Discussing Balance

[ansyears]

Saying that more people would play the class is not the same as saying that it would be BETTER...

Why would more people start to play a necro mage if a pure mage is a lot better, you make no sense.

 

[Revan123]

Learn to read?




You quoted critical gaming who did say that and you did like his post.





This is where learning to read helps, you said more than it should never stack, read the next sentence you wrote.




It isn't 7 damage? i tested it when you said it does 10-25, get a better box and admit you were wrong, are you able to do that? Now you are talking about getting chased by a group of people? I think everyone agreed pvp needs to balanced for 1v1s not a group of people chasing you. you say I fail to grasp that someone can hold an omen but you are failing to grasp someone can hold an explosion




You couldn't touch me on a necro archer. You didn't dismiss anything, you brought up a combo that does decent damage, i brought up a combo that can kill you.



You continue to fail to understand that if your opponent takes off the omen you will never get off the combo


Again you bring up only ranged wep for the dexxer and melee wep for the mage.. Stop being biased so I can answer your question fairly.

Okay, I'll try and sum this up because we're going in circles.

A. You can not kill me with the tank mage combo

and

B. Let's compare the two and break down the time it takes to cast everything

Necro Archer: pre-cast'ed Corpse skin -> Omen -> Concussion blow with bow
1.25 seconds .5 Seconds nearly instant ranged shot

Tank Mage: pre-cast'ed Curse -> Explosion -> Flame Strike -> Armor Ignore
1.25 seconds 1.75 seconds 2.0 seconds As long as it takes to chase target with melee weapon

So let's see... Assuming both parties pre cast their first spells, the Necro Archer will take half a second to cast omen and then all he has to do is shoot, which will be nearly instant because the weapon prepares to swing while you cast; whereas the Tank mage will need to cast Explosion, then Flame Strike, then chase the target with the melee weapon. Yeah... that's a HUGE difference. Against a tank mage, you can stand still for 3.5 seconds and still survive- even longer if you can disrupt your opponent and/or dodge their melee blow. Against the Archer, you can take a ton of damage just by stopping for half a second. I'm not saying corpse skin dropping someone to 55 of each resist is OP, but it DEFINITELY should not stack with curse.

 

[Revan123]

You refuse to back up what you say because you know you are wrong. You killed people like drcossack,oreo and revan , trust me when I say this no one is impressed. You have never seen a necro dexxer before you? I mean c'mon mate your post is just full of lies.

Well, I never died to it, but I can guarantee that if I did, you most certainly would.

 

[Revan123]

Why would more people start to play a necro mage if a pure mage is a lot better, you make no sense.

Because... it would be better than it is now... If it becomes better than it is now, then more people will play it than do now. Just because something isn't the "best" doesn't mean people won't do it at ALL.

 

[ansyears]

Okay, I'll respond to this briefly because we're going in circles.

A. You can not kill me with the tank mage combo

and

B. Let's compare the two and break down the time it takes to cast everything

Necro Archer: pre-cast'ed Corpse skin -> Omen -> Concussion blow with bow
1.25 seconds .5 Seconds nearly instant ranged shot

Tank Mage: pre-cast'ed Curse -> Explosion -> Flame Strike -> Armor Ignore
1.25 seconds 1.75 seconds 2.0 seconds As long as it takes to chase target with melee weapon

So let's see... Assuming both parties pre cast their first spells, the Necro Archer will take half a second to cast omen and then all he has to do is shoot, which will be nearly instant because the weapon prepares to swing while you cast; whereas the Tank mage will need to cast Explosion, then Flame Strike, then chase the target with the melee weapon. Yeah... that's a HUGE difference. Against a tank mage, you can stand still for 3.5 seconds and still survive- even longer if you can disrupt your opponent and/or dodge their melee blow. Against the Archer, you can take a ton of damage just by stopping for half a second. I'm not saying corpse skin dropping someone to 55 of each resist is OP, but it DEFINITELY should not stack with curse.

A. You can't kill anyone with the evil omen concussion combo, it isn't enough damage.

B. The mage is able to precast more than just curse. How many times do i have to say this next part the necro archer will struggle to get off his omen concussion if his opponent keeps taking off the omen (this means the clock is ticking). The mage only needs to get a casting focus flame strike and and rng AI. Your necro archer combo isn't enough to kill someone, the mage combo is. Please try to get this through your head because you keep talking about the mage being melee and the dexxer being an archer, it can go both ways. You can take a ton of damage from a mage for stopping for half a second too, pre cast flame strike ai.

