[Discussion] I think it is time for to DECLARE

[of The Ring]

As the new owner of Nail's Collections, I am very proud. lol. I have an agreement with Nail to setup a museum in Great Lakes Luna City for the collections.

AND I CAN SWEAR THAT I WILL NOT DUPE ANY OF THE ITEMS


I am a legitament player with no bad records in UO. Furthermore, i have no idea how the hell people dupe them.

Well, i have to say this. I will not be selling any of the items now, for sure. But maybe after some time, i may do some trade for other rares.

So please feel free to tell me what you wish to trade for or what you are selling.

It is great to know there are so many rares collectors around to make rares worth collecting at this point.

 

[AtlanticVlad]

Cuses I want the plow

 

[Lily of Arirang]

Well, i have to say this. I will not be selling any of the items now, for sure. But maybe after some time, i may do some trade for other rares.

Darn it!

 

[Simon]

AND I CAN SWEAR THAT I WILL NOT DUPE ANY OF THE ITEMS

You mean you do not can dupe?

 

[Hemisphere]

So um..

As I understand it this guy got well and truly fingered as a hacker on another forum, because he bought a bunch of stuff that was being sold by a hacker.

Public apologies are in order from a lot of people then, right?

Or perhaps he hacked Nails and hijacked his Stratics/ICQ accounts etc etc! You never know

 

[DVI]

There are a few things you left out which I'm not going to get into, but yes the individual was accused of being a hacker when they are not.

 

[paulstew]

I am the owner of the Atlantic museum. I purchased those cloaks along with some other items that are now reoccurring in Of The Rings collection from Nails Warstein before he even sold anything to Of The Rings. This makes me extremely suspicious.

 

[Xel Naga]

I am the owner of the Atlantic museum. I purchased those cloaks along with some other items that are now reoccurring in Of The Rings collection from Nails Warstein before he even sold anything to Of The Rings. This makes me extremely suspicious.

Yep, somewhere along the line there's definitely something to be suspicious of. Unique items don't just magically appear in pairs, so whether or not of the ring had anything to do with duping the items is something we can't see for now if you claim you bought it from nails direct.

However, whether he likes it or not, apparently nails' collection has been duped at least once. So looks to me like we'll be seeing a lot more items for sale soon. I've already seen unnamed "brokers" spamming sales of crowns and heads of talkeesh.

Paul, you should post the coordinates of your museum so the people can see it and confirm for themselves, it was being requested in another thread.

 

[Halister Marner]

AND I CAN SWEAR THAT I WILL NOT DUPE ANY OF THE ITEMS

Either too late, or too false. I won't venture to guess which one. I'll stay away from any accusations due to the forum rules, but sadly they have been duped. I just checked out a few collections and sent out a few messages for confirmation, and received what I needed to confirm several formerly unique seer items being in multiple locations now.

 

[of The Ring]

I have been playing UO since 1998, but the sad part is not until 3 years ago then i realise there are actually so many rare items around in the game. So i started to get very curious over those items, and it has been driven me to wanting to get them.

I started out buying lots of gold just to purchase some low-end rares which i myself also did not know where they come from or how it was gotten. I had never been thinking that duping items were so easy and there were so many people doing it. After spending billions of golg buying all those junkie rares for some times, i realised there were actually someones who collects them and probably keep them for as long as they still like it.

The sad part was i had never check out any UO related sites, not until i was told stratics is a wonderful site for rares. That was when I happened to buy over some of those items from someone whom i do not know, who had hacked the account of the owner of those items which he was selling. Then all those rumours started to circulate on stratics rares forum.

At the time, i saw Nail's collection. I was so amazed by all those items which he was going to sell. I quickly PM him and try to negotiate for a deal. Finally, we managed to close the deal and a lot of people knew i bought it.

I was so excited. In my mind, all i wanted to do is to setup a museum and display all those items. I even gotten Nail's to write history for all those items i bought from him, but sadly, he only managed to do it for some of the items.

Shortly after that, people started to PM me to sell some of them items which they wanted. All i can said at that time was, i had never thought of selling any of them. All i said was please wait for my museum to be opened then we talked about it. Everyone is anticipating the opening of the museum. And due to RL, it was delayed for 1 month.

Till now, i have not been thinking of selling any of the items. Now the question is, if i am a person who is going to dupe the item and sell it for cash or gold, will i display them? especially those unique items. If so, does not it will rise some questions on the item and probably devalue it?

Then it comes to another question, is Nail's collections questionable? If so, then is he and his trust questionable? Well, basically i do not have all the answers, because i ony know Nail's through the deal. And furthermore, I have not been able to get him since 1 month ago. Well, if a person like Nails is questionable, how about those other rares collectors who are also actively collecting and trading rares on stratics?

