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[Discussion] Clops Items and Houses

lineman

Rares Fest Host | Ches Jan 2011
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
It is amazing how people say that this is "unfair" based on the number of accounts that you have!
This is the same thing of buying a lottery ticket, the more tickets you have, the more chances you have, and this is everyone's choice, you can pay $12 a month or you can pay $300 a month, it is your choice!
Explain How this is unfair, for the 1st time I see this a fair chance to anyone, you can have 1 account or 50 accounts, they are all paid the same way..... anyone here can open 5,10,15,20 accounts and enter to participate, is your choice and your money :)
Because most people play this as a game as it was intended and not as a job. Were not trying to make profit on it.
 
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showtime414

Journeyman
Stratics Veteran
How does one acquire a navery tele. Not into calling it a navery hole lol. Just me I guess. I want one if they are able to be had. About the only thing I do on regular basis
 

Ducan IronWeaver

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How does one acquire a navery tele. Not into calling it a navery hole lol. Just me I guess. I want one if they are able to be had. About the only thing I do on regular basis

The hole was a server birth. The only way to get one now is if you buy from a player or get crazy lucky at a idoc
 

Captn Norrington

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The GM's also confiscated a lot of the Navery holes when they were new, as they were not actually intended to be part of the game.

The people that voluntarily turned the ones they had in got screwed over very badly. One week they were illegal to own, the next week they were legal and worth billions of gold. That's one of the things wrong with UO, history has proven it is generally a bad idea to give up ill-gotten items voluntarily, since half the time the ones who choose not to give them up as requested get rich off them later.
 

Zandor

Lore Keeper
Stratics Veteran
And just to add to the list of lost items: add in ethy hiryu and ethy reptalon. Luckily the white ridgeback was recently sold by clops.
 

Clops

Sage
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And just to add to the list of lost items: add in ethy hiryu and ethy reptalon. Luckily the white ridgeback was recently sold by clops.
I never purchased the ethy mounts. Those are with the previous owner to my knowledge. The white ridgeback has a new owner.

I owned 31 (of 25) Ebony Tables. I think there are likely fewer than 10 left.

I owned 3 Navrey teleporters. I know of 6 that still exist.
 

Igg A Pie

Slightly Crazed
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Let's be honest here, Clops had the most extensive rates collection.....ever. Generally speaking, rare collectors are jealous of what he obtained, myself included. Oh how i would have loved to own a single one of a kind of the many he had. Now that all of these rares have been confiscated, i get the impression most everyone feels like they deserve some sort of claim or are trying to give some half cocked reason of why they should be put back into circulation. These items are not yours. There should be no lotto, there should be no IDOC, there should be no give away.

Every single person that contributed something to Clops, whether it was for gold, USD, trade, donation, ect....you were compensated in some way, shape or form. While i will acknowledge there might be 10% of the rares community that really cares about the actual perseverance and history of these rate items, noone deserves any of these rare items. They are not yours.

This "IS" history for these items as it unfolds before us. The were obtained, displayed, and ultimately taken away. Let it go people, they are no longer obtainable to us any more. In my humble opinion, they should all be deleted. The rares should all be remembered as they were. And we should all use this tragedy as an example that there are consequences for our actions in this virtual world......which is very, very over due.
 

Restroom Cowboy

Crazed Zealot
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Stratics Legend
I got 12 accounts and I play them all for fun. I like hoarding stuff, collecting bods, so yeah it is possible. House holder accts... your statement is invalid...
I assumed he meant those who tend to play all 10 accounts at one time. If you pay for 12 accounts that you use as intended, enter away...and thank you for supporting UO.
 

Cyrah

Certifiable
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Stratics Legend
I looked at the safes on Clops roof of the west road house many times before this mess happened. There were no nails or executioner's axes. What is that supposed to mean and who placed them? Really... why?
 

Kylie Kinslayer

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I looked at the safes on Clops roof of the west road house many times before this mess happened. There were no nails or executioner's axes. What is that supposed to mean and who placed them? Really... why?
lol... no Encyclopedia Brown skills? ;)

Too many metaphors to list... although I would imagine someone will try.

