Chivalry Request for Devs

[tymbow]

I think it would be helpful to add a Buff/Debuf icon for Consecrate Weapon or at least a visible timer of some sort.

Bashing away in Doom today I found it is impossible to know when it has expired with all the noise made by other players and their pets. The sound made when it runs out just disappears into the noise floor. As the sound (to my knowledge) is the only way to know when it has run out a visual indicator would be great.

 

[Emil Ispep]

It really only lasts 10-15 seconds to begin with..

Id rather have a criminal flag timer.

 

[Arch Magus]

Why not both.

 

[Sir Kenga]

Consecrate lasts for 11 seconds, just recast it every few swings. Buff icon would be nice anyway.

 

[T_Amon_from_work]

What is the buff/debuff bar anyway? Oh yeah, a way to determine what is affecting the character.

What is Consecrate Weapon? It's a spell that affects the weapon and allows it to strike the foe in their weakest resist. Karma level 5 and GM Chiv this is 10 second duration, less with lower karma or skill - ref. Players Corner FAQ, "Paladin Spell Duration ..." sub-post.

 

[Gildar]

What is the buff/debuff bar anyway? Oh yeah, a way to determine what is affecting the character.

What is Consecrate Weapon? It's a spell that affects the weapon and allows it to strike the foe in their weakest resist. Karma level 5 and GM Chiv this is 10 second duration, less with lower karma or skill - ref. Players Corner FAQ, "Paladin Spell Duration ..." sub-post.

I can't tell if you're trying to say that it should or shouldn't be added to the buff/debuff bar...

 

[Dermott of LS]

...

However long it lasts, or what exactly it does, it SHOULD be put on the buffbar.

 

[Ender]

Agreed, and add one for curse weapon too.

 

[Extra Value Meal]

I can't tell if you're trying to say that it should or shouldn't be added to the buff/debuff bar...

He's saying that it shouldn't be added, but responding to the OP like a jerk.

 

[T_Amon_from_work]

Nope - not like a jerk. Pointing out the flaw in the thread to that point. CS was NEVER intended for being in th b/d bar ... it has been requested/suggested several times in the past and has not happened.

Duration of the spell is so short as to make popping an icon not wortrh the effort. It's not a toggle spell, so can be cast even prior to expiration which resets the timer.

 

[Dol'Gorath]

I think your dmg dropping drastically is a good indicator you need to recast. No need to waste dev time adding an icon thing.

 

[Basara]

Things like paralysis and dismount are shorter, and are still on the bar.

Plus, from my own experience, you can change weapons during the spell and still get the effect.

 

[MalagAste]

I don't see anything wrong with adding it to the buff/debuff bar.... infact I kinda like it...

Also whoever said the criminal status added I agree there too. I would really like to see that put on there. Most the time I can't tell if I'm Gray or not.... I'm always green.

 

[T_Amon_from_work]

Para and dismount are there because they affect the character - that's the buff/debuff purpose. EoO is there ... it affects the character, Divine Fury ... same thing. Think of the intent of the b/d bar ... character, not weaponry/armor.

 

[Dermott of LS]

...

Does Consecrate stay on the weapon if it is dropped or traded to another player within the timeframe?

If not, then CW affects the character, not the weapon specifically.

 

[Gildar]

Para and dismount are there because they affect the character - that's the buff/debuff purpose. EoO is there ... it affects the character, Divine Fury ... same thing. Think of the intent of the b/d bar ... character, not weaponry/armor.

Consecrate Weapon affects the character, not the weapon. It changes any damage dealt by the character through use of any weapon, not just the weapon they happen to have been using at the time of casting.

edit::
To expand upon that...
Focus Attack impacts the weapon currently being held at the time of activation. You know this because the weapon itself changes properties. Focus Attack does have additional effects, however, that impact the character, and it should also be in the buff/debuff bar.
Consecrate Weapon and Curse Weapon both do not modify the weapon.


Ignoring all that... the intent of the Buff/Debuff bar is to give the player a view on information that is important to the player. The common thread that happens to connect the pieces of information are currently there is not a good reason for not adding more pieces of information.