 

[ansyears]

Because... it would be better than it is now... If it becomes better than it is now, then more people will play it than do now. Just because something isn't the "best" doesn't mean people won't do it at ALL.

But no one plays it now and 12.5 damage increase isn't enough damage for people to start playing them when you can just get 15+10... This shouldn't be so hard to understand...

 

[OREOGL]

When relying on RNG before specials? What do you mean? Again, you're not really being clear.

Not sure how long you've played, but prior to weapon specials, dexers just sat there and swung at each other until it strung a few hits together. It was literally like watching paint dry and a sometimes just depending on who ran out of bandages first. For a while you literally had to cut bandages one at a time.

You could poison just about any blade, but it was random when it finally chose to go off.

Maces were extremely annoying because they'd destroy armor and clothes in minutes.

There were probably other things that escape me right now. There's no point to be made here, just reminiscing.

 

[CovenantX]

There are a lot of bad pvpers, proud of you.

I can compete, You are able to stack corpse and curse right now, I offered to fight you with you on the necro dexxer and me on a different character, you refused.

Show me you aren't lying by backing up what you say.

You are waiting for me to icq you about what? you already publicly refused to fight me because you couldn't be bothered to take 60 seconds to transfer a char and copy paste macros. I guess you are too busy spending your whole day posting here.

I'm not getting on TC to kill you if I have no way to know if you're going to be there or not, you asked me for my icq before you asked me to "test" on TC. that's why ICQ matters.

 

[ansyears]

I'm not getting on TC to kill you if I have no way to know if you're going to be there or not, you asked me for my icq before you asked me to "test" on TC. that's why ICQ matters.

If you accepted the fight on TC i would have icqd you but you refused to fight on TC so there was no point in ICQing you. Hah what a pathetic troll attempt by you but hey here it goes, do you accept to fight me on TC? I will gladly ICQ you.

 

[Revan123]

A. You can't kill anyone with the evil omen concussion combo, it isn't enough damage.

B. The mage is able to precast more than just curse. How many times do i have to say this next part the necro archer will struggle to get off his omen concussion if his opponent keeps taking off the omen (this means the clock is ticking). The mage only needs to get a casting focus flame strike and and rng AI. Your necro archer combo isn't enough to kill someone, the mage combo is. Please try to get this through your head because you keep talking about the mage being melee and the dexxer being an archer, it can go both ways. You can take a ton of damage from a mage for stopping for half a second too, pre cast flame strike ai.

Yet again you're missing the point. The point is that it's a monstrous amount of damage in a very short amount of time, and that adding curse on top of it is OP. Yes, a mage can pre cast curse, then off screen, then cast Explosion, then run on screen, cast flame strike, and then chase their opponent with an armor ignore; but that is still WAYYY more than just pre-casting a corpse, casting omen and then shooting your target. In the time it takes the mage to cast flame strike and chase the target (assuming the target is stupid enough to stand around and let you cast a flame strike while being cursed and having an explosion on them), the archer could omen and shoot twice.

The point is, it's too easy to get off for the amount of damage it does.

 

[ansyears]

Yet again you're missing the point. The point is that it's a monstrous amount of damage in a very short amount of time, and that adding curse on top of it is OP. Yes, a mage can pre cast curse, then off screen, then cast Explosion, then run on screen, cast flame strike, and then chase their opponent with an armor ignore; but that is still WAYYY more than just pre-casting a corpse, casting omen and then shooting your target. In the time it takes the mage to cast flame strike and chase the target (assuming the target is stupid enough to stand around and let you cast a flame strike while being cursed and having an explosion on them), the archer could omen and shoot twice.

The point is, it's too easy to get off for the amount of damage it does.

I'm not missing anything, i've already said you can just precast the flame strike and then ai right after , would that not be a monstrous amount of damage?

 

[Revan123]

But no one plays it now and 12.5 damage increase isn't enough damage for people to start playing them when you can just get 15+10... This shouldn't be so hard to understand...

Okay well again, this point is irrelevant. The fact of the matter is, you don't need to make one ability OP to make a template affective, you can marginally increase it in other ways. It doesn't matter if the template is the BEST template, people don't ONLY play the best templates; but the effectiveness of a template DOES affect how much people play it, so if you make it better, more people will play it. Durr? If people ONLY played the best templates, you would ONLY see healing parry mages and archers.

