M
Madrid_ls
Guest
How bad is the Greater Dragon Nerf? Just saw it in the patch notes. If they nerfed the Greater Dragon are they going to drop the required control slots?
What Patch notes?
Yeah I just read through the entire Patch Notes and saw it at the end.Great Dragons have been adjusted to reduce their damage output
One really does need to be patient and see what the Nerf really is. If anything, in the UHall forum, there is a thread announcing the patch notes.You have got to be kidding me. It's a 5 slot pet... so it's been reduced to what but still using 5 slots?
I say tamers go on strike... refuse to do another spawn with anyone and see how they hold up against the big bosses without that GD taking most of the damage!
Ok, *Looks nervous at the 1.0*rofl
Greater Dragon Nerf 1.0:
* Damage cap of 130 (Melee and Breath Attacks)
* Special attack change 10%, instead of 20%
* Special attacks fire no more than once every 30 seconds
* Breath fires no more than once per 45 seconds
* Breath and special attacks will never fire less than 15 seconds apart
* Tamers which are hidden and flagged aggressor against another player will be revealed when their dragon breath attack hits the player
I would disagree with the 130 Cap, only because it was not all that frequent, and yes I realize that argues against my position as in, well if it isn't all that frequent it isn't all that big a deal.
You have got to be kidding me. It's a 5 slot pet... so it's been reduced to what but still using 5 slots?
Another clarification.Oh wow, sorry, I didn't explain that well enough.What does the 10% vs 20% refer to? Damage? Duration? Both?
This is about rate of occurence. Most super boss-mobs in the game have a rate of occurence of 20% (1:5 hits unleashed a special move). The fact that the Greater Dragon kept this after being tamed was insane.
We've effectively halved that occurence rate to a much more acceptable rate of 10%, which is still upper-end, but not out of the range of other pets.
someone call the waaaambulance?You have got to be kidding me. It's a 5 slot pet... so it's been reduced to what but still using 5 slots?
I say tamers go on strike... refuse to do another spawn with anyone and see how they hold up against the big bosses without that GD taking most of the damage!
Most of this is changing the parameters of Damage Over Time.Yeah, the reveal part I'm totally fine with, as I don't PVP with GDs. PvP Tamers have other options anyway...the rest of it does affect PvM though. I'm curious to see what effect these changes will have in that venue.
No kidding? Join the club.The net effect of this is to extend the amount of time a Tamer will be required to expend (Think of it as a Time Sink) to achieve the same goal.
It for once, wasn't about the tamers. Besides they are getting all the new pets, stable slots etc. How isn't it more enjoyable?I really am not clear how this is going to make the game any more enjoyable for the majority of the Tamers.
The point is that they were overpowered. That is why they nerfed them. It will certainly improve gameplay and at least give events, peerless, spawns a little more challenge which does make it more enjoyable.I do understand the logic being applied, given the available information as to the why (aka what was the point) I am not at all sure this will improve the game play for the majority of Tamers.
you do realize that anything a tamer can do with a GD, a well-built dexxer can do faster and a bard can do (almost always) safer? the new tames are low-end. two extra stable slots are nice, but not game-improving and nowhere near an equal tradeoff. the GD was the first whiff of power that tamers have had since the control slot nerf. I can understand changes being made for PvP, but those changes should not bleed over into PvM. blehNo kidding? Join the club.
It for once, wasn't about the tamers. Besides they are getting all the new pets, stable slots etc. How isn't it more enjoyable?
The point is that they were overpowered. That is why they nerfed them. It will certainly improve gameplay and at least give events, peerless, spawns a little more challenge which does make it more enjoyable.
Of course you're unsure if itll make it more enjoyable for you, it's a nerf to a huge overpowered advantage tamers had.
The point is that they were overpowered. That is why they nerfed them. It will certainly improve gameplay and at least give events, peerless, spawns a little more challenge which does make it more enjoyable.
Of course you're unsure if itll make it more enjoyable for you, it's a nerf to a huge overpowered advantage tamers had.
I think it is of note, so I will bring this up.Yeah, I think (for me) it's less that the GD has gotten nerfed than that all the tamer haters out there "won". I'm not surprised or anything, I just found all the various "tamers are overpowered waaah" (and later the "screw you for anything at all independent of how you got it simply because you play a tamer") posts to be pretty much the essence of what I dislike about MMO communities, and it was nice to see them huff and puff in vain while it lasted. Oh well. It's been a good run. Just need to put in some thought as to what to do with my tamer now.
Quick note: Sampires were first indirectly nerfed with the change to leech weapons (which I think was stupid, hit leech sucks now imo) and directly when they made it so you had to keep the 99 necromancy to stay in vampire form. Also the nerf to evasion (which again was stupid imo) hit them a lil hard too.And if they wanted to "nerf" the sampire template would you be all for that too?
Enough said don't you think to make it clear who may be stating things more correctly....To say it takes 12 to 20 minutes is absolutely, blatantly false. This nerf was long overdue for those that hug drags in PvP.....
