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Done Testing things.

Tyrath

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Hope I have contributed a bit over the last few week on this forum and with folks in game that asked for advice and tagged along on my pirate training and shadow el trips.

So from my self and the 5 Legendary Prodo shard tamers that burned the scrolls and had the fun..... Thanks for reading my post and for those that tracked me down in game and learned more about High Seas and the boats. And a bigger thanks to everyone that contributed here with screen shots, tactics and questions that gave me far more knowledge than I had before.

Now the time has came for me to get back to my 70% Siege Game play and 30% Prodo Shard time. 120 scrolls are bit harder to come by on Siege and my stockpile of scrolls there is a fraction of what I had spread across Legends, Origin and Atlantic. LOL I have enough scrolls on Siege to make about a Dozen top of the line scrolled out pets, thanks in large part to my prodo testing and this forum I will not be making what would be very costly mistakes there. This is not one of the Stratics Forums I typically talk much in :)

The Toons that did all of my prodo testing :)

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Night

Journeyman
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A job well done Tyrath, thanks for all the testing and feedback :)

Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk
 

Please Dont

Journeyman
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Thank you for logging of your info into the successfully trained thread. I know for a fact people appreciated the time and effort you put into it.
 

skett

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Thanks for all your help friend

What is your rotten stench horse is it a nightmare looks blue-ish black
 

Lord Nabin

High Council Sage - Greater Sosaria
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Glorious Lord
*Raises a glass of good old Mooonglow Red in salute the Tyrath and his friends efforts*

Thanks for all the time and effort for the community on this friend. It is much appreciated!
 

Tyrath

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One thing I got asked often was why not have done the testing on TC instead of burning real scrolls. Over the years I have found what is on TC and what is on the real shards are two very different things. Testing on a prodo shard like Origin that gets the pubs a week or two before the rest of the shards is much more realistic IMO and gives a better feel for what really works. This is also why I have move all of my accounts to Origin, except the one house acct I keep on Atlantic. Hey there are things you just can find or buy on a low pop shard and things you can't sell so I export what I don't need to Atlantic to sell and import things I want or need to Origin. With a little planning before Origin is closed to Transfers in the pet revamp case we knew pets would be eating scrolls so I shielded over all of my power scrolls from ATL and Legends before the pub went to Origin and transfers were disabled. Rarely after the pub hits Origin are there any major changes, personally I think the pub should be on Origin and the other pre full release shards for a full month. As there is some tinkering like the pets mana thing that made so many people mad. If done in the closed environment of Origin there would not have been much uproar. A full month also gives us plenty of time to test everything in a real shard environent and find the glitches and bugs in real shard game play.

Origin and legends before I made the move is also where I try things in the relative safety of tram land and blessed and insured items. Then if it is something that will work on Siege I apply it in my game play there. LOL Prodo really is my TC before committing to something on Siege :)
 

Tyrath

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Thanks for all your help friend

What is your rotten stench horse is it a nightmare looks blue-ish black
Yep 16th Anni Pony they train up to pretty durable little 3 slot ride and pack some punch ;)
 

Poo

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good job @Tyrath i know a fella OCD'r when i see one.
enjoyed your training stuff, saved me a lot of time and experimenting.
 

Tyrath

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good job @Tyrath i know a fella OCD'r when i see one.
enjoyed your training stuff, saved me a lot of time and experimenting.
I had a lot of fun training the various pets up and taking them out on dungeon trips to see which were the most effective. For me the top 3 pets are Bushi/Parry Hiryus, Necro Tsuki Wolves and Blue Beetles. CUs just don't impress me unless they are scrolled out in everything. The Drakes are impressive in certain certain areas with their 100% damage types but don't see them being used much outside of places where 100% elemental damages are highly valuable. Serpantine dragons are kind of cool but come up very short in the training process. Shadow Wyrms with their over cap STR hit like a hammer but ultimately fail as a 5 slot pet IMO due to generally junky resist,pretty much the same feeling with the dragon wolf........ But alteast you get one training round to buff its resist a bit. Nightmares are a good all around hunting ride again and Firesteeds can be made into quite impressive pets, one of the better pets I trained up was the firesteed I put 120 SW. The Firesteed I put disco on not so impressive. The Najasaurus is impressive and quite a brutal little snakey thing, they are the crankiest pet I trained by far, at 120 tame and lore they still like to give you the finger on a regular basis. The wind runner from the store was a complete waste of 1000 sovs and after that I was not going to waste the SOVs on a lasher. Still have not got a Frost Dragon to pop on a L7 Map. After my general testing of a lot of critters I settled more in to seeing what builds in the 3-4 that best suited my general PvM needs. The Blue Beetle replaced GDs for my T hunter, in most cases he strolls through LvL 6 Maps but does need backup on most L7 maps. The Tsuki Wolf was built for taking out large numbers of spawn and is very effective either bushi or necro route I just like the necro and his wither better as his life leech and SS more than make up for the lack of High Parry. The Hiryu wins for me in the all around mount and hunting pet. I put my top Hiryu up against my top CU in a best 3 out of 5 match. Despite the CUs healing the Hiryu chewed right through him 4 out of 5 matches, the strings of high damage Armor ignores just overwhelm the Cus defense and healing ability. Basically the CU runs out of mana and the Hiryu doesn't. I would however recommend CUs as a general purpose pet as they can stay in the fight for a long time and their elemental damage is good. What I have seen is the more aggressive player/ play style like the Hiryus better and the more defensive player/play style opts for the CU. Rune Beetles are another impressive high damage pet but IMO limited to Gargs as a general purpose hunting pet. At this point Ethys really need to not take up a control slot so the non Garg tamers can have the same mounted speed the smelly, big feet, flappy winged gargs have, with 5 slot pets.