The point is, making corpse stack with curse is far too OP for group situations. There are OTHER, BETTER WAYS to make necros better.

 

[CovenantX]

If you accepted the fight on TC i would have icqd you but you refused to fight on TC so there was no point in ICQing you. Hah what a pathetic troll attempt by you but hey here it goes, do you accept to fight me on TC? I will gladly ICQ you.

ICQ me, we'll set it up... I already said this.

There was no point in asking me for my ICQ if you were afraid to ICQ me in the first place? I agree. you're a bad troll.

 

[Revan123]

I'm not missing anything, i've already said you can just precast the flame strike and then ai right after , would that not be a monstrous amount of damage?

No... it would be about 70 damage, and you would have to wait another 2 seconds to do it again.

 

[ansyears]

ICQ me, we'll set it up... I already said this.

There was no point in asking me for my ICQ if you were afraid to ICQ me in the first place? I agree. you're a bad troll.

You refused to fight on TC so i didn't bother icqing you, nice spin.

 

[ansyears]

No... it would be about 70 damage, and you would have to wait another 2 seconds to do it again.

70 so around the same as evil omen concussion "and would have to wait another 2 seconds to do it again." So? the necro would have to wait for their opponent to let the omen stick.

 

[CovenantX]

You refused to fight on TC so i didn't bother icqing you, nice spin.

I didn't refuse. I said I didn't feel like it.. if you're not going to tell me when to kill you, I'm not going to sit there and hope you show up.
ICQ me or continue backing down.

I don't want to see you post here on stratics regarding this, I want you to ICQ me, so I have proof it's YOU getting destroyed when you try to deny it later.

 

[ansyears]

I didn't refuse. I said I didn't feel like it.. if you're not going to tell me when to kill you, I'm not going to sit there and hope you show up.
ICQ me or continue backing down.

I don't want to see you post here on stratics regarding this, I want you to ICQ me, so I have proof it's YOU getting destroyed when you try to deny it later.

Yes you did refuse, it is common sense that i asked for your icq so we could log on at the same time, i added you and waiting for you to accept.

 

[Grazz't1970]

I PvP regularly. I'm good not great. Not a trammy. Mostly PvP and pvm for loot. That being said ... This thread is enough to make me hate pvpers ... Myself included!!! I mean there's people arguing that have never agreed on anything ever in any forum. Like typing more will change that? Next topic plz. At least the argument will change

 

[CovenantX]

Yes you did refuse, it is common sense that i asked for your icq so we could log on at the same time, i added you and waiting for you to accept.

Good fights, he did kill me... but it doesn't change my mind on corpse + curse stacking being OP or not.

He also didn't use a template that abused it either. (NS/DS+orc brute+alchy).
field. non-arena.

 

[Critical Gaming]

Lol he makes these ridiculous points, then draws his own false conclusions from your response to his ridiculous points, and then he starts arguing more ridiculous points in response to the false conclusions that he makes.

Yeah he's trolling. Such a try-hard.

 

[Merlin]

You refused to fight on TC so i didn't bother icqing you, nice spin.

Take your challenges to PMs, in-game gen chat or elsewhere. This thread is not for getting out your personal gripes.

 

[ansyears]

Take your challenges to PMs, in-game gen chat or elsewhere. This thread is not for getting out your personal gripes.

My challenges were not for my personal gripes they were to prove my point. Covenant was not able to get off a corpse and a curse. So @OREOGL and @drcossack and anyone else that agreed what do you know that covenant doesn't?

 

[Revan123]

Take your challenges to PMs, in-game gen chat or elsewhere. This thread is not for getting out your personal gripes.

If a bull craps, and you call it bullcrap, are you getting out a personal gripe? Or are you just calling bullcrap bullcrap?

 

[OREOGL]

My challenges were not for my personal gripes they were to prove my point. Covenant was not able to get off a corpse and a curse. So @OREOGL and @drcossack and anyone else that agreed what do you know that covenant doesn't?

Kid, I don't know what you guys did, what template you used or fought, or what you're even talking about.

If you'd like to address something with me, be a big boy and use your words.

 

[Nexus]

Well since a @Merlin tried to be nice and ask you guys to behave, and every post since has been to either challenge him or flat out ignoring him, I think we're done here.