing his throat so as not to appear cowed. "Skara has come under attack and the citizens are being slaughtered in the streets. Strange magical creatures are appearing and terrorizing all. The buildings burn even as I deliver the call."

As the reality of what the messenger said sank in, both ladies looked at each other and nodded. Flutter ran to grab her armor and sword and whistled shrilly for her trusted mount as Anne grabbed her potions and bandages. Both knew that, regardless of their differences, their combined strengths would be needed if this threat were to be dealt with. Flutter reached for Anne who swung up behind her and they flew to answer the call. All thoughts of their arguments and differences were put aside as they prepared to stand together, side by side and back to back, to defend their homes and the homes of their friends.
--------------------------------------------------------

To me the Royal Guard is, and always has been, outside of petty differences and larger than one guild or one person. Do you wish to play a fully trained and seasoned soldier who has seen much of war? Do you wish to play a lord or peasant with their own lives and worries to contend with? To defend your homes, your lands, even your families, would you not drop every difference and band together to fight, to lay down your lives?

It's not our place to develop guilds stating we are RBG. It's not our place to tell the EM's this is none of their business. It's exactly their business. It's for the very security of our lands and it's for everyone. This land we live in is not called Pitr's Sosaria or Anne's Sosaria or Flutter's Sosaria. It is, quite simply, called Sosaria. It belongs to us all.

The RBG should never, ever be used as an instrument to divide us. The flag and sash of the Royal Britannian Guard should unite ALL when called to serve.

I truly believe in my heart our EM's tried to accomodate and help what they saw as something the players wanted. They made a very noble try at helping foster that while saying from the beginning that NO ONE could be excluded. However, Pitr, by your own words you declared that you look after your own first. Believe me when I say, that is truly how it should be. However, NOT under the auspices of the Royal Guard.

I believe in my heart this is why the Royal Guard was never before, and I do not believe ever intended, to be a guild. We all know the reality is that guilds are subject to fighting within and without, amongst themselves, their allies and, yes, even spies and infiltrators. But the Royal Britannian Guard is above that. It is above our squabbles and our differences. It is above and beyond looking out for your own. The Royal Guard is our one shining example to rise above all that and become one. Not under the tag of any one guild but under the proud banner of ALL guilds and people standing side by side.

If you truly believe the only way that you can role play a guard is by forming a guild, by all means, do so. Call it whatever you wish, short of calling it the Royal Britannian Guard. That name belongs to all who lay down their differences and even their lives to defend when called.

I apologize for being so long winded on this. This is truly a subject that is near and dear to me as a long time resident of Catskills and proud defender of our lands through many battles.

Huzzah and tons of hugs Anne.
 

outcry

Slightly Crazed
Supporter
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First, let me say, this has nothing to do with anyone who is involved or posting on this matter. I would feel exactly the same way and make exactly the same statements if it were, say, Aedon who I consider a friend, or even Vallend who is like a brother to me. The only difference being, if I were saying it to them, I'd most likely be hurling something at their heads as well.

I also have to say that I really do not care what has been done on any other shard. This is not any other shard. Quite simply, it is Catskills and it is my home and has been for quite some time. The matters of Baja, Sonoma, Chessy, Atlantic, etc. do not concern me over much.

What does concern me greatly is when an honorable, long standing institution such as the Royal Guard becomes the basis for sniping and arguing and telling the Event Moderators to "mind their own business". Actually, the Royal Guard IS their business. If you go to the UO Herald and do a search, you will quickly find the that Royal Guard is part of the lore of the land. Several members are introduced to New Players as important people in history.

Going on further with history, the Royal Britannian Guard has always been a part of the fundamental background of the Event Moderator stories and has always fallen under their command/authority. It is an extension of the Crown and the commander has long been considered an important part of the Ruling Council. I believe this gives the basis to say that the Royal Guard is open to all and is above any one guild or collection of guilds as we know them.

Since the discussion has been about role playing, please bear with me while I set a scene of how I, personally, have always seen the Guard. Please believe the names I use here are only for the purposes of illustrating a point I'm trying to make which I hope will become clear.

--------------------------------------------------------
A discreet cough interrupted the argument currently becoming overheated between the normally genteel ladies Anne and Flutter. Glaring at the intruder, they both shouted, "WHAT?!"