*walks off muttering babble about "someone's ass getting nailed to the wall" and "final nail in the coffin"* :mf_prop:
 

Mesanna

UO Producer | Dark OverLady
VIP
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@Mesanna

The only positive I can think could come from this would be a giant sucking of gold from the economy, if you were to auction the plots and items and delete all the gold that comes from that auction. I could easily see 1,000 plat or more being generated and delete via such an auction. There are not many single sources that could generate that kind of proceeds, or benefit the economy so dramatically, but this is one of those few. In addition, I think allowing these items, many of them unique with long histories, to remain in the hands of players would be celebrated by all collectors.

If there's too much to handle logistically, I would be willing to volunteer my services to sort through all the stuff and pull off such an auction, and I'm willing to do it without personal benefit of any kind.

Let me know. :)

-Brian
I want to make this very clear. I am not going to sell or auction off any items or houses. I will not give any of these items away that were removed from Clops houses. I am however going to make it fair for the rich and poor people to have an equal chance to own one of 5 houses on Atlantic. I will be giving away 2 castles, 2 luna houses, and one other smaller house. I will be taking everything out of these houses and just turning over the house to the winners of that house. This giveaway will be done via account and you have to give me your email address. You have to have an active account of course. These houses will NOT be grandfathered.

These stones will be on Atlantic because it only applies to Atlantic. The Grandfathered castles I will be giving away the for the Anniversary celebrations the stone will only be on TC1 and those castles will be grandfathered in celebration of 20 years!!
 

THP

Always Present
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an atlantic grandfathered castle... or a atlantic grandfathered luna house...wow... thats one hell of an amazing 20th anni prize for 4 lucky lucky people
 

Prawn

Sage
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an atlantic grandfathered castle... or a atlantic grandfathered luna house...wow... thats one hell of an amazing 20th anni prize for 4 lucky lucky people
THP your ability to read and process information is dumbfounding. She stated the 3 castles being given away via test center (for the 20th anni celebration) are the only ones that will be grand fathered, not clops' houses.
 

Scott

Babbling Loonie
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Campaign Benefactor
Goodbye glacial... I think they need a "jump to conclusions mat" on that one. I don't own any recent glacial stuff, mines a bandana and long pants like everyone else... those are bad too?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Larisa

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THP your ability to read and process information is dumbfounding. She stated the 3 castles being given away via test center (for the 20th anni celebration) are the only ones that will be grand fathered, not clops' houses.
It's actually 6..she'll be giving away 3 at the actual party and 3 for us poor folk who can't afford to go ;)
 

Captn Norrington

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Goodbye glacial... I think they need a "jump to conclusions mat" on that one. I don't own any recent glacial stuff, mines a bandana and long pants like everyone else... those are bad too?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yes, the pants and bandanas get deleted too. There have already been about 10 vendors in Luna who were wearing glacial pants, which had the pants taken away. They turned from glacial to a normal gray color.
 

THP

Always Present
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THP your ability to read and process information is dumbfounding. She stated the 3 castles being given away via test center (for the 20th anni celebration) are the only ones that will be grand fathered, not clops' houses.
mesanna quote number #119 post...
I want to make this very clear. I am not going to sell or auction off any items or houses. I will not give any of these items away that were removed from Clops houses. I am however going to make it fair for the rich and poor people to have an equal chance to own one of 5 houses on Atlantic. I will be giving away 2 castles, 2 luna houses, and one other smaller house. I will be taking everything out of these houses and just turning over the house to the winners of that house. This giveaway will be done via account and you have to give me your email address. You have to have an active account of course. These houses will NOT be grandfathered.

These stones will be on Atlantic because it only applies to Atlantic. The Grandfathered castles I will be giving away the for the Anniversary celebrations the stone will only be on TC1 and those castles will be grandfathered in celebration of 20 years!!

sorry ive read in 10x....it says what i said @Prawn .......5 of clops houses...u indeed dumbfound me too...and yes yes there are anniverary celebration houses being given away on test shard too....sweet jesus....next!!
 