Finally, i do not know how many pieces does each rare is produced in the game and how we know how many pieces are produced or found for each item? All i care is owning it and displaying them in my museum. I hope this can clarify my position. I simply collects them.

 

[DevilsOwn]

for myself, I have these facts...

there were unique items in Nails' collection

the collection was sold

the formerly unique items are now showing up in quantities... now showing up, not previously

I have an answer that suits me

 

[Elbryan Uthador]

for myself, I have these facts...

there were unique items in Nails' collection

the collection was sold

the formerly unique items are now showing up in quantities... now showing up, not previously

I have an answer that suits me

I think your above statement shows how narrow minded some people on this forum are. Do you really believe that the "Duped Stickied List" at the top of this forum has EVERYTHING that has ever been duped? Get a clue! There are accounts out there that have so many items that haven't been released to the public its sickening.

As for some of Nail's old collection being the source of some dupes, I know for a FACT the the Skull and Crown of Tal'keesh were duped from the other ones given out since his were stil in his castle as the dupes were released into the market.

As for "Rings" being completely innocent? I am not sure on that, but you would have to be a complete mental midget to open a museum and sell items that you are displaying that everyone knows there are limited quanities of. This I do not see him doing.

 

[DevilsOwn]

I thought we were discussing unique items, that's all I was discussing, anyway

have I been misinformed? are the items showing up now in duplicates not some of which previously there were only one?

if so, I stand corrected

if, on the other hand, there are now copies of items which there were not copies of during Nails' possession of then my statements hold true

and to answer your question, no, the stickied list most certainly will not contain all duped items...... if someone can make a buck by duping vendor bought garlic, they will

 

[Elbryan Uthador]

if, on the other hand, there are now copies of items which there were not copies of during Nails' possession of then my statements hold true[/COLOR]

The above statement makes my point. You, I , no one knows exactly what was duped when it was duped or how many were duped. Saying that the copies are from Nail's / Ring's collection shows a narrow sighted view.

Again, why would "Ring" start selling items that he is displaying in his musuem. That would be a stupid thing to do (If he has the dupes).

All I am saying is that someone is releasing items on hold accounts to the fencers and they are in turn putting them out for sale.

 

[DVI]

gain, why would "Ring" start selling items that he is displaying in his musuem. That would be a stupid thing to do (If he has the dupes).

I am not stating that I believe of the ring is a duper, merely exploring a possible scenario.

This could very easily be a situation where someone took advantage of another individual, if no one can prove that nails did not dupe the items, and suddenly after he sells his collection multiples of both unique and very limited items begin to appear you're forced to assume it was either the buyer or the seller.

On the one hand would anyone believe Nails to be a duper? maybe, maybe not.

Would anyone believe that of the ring, who most do not know at all could be a duper? It's much easier for most people to accept than someone they know and have interacted with.

Would of the ring pay as much as they reputedly did for Nail's collection only to dupe it and then watch the value begin to drop? Maybe, as they could feasibly make a profit off it if they were intelligent about the dissemination process. Plus they could lay blame on Nails and attempt to appear innocent.

Would Nails dupe his collection just prior to selling it knowing that of the ring would most likely be blamed? It's possible, and a very easy way to get away with it.

Do I know who is responsible? No. Can I make some reasonable hypotheses based on past evidence, and new information, certainly.

 

[of The Ring]

i started to love this forum. I am suddenly so famous.


what i am not very sure is when Nails has not sold his collection to me, did he display everything he is selling to me in his castle? or house whatever. if not, then no one will discover there is another piece of that item which maybe have been thought to be unique.

Or when is that Atlantic museum started? after Nails sold me his collections? or before? If after, then did i ever sell any single piece of those rares? NO !!! the answer is NO. Just think of this, will there be another person other than the usual rares collector who will pay this kind of price in terms of gold or cash? maybe yes, but still people will know when they started to show off what they have just purchased.

I guess the biggest question is who sell those rares to Nails? Unless anyone knows that, it will always be clueless. It can only be guessing. There are no facts. Unless EA can tell where which item is fake, it will always be a guess. Or maybe EA can clarify how many pieces of each rares are actually given out in the game.

I am just wondering who is the one who determine how many of that particular item is given out? And still, UO is always full of bugs and problems. it can be a glitch which maybe give out 1 or 2 or more of an unique item which is declared.

so what is the conclusion?