The messenger looked extremely uncomfortable and more than a little wary, especially as both ladies had heavy jars lifted over head as though ready to bash each other or anyone else that might try to come between them.

"My apologies but there is urgent news and you are needed," he said clearing his throat so as not to appear cowed. "Skara has come under attack and the citizens are being slaughtered in the streets. Strange magical creatures are appearing and terrorizing all. The buildings burn even as I deliver the call."

As the reality of what the messenger said sank in, both ladies looked at each other and nodded. Flutter ran to grab her armor and sword and whistled shrilly for her trusted mount as Anne grabbed her potions and bandages. Both knew that, regardless of their differences, their combined strengths would be needed if this threat were to be dealt with. Flutter reached for Anne who swung up behind her and they flew to answer the call. All thoughts of their arguments and differences were put aside as they prepared to stand together, side by side and back to back, to defend their homes and the homes of their friends.
--------------------------------------------------------

To me the Royal Guard is, and always has been, outside of petty differences and larger than one guild or one person. Do you wish to play a fully trained and seasoned soldier who has seen much of war? Do you wish to play a lord or peasant with their own lives and worries to contend with? To defend your homes, your lands, even your families, would you not drop every difference and band together to fight, to lay down your lives?

It's not our place to develop guilds stating we are RBG. It's not our place to tell the EM's this is none of their business. It's exactly their business. It's for the very security of our lands and it's for everyone. This land we live in is not called Pitr's Sosaria or Anne's Sosaria or Flutter's Sosaria. It is, quite simply, called Sosaria. It belongs to us all.

The RBG should never, ever be used as an instrument to divide us. The flag and sash of the Royal Britannian Guard should unite ALL when called to serve.

I truly believe in my heart our EM's tried to accomodate and help what they saw as something the players wanted. They made a very noble try at helping foster that while saying from the beginning that NO ONE could be excluded. However, Pitr, by your own words you declared that you look after your own first. Believe me when I say, that is truly how it should be. However, NOT under the auspices of the Royal Guard.

I believe in my heart this is why the Royal Guard was never before, and I do not believe ever intended, to be a guild. We all know the reality is that guilds are subject to fighting within and without, amongst themselves, their allies and, yes, even spies and infiltrators. But the Royal Britannian Guard is above that. It is above our squabbles and our differences. It is above and beyond looking out for your own. The Royal Guard is our one shining example to rise above all that and become one. Not under the tag of any one guild but under the proud banner of ALL guilds and people standing side by side.

If you truly believe the only way that you can role play a guard is by forming a guild, by all means, do so. Call it whatever you wish, short of calling it the Royal Britannian Guard. That name belongs to all who lay down their differences and even their lives to defend when called.

I apologize for being so long winded on this. This is truly a subject that is near and dear to me as a long time resident of Catskills and proud defender of our lands through many battles.
She is very right and this was very well spoken, Anne is the one of the great people in this game who have true honor and while she may be shocked that I say this I have always listen with an openness to her opinions and given her the respect she always deserves
 

Black Sun

Grand Poobah
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I have very little interaction with the RP community, but I think I'm understanding the situation correctly. I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong.

My 2 cents is that anyone telling the EM to "mind their own business" when the EM tries to clarify (mis)information regarding one of their events/story lines is just rude and ungrateful. After all the EM's (every one of them in the program, not just ours) do for our shards they deserve more respect than to be told to "mind their own business".
 

Giggles

Wielder of Ebil Cookies
Moderator
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Well.. All I know is I hope you EM's realize that the opinion of Pitr/Oriana rarely, if ever, reflects the opinions of Catskills as a whole. I personally love the hard work you guys do. Please don't let this discourage you.

Keep on rocking!!!
 

Gheed

Certifiable
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Always the same folks squabbling. Doesn't matter what the guild is named. Call it Protectors of Sossaria (PoS) and read the posts on how that is RBG's job and no PoS has the right to interfere.

I have a char in RBG. I don't agree with anyone here including the op. I will tell you Pitr has not once asked me to do anything but play the part a little more. Even that has been merely hinted at.