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Captn Norrington

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an atlantic grandfathered castle... or a atlantic grandfathered luna house...wow... thats one hell of an amazing 20th anni prize for 4 lucky lucky people
mesanna quote number #119 post...
I want to make this very clear. I am not going to sell or auction off any items or houses. I will not give any of these items away that were removed from Clops houses. I am however going to make it fair for the rich and poor people to have an equal chance to own one of 5 houses on Atlantic. I will be giving away 2 castles, 2 luna houses, and one other smaller house. I will be taking everything out of these houses and just turning over the house to the winners of that house. This giveaway will be done via account and you have to give me your email address. You have to have an active account of course. These houses will NOT be grandfathered.

-------------------------

The parts I highlighted in your quote, and in what Mesanna said are what Prawn was talking about.

Clops' houses are not being given away at the 20th anniversary party, and none of Clops houses are being grandfathered.

Mesanna is giving away grandfathered castles (not luna houses) that do not currently exist at all at the 20th anniversary party. She has not placed them yet, they are not Clops' houses.
 

THP

Always Present
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THP your ability to read and process information is dumbfounding. She stated the 3 castles being given away via test center (for the 20th anni celebration) are the only ones that will be grand fathered, not clops' houses.
they are clops 5 house....2 castles 2 luna and whatver ......jesus picking at straws....whos next...so not grandfathered....next!!

please let us be clear i feel for Clops... and it saddens me how others have maybe let him fall on his own sword and scurried briskly away....maybe mesanna should make a special bin were folks with stuff hoarded that they know is not legit ....and yes theres quite a few out there...can bin them b4 the greater culling spree begins in earnest....
 
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UNKNOWN of Atlantic

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Jeez Everyone needs to Settle down Over these Houses, @Mesanna Is being Gracious enough to let the house go back to the community. She could just Burn them & leave them as rubble forever. As Far as Multiple accounts is concerned I used to be a Hardcore idocer. And I would place Houses in castle / keep spots to buy out the neighbors or wait for them to decay. I don't count myself As a big UO House Seller but I have Sold Many houses, Keeps and castles. Some People May know me , A lot probably don't. I have access To MANY accounts I could open. But I'm not going to. Right now I have 2 Active I run & several others I use for house storage of my Idoc loot ..Yeah I'm a hoarder & a lazy Vendorer and castle's 7,500 storage with 60% is Awesome. I play this Game for fun And its a shame Some use this game for ill gotten gains, But every game has those kinds of people. Just be Glad we have a person like Bonnie (Messana) that Really cares about the Players that make up this community. She tries to do what is best for people. She has taken out her time & helped me With Several things ..And with in a few days Not weeks or months. She is one person having to deal with Thousands of people across all shards. How she does it is beyond me (I suspect she has Clones). I never really got into rares from other shards / EM events. But Just like I'm in to Idocing I suspect rare collectors are just as passionate about their Rares. Please Remember Messana Also feels Betrayed by this person, She handed them the power & I'm sure she is upset with what this person did to the community out of greed. For everything there is a season ..maybe some these items may turn up version 2.0 in a legit EM run event down the road ...who knows. I know the UO community Will get past this.

So have a great day UO
UNKNOWN
AKA- Joxer The Mighty
 

Lady Storm

Grand Inquisitor
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Stratics Legend
I think I can clear this up .... your reading it as one long sentence.
first off Mesanna said the 5 houses that were taken from the player Clops will be given away empty...just the house to the lucky player chosen by random.
this is his 2 castles 2 Luna houses and a small house. Anyone can apply for this rich or poor.
This is to stop the fighting over who cheated to get the plot in first like usual...

Now here is where many are getting confused I think.

In September at the 20th anniversary party, 3 castle gifts will be given out and 3 more for people who cant go to this gathering.
This will be by way of a click machine that you enter for the other 3 gift castles on TC1.
These castles for the anniversary are to be grandfathered to the winners chosen accounts. This in my opinion is a great thing.

These are not in any way part of the Clops issue.

I do hope this clears it up I was so tired of some misunderstanding things.
 