 

[tymbow]

He's saying that it shouldn't be added, but responding to the OP like a jerk.

Wow this has started a bit of agro. Shall I arrange pistols at dawn?

I don't think he is being a jerk - I agree with his logic. It's just that the bar seems to be the most convenient place for things like this. People are also right in that it is very short lived and there are other ways around dealing with this. The whole thing was just a thought - in any case I could list a pile of bugs that need fixing well ahead of anything like this.

 

[Extra Value Meal]

Wow this has started a bit of agro. Shall I arrange pistols at dawn?

I don't think he is being a jerk - I agree with his logic. It's just that the bar seems to be the most convenient place for things like this. People are also right in that it is very short lived and there are other ways around dealing with this. The whole thing was just a thought - in any case I could list a pile of bugs that need fixing well ahead of anything like this.

Delivery...

 

[Duku]

Agree, and id like also to see Curse weapon

 

[T_Amon_from_work]

Consecrate Weapon definition: "Temporarily enchants the weapon the caster is currently wielding. The type of damage the weapon inflicts when hitting a target will be converted to the target's worst Resistance type. Duration of the effect is affected by the caster's Karma and lasts for 3 to 11 seconds."

Please note the bold part.

Dermott - Never tried that however, the above implies it would follow the weapon.

 

[Uvtha]

Para and dismount are there because they affect the character - that's the buff/debuff purpose. EoO is there ... it affects the character, Divine Fury ... same thing. Think of the intent of the b/d bar ... character, not weaponry/armor.

What a stupid thing to fight against. Its an effect that the player has activated. Who cares what it effects, it would be nice to know when its necessary to recast. There is no good reason for this NOT to be on the bar.

 

[T_Amon_from_work]

Don't cave in, though. You have what you consider a good reason for actually implementing it in the b/d bar.

I believe it goes counter to the purpose/intent of the bar as developed. However, it doesn't mean we can't discuss this from our viewpoints to make sure everyone reading sees both cases.

Your change (and adding Curse Weapon and others) may well wreak havoc in the code that handles all this. But ... we won't know unless a Dev can tell us it just ain't gonna happen. Where's them folkses when we could use them?

 

[kilo729]

Don't cave in, though. You have what you consider a good reason for actually implementing it in the b/d bar.

I believe it goes counter to the purpose/intent of the bar as developed. However, it doesn't mean we can't discuss this from our viewpoints to make sure everyone reading sees both cases.

Your change (and adding Curse Weapon and others) may well wreak havoc in the code that handles all this. But ... we won't know unless a Dev can tell us it just ain't gonna happen. Where's them folkses when we could use them?

It's a BUFF bar. How does putting BUFFS on it counter the purpose of a BUFF bar? Terrible reasons to not include it, and suggesting that it "may well wreak havoc in the code" is laughable at best.

 

[T_Amon_from_work]

T'is a buff/debuff bar ... both. As far as the code, you know 100% for sure that putting these in is not gonna screw the code up at all? Have you even been around to see various tweaks that nerf or disable something else?

 

[Maplestone]

But this is simply providing information - it's not interacting in any odd way with code for the ability itself. Yes, the fact that it's not implemented yet is suspicious, but given that the effect is attached to the character, not the weapon, I can't imagine what chaos must lurk below the surface to prevent this from being a fairly trivial addition.

 

[Pickaxe Pete]

Every activated combat skill, spell and illusion should have a buff bar icon. Every other game works this way, it just makes UO look poorly thought out to omit some and not others.

 

[Warrior of Time]

Well I would like to request a Good reason to go over GM in Chivalry. Maybe add diff abilities. There is going to be a lot of evil released in UO:SA . Why not add more good. I think a paladin would be a good place to start. I am sure they will be new throwing weapons to go with the skill. It should not stop with those weapons. I feel there will be a need to counter evil too.

Speaking of throwing weapons. The ninja has had one for years now that can be poisoned and no use to do so. Will that change in UO:SA? Will weapons like the caltrop be used against horsemen? Will the trident be added, or flail. These weapons can be used by everyone. If you add gargoyle only weapons do the same for others.