But I don't see Pitr rping any more than nearly everyone else here giving their two cents. Looking back, I wonder why Pitr even started the guild in the first place. I wonder why most of the rest of you even give a damn. I wonder how long this thread would be if EM events didnt hand out rares. I wonder why "I also have to say that I really do not care what has been done on any other shard. This is not any other shard. Quite simply, it is Catskills" and "If you go to the UO Herald and do a search, you will quickly find the that Royal Guard is part of the lore of the land" are in the same post.

I have always been interested in RP. I see very little of it. I join the RBG and folks come out of the woodwork to be sure to claim their turf "Trinsic is mine.. stay out" "Yew is mine stay out" "Haven is mine stay out" except we equip our persona shields (guild names) to our cause and bathe in our own self righteousness for the nobility of lore and un-rivaled sacrifice of a few good EM's.

The product:

1. Loosely knit story lines that do not mesh together or make much sense.
2. I think we have 3 or 4 magical crystals now.
3. several hundred additional [young] chars.
4. one helluva rares market.

I'm sitting in the cheap seats with just about everyone else and the view IS good here.
 

Thom

Lore Keeper
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I thought Anne was pretty well spot on with her comments. If you think she was wrong on some points, point them out and give your veiws instead of just saying that you would but it'd get lost in the noise. That doesn't really help anyone understand anything. Not everyone that agrees or disagrees with what's being said in this, or any other, thread actually posts. The way I see it RBG the guild was formed for people to be guards, whether they rp or not, under the supervision of the EM team with the leadership of the EM played character of Commander Kanlock. Everyone in RBG seemed rather happy with the arrangement until the other night when Elder EM Kasaven started speaking. He apparently said some things, I had to leave after the two hour mark of the meeting, that irritated a few of the RBG folks. Whether anyone meant to or not the impression was given by RGB the guild, in my opinion, that you needed to be in RBG the guild to be a part of RBG the program. Most likely due to both having the same name. Now for the part that will really bother some people. It's at the very least rude to tell the EM's to mind their own business when, as far as I could tell from the parts of the meeting I caught, they were just asking the guild that is supposedly the public face of the EM program to adopt policies that would allow the greatest number of interested people to participate in the program.

*standard discalimer so I don't get anybody else in trouble*
The views expressed in this post are solely my personal views and opinions and in no way reflect on the views and opinions of PGoH or any other person that may or may not be affiliated with the guild.
 

Black Sun

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The original dispute has nothing whatsoever to do with any event or story line or the EMs trying to clarify (mis)information.

I've explained the setting and the issues at some length elsewhere, as have others. If you are interested, the information is out there.

(I'm still trying to locate a complete, unedited log from last Monday if anyone has that.)
Regardless of what the dispute is or was about, telling the EM to "mind his own business" is rude and childish.

Besides, I have read what was posted elsewhere, I took the same thing away from it as I did from this thread.
 

Flutter

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The original dispute has nothing whatsoever to do with any event or story line or the EMs trying to clarify (mis)information.

I've explained the setting and the issues at some length elsewhere, as have others. If you are interested, the information is out there.

(I'm still trying to locate a complete, unedited log from last Monday if anyone has that.)
Regardless of what the dispute is or was about, telling the EM to "mind his own business" is rude and childish.

Besides, I have read what was posted elsewhere, I took the same thing away from it as I did from this thread.
It's always as if everyone else is just too stupid to understand and the only one who could possibly be right or have valid input is La Belle. (This I get from quoted text only)

Gheed, as to why people care I think it's just because there's absolutely no respect for anyone else regarding this issue... not even the EMs (as shown by Pitr's post above telling him to "mind his own business").
The royal guard is everyone's business. It is and has been a part of this community long before any RBG guild existed.

This has been said time and time again and I needn't repeat it. Anne's post is spot on. I didn't see what La Belle posted regarding her post but I do hope it was given the respect it deserved and wasn't told that she, too, has no idea what she's talking about.
 

Slickjack

Rares Fest Host | Cats Nov 2010
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
UNLEASHED
You know, this subject has gotten a lot of reads.
I know that some might wonder why mean ol' Lykor is meddling in RP affairs when he doesn't RP....