Qikdraw

Sage
Stratics Veteran
It's a shame that this is how the UO community gets into the "news."
Well hell, even back in the day UO never really had a good PR department. If they had advertised even half-assedly UO could have had a lot more players.I never saw any advertising like EQ did. These days getting noticed at all in gaming media is a plus. Maybe it will bring in new/old customers too.
 

Decadence

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I want to say... as I have spent many many hours collecting pictures of rares, and information, and I have to say Manticore has done this for many many years and doesn't get thanked enough... Brian has been doing a ton of collecting and hunting down rares to take pictures and collect history as well. Many others have also contributed in this. I no longer have the time to do this, but it does not negate the work I have done...Anyway I digress... I am very saddened by the loss of historic items. I have never felt that the community should be punished by the loss of the items. I don't have an answer to a fair way to distribute the items--But I would think there could be some ideas. (perhaps rehashing the drops in EM events could be one idea)We all love museums to look at items even if we don't own it. I know many people including myself who are careful with who we sell unique items to, with fear that it could perhaps get into a dupers hands. The historic items and the inability to look upon them, make sure we have pictures of, if we hadn't gotten around to it etc is a serious loss to the history and community of UO.

-My Two Cents,
Lady Deca

PS. Also I still have my ethy pets, thankfully the white ridgeback had been resold and still exists.
 

Chump Thumper

Lore Keeper
Stratics Veteran
I want to just login one day soon and not see these posts at the top. I dunno what else could be said or written thats beneficial to anyone other than messanna announcing info on the raffle. other then that. remember the items and the fun but lets move on past these threads just my opinion. I love the rare community ive played this game since 97 taken several breaks, but i think the rares community has been very good too me probably one of the best communitys or groups of people ive known since playing this game. things will go on, and hopefully we get some amazing em events coming up. as thats what ive been preparing for, So Please @Captn Norrington can stratics maybe get together the people that be and maybe help this if you agree.
 

Scott

Babbling Loonie
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The problem we have is no one truly knows what @Mesanna and @Broadsword have to do to make this game what it continues to be. It's like the fat guy that paid $150 for a seat at an NFL game who is yelling at the very well trained athletes on the field whose been doing this their whole life. Due to their policies, they cannot say what they feel. @Bennu did and stated he might even get fired for it. The crap leadership takes for you and me to continue to play this game, even when we don't agree, is a relentless fight between what I want to say and what I should say. As a wise patron once said, "a smart person knows what to say, a wise person knows whether to say it or not." All of us could learn a few things by keeping our opinions to ourselves, no matter who the recipient is or what they deserve!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Captn Norrington

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So Please @Captn Norrington can stratics maybe get together the people that be and maybe help this if you agree.
After a staff discussion a couple days ago, we decided to leave this thread open so that people can talk about the rare items which were lost, because we recognize that this situation has resulted in the loss of a great deal of history and in-game property that people enjoy, and it is a valid topic.

We do not want to hide the corruption and misdeeds that resulted in that loss. The person who caused it all chose to place us in the middle of this situation by using Stratics to reveal his actions, but we do not as a rule allow accusations or personal attacks, which most of the threads almost immediately devolved into and were locked because of it.

As long as the discussion here revolves primarily around the items and history, it will be allowed. This forum exists for discussion about rares, and the massive loss of the collection being discussed is a topic that touches many members of the extended UO community, even those who may not consider themselves rares collectors.

As long as this thread stays civil, we will try to keep it open so people can continue sharing their thoughts about the loss of items and history.
 

THP

Always Present
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its a game guys/gals a vidio game from the 90s!!!!

at some point it will end... NO i dont want this to happen..YES i will be there the night the servers get turned off

please play it as a game.... this is no real life... take a step back... and think...do u really need every drop ever... no u dont.... we all love UO but this as proved it can go beyond of reason...... crazy.... its a few unique pixels that make u smile.... this is NOT some business enterprise.. if u think it is.. u will lose everything ....when the lights fade and get switched off.............

its a game... we collect pixels...diff peeps collect all sorts of stuff.... they are not real... we like our game...lets enjoy what we have.... spending crazy real money is definate a bad idea on a game 20 years old

saying that... puts his tin helmet on.. because some folks are.......[end]
 
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petemage

Babbling Loonie
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yeah I wonder how this will work because I personally have 7 accounts so does that mean I get 7 entries??
Sounds about fair. I mean your are paying all 7 so why not. I only pay one but if I wanted the castles so hard I could open accounts as well.
 