 

[DVI]

I am just wondering who is the one who determine how many of that particular item is given out? And still, UO is always full of bugs and problems. it can be a glitch which maybe give out 1 or 2 or more of an unique item which is declared.

so what is the conclusion?

only you and nails know who the real duper is...which was some what of my point, and that you each have your own motivations for chosing to dupe and could blame the other individual.

 

[of The Ring]

If I am in a duping business or if i know how to dupe, i will not need to spend that kind of money to own Nail's collections and display them for everyone to see and later find out that hey there is a pair of the supposingly to be unique item. WTF !!!

Instead as a duper, to protect its own interest, they will be secretly producing the rares and sell it in small quantities. Definitely they will not want to dupe those unique items and sell it. BECAUSE ONCE PEOPLE KNOW ABOUT IT, IT IS ALL USELESS !!!

And if i know how to dupe, i will think of duping something which i can securely sell them. like the valorite runic hammers which has been selling to aggressively in the UO. i am very sure a lot of people know about this issue.

I was approached by people who i do not know, and they want to sell their valorite runic hammer to me for as cheap as 15mil each. can you believe at that price the runic is real? well, not for me. But, i was told what the duper did was duping the the filled large BOD which you can turn in for a valorite runic hammer. So in this case, is the runic fake? or it is just the LBOD which is fake? LOL ... it is just so unclear.

 

[DVI]

If I am in a duping business or if i know how to dupe, i will not need to spend that kind of money to own Nail's collections and display them for everyone to see and later find out that hey there is a pair of the supposingly to be unique item. WTF !!!

Instead as a duper, to protect its own interest, they will be secretly producing the rares and sell it in small quantities. Definitely they will not want to dupe those unique items and sell it. BECAUSE ONCE PEOPLE KNOW ABOUT IT, IT IS ALL USELESS !!!

Again, I am not indicating any one individual is to blame, but that only the two of you know whether you are really innocent.

Also there are plenty of reasons why someone would spend a significant amount of money to purchase an item or items to dupe and resell. The value may decrease but you can still make your money back, even off of formerly unique items.

 

[of The Ring]

Maybe if every rare collectors can display all that they own, it will help solve this problem as well. Unless they have somethings which they will not want to show.

See, if i have not opened this museum, no one will find out that there is one more piece of certain items.

Furtheremore, after all these long debate, we still do not see a sign of Nails. I have been trying to get him, but his ICQ just seems no replies.

 

[Pickaxe Pete]

Just speculation, but perhaps there is/was an exploit to duplicate items that does not require the item to be in the player's backpack. I'm sure all museum owners have feared something like that. If so, everyone involved here could be innocent of any wrongdoing since the perpetrator could be simply a 'visitor' of museum(s). Again, merely speculation.

 

[Xel Naga]

Just speculation, but perhaps there is/was an exploit to duplicate items that does not require the item to be in the player's backpack. I'm sure all museum owners have feared something like that. If so, everyone involved here could be innocent of any wrongdoing since the perpetrator could be simply a 'visitor' of museum(s). Again, merely speculation.

This situation did occur which is why you see glacial spellbooks and ethereal cloaks. Changeling (imprisoned dogs) mimicked the appearance of items on players or NPCs. While it would not retain the item's name, it did in fact copy the exact hue of the item. Nails' museum whether he intended for it to happen or not, had most of his wearable items displayed on NPCs. A duper's dream eh? Well they pretty much camped in his house duping all the nice looking items in his house with changelings until nails put his house to private.

And Ring, as dvi pointed out there would only be three reasons why anyone would spend a huge amount like $30k on the game without knowing if the items were actually unique or not.

1. That person was extremely well off in real life and for some reason would value pixels over real life usage of the said funds.

2. The person knew already if the items were duped or not and knew they could make the money back either by selling off the items which they had bought at a marked up value to profit, or by selling/renting it to dupers to simply make them a copy to keep, and copies to sell first. Which is what dupers offer you when you have many nice items. And yes, I know because I have been offered plenty of times in the past which I declined. One of them even being my old college buddy wanting to dupe my items which I clearly declined because I'd rather look unique in game than have 5000 noobs looking like me without putting in any work to get the item. So don't be surprised if a duper comes up to you and offers you to dupe your items for you. One copy for you to sell first, and after you sell they will begin fencing off copies of it.

3. If the person was involved in the whole thing and is playing innocent.

Though no accusations are being thrown now since we can't be sure who is at fault, I would assume you would be classified as #1.

Though many people already have their personal beliefs as to what happened to this collection in question. Some on your side, some not.

As for the cloaks which seemed to have sparked this, Manticore I believe was the prior owner of it. And while he has enhanced items in his collection via not so legit means to get more mods on them, I don't think anyone would ever consider him a duper or one to be in business with said dupers.