As any of you can read above, and a few have agreed, it just pisses me off that the "Great Communicator" was so rude to our EMs and claims he formed this opinion after speaking to MANY and several GMs, yet the only person that seems to side with him here is Ori. And even though I'm sure she would never say such things herself, she didn't say the first ill word about Pitr's rudeness that seems universally seen here as unacceptable.

My guild, which is of a pretty good size, always said that they weren't interested in participating in RP because of not understanding a lot of the history and being behind. This ugliness is just another reason or excuse for some to not join and I think it's a shame.

As far as people here for the "rares market" and the insinuation that it's the only positive thing that comes out of the EM program: bollocks!

I can, without hesitation, say that I'm the largest buyer of Rares on this shard and no Catskills item that I've been lucky enough to loot or buy or that any guild mate looted or bought has EVER left my museum. So that certainly doesn't "help" the so called great market....and every shard has guests for events trying to get items for themselves, but nothings keeping anyone from making players on other shards and doing the same thing.

Bottom line:
We need more people to participate in our EM events. Whether people are there for items, sashes, or just to hear some story line, does it really matter their motive?
Less spamming during the EMs speeches, less demanding for things, and more patience from everyone because coordinating these events HAS to be terribly difficult without player made problems....

Sorry for returning an ugly post with another ugly post.
 

Zosimus

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I was going to make a detailed reply to your post. You misunderstand a number of points. Aside from being too long, such a reply would be pointless in the middle of the noise, confusion and prejudice on this board.

To requote you on Elbert Hubbard:

"Never explain. Your friends do not need it and your enemies will not believe it anyway."
Wow just wow is all I can say. Taking an easy night off on my vacation and I decide to get on stratics to catch up and I read all these posts.

First, why reply to Anne's posts at all if you wasnt going to post a response to any misunderstanding she may have?

Second, its more of a troll post then a response truthfully.


Third, why are you quoting Hubbard in a video game forum?


Last but not least, HTF you consider her (Anne) an enemy when she does nothing but good for catskills?!?

Let me answer the last question for you because I know the swagger of board warrioring. You meant it to other so called enemies in a pixelated game, not directly to Anne but you could understand how it was directed to her indirectly.

If you also feel that the catskills forums are "prejudice" of your views then you should not post if you feel that way. Important people ( since you are using Hubbard as a quote) in history didnt give up and take the easy way out. Some community players do make an impact in a game but guess what? They didnt give up either but discussed their views. It's one thing to DISCUSS views in an adult manner but to take the easy way out and lump the catskills forums as "prejudice" to discussions then it is an epic of epic fails.
 

Zuckuss

Order | Chaos
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My my my, Look at what I have missed!


I would like to start off by thanking Captain Pike for providing us with the most valuable piece of info in this wonderful thread. Anne and Gheed get tied for second place!

I would also like to acknowledge that the words and blunt nature of Pitr's OP certainly were borderline "rude," and it was not the better choice of chosen words which would move towards a resolution.

That being said, Pitr has put in much time and involvement into an idea in which we would simply not have today to be bickering about. Pitr has purposely kept himself to a minimal level of leadership in RBG so that the town Captains can set forth their own procdeures and lead their regiments themselves. He has only stepped in when some opinions were presented involving further changing of the guild structure by a few members. The idea's voice by these members are still currently under discussion.

RBG has followed the EM policy to a T, making many strutural changes from the original template so that it would fall under the catagory of what UO considers to be an RP guild.

There have been no crossed words, no ill-will, no arguments or debates between RBG and the EM staff. They have each worked in a productive nature with one another to further the Catskills Roleplay community.

The idea was to create roleplay activity on Catskills, and since it's existance, RP activity had sparked significantly in game and on the boards. Where we were at a stage where there was very little discussion, little action, and little posting (save for the Pirates Black Market of course), we are now getting interaction, activity, and community participation. The several times I have personally been in game to participate in an event with Aegis, PGoH, and the Pirates, all have been successful and entertaining (at least to the several from all sides I have spoken to).




Regardless what many think of the nature of this thread, the majority of this thread, or at least a good deal of it, in my opinion, was the same usual folks taking any oppertunity allotted to attack, and running with it. Not to say that no one had a valid opinion, very few simply had a valid opinion without letting some of that Pitr biased slip out.

I don't think anything has happened that can't be fixed through conversation. Attacks however, wont help anyone.