Other fun pets have been Sabre Tooth, Wild Tigers, and the Ossein Ram but again not rideable thus limiting their usefulness with not smelly garg tamers. Also given the environment in which the Ram must be tamed, I really expected more bang for the effort you end up when training is done with a good pet but very far from a great pet. The pheonix is also impressive but is too small LOL I tend to lose health bars and finding the little bird can be a challenge under a MOB pile.

Something I did not think would be impressive were many of the general animals. I have been training a Bull up for the Siege Bull Fight Tournament that is coming up. They go 1-4 slot and once you buff their resist, give them some HP/STR/Stam and add 20 HPR and add Piercing to them the simple common bull is rather impressive in the damage dealing department. Took him at 3 slot to Miasma last night and he dominates the Scorpion. If I did not have such a limited supply of scrolls on Siege I would probably give him 120 wrestle/tact/anat/ and resist in the last round of training. As it is he will get Stam and Mana Regen more HP and Str and a bit more mana.

Scrolled VS Unscrolled pets. I have done a lot of side by side testing of them. A CU or Hiryu with a long list of 120s is impressive. The real question was are they 250,000,000 gold worth of scrolls (or More) impressive. The short answer is NO not IMO. For PvM a base pet with no scrolls is still very effective, Let us not forget a month ago most of these pet types never left the stables and colored Hiryus and CUs were for bank sitting. To take them up to a 5 slot has made everything useful again whether you put 1/4 of a plat worth of scrolls into them or not. It could even be argues that the points not spent on scrolls and used to buff up areas that get shorted by adding scrolls makes the unscrolled pet better. A CU benefits most by adding a 120 Healing and 120 Anatomy, A hiryu with adding 120 bushi and Parry. A tiger or Sabre tooth 120 Wrestle and Tactics a Tsuki 120 Necro and SS or 120 Bushi and Parry. I largely ignore resisting spells on pets for the average tamer PvM it is just a expensive add on that does not give that much bang for the buck. If you are doing a lot of high end caster type stuff then it is probably worth the investment, as are all the other scrolls . But it is mythology that in order to have a effective pet that you have to invest hundreds of millions worth of scrolls into them. Also several critters can be tamed with higher wrestling and tactics than GM and some like the Najasaurus come with crazy high resisting spells.

As Donavon post regularly the behind the scenes changes and tweaking of pets has been on going and I kind of expect them to continue tweaking them for the next 3-4 weeks. PersonallyI think this pub should have stayed on Origin and the other pre full release shards for a solid month if not two. A lot of crying could have been avoided by doing the the tweaks and Nerfs in that closed environment. But then there would be the we want it worldwide right now crying, so we can complain that it was released before it was well tested and fine tuned. So like with the mana issue, which was very unbalanced they really had no choice but to hit it with a hot fix NERF hammer and then go back and start tweaking and balancing it better. Which they obviously have been doing. This was a big pub that changed the entire system and dynamics of a large portion of the game. A very impressive feat given the Dev team size and resources. Some imbalance, glitches and bugs are to be expected. Even if the Dev team were 10X bigger with endless resources there would have been things missed and tweaks/nerfs required. Yet they built the pub and released it with relatively few bugs, glitches or imbalances. Ya really gotta work at finding something to complain about for the most part with pub 97.
 

Tabby Kapak

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The Najasaurus is impressive and quite a brutal little snakey thing, they are the crankiest pet I trained by far, at 120 tame and lore they still like to give you the finger on a regular basis.
Huh? But snakey things don't have fingers?