Aquarius

Sage
Stratics Veteran
LET ME MAKE THIS CLEAR, CLOPS DID NOT STEAL NOR TAKE ANYTHING THAT WAS MINE. My post is being misunderstood. He was merely holding them for me until we could meet up.

Hurts me because the pigs he had were mine! I know he sold one of them, The Farmer one and to who he sold it to. I REALLY would like my pigs back. Him and I were trying to work out a schedule when we both could be on. I just found this out right now what happened. Now I wont ever get my rightful pigs back @Mesanna
Can I PLEASE get my pigs! uhg
 
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Restroom Cowboy

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@Decadence, I am sure Mesanna and the team have been keeping a comprehensive list of items over the years. If the items are not legit, it would be tough to tell the actual *born on* dates due to the issues that arise during transfers as well as a lack of an records being kept on said items. If she tells you the item is not legit, she probably has reason for saying so...regardless of what dates are tied to it.

@THP, I agree with you 100%. Unfortunately the *scene* now is different than it was close to a decade ago. With over half the items going to bots every event, the addition of auction safes and searchable vendors, the human element which many of us have enjoyed has given way to selfishness, profit, and greed. What was lost? Community, trust, camaraderie. Essentially the most important elements...
 

Captn Norrington

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With over half the items going to bots every event, the addition of auction safes and searchable vendors, the human element which many of us have enjoyed has given way to selfishness, profit, and greed. What was lost? Community, trust, camaraderie. Essentially the most important elements...
Although I do agree with you that it's a shame some of the community element has been lost.... I think people forget that these problems aren't a new thing. The UO community has always had quite a lot of selfishness, profit and greed all the way back to the beginning.

Remember way back before lockdowns existed and you needed a house key to open your door, if someone else got your house key somehow 9/10 times you would log in the next day to find 100% of your belongings were gone, and since you still didn't have the key the entire house was essentially useless at that point on top of it.

Is that not selfishness, greed, and profit? That has always just been the way UO is, it's nothing new.

As for the trust aspect, how many thousands of people have been scammed or robbed by someone they trusted in this game? From simple things like stealing a piece of armor someone gave them to repair, to that time an entire rares festival silent auction house was looted by a thief.

Forcing people to trust other players, with no other option, quite simply does not work out very well. It's great that over the years things have been added which allow people to do things for themselves, like repair deeds and the new secure trade window, instead of being forced to rely on others who may or may not screw them over just for the heck of it.

Yes, it's a shame some of the community aspect has died off, but I think overall the new things have been a huge improvement by preventing people from being scammed by other players they were forced to trust just to play the game.
 

Lady Storm

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Well don't hold your breath on the rares and unique item that were removed.
Mesanna is very adamant they will never see the light of day again.
And no she will not "return" what some have already tried to claim was theirs and held or barrowed by Clops.
She will tell a player who is trying to talk her into returning what he claims was a loaned unique item. Oh Hell No.
Bemoaning the loss is only making her more adamant to not let any escape her sight.
I for one see her point..
There is no proof it was yours ... there is no logged bill of sales if he purchased it or agreement of loan.
Do you see my point?
The idea of a liar claiming say the teleporter to navery....was his and on loan... is not gunna float.
Anything in his possession is lost ...period.
You all who have been in UO as long as I know this is a fact.
Dev will have little tolerance for Cheating... and this is the result of being caught.
 

Slickjack

Rares Fest Host | Cats Nov 2010
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I want to make this very clear. I am not going to sell or auction off any items or houses. I will not give any of these items away that were removed from Clops houses. I am however going to make it fair for the rich and poor people to have an equal chance to own one of 5 houses on Atlantic. I will be giving away 2 castles, 2 luna houses, and one other smaller house. I will be taking everything out of these houses and just turning over the house to the winners of that house. This giveaway will be done via account and you have to give me your email address. You have to have an active account of course. These houses will NOT be grandfathered.