Also when you figure damage on a flail count on not only the speed it can hit as well as damage. You never swing one in the direction to strike the shield first. It is used so the shaft blocks the sword and the ball continue around the sword to strike the head. Back then you better be good with a shield. Adding a second ball ment double trouble.

There are old templets to consider. Not everyone will have or want a gargoyle.

Are there going to be scrolls for the gargoyle race. I think there should be a reason to want Gargoyle, and Chivalry scrolls as there is for magery. [If possable]

I think it is time to want to be a noble paladin.

 

[aarons6]

if not put it on the buff bar, make the icon turn red.
like all the other bushido/ninja spells.

 

[kilo729]

T'is a buff/debuff bar ... both.

Then why do you disagree so vehemently with adding a buff to it?

As far as the code, you know 100% for sure that putting these in is not gonna screw the code up at all?

Have you even been around to see various tweaks that nerf or disable something else?

I've been around UO for 10 years, so yes. What does this have to do with anything, seems like a personal attack to me.

 

[Kiminality]

The de/buff bar is a system that was bolted on, to provide a little of the more common functionality of modern MMOs.
A lesson that has been very much learned, is that the player wants/needs to know what's happening to their character.
Of course, it was never an original part of UO, and like the new targeting system, was added as a kind of interpreting system. For example, if you get debuffed (weaken, for example), then sometimes it doesn't "notice" that the effect ended.
Like with the targetting system, when you "select nearest mobile", and it insists that there are no mobiles on the screen, when you're in the middle of a gank.

What the game really needs, is for the core systems to be changed, and for there to be a more integrated status effect system.
That way, every affect would be represented, by default.

 

[Sir Kenga]

What is the buff/debuff bar anyway? Oh yeah, a way to determine what is affecting the character.

What is Consecrate Weapon? It's a spell that affects the weapon and allows it to strike the foe in their weakest resist. Karma level 5 and GM Chiv this is 10 second duration, less with lower karma or skill - ref. Players Corner FAQ, "Paladin Spell Duration ..." sub-post.

If what u r saying was true, we wouldn't ever get icons of EoO and Divine Fury.

 

[Setnaffa]

We asked for this shortly after they added the Buff/Debuff bar. They didn't add it then; I doubt they'll add it now, but I suppose it doesn't hurt to ask.

 

[T_Amon_from_work]

Divine Fury: "Temporarily increases the Paladin's swing speed, chance to hit, and damage dealt, while lowering the Paladin's defenses. Upon casting, the Paladin's Stamina is also refreshed. Duration of the spell is affected by caster's Karma. The effect lasts for 7 to 24 seconds."

Increased swing speed, HCI, damage = character effects; refresh stamina = character effect.

Enemy of One: "The next target hit becomes the Paladin's Mortal Enemy. All melee damage dealt to that exact creature type is increased, but the Paladin takes extra damage from all other creature types. Mortal Enemy creature types will highlight Orange to the Paladin. Duration of the spell is affected by the Caster's Karma and lasts for 1.5 to 3.5 minutes."

Increased damage to mortal foe = character effect; increased damage from others = character effect.

Consecrate Weapon (original premise): "Temporarily enchants the weapon the caster is currently wielding. The type of damage the weapon inflicts when hitting a target will be converted to the target's worst Resistance type. Duration of the effect is affected by the caster's Karma and lasts for 3 to 11 seconds."

Now if CW was simply Consecrate where the caster then passed resistance damage to the weapon, I would be all for it. But the bar is a character bar, not an "all spells" item.

And please note - all the Paladin spells that affect the character have the words "the Paladin" in them and the icons do show in the bar, whereas items without those words are spells that do not show icons and thus are NOT character effects.

I don't remember seeing any weapon/armor buff/debuff icons in DAoC when I played ... but any character effects were displayed iconically.

 

[Basara]

Consecrate Weapon (original premise): "Temporarily enchants the weapon the caster is currently wielding. The type of damage the weapon inflicts when hitting a target will be converted to the target's worst Resistance type. Duration of the effect is affected by the caster's Karma and lasts for 3 to 11 seconds."