BS. Either your dragon sucks or it was not fully trained. I just took one of my middling drags out after reading this post to the Weald. Sent it against a full health swoop. Fight started at 12:40:26, ended at 12:43:03. That is about 2.5 minutes for a swoop. I suggest you pick better pets or get them trained up. To say it takes 12 to 20 minutes is absolutely, blatantly false. This nerf was long overdue for those that hug drags in PvP. Imagine that, we might actually have to be TAMERS again and heal/manage rather than just utter "all kill" and sit back. Wow.Ok tried the nerf'd greater on swoops, something I would do regularly to train them and get gold. So I had a good idea on what damage and speed should be involved. First, when only using magery and firebreath, time to do swoop is more than doubled. When using physical attack also it improves by about 25 %. Currently either of my cu's can do more damage than my greater and do it faster. My rune beetle does more damage quicker using magery. I know this was to make them less powerful in PVP. But the nerf will hurt PVM alot. My dread is also better now again swoops. I have seen a pally take a swoop down in around 2 minutes. The GD now is doing it in 12 to 20 minutes.
I had a guild mate take his cu to wind when I started at swoops by the time I had killed my first swoop he had made nearly 60000 gold. As I said previously I know that they were overpowered in PVP but then again so are archers, sampires and any other template that can kill you in full 70's in two hits. Draconi I ask you to rethink the damage done to monsters. Or reduce the number of control slots. GD were give 5 control slots because of their power, now they are effectively nerf'd to the level of a dread or at most a cu. Both of those pets do more damage now and need less slots.
Those against the tamer template say about time. Maybe but it should be fair. If you cut damage that much for a GD then no one in game should be able to two hit any player. Also, I gather this does not apply to the wild dragons. I never saw the need for a major nerf, but then I and alot of other pally PVM's have tilted with greaters and lived by using various strategies including realizing that the horrible fireball would time out and a running player can keep ahead of it until it did. The fireball also would do less damage the further it travelled. Timed right you would be hit for maybe 7 or 15 damage while you got to hits with a dragon slayer for 100 damage each time. Not a pvp tactic but a pvm one. The tactics are different and so are the uses, the current nerf affects both styles and one the PVM takes the bigger hit.
I know the Dev's only balance PVP and not PVM but that is flat out wrong. Balance is Balance, anytime you make a change like this you have to consider PVM too. Otherwise you are telling PVM to adapt and change tactics, while telling the PVP you do not have to adapt. We will do it for you.
I'm not trolling. As my post above states, I didn't see a difference. From a PvP standpoint, I think it's fine. From a PvM standpoint....suffice it to say that GD's made a lot of wannabe's THINK they were great tamers. It's nice to actually have them have to be tamers again. No trolling intended, just my personal experiences.Enough said don't you think to make it clear who may be stating things more correctly.
But seriously, it is nice that you are identifying that you applaud and approve the NERF for PvP and well screw PvMr's.
And no I am not going to be your platform for trolling.
What the heck the post is gone, if it was self deleted then I will leave this, if it was mod deleted, then delete this one as well or let me know and I will.
I don't dispute your efforts with your pet. I DO dispute the 12-20 minutes comment. Unless your dragons are poor representatives or not fully trained, this is simply not a true statement. No more and no less.You can disagree, but I stand, I vet and I train my pets constantly and I fight with them constantly. I know what it normally takes to do a swoop and I now how long it took tonight. I also know that my cu does between 75 to 100 damage consistantly against swoops tonight I my greater never got close to that. I seriously do not think a greater is a 5 slot anymore, not when 4 slot pets do more damage. The nerf was warranted for PVP yes but it affects more than PVP and it seriously affects it. I know that my arguing for a re-look is very likely a lost cause but I will. Tamers will adapt we always do but, those who constantly cry for the nerf of tamers need to adapt too. It is about Balance and there was no balance in the nerf. It benefits one style of play only.
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From a PvM standpoint....suffice it to say that GD's made a lot of wannabe's THINK they were great tamers. It's nice to actually have them have to be tamers again....
And you would know this TRUTH because you were there and timed the effort?I don't dispute your efforts with your pet. I DO dispute the 12-20 minutes comment. Unless your dragons are poor representatives or not fully trained, this is simply not a true statement. No more and no less.
You want to go watch my drag kill a swoop? You too are playing seriously with the concepts of truth (and validation). My concept of TRUTH was that waves' drags either 1.) SUCK or 2.) are not fully trained if it takes 12-20 minutes to kill a swoop after the nerf. No more, on less. Sorry if this simple concept is lost on you.And you would know this TRUTH because you were there and timed the effort?
You have been playing rather loosely with the concept of TRUTH all the while expressing your delight and glee that PvM tamers got a HUGE nerf from their perspective.
Expressing ones opinion is one thing, claiming you KNOW THE TRUTH of some one else's experience is quite another thing.
And as you like for people to be able to express their opinions, in my opinion you are stating VOLUMES about your ... real goal. (Notice how I am not saying your not even a tamer? Why? Easy because I can not prove it ).
So you be sure to tell everyone here the TRUTH of their statements that ... hum don't agree with your STATED TRUTH.