On a serious note, wonderful post again Tyrath! Thanks for all the testing and sharing your findings here! And we agree on what you wrote about the accomplishment of the Dev team, we are glad so many of our pets get to see daylight again finally! (Even though we haven't used the training yet for fear of messing up things, we do try to get most to the first 100% initially.)
 

railshot

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I had a lot of fun training the various pets up and taking them out on dungeon trips to see which were the most effective. For me the top 3 pets are Bushi/Parry Hiryus, Necro Tsuki Wolves and Blue Beetles. CUs just don't impress me unless they are scrolled out in everything. The Drakes are impressive in certain certain areas with their 100% damage types but don't see them being used much outside of places where 100% elemental damages are highly valuable. Serpantine dragons are kind of cool but come up very short in the training process.
Thank you for a very informative write up.
Can you elaborate on your Necro Tsuki wolf setup, please? I run one with life leach, AI and Goo. It does great in spurts both in damage and tanking, but his mana regen hurts him quite a bit. Does your wolf fire Wither often enough to not need Goo? How's it's mana?
 

Tyrath

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Thank you for a very informative write up.
Can you elaborate on your Necro Tsuki wolf setup, please? I run one with life leach, AI and Goo. It does great in spurts both in damage and tanking, but his mana regen hurts him quite a bit. Does your wolf fire Wither often enough to not need Goo? How's it's mana?
With Goo and Necro even the faster mana regen critters burn through it. I left Goo off of them after the first one and the wither has been more than a compensation for the goo and does more damage. The Life Leech is the wolfs greatest asset IMO giving them the staying power of a CU in terms of healing (It is a liability with some critters thou. Not sure if they raised the mana cost of the Goo after my first one by a lot or what but after the mana fix it came down to lose the goo or not build the next one with necro. I just lost the goo and all was well. Now does he fire the wither enough..... That is a good question and one I don't have the answer to. 4 wolves almost identical in every aspect and one fires wither constantly, another very regularly and the other two is like whenever they get a urge to which might be almost never up t regular but not spamming it like the one does. That and some other weirdness in testing has made me wonder if there are unseen factors in each individual critter. I actually wondered this with a pair of 4.0 GDs a long time ago, one is a super dragon and the other looks good on the lore but falls far short of the other. But on the lore they should perform nearly identically, but sure dont. What made wonder even more with the dragons was after fully trained ones barding difficulty kept going up and the others stopped. That though is for greater minds than mine to ponder :)
 

railshot

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4 wolves almost identical in every aspect and one fires wither constantly, another very regularly and the other two is like whenever they get a urge to which might be almost never up t regular but not spamming it like the one does. That and some other weirdness in testing has made me wonder if there are unseen factors in each individual critter. I actually wondered this with a pair of 4.0 GDs a long time ago, one is a super dragon and the other looks good on the lore but falls far short of the other. But on the lore they should perform nearly identically, but sure dont. What made wonder even more with the dragons was after fully trained ones barding difficulty kept going up and the others stopped. That though is for greater minds than mine to ponder :)
Thank you for the explanation. As far as the weirdness, we know that there were some skills that did not show in the gumps for average users prior to this publish. So based on that, and prior to my own experience with GDs, I am 90% sure that there are AI related variables that are random, and are not shown to users.
It does add some realism though. Kinda like my Rhodesian Ridgeback. This is a breed of dogs that they used to hunt lions with. My dog on the other hand is afraid of things like a Christmas tree. She also hides in the garage when someone rings a doorbell and I am not home. No mana problems though :D
 

Tyrath

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Thank you for the explanation. As far as the weirdness, we know that there were some skills that did not show in the gumps for average users prior to this publish. So based on that, and prior to my own experience with GDs, I am 90% sure that there are AI related variables that are random, and are not shown to users.
It does add some realism though. Kinda like my Rhodesian Ridgeback. This is a breed of dogs that they used to hunt lions with. My dog on the other hand is afraid of things like a Christmas tree. She also hides in the garage when someone rings a doorbell and I am not home. No mana problems though :D
That is why I hate telling someone this works great, it might work great on 9 pets and the 10th on Identical to the other 9 is a total lemon :)
 

Donavon

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Good afternoon.. just thought ya would like to know they did increase the mana cost of goo by 30 not long ago...shortly after the mana nerf ^_~
 

Tyrath

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Good afternoon.. just thought ya would like to know they did increase the mana cost of goo by 30 not long ago...shortly after the mana nerf ^_~
That explains a lot! TY!!! If dropping goo, + Necro spells 500 mana doesn't go very far and does not regen fast enough even on a tsuki to keep any significant amount of either firing off, as when the mana ran out and regened it went to casting the low cost necro spells and rarely got high enough in a encounter to do more goo. Only work around would be add 1500 mana and sacrifice some HP or something else for a longer initial high Goo/Damage burst but ultimately would run out on tougher fights and be down to dropping pain spikes and corpse skin.
 
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