Let us get back together, continuing to better the RP community on Cats?
 

hawkeye_pike

Babbling Loonie
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
If all the energy that's been put into this thread would flow into the community and/or RP projects, Catskills would be a much more fun shard to play on.

This is a fine example for what is (not) happening while such things are being discussed.
 

Zosimus

Grand Inquisitor
Alumni
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Your assumption that Anne and I are enemies is an example of prejudice. This is not meant as an attack on your character but it is a fact. Strong emotions are usually the precursors of prejudice. You saw my post. You like Anne (as you should). You may or may not like me from other posts I've made on Stratics - I don't really know. And you post while you are upset: "Wow just wow is all I can say," you begin. Out of this emotional fog, basing your judgment on inadequate information, you make inaccurate conclusions. Everyone does this, not just you. I do it too.
Let me SHOW you AGAIN since I already wrote this and you bypassed it.....

"Let me answer the last question for you because I know the swagger of board warrioring. You meant it to other so called enemies in a pixelated game, not directly to Anne but you could understand how it was directed to her indirectly."
 

Aedon Durreah

Village of Aegis
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I hope the EMs realize that the opinions of each player should matter and should be heard, whether or not they represent the opinions of some supposed "majority." (Do we have a door to door pollster who canvasses the shard recording opinions?)

And there is no "opinion of Pitr/Oriana."
Pitr has his opinions; I have mine. We are not two characters played by one person. I think that is easy to spot by our writing styles. lol
Pitr's style is Zen. Mine is Rococco.

Flutter, you don't actually know the totality of either of our opinions about the EMs, do you. You know just a fraction of the whole. Don't assume that Pitr and I discount the obvious dedication of our EMs, their hard work, and their service to the community just because we speak out when we see a problem. I won't presume speak for Pitr, but in my opinion the EMs are fundamentally good people with extremely creative ideas. They work hard for us. And, like us, they are entitled to make mistakes.

And - speaking for myself, I would rather hear frequent criticism than suffer endless praise.

I am a wee bit curious here Belle. Just what "mistakes" did the EM's make?

And as to writing styles, I myself lean towards snarky.*grins*
 
C

Corvak

Guest
Hey look, typical forum arguments. /sigh.

The only "mistake" was actually that half of the room was confused by the term RBG and the guild tag, [RBG].

The guild tag is not and never was required to be part of the RBG - the theme, or the group of those dedicated to defending Britannia. The boxed green letters are irrelevant here. The RBG consists of anyone who wants to stand up and defend a town. Some do it full time, and RP the role, some do it when called, at an EM event.

I see Victoria intends to make the Serpent's Hold RBG, and I welcome this with open arms. It's proof that we are NOT trying to be the only guards. As stated by the EM, an RBG group trying to run a town shall be met with their wrath. :)

The [RBG] guild is simply a group of friends who all want to RP and have a guild chat channel. We don't intend to be the only ones on the server RPing it, and as such, we took offense to the EM asking us to change our internal guild policies.

Perhaps the EMs were themselves confused, and thought we intended to gather everyone playing as RBG under our tag. But we'd be guilty of recieving special treatment from an EM in that case.

While the [RBG] tag may be True Britannian, I invite everyone else, regardless of factions, to create a regiment and interact with us in-character.
 

hawkeye_pike

Babbling Loonie
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The only "mistake" was actually that half of the room was confused by the term RBG and the guild tag, [RBG].

The guild tag is not and never was required to be part of the RBG - the theme, or the group of those dedicated to defending Britannia. The boxed green letters are irrelevant here. The RBG consists of anyone who wants to stand up and defend a town. Some do it full time, and RP the role, some do it when called, at an EM event.
Then what is the point of it? Everyone could declare themselves an RBG or not, it doesn't really matter when it comes to monster killing, does it? In this case, the RBG would merely be a theoretical RP construct without any "feature", am I right? After all, almost all players are dedicated to defending Britannia, whether or not they call themselves a Royal Britannian Guard.

Being member of an [RBG] guild however, would allow the guards to protect the town from evil guilds and interact technically (if war has been declared), which would be a much more practical approach in my opinion. This is the only way to establish a code and enforce certain rules, without being mocked by people who decide to simply put on a golden armor and wear a red sash.
 
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