And look at your ... well for the board sake, argument style. You tell some one they are a lier because they don't agree with you and then say others should come seek you out so you can be the center of attention and how your being victimized, after all your only expressing your opinion, that anyone that doesn't agree with your opinion that Tamers should be nerf'd into oblivion, are plain ordinary liers.You want to go watch my drag kill a swoop? You too are playing seriously with the concepts of truth (and validation). My concept of TRUTH was that waves' drags either 1.) SUCK or 2.) are not fully trained if it takes 12-20 minutes to kill a swoop after the nerf. No more, on less. Sorry if this simple concept is lost on you.
And what is my "REAL" goal here enigma? Let me know. As far as my tamers, I have two legendary, and one that is 113 actual with 120 vet and 120 lore. When you show up to see my drag kill a swoop in WAY under 12-20 minutes I'll be happy to show them AND their paperdolls to you.
Debate lost. Thanks for playing. My offer stands...you want to come watch, I'm more than willing. Explain to me how I feel I'm being "victimized"? Talk about reaches. Again, I'm STILL waiting for you to expound on what my "real goal" is (stated twice now by you lol), you are determined that you have this "real goal" pegged, but you fail to state what it is. Perhaps because....I don't have one? This isn't a "platform" for me, it's an information exchange. The fact that I disagree with Wave's comments has obviously touched a raw spot with you. Sorry. As far as your other comments...perhaps you don't like when I call BS...BS???? The only "style" I don't like is when others pretend to know what my "real goal" is without a clue wtf they are debating. Any time you wish to watch, or meet my tamers, you are welcome to PM me. Goodnight.And look at your ... well for the board sake, argument style. You tell some one they are a lier because they don't agree with you and then say others should come seek you out so you can be the center of attention and how your being victimized, after all your only expressing your opinion, that anyone that doesn't agree with your opinion that Tamers should be nerf'd into oblivion, are plain ordinary liers.
Go find some other platform to .... well do the thing you call expressing an opinion, that others may call something else, but would just be told they are liers.
I am done with this
You have fun telling everyone else they are Wanna Bee's, deserved to have their world turned upside down etc. I think they will understand exactly were your coming from and what your real goal is.
Stop kidding yourself. That's not even close to being true.you do realize that anything a tamer can do with a GD, a well-built dexxer can do faster and a bard can do (almost always) safer?
They weren't supposed to be that powerful.the new tames are low-end. two extra stable slots are nice, but not game-improving and nowhere near an equal tradeoff. the GD was the first whiff of power that tamers have had since the control slot nerf.
Funny we said the GD shouldn't have bled over to PvP but since they have it's only right they nerf it for both.I can understand changes being made for PvP, but those changes should not bleed over into PvM. bleh
You're kidding right? And if they wanted to "nerf" the sampire template would you be all for that too? I've read pages of people who can solo spawns with that template... liars? Or overpowered? I just don't understand why all of you are so ridiculous about this. OF COURSE EA would do something... all of you do nothing but complain about it. Enough threads = do something. Doesn't make you right..
Honestly if they did it just for pvp I would have been just as happy, otherwise I could care less.That said...
I could understand tempering them a bit for PvP... that much damage is a bit much in one hit. I've been attacked in Fel Moonglow bank by someones GD... so I get it. BUT... I've also been hit by a Cu during a champ raid... that hurt ALOT!
Are you saying tamers never get loot? Then why do I get it on mine?The crying about GD's damage meaning the tamer gets all the loot? I can tell you with all honesty... I've done peerless and champ spawns with my guild for months now. 2 tamers with GD's.. one almost legendary mage and one legendary dexer.. several lower mages and dexers included. The tamers? NEVER GET A THING... The Dexer and the Mage ALWAYS get drops. That GD did nothing but allow the other players to play... and I hope that will still be the case.
Only until they figured out they were nerfed.But I agree that this did nothing more than allow all the haters an area to gloat and be even more rude. I wish they had done the change and just not told anyone... I bet the anti-tamer crowd would still be complaining.
That's a little melodramatic, doncha think?Are you going to be known as the Architect that finally, once and for all, removed Tamers from UO as a viable class, leaving it to be viable in only one aspect. Where Tamers can pit their pets against each other to win a Bet?
Look Wulf2k, you came here to voice your perspective that Greater Dragons had no place in UO, that Tamers that had and used them have not place in UO.That's a little melodramatic, doncha think?
You're implying tamers weren't viable before GDs? And they were viable before the mini-nerf, but not after? All the dexers and mages are gonna laugh at you when you show up to a spawn with your wimpy little GD that can't even do 300 points of damage in an entire second?
Step back, get some perspective.
Ohhh... Kay....Look Wulf2k, you came here to voice your perspective that Greater Dragons had no place in UO, that Tamers that had and used them have not place in UO.
Last I looked you expressed that opinion. Question is just how many times are you going to express the same opinion while attacking people, as in telling them what to do, what to think, how to dress etc.
Just how many times are you going to express an opinion you have already made clear.