These stones will be on Atlantic because it only applies to Atlantic. The Grandfathered castles I will be giving away the for the Anniversary celebrations the stone will only be on TC1 and those castles will be grandfathered in celebration of 20 years!!

I haven't the time to re-read all of the 3 pages (thus far) of messages on this topic. I've been out of town for a couple weeks and just came back to this mess.

Being the former owner of maybe 20% of what Clops had, I can tell you that I don't want to see these items back in game. I'm very proud that Mesanna has taken this stance.

We just need to hit the hard re-set button and move on and learn from the lessons that this has taught us. So many years of people abusing the game and it's mechanics - definitely long overdue for a "corrective" move by the devs to clean some stuff out.

Very sorry that this has happen in the game that I love.
 

Cymidei

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hmm okay, if it's not per person what's to stop someone from opening trial accounts and spamming TC1's stone with them? Really it should be limited by individual or IP address just to stop cheaters. Most of us are savvy enough to find a way to get more entries without paying if it comes to that. Then there are the ultra crazy folks who will not only have 10 accounts but will use a script to create and log in on 9,999 more accounts so they can get a castle. People will move heaven and earth to win castles and stuff because they think they are making money at it.

I am not merely joking, there are some folks who play this game and can't figure out that holding on to some castle, or Luna plot with multiple accounts long term is a bad investment. I personally know such a foolish fellow who wants an ungodly sum of money for a property in Luna that he doesn't use. Why the precious cost? He's got multiple properties, on multiple accounts and has been trying to sell each of them for a decade, in the meantime he's spent some $155.88 a year on each property/account *10 accounts *10 years in subscription fees. A serious long term multi accounter, say 10 accounts for 20 years is paying how much for Ultima Online, $30,000? Now I understand why this game makes money!

If you're giving a castle out to someone like that Mesanna...make sure it's a broken down, double-wide, complete with a chevy pickup on blocks in the front yard, in the Felucca savage swamps. They will try to sell it for billions of gold and pay thousands on the account because most people wouldn't want it! Seriously, some servers still have castles precisely as described that have been owned by GMs, to be given away, for over a decade! I wanna know, why haven't I received my skeeter-filled Cymidei dream castle yet? Entered the contest years ago, no winner was declared, I am the last man standing and demanding, give me, give me! *snickers*
 
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S_S

Babbling Loonie
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UNLEASHED
hmm okay, if it's not per person what's to stop someone from opening trial accounts and spamming TC1's stone with them? Really it should be limited by individual or IP address just to stop cheaters. Most of us are savvy enough to find a way to get more entries without paying if it comes to that. Then there are the ultra crazy folks who will not only have 10 accounts but will use a script to create and log in on 9,999 more accounts so they can get a castle. People will move heaven and earth to win castles and stuff because they think they are making money at it.

I am not merely joking, there are some folks who play this game and can't figure out that holding on to some castle, or Luna plot with multiple accounts long term is a bad investment. I personally know such a foolish fellow who wants an ungodly sum of money for a property in Luna that he doesn't use. Why the precious cost? He's got multiple properties, on multiple accounts and has been trying to sell each of them for a decade, in the meantime he's spent some $155.88 a year on each property/account *10 accounts *10 years in subscription fees. A serious long term multi accounter, say 10 accounts for 20 years is paying how much for Ultima Online, $30,000? Now I understand why this game makes money!

If you're giving a castle out to someone like that Mesanna...make sure it's a broken down, double-wide, complete with a chevy pickup on blocks in the front yard, in the Felucca savage swamps. They will try to sell it for billions of gold and pay thousands on the account because most people wouldn't want it! Seriously, some servers still have castles precisely as described that have been owned by GMs, to be given away, for over a decade! I wanna know, why haven't I received my skeeter-filled Cymidei dream castle yet? Entered the contest years ago, no winner was declared, I am the last man standing and demanding, give me, give me! *snickers*
I guess you missed this detail in the newsletter?

You can only sign up once per account and trial accounts are not eligible.
 
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