But, it's already established that it doesn't work that way - it IS, in its implementation, a CHARACTER BUFF.

Look what happened the last time they tried a "weapon" buff (one of the SE "combat caster" abilities) - it messed up a LOT of existing weapons, by giving them extra intensity on some properties while in effect, and then taking away MORE than the buff added. They had to change it to a purely character buff, to keep it from destroying players' Doom artifact and high-end runic weapons.

Since Day One of actual implementation, Consecrate Weapon has been, in reality, a CHARACTER BUFF. You change weapon, the NEW weapon is also consecrated until the spell ends.

Hell, the special fish last even less than CW, unless you have GM Eval, but they give icons.

 

[tymbow]

Here's another thought then.

If the buff/debuff bar is not the place, how about adding a visible count down timer (similar to when you apply bandies) to the weapon icon when it is added to a KR hotbar for example?

Similarly a cycle counter could be added for hotbar macro icons that have repeating enabled to show how many repeats are left for the running macro.

 

[Lord Kotan]

Consecrate lasts for 11 seconds, just recast it every few swings. Buff icon would be nice anyway.

It can last shorter...

 

[ColterDC]

Mod fight!!!!

It's a spell/ability/effect/etc that your character is currently under..... some indicator would seem appropriate.

 

[Lyconis]

However long it lasts, or what exactly it does, it SHOULD be put on the buffbar.

I would like it too.

 

[Restroom Cowboy]

I would like it too.

Couldnt you just turn your sound up and refer to the audio cue?

Seems pointless to task the server with queries every 5 seconds for a spell that lasts no more than 7.

But hey...thats just me.

Another possibility is KR...perhaps there is a visual cue to the spell fade you dont see in 2d.

 

[Maplestone]

Mod fight!!!!

*hides the blackrock*

 

[PixelPusher]

Couldnt you just turn your sound up and refer to the audio cue?

Bashing away in Doom today I found it is impossible to know when it has expired with all the noise made by other players and their pets. The sound made when it runs out just disappears into the noise floor. As the sound (to my knowledge) is the only way to know when it has run out a visual indicator would be great.

Already addressed by the OP at the begining of the thread, and he's correct. This is something that I, too, would like to see.

 

[Mayadevi]

Yikes ! What a number of different opinions !

Sorry if it's already been said but...Confidence has it's spell icon turn red, when it's active. I'd like the Consecrate weapon icon to turn red too !

CW makes a sound? What sound? I'm Deaf, I don't hear any sound. LOL

Some sort of Visual indication would be nice, not just for me, for all the people who play late nights with the sound off because someone in their house is asleep !

Mayadevi

(overcharging at 2 cents

 

[Arch Magus]

Seems pointless to task the server with queries every 5 seconds for a spell that lasts no more than 7.

Seriously?

The POINT is, it makes Consecrate easier for the players, something wrong with that?

God forbid we ask for simple things to be changed in the game we pay for to make things easier.

 

[kilo729]

But, it's already established that it doesn't work that way - it IS, in its implementation, a CHARACTER BUFF.

Look what happened the last time they tried a "weapon" buff (one of the SE "combat caster" abilities) - it messed up a LOT of existing weapons, by giving them extra intensity on some properties while in effect, and then taking away MORE than the buff added. They had to change it to a purely character buff, to keep it from destroying players' Doom artifact and high-end runic weapons.

Since Day One of actual implementation, Consecrate Weapon has been, in reality, a CHARACTER BUFF. You change weapon, the NEW weapon is also consecrated until the spell ends.

Hell, the special fish last even less than CW, unless you have GM Eval, but they give icons.

You're wasting your time, the guy seems to be ignoring the facts.

 

[Connor_Graham]

What does it matter if it's a character buff or a weapon buff? It's all semantics anyway.

Bottom line is a timer is a good idea, and would be very helpful. Considering that several magery spells have the same sound effect as Cons Wep does, it would save players from recasting thinking that the spell had worn off, only to find that it was something the monster cast.

Along these same lines I'd like to know why recasting Divine Fury doesn't reset the timer like the other Chiv spells do.