As for me, I'd rather have this for my $30k if I had it to waste.

 

[Tomas_Bryce]

Elbryan it is possible that in some far away past some of these items were duped and only now they are showing up.

However, I find that extremely unlikely. There were not two Rainbow mage seer robes, nor two sets of catskills cloak, nor multiple copies of Necromancer staffs, etc. Most of these items were in Nails' possession for quite some time. So I think there is enough evidence to strongly suggest that atleast one of the owners of this collection (past or present) has indulged in duping. I personally don't even think that it matters who did it because it sucks either way

But anyways there is not much else that can be said of this matter without crossing the line.


Pick Axe: I don't think there has ever been a way to do that as far as I know. That would be bit scary


PS. use the notification button if there are any posts crossing the line. I am pretty busy to read everything right now.

 

[Elbryan Uthador]

I agree with that, same as what Aspen says. There are 4 possiblities to this.


1) Nail's duped them.
2) Of the Ring duped them.
3) They both duped them.
4) Another source duped them and is now releasing them to the public.


I have to look to 4, since I know for a fact who duped the Skull and Crown of Talkeesh and he is neither 1 or 2. Then again, all can be true.

 

[xxstaticxx]

There were not two Rainbow mage seer robes

Actually there was, as with most seer items the event was held on multiple shards. I know LS was one for a fact, not exactly for sure where nails originally obtained his though.

 

[Xel Naga]

Actually there was, as with most seer items the event was held on multiple shards. I know LS was one for a fact, not exactly for sure where nails originally obtained his though.

According to this, these items were only on Lake superior and Maybe drachenfels even though Drach has no actual image or information about the item on their shard, one can assume it might be the same thing.

http://uo.stratics.com/secrets/IA/Drachenfels/DrachenfelsIndex.shtml

http://uo.stratics.com/secrets/IA/LakeSuperior/LakeSuperiorIndex.shtml

 

[Myphsar]

Nails has already admited buying known duped item bless deeds,
Imho, ur either with it or 100% against it,

 

[xxstaticxx]

According to this, these items were only on Lake superior and Maybe drachenfels even though Drach has no actual image or information about the item on their shard, one can assume it might be the same thing.

http://uo.stratics.com/secrets/IA/Drachenfels/DrachenfelsIndex.shtml

http://uo.stratics.com/secrets/IA/LakeSuperior/LakeSuperiorIndex.shtml

The one from LS is still in the Glowing Orb. Thus proving there was at least 2 originally .

 

[Wraith One]

I think I read that book in the museum on Great Lakes correctly. Book stated that there were 3 rainbow mage robes not one, as there were 3 rainbow mages. At least, thats how the book was written according to Nails. Maybe someone should try reading some of the books. Now, its also possible that the info is fabricated, but in light of things lets try to look closer and longer at the situation at hand. Also just because some of the items in the said collection are showing up does not mean the entire collection is questionable. There are several items of which he had that I haven't seen showing up in quantities. There needs to be more evidence before we can fully say anything regarding the entire collection he had.

 

[xxstaticxx]

I think I read that book in the museum on Great Lakes correctly. Book stated that there were 3 rainbow mage robes not one, as there were 3 rainbow mages. At least, thats how the book was written according to Nails. Maybe someone should try reading some of the books. Now, its also possible that the info is fabricated, but in light of things lets try to look closer and longer at the situation at hand. Also just because some of the items in the said collection are showing up does not mean the entire collection is questionable. There are several items of which he had that I haven't seen showing up in quantities. There needs to be more evidence before we can fully say anything regarding the entire collection he had.

If that was the case then there would have been 3 Robes per shard as the event its self was on multiple shards and it would not have been split up. But that isn't the case, so either whoever wrote the books had no idea what they was talking about Or their just lying to cover their own ass. And your absolutely right, it is extremely possible that he only duped the higher end items such as paul said (lights rampart, the cloaks, the robe etc) but then again, the majority of the stuff in nails museum was high end which makes me believe that it was all duped. You have to take into consideration the Jade Armband that Simon Francis was so graciously selling as well (Unduped) Nails most certainly did not have 2 originally but its quite clear that he obviously does now.


Paul, What makes you so special that your the ONLY other collector in the game that got the chance to buy or even Trade items from nails collection? Out of all the ppl that were picking at that collection wanting a shot at some of the items and bugging nails to sell why on earth would you out of all ppl be the Only one to get to buy some? Unless of course you was in on it? I wouldn't be surprised at all to see that your collection is duped as well.